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Siigari Kitawa
Gallente
Perditus Peregrinus
Posted - 2010.05.06 12:13:00 - [1]
 

Edited by: Siigari Kitawa on 21/05/2010 07:14:57
Edited by: Siigari Kitawa on 07/05/2010 16:42:59

I'm on Sisi right now, trying to mess with some stuff. I experienced and noted some rather serious issues for me, that I'd like to address.

Issue 1: Overview distance text is now aligned right instead of aligned left. This means the text looks like this:

| 0 m|
| 523 km|
| 5.6 AU|
| 14.3 AU|

Please visit your user settings to re-enable images.


On TQ, it appears like this:

|0 m |
|523 km |
|5.6 AU |
|14.3 AU |


I find the current display on TQ far more useful because I read from left to right. The long space before getting to 0 is difficult for me.


SOLUTION: Please allow us to choose how we align text in the overview.


FIXEDIssue 2: You can no longer target or click on object TEXT in the game space to select its menu or target it.

You can on TQ. Example:

(O) Stargate (Jita)

If I right click on the words "Stargate (Jita)" I would activate the dropdown menu. Now I must click on the small box area surrounding the object. That is less space to click something I may need to click. Why was this taken away?


SOLUTION: Retain the text clicking.



Issue 3: The contextual mouse changes are less intuitive, and as a result, seemingly less responsive.

This may just be me, but when I move my mouse over something in the overview or a ship in TQ, the mouse becomes a crosshair. This is probably because I can target something from the overview. Now, it turns into a contextual mouse icon which barely looks any different against a crowded overview than a crosshair does.

The only reason this is an issue to me is sometimes my computer has some visual lag where the display may not be keeping up with my movements. I would appreciate keeping the crosshair in the overview.

Thanks.

CCP Lemur

Posted - 2010.05.07 11:44:00 - [2]
 

Regarding the alignment: the UI folks told me that they think it is the other way around to be easy to read. Right aligned like the standard Excel formatting. No pun intended.

No idea about the rest for now.

Siigari Kitawa
Gallente
Perditus Peregrinus
Posted - 2010.05.07 11:49:00 - [3]
 

Originally by: CCP Lemur
Regarding the alignment: the UI folks told me that they think it is the other way around to be easy to read. Right aligned like the standard Excel formatting. No pun intended.

No idea about the rest for now.

So are you saying they prefer it the new way?

If THEY prefer it the new way, please give us a toggle so the players that have learned to deal with it for over 7 years can continue to use it their way, and not your way.

No offense. I just feel the UI should be one of the things in Eve we have some control over (which in most cases we do.) Simple fact is, it breaks continuity being the ONLY thing on the overview that is now justified to the right.

MILK Monk
Knights of the Silver Dawn
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
Posted - 2010.05.07 11:53:00 - [4]
 

Originally by: CCP Lemur
Regarding the alignment: the UI folks told me that they think it is the other way around to be easy to read. Right aligned like the standard Excel formatting.

this is right and nothing else

Vir Hellnamin
Gradient
Electus Matari
Posted - 2010.05.07 11:55:00 - [5]
 


Left aligned text was nice since you could narrow the column over the quantity-text (m,km, AU) and just read the numbers... right aligning means that you need to span the whole biggest number now always... :(

CCP, make the UI more user-definable!

van Ice
Posted - 2010.05.07 13:46:00 - [6]
 


"They think it is better". Ok, ever heard of usability testing? Letting programmers, probably junior ones, make random decisions like this is a clear sign of bad software management.

One, the time they spent changing this could have been spent on other known issues.

Two, changing the UI on a major feature item like the Overview is not to be taken at a whim.

Three, if someone just decided to do this, then the project is not under control.

Ariane VoxDei
Posted - 2010.05.07 14:15:00 - [7]
 

Originally by: CCP Lemur
Regarding the alignment: the UI folks told me that they think it is the other way around to be easy to read.
It is. Ignore Siigari, just a oldtimer who does not like change.

PS. great to see that you actually have UI people and that they do something. I had almost lost all faith in you.

Rixiu
The Inuits
Posted - 2010.05.07 14:32:00 - [8]
 

Oh god. Why? Why would you do this? Please, tell me why you change this? Fix broken stuff instead of things like this.

I'm stunned, why do you, of all the UI things that needs to get some attention, decide to change this? Please tell me, otherwise I'm loosing faith in mankind Neutral


Tobias Sjodin
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2010.05.07 14:53:00 - [9]
 

Originally by: CCP Lemur
the UI folks told me that they think it is the other way around to be easy to read.


That's the worst argument I've heard today.

Avalon Ranger
Cold Void Industry and Trading
P R I M E
Posted - 2010.05.07 15:07:00 - [10]
 

Edited by: Avalon Ranger on 07/05/2010 15:10:33
Originally by: CCP Lemur
Regarding the alignment: the UI folks told me that they think it is the other way around to be easy to read. Right aligned like the standard Excel formatting. No pun intended.

No idea about the rest for now.

Every aesthetic change to a game should have the ability to turn it off, turn it back or not use it. Every brain in the human population is different. Some read from left to right, others right to life. Some even up and down and back again. Some like blue and not orange. The list is ENDLESS.

Rather than making a single UI, static, apart from a few floating boxes that you can move around I'd really like to see a UI that's user created. Place all the methods, functions and features in one place and allow us to move them where we want. I'd prefer my Capacitor as a long bar across the bottom of my screen with Three bars above it. Someone else however will hate this idea and want to change it. Using XML data and a list of preset design pieces the player should be able to choose place, colour and design.

It's not a huge project and of course the good old AI would still be in there. Privates could even make their UI more pirate looking. Miners could go for something industrial themed. Focused on cargo management and drones. You name it it would be there. All the same featured just bundled into 1000's of different packages.

http://desusig.crumplecorn.comPlease visit your user settings to enable images.

Shionoya Risa
The Xenodus Initiative.
Posted - 2010.05.07 15:57:00 - [11]
 

Originally by: Vir Hellnamin

Left aligned text was nice since you could narrow the column over the quantity-text (m,km, AU) and just read the numbers... right aligning means that you need to span the whole biggest number now always... :(

CCP, make the UI more user-definable!


That.

PS. Hey Siigy Razz

Zirator
Evoke.
Ev0ke
Posted - 2010.05.07 16:08:00 - [12]
 

Originally by: Vir Hellnamin

Left aligned text was nice since you could narrow the column over the quantity-text (m,km, AU) and just read the numbers... right aligning means that you need to span the whole biggest number now always... :(

CCP, make the UI more user-definable!


What he said, getting the overview right without taking away to much from the spaceview is hard enough allready. Alligning to the right will even take away more room on my screen.

Neutrino Sunset
Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse
Sanctuary Pact
Posted - 2010.05.07 17:03:00 - [13]
 

I'm surprised that actually getting the Overview to work properly at all wasn't a higher prioroty than this. You know the 7 year old bugs like items no longer on grid still being displayed, Selected Item button enabled states not updating so you can't click the damn buttons etc.

Key bindings for basic control movements like Approach and Orbit would have also been nice things to spend the time on.

Reten Kip
Everset Dropbears
Posted - 2010.05.07 17:14:00 - [14]
 

Originally by: Shionoya Risa
Originally by: Vir Hellnamin

Left aligned text was nice since you could narrow the column over the quantity-text (m,km, AU) and just read the numbers... right aligning means that you need to span the whole biggest number now always... :(

CCP, make the UI more user-definable!


That.




This.

Percivs
Sebiestor Tribe
Posted - 2010.05.07 17:18:00 - [15]
 

Originally by: Vir Hellnamin

Left aligned text was nice since you could narrow the column over the quantity-text (m,km, AU) and just read the numbers... right aligning means that you need to span the whole biggest number now always... :(

CCP, make the UI more user-definable!


^^^ This

Herschel Yamamoto
Agent-Orange
Nabaal Syndicate
Posted - 2010.05.07 17:46:00 - [16]
 

1) I actually sort of prefer the new way. Lets me see instantly what units they're each measured in. Agreed that it should be an option though.
2) Agreed, that's bizarre and stupid.
3) I'm not actually sure what you're talking about.

Siigari Kitawa
Gallente
Perditus Peregrinus
Posted - 2010.05.07 18:03:00 - [17]
 

Originally by: Herschel Yamamoto
3) I'm not actually sure what you're talking about.

Hover your mouse over a ship in space, or over something in the overview. Does your mouse change to a crosshairs, or a contextual mouse icon cursor thingie?

That's annoying. They went so far to include the contextual dropdown mouse icon cursor thingie when you hover over "dock" in the selected item menu. There are dock right click options now?!

Oh, guess not :P

Catari Taga
Centre Of Attention
Middle of Nowhere
Posted - 2010.05.07 18:04:00 - [18]
 

Originally by: Vir Hellnamin

Left aligned text was nice since you could narrow the column over the quantity-text (m,km, AU) and just read the numbers... right aligning means that you need to span the whole biggest number now always... :(

CCP, make the UI more user-definable!

This.

I'm all for right aligned numbers everywhere but due to the UI limitations left aligned was actually better in this case.

Kyra Felann
Gallente
The Scope
Posted - 2010.05.07 18:11:00 - [19]
 

Originally by: Siigari Kitawa
The long space before getting to 0 is difficult for me.


lol Yeah, moving my eyes those few millimeters is so exhausting and hard.Rolling Eyes

The new way is much better and easier to read. It makes distinguishing units much easier. It may take some adjustment, though.

They can't have an option for everything, otherwise the UI would keep getting more and more complex, full of options that the majority of people wouldn't use.

Every improvement has met with whining from people who are afraid of change. This one is no different. At least they are slowly improving the UI.

The solution is: get used to it. It shouldn't take that long. What happened to "adapt or die"?

Hra Neuvosto
The 8th Order
Posted - 2010.05.08 02:06:00 - [20]
 

Originally by: Vir Hellnamin

Left aligned text was nice since you could narrow the column over the quantity-text (m,km, AU) and just read the numbers... right aligning means that you need to span the whole biggest number now always... :(

This right here, listen to this please.

Cadde
Gallente
221st Century Warfare
Posted - 2010.05.08 04:41:00 - [21]
 

People saying it should be left to right because they wanna hide the distance text are right in their own way but seriously now... Has it come so far that your UI layout hangs on the fact you are losing some 30 pixels width wise?
Are you one of those people that have your widescreens standing sideways so you only have 1080 pixels wide and 1920 pixels high? (or whatever widescreen resolution you have)

The UI is bad enough as it is without having to go into these small details about left/right alignment and to be honest i prefer the right aligned distances over left aligned as it DOES make it easier to read. Anyone saying anything else just doesn't like things changing imo.

On all other counts though, having to click the base icon instead of the text and less responsive UI i do agree.
The UI is slow in so many ways it's embarrassing. Especially when the entire game freezes while loading from hard drive or waiting for network traffic.

And even with right justified distance text the UI is by far too hardcoded and should be let lose through XML or anything like that where WE the users who know what WE want can make it work the way WE want it to. Not some arbitrary game designer with his head so far into the sand his toes is all that is visible.

Don Pellegrino
Pod Liberation Authority
HYDRA RELOADED
Posted - 2010.05.08 04:49:00 - [22]
 

Originally by: Vir Hellnamin

Left aligned text was nice since you could narrow the column over the quantity-text (m,km, AU) and just read the numbers... right aligning means that you need to span the whole biggest number now always... :(



This has not been quoted enough, I can currently squeeze alot of information in my overview without having to expand it too much. Unless columns are now resized from the right side as well, then it is going to drive TONS of pvpers crazy.

Basically:
text aligned on left side = resize from left side
text aligned on right side = resize from right side

Daan Sai
Polytrope
Posted - 2010.05.08 10:35:00 - [23]
 

Agree completely with Siigari, this will just force unnecessarily wide columns wasted on leading spaces in an interface that is already space crowded. It really must be a user config option to turn on/off.

Daan

HeliosGal
Caldari
Posted - 2010.05.08 11:17:00 - [24]
 

user definatble is a better idea.

Geanos
Missions Mining and Mayhem
Posted - 2010.05.08 11:19:00 - [25]
 

Edited by: Geanos on 08/05/2010 11:23:27
People in charge with the UI should play the game more and not just try it a little bit before making changes.
10x.

Villian
Posted - 2010.05.08 16:25:00 - [26]
 

People whining about the new UI should use the new UI more instead of just complaining absently about it.

Sjolus
Metafarmers
MeatSausage EXPRESS
Posted - 2010.05.08 17:01:00 - [27]
 

Can't do anything other than chime in with the guys that keep saying this is an unnecessary change. Either make it optional or don't do it at all. I want my extra pixels.

Adunh Slavy
Ammatar Trade Syndicate
Posted - 2010.05.08 17:15:00 - [28]
 

I prefer the left justify, just looked more neat. I read left to right, my eye grabs the ata faster than having to rectify blank spaces since the table is scaled fom the right, not the left.

Nicholas Barker
Deez Nuts.
Posted - 2010.05.08 18:13:00 - [29]
 

Originally by: Kyra Felann
Originally by: Siigari Kitawa
The long space before getting to 0 is difficult for me.


lol Yeah, moving my eyes those few millimeters is so exhausting and hard.Rolling Eyes

The new way is much better and easier to read. It makes distinguishing units much easier. It may take some adjustment, though.


read

Originally by: Vir Hellnamin

Left aligned text was nice since you could narrow the column over the quantity-text (m,km, AU) and just read the numbers... right aligning means that you need to span the whole biggest number now always... :(

CCP, make the UI more user-definable!


My screen is already cluttered enough with all the UI bull****. Making the overview even wider isn't going to help.

Originally by: CCP Lemur
Regarding the alignment: the UI folks told me that they think it is the other way around to be easy to read. Right aligned like the standard Excel formatting. No pun intended.

No idea about the rest for now.


This dev response made my day.

Matsumoto Yoshizu
Genos Occidere
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2010.05.08 18:59:00 - [30]
 

CCP has people working on UI? Nice troll, 7/10.


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