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Lilith Velkor
Minmatar
Heretic Army
B A N E
Posted - 2010.02.11 17:40:00 - [31]
 

Edited by: Lilith Velkor on 11/02/2010 19:01:19
Originally by: Solid Star
An interesting idea would be to change it similar to the Phoon. Make it have 4/4 Turret/Launcher hard points, switch base shield / armor hit point and give it another low slot (take from the high). This would make it a potential option for armor rep gangs.


That would completely destroy the ship. If you want an option for armor RR gangs, fly a Rapier.

No idea why people want to fit artillery on it, it is meant to use autocannons and works perfectly well the way it is. In fact, if you dont need a cloaky / prober, there is no reason to fly a Rapier instead of a Huginn unless you want armor tank for a RR gang.

Edit: if for some reason you really want artillery, the 650s conveniently fit with a single RCU and assault launchers. The damage difference to heavy launchers is almost nonexistant with about 13 raw dps anyway, besides you get a better real dps output due to sig radius of the light missiles.

Guillame Herschel
Gallente
NME1
Posted - 2010.02.11 18:38:00 - [32]
 

Originally by: McRoll
On a ship that gives web range bonuses you'd think you want to stay as far away as possible from a target.


Call me kooky, but I think it's useful for closing range on the target. Therefore, autocannons and assault launchers make sense, and a plate is no handicap: any target I could catch with a nano + shield Huginn, I can slow down enough to close on with a plated Huginn.

I do wish it had a bit more grid. A 1600mm plate requires an ACR rig to fit with MWD, 180 AC's and assault launchers.

McRoll
Minmatar
Heatseekers
Posted - 2010.02.11 19:39:00 - [33]
 

Edited by: McRoll on 11/02/2010 19:42:17
Care to explain why you find it useful to fight closerange with it?

A 100+ million ship which is uninsurable, has only about 400 DPS and lolEHP. If you do not use the web range bonus, you can as well take a Hurricane and fit 2 webs on it. A Huginn with heavy assault/assault launchers and autocannons is unable to apply DPS over 20 km, so either you web someone without doin damage on it or you go closerange where the bonus is wasted and practically every other ship is a better choice.

Sure, you can use the webs to web something small and catch up or hold something in place. But then the question emerges, why just not use a Rapier instead?

Edit: Also, plating a T2 cruiser and giving up the superior shield resistances and speed of a Minmatar ship is really a bad idea. Seriously.

Max Hardcase
The Scope
Posted - 2010.02.11 20:07:00 - [34]
 

The only fix needed would be to increase the base hull : The bellicose.
Increase weapon slots to 4/4 (= mini typhoon )
+1 mid slot
And enough grid/cpu boost for some meaningful fitting options.
Ohh and TP bonus to 10% ofcourse.

Guillame Herschel
Gallente
NME1
Posted - 2010.02.11 20:33:00 - [35]
 

Originally by: McRoll
A 100+ million ship which is uninsurable, has only about 400 DPS and lolEHP.


It has enough EHP. I've survived being primaried several times in my 1600 plate Huginn.

Quote:
If you do not use the web range bonus, you can as well take a Hurricane and fit 2 webs on it.


But I do use the web range bonus. I can web at long range and then close distance easily thanks to the target being triple-webbed. Get it?

Quote:
But then the question emerges, why just not use a Rapier instead?


I'm in Low sec and in a fleet. Don't need a cloak. Huginn is cheaper than the Rapier. No FC has ever told me "Dammit Guillame, why did you bring that lame-ass Huginn?" Instead, I'm welcome in any HAC/Recon fleet.

Quote:
Edit: Also, plating a T2 cruiser and giving up the superior shield resistances and speed of a Minmatar ship is really a bad idea.


I don't give up the speed advantage. I use triple webs to achieve it. You don't need to go 3.5km/sec when your target is triple webbed. And if the target can still escape when tripled-webbed, it could have escaped a nano-shield Rapier, too.



Max Hardcase
The Scope
Posted - 2010.02.11 20:37:00 - [36]
 

Originally by: Guillame Herschel
Originally by: McRoll
A 100+ million ship which is uninsurable, has only about 400 DPS and lolEHP.


It has enough EHP. I've survived being primaried several times in my 1600 plate Huginn.

Quote:
If you do not use the web range bonus, you can as well take a Hurricane and fit 2 webs on it.


But I do use the web range bonus. I can web at long range and then close distance easily thanks to the target being triple-webbed. Get it?

Quote:
But then the question emerges, why just not use a Rapier instead?


I'm in Low sec and in a fleet. Don't need a cloak. Huginn is cheaper than the Rapier. No FC has ever told me "Dammit Guillame, why did you bring that lame-ass Huginn?" Instead, I'm welcome in any HAC/Recon fleet.

Quote:
Edit: Also, plating a T2 cruiser and giving up the superior shield resistances and speed of a Minmatar ship is really a bad idea.


I don't give up the speed advantage. I use triple webs to achieve it. You don't need to go 3.5km/sec when your target is triple webbed. And if the target can still escape when tripled-webbed, it could have escaped a nano-shield Rapier, too.




A general speed advantage is supposed to be the Minmatar thing but what do I know.

Lilith Velkor
Minmatar
Heretic Army
B A N E
Posted - 2010.02.11 21:19:00 - [37]
 

Edited by: Lilith Velkor on 11/02/2010 21:42:11
Originally by: McRoll

Sure, you can use the webs to web something small and catch up or hold something in place. But then the question emerges, why just not use a Rapier instead?



Killing speed? The Huginn dispatches frigates roughly twice as fast as a Rapier does, and it doesnt die that easy if it gets swarmed by frigs either.

Pretty much the only thing I use my Rapier for is as scout and / or prober, for everything else the Huginn is way superior.

Oddymandius
Minmatar
Red Federation
Posted - 2010.02.11 21:57:00 - [38]
 

Edited by: Oddymandius on 11/02/2010 21:58:26
As people are posting fittings...

[Huginn, New Setup 1]
Gyrostabilizer II
Tracking Enhancer II
Damage Control II

Warp Disruptor II
Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I
Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I
Large Shield Extender II
Large Shield Extender II
10MN MicroWarpdrive II

Heavy Missile Launcher II, Thunderbolt Fury Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Thunderbolt Fury Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Thunderbolt Fury Heavy Missile
425mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M
425mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M
425mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M

Medium Ancillary Current Router I
Medium Ancillary Current Router I


Valkyrie II x3
Warrior II x2


410 dps, 24889 EHP. Barrage gives an autocannon falloff of 23 km; Caldari Navy missiles will do better v.s. frigates despite lower EFTDPS. Valks will catch a double-webbed frig easy.

I think the reason the base PG is so low is exactly because CCP wanted to limit the ship's potential as a solopwnmobile by making it difficult to fit for both optimal DPS and tank. So you have to sacrifice rigs to get a decent fit and accept you're not going to get HAC EHP with good DPS. Working as intended as far as I can tell.

Guillame Herschel
Gallente
NME1
Posted - 2010.02.11 22:47:00 - [39]
 

Originally by: Max Hardcase
A general speed advantage is supposed to be the Minmatar thing but what do I know.


Yes. Huginn has that advantage, even with a plate, and especially with 3 webs.





Stygian Knight
Blood Covenant
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2010.02.12 00:09:00 - [40]
 

Originally by: Oddymandius

I think the reason the base PG is so low is exactly because CCP wanted to limit the ship's potential as a solopwnmobile by making it difficult to fit for both optimal DPS and tank. So you have to sacrifice rigs to get a decent fit and accept you're not going to get HAC EHP with good DPS. Working as intended as far as I can tell.




eft warrior please stop efing and try to pvp once for real then you will see that your words have absolutely no meaning.

I dont plate my munins or ships that are ment to have advantage in any kind of range bonus. If i want to kill inties close i can use my hurricane put 3 webs and 2 neuts and say bye bye to swarm of ceptors trying to kill me.

Huginn is a support ship and therefore it should be close with the gang that uses it's range advantage. So your role is to stop ships that are burning towards your friendly group.

Problem is that huginns PG is terrible and he cant use any normal long range fit without spending half of his slots / rigs to fix PG.

So dont say it's good, it's bad. EvE is a multiplayer game and you fly in groups. if you want to play solo and eft every ship for solo - this way >>>>>> star wars

Lilith Velkor
Minmatar
Heretic Army
B A N E
Posted - 2010.02.12 00:17:00 - [41]
 

Originally by: Stygian Knight

Huginn is a support ship and therefore it should be close with the gang that uses it's range advantage. So your role is to stop ships that are burning towards your friendly group.


And that works perfectly well with autocannons and assault missiles, better than artillery for that matter.

Takes some piloting skill and situational awareness though.

Rip Striker
Posted - 2010.02.12 08:14:00 - [42]
 

[Gang support + decent dps]
Damage Control II
Signal Amplifier II
Signal Amplifier II
10MN MicroWarpdrive I
Stasis Webifier II
Stasis Webifier II
Invulnerability Field II
Large Shield Extender II
Large Shield Extender II
220mm Vulcan AutoCannon II,Barrage M
220mm Vulcan AutoCannon II,Barrage M
220mm Vulcan AutoCannon II,Barrage M
Heavy Missile Launcher II,Caldari Navy Thunderbolt Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II,Caldari Navy Thunderbolt Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II,Caldari Navy Thunderbolt Heavy Missile
Medium Ancillary Current Router I
Medium Core Defence Field Extender I
Drones_Active=Hammerhead II,4

All level V: 500 mm scan resolution, dps up to 20km (300-400 dps), 37k ehp, decent align time for a cruiser. And it can web up to 40 km with standard tech 2!

Oddymandius
Minmatar
Red Federation
Posted - 2010.02.12 08:15:00 - [43]
 

Originally by: Stygian Knight
Stuff that agrees with what I wrote but attacks it as if I was saying the opposite.
8/10!

Stygian Knight
Blood Covenant
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2010.02.12 10:41:00 - [44]
 

freeeedom for huginn Very Happy

give him more PG

Lilith Velkor
Minmatar
Heretic Army
B A N E
Posted - 2010.02.12 17:40:00 - [45]
 

More PG wouldnt help the ship at all, unless you insist on putting the least effective weapon system on it you possibly could.

If it really needs a buff, which it doesnt imo, give it an extra mid. Enables it to actually fit a target painter, helps out the "ZOMG nerfed webs" whiners, gives the needed grid to the "I wanna fit lolarties" crowd by freeing up rig slots.

Guillame Herschel
Gallente
NME1
Posted - 2010.02.12 19:19:00 - [46]
 

[Huginn, no ACR lolarties]
Domination 650mm, RF whatever M
Domination 650mm, RF whatever M
Domination 650mm, RF whatever M
Domination Heavy Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy whatever
Domination Heavy Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy whatever
Domination Heavy Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy whatever

Y-T8 Overcharged Hydrocarbon I Microwarpdrive
Stasis Webifier II
Stasis Webifier II
Warp Disruptor II
Large Shield Extender II
Large Shield Extender II

Damage Control Unit II
Tracking Enhancer II
Tracking Enhancer II

2x Medium Polycarb

2x Valkyrie II, 3x Warrior II

Faction weapons are not too expensive and have extra damage modifier that helps make up for lost T2 spec damage bonus (and you weren't really planning on using Tremor, were you?)

John Blackthorn
Foundation
Posted - 2010.02.12 21:19:00 - [47]
 

I've flown Huggins for many years now, been one of my most favorite ships to fly. I've never had any issues with the split weapons, I typically like my triple 220mm auto's with my triple heavy launchers. I've never found a use for the painter bonus. Artileries on the huggin is useless.. too low dps and you miss any target smaller than a battle cruiser. Also if you run a scram on the huggin you have to get to 24km anyway which means your artillery really start to miss shots then.

I would rather have less web range and get a bonus to web strength. If you can put two web's on a target and they can still mwd at 1k then there really is no use to using the web's. mines well use disruptor and turn the mwd off. and the target is still going to drive back to the gate anyway.

The web bonus dosn't need to be 90% again.. but something better than 60% per web would be helpfull.. maybe with level 5 recon they could max it out at 75-80%

Omarvelous
Destry's Lounge
Important Internet Spaceship League
Posted - 2010.02.13 01:15:00 - [48]
 

Originally by: Oriss Amarr
They see me Huginn, they hatin'...


That was outrageously funny.


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