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Nooma K'Larr
Minmatar
Posted - 2010.02.01 05:34:00 - [1]
 

Frozen Corpse Contracts:

You get isk in return for the frozen corpse of the target.

Discuss

Oh and MEDIUM SHADER Evil or Very Mad


Blane Xero
Amarr
The Firestorm Cartel
Posted - 2010.02.01 05:41:00 - [2]
 

Originally by: Nooma K'Larr
Frozen Corpse Contracts:

You get isk in return for the frozen corpse of the target.

Discuss

Oh and MEDIUM SHADER Evil or Very Mad


So now instead of having to get a Friend/Alt to pod me, i'll have to ask them to also pickup my corpse and turn it in aswell!?!


Well that certainly IS too much effort.

Nooma K'Larr
Minmatar
Posted - 2010.02.01 05:45:00 - [3]
 

Originally by: Blane Xero
Originally by: Nooma K'Larr
Frozen Corpse Contracts:

You get isk in return for the frozen corpse of the target.

Discuss

Oh and MEDIUM SHADER Evil or Very Mad


So now instead of having to get a Friend/Alt to pod me, i'll have to ask them to also pickup my corpse and turn it in aswell!?!


Well that certainly IS too much effort.


Exactly.Wink

Since when a bounty hunt supposed to be profitable for the victim?

Carmine Terriv
Caldari
Eve Defence Force
DEM0N HUNTERS
Posted - 2010.02.01 05:53:00 - [4]
 

Mmm.

Maybe have the bounty scale with the $ lost in implants, meaning, if the target is podded with 50 mil worth of implants (The amount he had in him at the time the bounty was placed) payout would be 100%. If since then the pilot had clonejumped into a fresh clone, make it a fraction of the bounty (100% - Base clone cost x Bounty)

That might cut down on friends podding you a bit.

Blane Xero
Amarr
The Firestorm Cartel
Posted - 2010.02.01 06:00:00 - [5]
 

Originally by: Nooma K'Larr
Originally by: Blane Xero
Originally by: Nooma K'Larr
Frozen Corpse Contracts:

You get isk in return for the frozen corpse of the target.

Discuss

Oh and MEDIUM SHADER Evil or Very Mad


So now instead of having to get a Friend/Alt to pod me, i'll have to ask them to also pickup my corpse and turn it in aswell!?!


Well that certainly IS too much effort.


Exactly.Wink

Since when a bounty hunt supposed to be profitable for the victim?
*whoosh*

Haks'he Lirky
Durgarnir
Posted - 2010.02.01 06:59:00 - [6]
 

I do not understand why CCP have not linked it to the prize of the ship blown up.

Bounty: 100mil
Condition: 40% payout of hull price blown up.

If the Bounty target only flies Rifters it is going to take a while for those 100mil to deplete, but still give people extra incentive to hunt down the pirate. And make it fiscally impossible for the pirate to monetize on the bounty.


Nooma K'Larr
Minmatar
Posted - 2010.02.01 07:26:00 - [7]
 

Originally by: Haks'he Lirky
I do not understand why CCP have not linked it to the prize of the ship blown up.

Bounty: 100mil
Condition: 40% payout of hull price blown up.

If the Bounty target only flies Rifters it is going to take a while for those 100mil to deplete, but still give people extra incentive to hunt down the pirate. And make it fiscally impossible for the pirate to monetize on the bounty.




The bounty system is one of those mysteries. Why a major element of eve has gone abandoned for so long by ccp is beyond me. They treat it like a bastard child.

Haks'he Lirky
Durgarnir
Posted - 2010.02.01 07:59:00 - [8]
 

Originally by: Nooma K'Larr
Originally by: Haks'he Lirky
I do not understand why CCP have not linked it to the prize of the ship blown up.

Bounty: 100mil
Condition: 40% payout of hull price blown up.

If the Bounty target only flies Rifters it is going to take a while for those 100mil to deplete, but still give people extra incentive to hunt down the pirate. And make it fiscally impossible for the pirate to monetize on the bounty.




The bounty system is one of those mysteries. Why a major element of eve has gone abandoned for so long by ccp is beyond me. They treat it like a bastard child.


Yeah, really noomaing on this subject.

Mr Kidd
Posted - 2010.02.01 08:38:00 - [9]
 

Originally by: Nooma K'Larr
Originally by: Haks'he Lirky
I do not understand why CCP have not linked it to the prize of the ship blown up.

Bounty: 100mil
Condition: 40% payout of hull price blown up.

If the Bounty target only flies Rifters it is going to take a while for those 100mil to deplete, but still give people extra incentive to hunt down the pirate. And make it fiscally impossible for the pirate to monetize on the bounty.




The bounty system is one of those mysteries. Why a major element of eve has gone abandoned for so long by ccp is beyond me. They treat it like a bastard child.


....because there are no mechanics that prevent the unintended consequence of it being used to to enrich the victim.

Chaos Incarnate
Faceless Logistics
Posted - 2010.02.01 10:36:00 - [10]
 

Edited by: Chaos Incarnate on 01/02/2010 10:38:19
Originally by: Mr Kidd
....because there are no mechanics that prevent the unintended consequence of it being used to to enrich the victim.


^^pretty much this. To make bounties not exploitable, you have to ensure that the payout from the bounty is less than the damage to the player (and you have to properly figure out what the damage to the player is); to make bounties worthwhile to hunt, you have to make the payouts big enough to attract attention.

The two are in pretty much direct opposition, as the only isk damage to the target that CCP can easily quantify is ship basecost and insurance payouts, along with clone costs, which altogether can be pretty low compared to actual losses and the difficulty of killing the target.

Oh, plus, any bounty changes have to not make life as a pirate incredibly difficult

Crimsona Endarius
Posted - 2010.02.01 10:53:00 - [11]
 

Are you a troll, stupid or am I stupid for replying in this thread?

Anyhow, what changes if you have to bring the corpse? Have your alt pod you, take the corpse and give money to your main char the victim?


Psychotic Maniac
Caldari
Head Shrinkers
Posted - 2010.02.01 10:55:00 - [12]
 

Private contracts? But, the only way that would work if you know a reputable bounty hunter. One that will not abuse this by spilting teh booty with the pirate. GL with that. LOL

Wesfahrn
WESCORP 2.0
Posted - 2010.02.01 11:01:00 - [13]
 

The bounty system serves no purpose, they might as well remove it. Then they could implement tradable kill rights :)

NICK NG
Posted - 2010.02.01 11:11:00 - [14]
 

Edited by: NICK NG on 01/02/2010 11:34:15
Edited by: NICK NG on 01/02/2010 11:30:34
Edited by: NICK NG on 01/02/2010 11:29:04
there is one ideia:

for the first bounty kill you get only 20% of the sum (or 10%)
for the second bounty kill you get 40% (or 20%) of the sum and another 40% (or 20%) from the first bounty kill
for the third bounty kill you get 60% (or 40%) of the sum and another 60 (or 40) from the first bounty kill and another 40% (or 20%)from the second bounty kill
and so on ..
and after 5 (or 10) bounty kills you start to get 100% of the sum (and already received all sums from previous bounty kills)

in this way there will be on opportunity to become a real bountyhunter (and become a veteran after 10 bounty kills)

and there will be less profitable to use alt or friend to kill you (he will get only 10% or 20%), if he is not a "veteran bounty hunter"

of course there will be players that will create such veteran bountyhunters for personal use but it will be some kind of effort to do it .... and if the price for the clone rise when you get killed from bountyhunters for second or third time it will be a little bit more harder to "cheat the system"

and riseing the price for the clone when you get killed from bountyhunters can resolve the canfliping problem too ... I mean ....
lets say you go and start canfliping somone and he put a bounty on you ... you get killed from bounty hunter and pay 1 368 ISK (if I remeber corect) for the clone
you go and start canfliping again and again you get bounty and someone kills you, but this time you pay fro the clone 100 000 ISK (or something like that) and if this happen for the third time you will pay 10 millions for the clone ... and so on ...
of course the clone price will rise only if you get killed with bounty on you
in this way I think there will be not so much people that will want to have a bounty on them .. in other words if you "continue" to get bountys on you and get killed for them you will pay more and more for you clone

and when you put a bounty for someone you will know that there is a real "punishment" for him .... rising his clone price

Mr Kidd
Posted - 2010.02.01 12:08:00 - [15]
 

Originally by: NICK NG
Edited by: NICK NG on 01/02/2010 11:34:15
Edited by: NICK NG on 01/02/2010 11:30:34
Edited by: NICK NG on 01/02/2010 11:29:04
there is one ideia:

for the first bounty kill you get only 20% of the sum (or 10%)
for the second bounty kill you get 40% (or 20%) of the sum and another 40% (or 20%) from the first bounty kill
for the third bounty kill you get 60% (or 40%) of the sum and another 60 (or 40) from the first bounty kill and another 40% (or 20%)from the second bounty kill
and so on ..
and after 5 (or 10) bounty kills you start to get 100% of the sum (and already received all sums from previous bounty kills)

in this way there will be on opportunity to become a real bountyhunter (and become a veteran after 10 bounty kills)

and there will be less profitable to use alt or friend to kill you (he will get only 10% or 20%), if he is not a "veteran bounty hunter"

of course there will be players that will create such veteran bountyhunters for personal use but it will be some kind of effort to do it .... and if the price for the clone rise when you get killed from bountyhunters for second or third time it will be a little bit more harder to "cheat the system"

and riseing the price for the clone when you get killed from bountyhunters can resolve the canfliping problem too ... I mean ....
lets say you go and start canfliping somone and he put a bounty on you ... you get killed from bounty hunter and pay 1 368 ISK (if I remeber corect) for the clone
you go and start canfliping again and again you get bounty and someone kills you, but this time you pay fro the clone 100 000 ISK (or something like that) and if this happen for the third time you will pay 10 millions for the clone ... and so on ...
of course the clone price will rise only if you get killed with bounty on you
in this way I think there will be not so much people that will want to have a bounty on them .. in other words if you "continue" to get bountys on you and get killed for them you will pay more and more for you clone

and when you put a bounty for someone you will know that there is a real "punishment" for him .... rising his clone price


So, now the person kills himself multiple times to collect the bounty.

Rising clone costs: How would this not become ridiculously expensive for everyone? And at what point does the cost of a clone become prohibitively expensive to continue playing the game?

There is nothing that can be done with the bounty system which would not either directly benefit the player with the bounty or motivate the player to stop playing the game because of detrimental penalties.

Bounties only work when there are real consequences to incurring them. As there aren't any such consequences in a game without destroying one's player base, the bounty system cannot work.

Be thankful that it doesn't work. Otherwise, like wardec's it would be abused by those with the isk to abuse it. How would you like to be a carebear that incurred an irresistible bounty because your name was randomly chosen? Or a new player that is being griefed? Or an enemy corp to an alliance such as the Goons?

There are no methods I can envision that a bounty system would work as intended without massive abuse. The only way to do so is to institute real penalties such as loss of game privileges to prevent such abuses in the same way that GM and ISD players have real penalties for abusing their positions. And that is never going to happen for the common player base.

Nooma K'Larr
Minmatar
Posted - 2010.02.01 12:13:00 - [16]
 

Killing yourself can be prohibited. We have the technology. The bounty system can be fixed. We have the technology.

CCP just wont.

Othran
Brutor Tribe
Posted - 2010.02.01 12:27:00 - [17]
 

Solution = remove bounty system completely.

All it does is transfer money from idiots to the people who blew the idiots up. You can put it in nicer terms but that's the bottom line.

I've never seen any proposed "solution" to the bounty system that couldn't be circumvented within the terms of the EULA. I don't believe that a cost-effective solution is possible - ie one that doesn't have to resort to manual petitions to make the system work.

Nooma K'Larr
Minmatar
Posted - 2010.02.01 12:32:00 - [18]
 

Originally by: Othran
Solution = remove bounty system completely.

All it does is transfer money from idiots to the people who blew the idiots up. You can put it in nicer terms but that's the bottom line.

I've never seen any proposed "solution" to the bounty system that couldn't be circumvented within the terms of the EULA. I don't believe that a cost-effective solution is possible - ie one that doesn't have to resort to manual petitions to make the system work.


A bounty system whereas if you get killed, you get a reduction in skillpoints. That would work. Non one will get their friends to kill them, and targets will be scared to death of undocking.

Loss of life (the usual deterrent in real life) is not a deterrent in EVE because of cloning. The only things of any value are isk and skill-points.

That would work.

Tornado Bait
Minmatar
Douchingtons
Burn Away
Posted - 2010.02.01 12:34:00 - [19]
 

They should just make bounty hunting something done through agents, the higher your standing with your bty agent the higher the percentage of the bty you are rewarded [lvl 1 10%, lvl 2 20% ect]. Atleast the people who want to get alts to pod themselves will have to spend time grinding standings to do it :)

Doctor Mabuse
Posted - 2010.02.01 13:02:00 - [20]
 

Why make it complicated? Have fixed amounts of bounty, (1 mill, 5 mill and 10mill?)when the target is killed, bounty hunter gets the bounty from whoever placed it, and CONCORD takes the same amount from the target.

Then there is no point killing yourself with an alt/friend for the bounty

Dunno, I'm sure there is a reason why it still won't work though...


Mrs Management
Limited Liabilty
Posted - 2010.02.01 14:00:00 - [21]
 

The "only" way I can see the problem being solved is as follows.

Person A sticks a bounty on Person B 40 Million (for example)

Person C kills and pods Person B and recieves 20-30 million in bounty

The other 10-20 million going in concord Tax, death duty etc etc.

Therefore people cannot make the same isk back when placing bounties.

Just an idea to fix a problem

Julius Rigel
Sub-warp Racing Venture
Posted - 2010.02.01 14:35:00 - [22]
 

Get off my lawn!! Evil or Very Mad

Oh ship... I'm sorry, this is Features & Ideas Discussion, I thought I was in General Discussion, I'm really sorry, Ms. K'Larr, I should have posted something constructive since this is Features & Ideas Discussion and not General discussion. Sorry.

Danton Marcellus
Nebula Rasa Holdings
Posted - 2010.02.01 14:41:00 - [23]
 


Taikun
Gallente
Jovoso
Teldar Paper
Posted - 2010.02.01 15:30:00 - [24]
 

Edited by: Taikun on 01/02/2010 15:31:45
Make bounties liked to the charactor for a given period and take players out of the equation.

I put 1 million bounty on some jerk pirate. Concord then has a mandate to go into low sec for oh.... 14 weeks and kill the pirate over and over and over.

Concord ships will have no bounty and will reduce faction if shot as per usual. This keeps the jerk pirate safely docked up with his Miley Cyrus collection for 14 weeks and it only costs a million.

Simple solution.

Taikun

P.S. I was going to suggest putting a contract/bounty on them in real life but I'll leave that to the Russians and Korean corps. Those boys know how to stop corp theft D.E.A.D.

price checkinho
Posted - 2010.02.01 17:38:00 - [25]
 

In cases of IP bannings, I can see why you would not want to do such a thing, people on the same lan may have not broken rules. However, in the case of bounties you could simply place an IP ban on the targets IP for the collection of the bounty.

Of course *******s whould spoof their IP, but thats harder than what the average douchebag is willing to learn.

Jhoria Englside
Caldari
Posted - 2010.02.01 17:48:00 - [26]
 

unrelated, someone put a 10m bounty of me sometime before last night and i didnt notice. i feel so spacial to have impacted someone so greatly. i only wish i knew who it was so i could mock them.

Mr Kidd
Posted - 2010.02.01 18:06:00 - [27]
 

Quote:
A bounty system whereas if you get killed, you get a reduction in skillpoints. That would work. Non one will get their friends to kill them, and targets will be scared to death of undocking.

Loss of life (the usual deterrent in real life) is not a deterrent in EVE because of cloning. The only things of any value are isk and skill-points.

That would work.


Reduction in skill points?!? Are you insane? Do you not see the ability to abuse that? That it's a double penalty on the person with the bounty?

You'd have people who have spent years playing the game bountied back to noobism. And the player leaves the game multiply by 300,000 accounts.

There is nothing that can be done with the bounty system. Either the player with the bounty can directly benefit from getting his friends to kill him and share it, or, from the suggestions made here, the player that gets the bounty is penalized out of the game. Honestly, if I had a bounty on me AND I lost skills points, or had Concord insta-kill me where ever I happen to be for 14 weeks......are you kidding? Why keep playing the game?!?!?

And even if the latter option were implemented, how long do you think it's going to take until those with more isk than the Jovians are going to start griefing people out of the game just because they can???? Seriously!

You do not want a working bounty system that puts so many restrictions or additional penalties on the person with the bounty.


Violet Serena
Posted - 2010.02.01 18:30:00 - [28]
 

Originally by: Nooma K'Larr
Originally by: Blane Xero
Originally by: Nooma K'Larr
Frozen Corpse Contracts:

You get isk in return for the frozen corpse of the target.

Discuss

Oh and MEDIUM SHADER Evil or Very Mad


So now instead of having to get a Friend/Alt to pod me, i'll have to ask them to also pickup my corpse and turn it in aswell!?!


Well that certainly IS too much effort.


Exactly.Wink

Since when a bounty hunt supposed to be profitable for the victim?



Bounties have always been a problem in games. Established player ramps up a huge bounty on his own head, and has a friend kill him to turn it in.

Happens all the time regardless of whether the cash was intended to get back to the outlaw or not.


Now if the character was perma-killed, or lost half their SP regardless of their clone insurance level, then it would be slowed greatly.

But "you can't play that char" for 14 days, or 30 days, or whatever, would be irrelevant for most established players who don't pull them out half the time, so it's pointless. And longer than that may irritate the player, and thus affect CCP's subscription, go figure! :) So that won't happen, either.


So how do you build a severe enough penalty for being bounty-hunted and killed, such that it isn't rampant for abuse, without making it so severe people ragequit?

Roemy Schneider
Vanishing Point.
Posted - 2010.02.01 18:36:00 - [29]
 

pass the insurance to the killer(s) if the victim has a bounty :D

/me puts a bounty on every NC member with a negative sec status -.-

ohwait...

Jim Luc
Caldari
Rule of Five
Vera Cruz Alliance
Posted - 2010.02.01 18:37:00 - [30]
 

Well, I'm a bit confused by this topic, as I've never heard of this "exploit" before. I've never put a bounty on someone, but whoever puts the bounty on someone, has to put up the money for the bounty, right? So what's the big deal? If, however, it's possible to place a huge bounty on someone without actual ISK, then the easiest way for CCP to fix this is to make it necessary for anyone placing a bounty, to immediately be charged for the entire bounty plus a processing fee, just like a contract.

It would be cool for CCP to set up an assassin system. Agents for hiring assassins, and getting jobs as assassins. The targets would be real, and it should cost a ton to hire someone, and of course depending on how much you spent, the assassin would be varying in skill. They can even work factions into it somehow, hiring a blood raider assassin to take out an expensive shipment from a rival corp in high-sec.

IF I don't need to put up actual CASH for bounties, then I'll be a rich pod pilot in a very short amount of time Twisted Evil


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