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Banana Torres
The Green Banana Corporation
Posted - 2010.01.21 03:41:00 - [1]
 

Am I the only person that uses certificates to decide on my training plan? I read a lot of posts on this forum asking what should be trained next and I keep thinking that if you looked at the certificates the answer is obvious.

What are peoples opinion of certificates? Are they so out of whack with the reality of Eve that I should ignore them. Or do the provide a reasonable way of deciding on a training plan.

TIA.

Tau Cabalander
Posted - 2010.01.21 03:54:00 - [2]
 

Certificates are great for when you are really not sure what to train next.

I wish there were more certificates for advanced roles and capitals.


Harkwyth Mist
Caldari
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2010.01.21 07:47:00 - [3]
 

Some of them are okay to aim for

Core Capacitor
Core Fitting
Core Integrity

Armour Tanking
Active/Passive Shield Tanking

Some are of dubious benefit

Keitaro Baka
Babylon Scientific and Industrial Enterprises
Babylon Project
Posted - 2010.01.21 08:54:00 - [4]
 

Originally by: Harkwyth Mist
Some of them are okay to aim for

Core Capacitor
Core Fitting
Core Integrity

Armour Tanking
Active/Passive Shield Tanking

Some are of dubious benefit


This is basically true.

Most of the people that ignore them tend to be either older experienced eve chars that have been playing for years, people with insider info, or arrogant silly ****s. But mostly the first two groups :)

We (experienced crowd) tend to have pretty specific skill set requirements for what we feel is a good way to get ahead in eve. We'll tend to say stuff like 'first get your basic skills up, those are always useful and are so basic blabla' and tend to go a bit overboard on the lvl 5s.

One of the best things I tell my friends to do when they start eve is (after doing learning skills for a bit) ask for advice on the forum, check what certificates eve suggests and notice how many of those skills actually are the same, after which they can generally make up their own minds.

Certificates are a decent guideline, although personally I prefer to follow experienced pilots' advice rather than those certificates..

Juwi Kotch
KOTCH Construction and Anchoring
Posted - 2010.01.21 08:59:00 - [5]
 

Unfortunately, certificates have got some kind of bad reputation. Why? Because a handful of them are outrightly stupid. The other 300 or so are useful to really good, albeit sometimes rough, guidelines to what to train.

For me, and that was already said, the bigger problem with certificates is, that they are limited to generic skillsets for starter and mid-level pilots. They offer no or only very rudimentary support for some mini-professions like exploration or production, and no support for capital ships. I would like to see the certification system improved and expanded, because generally, its a helpful concept.

Vins Chicago
Gallente
Regent Laboratories
Posted - 2010.01.21 16:03:00 - [6]
 

CCP didn't design certs to be a goal in and of themselves. Personally, I train for specific ships and fits, or abilities I'd like to have. The cert planner is nice in that it groups complementary skills together, so you can see if you have any gaps, but IMO it's a bit of a waste to "collect" certificates. To each their own, though.

L'Petit Object
Posted - 2010.01.21 17:59:00 - [7]
 

I'm a new pilot (1.4sp) - but I have a bad habit of binging on skill books and training for maximum equipability.

TL;DR: Get EVEMON

At this point I own 95% of all the skills that cost less than 1M.

Eg. 'ooh look, shiny ship equipment on market, why can't I use that?' Oh ye old red skill, bought, train to 1.'

Certificates stress diversified skills, and also make clear what the support skills are for weapon types and ship systems. It's especially helpful that it has categories like "shield" and "armor". Also, without having to travel to a fully stocked market, it lets me know what skills I should be looking for.

The next step up is to get Evemon, and formulate training plans, and use its attributes remapping feature. Evemon is fantastic!




Mashie Saldana
Minmatar
Veto Corp
Posted - 2010.01.22 00:47:00 - [8]
 

It is great when someone ask what the support skills are for this or that and you can point them to the related certificate.

Osric Wuscfrea
Gallente
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2010.01.23 01:29:00 - [9]
 

Er, no. Total waste of time with absolutely no merit. A bit like Dominion I guess...ugh

Darthewok
Perkone
Posted - 2010.01.24 08:32:00 - [10]
 

Edited by: Darthewok on 24/01/2010 08:36:02
how to set up training plan:
1. pick ships you want to fly
2. find fits that are decent for it
3. add all prerequisites for ship into the EVEMON training queue
4. add all prerequisites for modules in the fit into the EVEMON training queue
5. add all recommended certs for ship for support skills (see info for ship to see certs)
6. add T2 weapon skills if they already aren't in
7. raise the level of any skills you find are more useful
8. move to the end of the queue or remove any skills in the queue that do not seem urgent
9. accept, if any, any recommendations EVEMON makes for learning skills to speed up your queue
10. cut and paste these steps to anyone asking this sort of question..

step 5 is quite useful.
recommended certs for ships are actually usually quite spot-on, though at times, you may want to remove or train to a lower level 1 or 2 recommended skills as they are not so useful. for example targeting.

Colporter
Posted - 2010.01.24 11:35:00 - [11]
 

I use the certificates as guides coupled with the prequisites for the ships I fly. With both my main character and the hundred or so alts I run through, the Core Certificates are a given, then the recommended certificates for the ships, and finally the occupational certificates.

Patrice Macmahon
The Lost Minmatar Legion
Posted - 2010.01.24 15:00:00 - [12]
 

I have used them quite a bit over the last year to help keep me focused on improving specific areas.

So far I've worked towards Core Competency Elite, Armor Tanking Improved, Turrent Controll Improved, Drone Controll Improved, and the combat oriented profession certs for Gallente. I've found that I am better well-rounded than my uber specialized counterparts and can still go toe to toe with them when it comes to PVP.

Don't try to work on too many certs as they get really time consuming after a while. And the Mining Certs are just rediculuous if your trying to build a miner from scratch. Just shoot for mining IV, and astro geology V so you can sit in a covetor to boost your ore intake, then go back and play with the actual certifications.

Andy Tibs
Amarr
Galactic Express
Posted - 2010.01.25 15:21:00 - [13]
 

I look at my certs a lot to help guide me to what needs to be trained, etc... seems to cut down on my question asking :D

Lo KeTral
Amarr
Ravenous Pathogen
Posted - 2010.02.03 13:33:00 - [14]
 

Originally by: Patrice Macmahon
And the Mining Certs are just rediculuous if your trying to build a miner from scratch. Just shoot for mining IV, and astro geology V so you can sit in a covetor to boost your ore intake, then go back and play with the actual certifications.


I disagree with this, I`m like 3 months from all harvesting certs at elite and about 6 months from the industry skill tree maxed out.

What`s insane looking to me is the gunnery and starter profession certs

Yarinor
Capital Construction Research
Pioneer Alliance
Posted - 2010.02.03 13:48:00 - [15]
 

Originally by: Lo KeTral
Originally by: Patrice Macmahon
And the Mining Certs are just rediculuous if your trying to build a miner from scratch. Just shoot for mining IV, and astro geology V so you can sit in a covetor to boost your ore intake, then go back and play with the actual certifications.


I disagree with this, I`m like 3 months from all harvesting certs at elite and about 6 months from the industry skill tree maxed out.

What`s insane looking to me is the gunnery and starter profession certs


Gunnery ones are fine, You shouldn't get Elite unless you really max something.

Kyra Felann
Gallente
The Scope
Posted - 2010.02.05 01:57:00 - [16]
 

When certificates were first introduced, a lot of them were really odd and had strange requirements and that's why a lot of people dismiss them still. However, they've been improved since then and now they mostly give you a good idea of what to train. I've been playing for over two years and I still use them sometimes. I doubt I would've gotten all my core support skills maxed by now if it weren't for the core certificates, and I definitely don't regret getting those skills trained up. It's easy to overlook support skills and instead focus on training for new ships or modules if you don't look at certificates.


 

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