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blankseplocked re-re-re-thinking about cloak balancing
 
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Sphit Ker
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
Posted - 2010.01.17 12:35:00 - [1]
 

I don't wish for any change to cloak, really. I'm feeding the thought's fire once more, is all.

hmm. How about giving away the distance (in overview) of a cloaked ship and nothing else. No icon, no bracket, no type, no speed, etc. Nothing but distance.

We can "see" there is a cloaked ship on-grid that lies somewhere on the surface of a sphere around us. Cool

Looks cool to me. Thoughts?

Bibbleibble
Posted - 2010.01.17 12:41:00 - [2]
 

A) Cloaks are fine

B) Even if they weren't, this wouldn't solve the main issue people seem to be having with Cloaks (AFK Cloakers)

C) Nerf Local

Cmd BenJames
Gallente
Power Seed Enterprises
Posted - 2010.01.17 12:45:00 - [3]
 

Kind of defeats the point of cloaking, being the ability to disappear completely. If your changes were to be made it would make cloaky's like Recon's and Stealth Bombers completely useless for the element of surprise if they can see you on grid.

Sphit Ker
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
Posted - 2010.01.18 13:46:00 - [4]
 

nah it's not like that. A cloaked ship has an entry in overview giving distance from you and nothing else. No type, no speed details, no icon neither bracket but I digress.

Durzel
The Xenodus Initiative.
Posted - 2010.01.18 13:50:00 - [5]
 

Originally by: Sphit Ker
I don't wish for any change to cloak, really. Here's what I propose to change cloak:

Santiago Fahahrri
Gallente
Galactic Geographic
Posted - 2010.01.18 14:07:00 - [6]
 

Originally by: Durzel
Originally by: Sphit Ker
I don't wish for any change to cloak, really. Here's what I propose to change cloak:


Cedims
Posted - 2010.01.18 14:36:00 - [7]
 

Originally by: Sphit Ker
We can "see" there is a cloaked ship on-grid that lies somewhere on the surface of a sphere around us.


This is the ROOT of the problem. If the "Local" channel was removed, cloakers would be unknown, until decloaked. Which was the original intention, I am sure.

NOTHING wrong with Cloak modules as it is.

(Note: Black Ops ought to be able to fit a Covert Ops Cloak, IMO, it is the natural extension of the CovOps/Recon line of ships.)

Mag's
the united
Negative Ten.
Posted - 2010.01.18 14:56:00 - [8]
 

Originally by: Durzel
Originally by: Sphit Ker
I don't wish for any change to cloak, really. Here's what I propose to change cloak:



This.

OP stop trying to fix things that are not broken.
Your idea would completely finish, finding and setting a warp in position on an enemy fleet.

Try asking for the removal of local in 0.0, if seeing someone in that channel bothers you so much.

Comodore John
Gallente
Trixi IFI
Posted - 2010.01.18 15:22:00 - [9]
 

Quote:
A cloaked ship cannot hurt you. It can't target you. It can't shoot you. Before it can do anything it has to decloak.

Is it honestly that hard to understand?

mchief117
Posted - 2010.01.18 16:40:00 - [10]
 

Originally by: Mag's
Originally by: Durzel
Originally by: Sphit Ker
I don't wish for any change to cloak, really. Here's what I propose to change cloak:



This.

OP stop trying to fix things that are not broken.
Your idea would completely finish, finding and setting a warp in position on an enemy fleet.

Try asking for the removal of local in 0.0, if seeing someone in that channel bothers you so much.


Its funny how you say that as clocking is one of th emost broken game mechanics atm . on one had there is no way to counter a cloaked ship other than the 0.000001% chance of runing into him. and on the other hand all it takes is taht the ship is target locked and the cloak it useless. seriously get out of your security blanket and make the cloak better

Mag's
the united
Negative Ten.
Posted - 2010.01.18 17:07:00 - [11]
 

Originally by: mchief117
Originally by: Mag's
Stuff.....


Its funny how you say that as clocking is one of th emost broken game mechanics atm . on one had there is no way to counter a cloaked ship other than the 0.000001% chance of runing into him. and on the other hand all it takes is taht the ship is target locked and the cloak it useless. seriously get out of your security blanket and make the cloak better


I would reply, if I had any idea what you said, but I can quote something else for you to read.

Quote:
A cloaked ship cannot hurt you. It can't target you. It can't shoot you. Before it can do anything it has to decloak.

mchief117
Posted - 2010.01.18 18:58:00 - [12]
 

Originally by: Mag's
Originally by: mchief117
Originally by: Mag's
Stuff.....


Its funny how you say that as clocking is one of th emost broken game mechanics atm . on one had there is no way to counter a cloaked ship other than the 0.000001% chance of runing into him. and on the other hand all it takes is taht the ship is target locked and the cloak it useless. seriously get out of your security blanket and make the cloak better


I would reply, if I had any idea what you said, but I can quote something else for you to read.

Quote:
A cloaked ship cannot hurt you. It can't target you. It can't shoot you. Before it can do anything it has to decloak.

while that is technicaly true its not like a cloaked ship takes minutesw to uncloak. many a Bs captain has lots a ship due to these so called bombers who can decloak and fire of afew round that deal quite a bit of damage. the only time a cloaked ship cant hurt me is when it has no weapons.

Davelantor
Caldari
The Resistance Movement
Posted - 2010.01.18 19:06:00 - [13]
 

the idea of cloaking is ... to be cloaked .. if you know there is a cloaked ship around .. eventho you havent seen it cloakup ... that would be one of the worst things you can do to cloaking system.

cloak is good just as it is ... does almost every ship that uses it can be considered as a invisible tin can ? ... yes, so stop whining about nerfing the cloaked ships because some ambushed you (guessing).

Reggie Stoneloader
Poofdinkles
Posted - 2010.01.19 05:16:00 - [14]
 

Quote:
A cloaked ship cannot hurt you. It can't target you. It can't shoot you. Before it can do anything it has to decloak.
That's a very myopic view of the situation. The cloak gives the cloaker enormous power, and especially in places where non-military operations are going on, a cloaked ship can be doing a lot of harm just by sitting, watching, setting bookmarks and reporting intel. In some cases, the cloaked ship has enough firepower to catch and kill any non-combat ship with ease and then immediately vanish.

I think it's fine for that to be possible, but afk cloaking creates a perfectly convincing illusion that there's a ship in your system that is wielding that power when it is not. I'm a proponent of a simple solution, a litmus test that allows you to send out a specialized ship to do two things: First, it'll determine whether or not the cloaker is at his keyboard and playing the game, and second, it'll kill him if he isn't. A specialized, weak probe that can--eventually--let you warp to where a cloaked vessel was two minutes ago and then allows you to approach their present location would solve the problem.

The cloaker doesn't even have to be particularly alert. He has to either spot the probes on scan or notice an uncloaked ship arriving on the grid with him, and then warp to another spot, where he'll be totally safe for a minimum of two minutes plus the time it takes his pursuer to probe him down. Not too much work, just some work, and it would achieve two goals: First, it would allow you to be sure that the red in local is actually online and maybe susceptible to convo or local smacktalk, and second it would--on rare occasions--allow people to catch and kill a cloaker due to his stupidity and inattention.

Laurew
Posted - 2010.01.19 06:56:00 - [15]
 

Originally by: Bibbleibble
A) Cloaks are fine

B) Even if they weren't, this wouldn't solve the main issue people seem to be having with Cloaks (AFK Cloakers)

C) Nerf Local


^^ this

DrDooma
Posted - 2010.01.19 07:13:00 - [16]
 

Originally by: Laurew
Originally by: Bibbleibble
A) Cloaks are fine

B) Even if they weren't, this wouldn't solve the main issue people seem to be having with Cloaks (AFK Cloakers)

C) Nerf Local


^^ this


I fail to understand how nerfing local will fix any issues that people are complaining about.

If you think nerfing local is a good idea make post but donít turn this discussion in to something its not.

Killer Gandry
Caldari
Shadow of the Pain
Posted - 2010.01.19 08:29:00 - [17]
 

I think the main issue here is that an afk cloaked ship can be a huge pain in the butt.

All I actually have to do is roll an alt and train him or her up to be able to fly a stealthbomber with some skill.

Fly it out to some system in 0.0, preferably a system where socalled reds have a staging area for ratting or such and put my cloaked alt somehwere afk while I happily grind or PvP on my main.

No harm done for me because I play the game on my main asif nothing is wrong.
In the meantime I am disrupting the activities of the reds by merely being present in system all cloaked up without actually having to do anything else than make sure they know it's a bomber.

Keep the alt there a few days till the guard let's down a bit and then I just play like an hour on the alt and get an easy kill, back to the safespot all cloaked up and back to the main and let them be frustrated in that system again.

I do smell a very thin line between this kind of action and harrassement though to be honest.
Yet there is a line thus making it legal gameplay.

Not the most fair or honest gameplay in my opinion. And certainly not something worth bragging about unless your really shallow and dense I think but still.

Then again a lot of playstyles don't stroke with my gaming style. Does that mean they have to adjust to my playstyle?
No, because then EVE would become a very boring game because everyone would be doing the same things the same way.

So I just play my game and be done with it. I am sure there are people who don't like my gaming style either.

In short, cloaking is fine as it is. People for themselves deside how, when and where to use it with which intention.

Hurricane Carter
0ccam's Razor
Corcoran State
Posted - 2010.01.19 11:38:00 - [18]
 

Originally by: Cedims


(Note: Black Ops ought to be able to fit a Covert Ops Cloak, IMO, it is the natural extension of the CovOps/Recon line of ships.)


THIS !

I love my panther but for the love of god give it a cov ops cloaking device.

Wacktopia
Sicarius.
Legion of The Damned.
Posted - 2010.01.19 13:10:00 - [19]
 

Originally by: Bibbleibble
A) Cloaks are fine

B) Even if they weren't, this wouldn't solve the main issue people seem to be having with Cloaks (AFK Cloakers)

C) Nerf Local


Couldn't agree more. C needs thought but would be fun in 0.0.

Allan Sheperd
Posted - 2010.01.21 05:48:00 - [20]
 

I love AFK Cloaking. Sit in space all day, periodically check every hour or two for that big juicy mining fleet to come out thinking you're still AFK. Drop a bomb, and then escape knowing you're practically immune from most smaller gatecamps.


 

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