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Tillakna
Gallente
Rim Collection RC
Test Alliance Please Ignore
Posted - 2009.11.29 01:38:00 - [871]
 

Edited by: Tillakna on 29/11/2009 01:44:37
Titans can't hit a moving target smaller than a capital under 80km - check

Titans can't refire it's DD after 10 minutes of wait assuming it's still alive - check

Titans can't break the tank of a non-triaged/sieged capital with it's turret/launchers - check

Titans have the usual short Jump Portal range - check

Titans get bumped nearly 100km off after warping to 0 on any object - check

Are you f***ing kidding me?

So basically it's a POS ornament at best, at least it can survive long enough to ponder why I deployed it in the first place in a "epic battle". Rolling Eyes


Edit: WTS Erebus Cool

Corinae
Gallente
Insurgent New Eden Tribe
Systematic-Chaos
Posted - 2009.11.29 03:52:00 - [872]
 

Originally by: Serena Ku
Edited by: Serena Ku on 28/11/2009 13:53:47

Good summary, thanks for taking the time to type it out.

Edit: Drivebys won't really happen since you will be tackled by HICs or bumped by the time you get out of your 30-sec immobility.


Drive-by does not mean you are arriving and warping out in 1 row, it means that you are NOT going to sit voluntarly on the field, you enter the field, doomsday and get out as soon as you are allowed to.

With 5 minutes doomsday you have the choice to STAY in the field, make the "damage sponge" and take damage instead of your dreads fleet and take the advantage of staying there for 5 mins, launch a second strike and keep going, it lower the damage on your dread fleet and while the enemy dreads die your dreads does not.

This does not apply to 50+ enemy dreads because you will die before u can get out in time (and this include killing a bunch of hictors that tackle you in few minutes using support fleet)

With the current hp buffer you can stay in the field, but there is NO REASON to do it because your damage does not worth the cost of your ship.

i say it again:

1) HP boost is fine and balanced, good work.
2) DDD have correct damage, it can be tanked only using specialized fittings and would ruin the dread fitting itself for doing it.
3) 10 minute refire on ddd is too long, does not worth the risk of staying in the field and a super capital ship warping in and our while the "support dreads" are locked in siege looks RIDICOLOUS, 5 minutes is ok, is worth to stay in field and sponge damage.
4) Tracking of XL guns is NOT good, long range guns are completely useless at shooting anything except caps, i understand that CCP want to avoid "solo pwnmobile" but we are speaking about a ship that will NEVER replace dreads fleet, the damage that it pull out is not at least to worth switching from dreads to titans considering the cost.

Solution:
1) Turn back the DDD to 5 minutes refire rate
2) give titans a tracking bonus on XL guns (if you don't want to change the current tracking/siege balance that is good for dreads)

You reduced the tracking of around 50% on the XL guns, make a 10% tracking bonus each level of Titan skill and for caldari make it explosion velocity and explosion radius, 10% too each level.

We are NOT asking the MOON we are asking to have a ship that worth using it in the field, most of us spent years to get in a TITAN, we want to use our ships, that's all.

If you want our ships to blow up in the field in first place give us a REASON to bring them in those epic battles.

Daeyreth
The Ankou
Raiden.
Posted - 2009.11.29 03:53:00 - [873]
 

Edited by: Daeyreth on 29/11/2009 03:54:42
Originally by: Corinae
Edited by: Corinae on 28/11/2009 08:18:53
Update, more test server testing:

Spent some more hours in my erebus, i noticed ccp spawned a lot of officers on a planet and warped there for having a mixed fleet gank me, they tryed it, about 50 people, just 4-5 dreads and made a test with my corp-mates using 10 dreads for some tanking testing.

Summing up the result:
1) The tank is ok, hp boost was fine, my testing show that takes 30 minutes to kill a officer fitted buffer hp titan with 10 dreads, it make it 10 minutes with 30 dreads (the average normal size of a dread fleet nowdays for day to day stuff) and i find it appropriate, we speak about fittings without any active tank, just a lot of hp.
2) The Doomsday is ridicolous, i confirm: 10 minutes is not acceptable, 5 minutes would be good, i tested this thing for hours, the 10 minutes doomsday does not pay off to stay in field, 5 minutes yes, 10 no.
3) The tracking of the guns is still NOT acceptable, you can hit a standing still or very slowly moving bs using BLASTERS (the best tracking XL gun) at 20km or so, if they come a bit more near is impossible, and if you speak about Railguns you can't even hit moving targets at 100km :) completely useless, same as a dread in sige gainst support, the titans need the ORIGINAL TRACKING back.

My hopinion on this as a Titan pilot:

This ship does not worth to be used in the field when there is a big fight going on, the HP are fine, but the ship have no way to change the outcome of the battle, the doomsday is completely useless in a dozen vs dozen capital fights, the only way the DDD is useful considernig the actual numbers is if you bring at least 10 titans in the field, and you shall NEVER bring a titan to a fgiht with more then 50 dreads unless you want to just trash it without even the time to warp out.

So the use of the titan with the current patch become:
1) Using 10 or so titans togheter with a standard dread fleet in "mid-size" capital engagement, 30vs30, 40vs40 etc, when numbers rise to 50+ hostile dreads using the titan become too dangerous. Loosing your 50 dreads cost WAY LESS then loosing 1 single titan.
2) Using it for griefing, camping bridges, camping cyno generators, nuking capitals undocking in NPC space and similar things, pretty useless and horrible works for a super capital.
3) Drive-Bys in capital engagements, warping in multiple ****, doomsday some enemy caps and get the hell out for 10 minutes, i tought ccp wanted titans to stay on the field not to make drive by.
4) The usual mobile Jump Bridge work.

This is the situation, i don't know who are your experts about these things, but i seriously belive they should own one of these things in game, having used it in game and beign at least a bit experienced on wtf goes on in eve.


/signed

Corinae
Gallente
Insurgent New Eden Tribe
Systematic-Chaos
Posted - 2009.11.29 13:59:00 - [874]
 


Let's have a look at some damage comparsion between titans, all the fitting will not use any implant even if we all know that 5% turret damage / or turret rof and 5% falloff and all skills to lvl 5 (all of us titan pilots have very few skills to max out, so usually we do it over time, we will be in our golden grave until we die...) all the fittings does not consider ANY damage mod even if ragnarock could fit some gyros without loosing 20 mill effective hp doing it.

Erebus Blaster:
Antimatter DPS 6167.9 VOLLEY 47215.9 OPTIMAL 15km FALLOFF 11km
Iron DPS 2570.0 VOLLEY 19673.3 OPTIMAL 48km FALLOFF 11km

Erebus Railguns:
Antimatter DPS 3059.2 VOLLEY 31596.5 OPTIMAL 60km FALLOFF 30.6km
Iron DPS 1274.7 VOLLEY 13165.2 OPTIMAL 192km FALLOFF 30.6km

Avatar Pulse:
Multifrequency DPS 5607.4 VOLLEY 47692.8 OPTIMAL 20km FALLOFF 6.3km
Radio DPS 2336.4 VOLLEY 19872.0 OPTIMAL 64km FALLOFF 6.3km

Avatar Beam:
Multifrequency DPS 3373.3 VOLLEY 32788.8 OPTIMAL 45km FALLOFF 28km
Radio DPS 1405.6 VOLLEY 13662 OPTIMAL 144km FALLOFF 28km

Ragnarok Autocannons:
EMP DPS 4870.2 VOLLEY 33136.6 OPTIMAL 12.5km FALLOFF 24km
Carbonized DPS 2029.2 VOLLEY 13806.9 OPTIMAL 40km FALLOFF 24km

Ragnarok Artillery:
EMP DPS 2703.7 VOLLEY 68986.9 OPTIMAL 45km FALLOFF 87.5km
Carbonized DPS 1126.6 VOLLEY 28744.5 OPTIMAL 144km FALLOFF 87.5km

What we see from this comparsion?

1) CCP lied us all, without tracking computers short range weapons are NOT useful for shooting pos's or anything at 40km, for ALL the 3 races of turret titans the DPS at 40km (and you need the longest range ammo for that..) is better using short range ammo on long range guns instead of long range ammo on short range guns, first lie discovered.

2) Short range weapons have a RIDICOLOUS dps while using long range ammo, the only one able to hit decently out of 25km using short ammo and short guns is the ragnarock thanks to the minmatar falloff (and remember that autocannons tracking is very close to blaster one, nice one -.-)

3) The dps using Long range guns with short range ammo (for pos bashing) is ridicolous, we speak from 2700 to 3300 dps.

4) for understanding better, an average Revelation using beams and faction ammo with 3x heat sink (as most of alliance fits nowdays) 4491 dps, so for comparsion:

Avatar with 6x Giga Beam and True Sansha Multifrequency with 0 damage mod (avatar pilot with dmg mod would be IDIOT to waste 20-30m effective hp) make 3373.3 dps a revelation make 4491.7 dps are we JOKING OR SOMETHING? the 200% damage was "too much" ? there was a RISK OF HAVING TITANS REPLACE DREADS?? is this all a joke or what?

5) Now, most of current dreads fitting use long range fittings, with 2x tracking computer or mixing tracking enhancer and tracking computer, giving to the dreads with mid range ammo an ability to fire way over the optimal of a titan, or we are supposed to have a titan fitted as an expendable dread? with 3 dmg mod and 2x tracking mods? again: are we joking or you guys at ccp print ISK and don't know what would happen at using a titan fitted like that? i tell you: survive less then 1 minute under 30 dread fire, very smart of a ship that fitted cost 100b.

6) Since today i'm very bad, and angry (i'm stuck on a netbook) i would like to add another comparsion, what happen if we compare a dread in siege with short range guns and long range guns using a "common" 2x tracking mod fitting against a titan without any tracking module? (same as before, you can't waste tanking mods or cap mods, you are not an expendable dread)

Moros Blaster No Tracking Mods: 0.00338
Moros Blaster 2x Track Comp: 0.00554
Erebus Blaster No Tracking Mods: 0.00677

Moros Railgun No Tracking Mods: 0.0012
Moros Railgun 2x Track Comp: 0.00197
Erebus Railgun No Tracking Mods: 0.00241

Now, look at these numbers people, are we joking or something?

Please CCP, when you balance things take in mind how people fit them and how they WILL fit them with some brain, if you balanced titans with 3x damage mods fitted help

Corinae
Gallente
Insurgent New Eden Tribe
Systematic-Chaos
Posted - 2009.11.29 14:11:00 - [875]
 


Sorry for double post but i finished the space...

Seriously people at ccp, if you want i take a fly to iceland (again) at my expense, i come in ur office and spend all the time you want making you numbers comparsions, whatever you want, i don't ask anything, just PLEASE, listen us, LISTEN US!!!

The mothership threadnought had you guys consider to DO NOT apply changes before planning them well... Abathur on his FIRST titan balance got it RIGHT istantly at the first shot.

Then you guys balanced it out of a "massive" 100 noobs in titan event where they clearly showed to be overpowered.

Then i had to use my calculator and plenty of HOURS of work spent to get some decent numbers up, and HOURS spent in the test server trying in REAL SITUATION using my corporation dreads shooting me for having REAL data and not just "eft" warrioring...

LISTEN US PLEASE!! we are the pilots of the biggest ships in game, even if you say "balancing ships out of cost proved to be bad" yea ok, we got it, we just want to have our ships ABLE TO FIGHT!!!

This dominion patch is a DREAM for all of us titan pilots, we was told that we was going to enter the field and fight togheter with our FRIENDS in this game, and the FIRST abathur proposal was PERFECT for doing it...

Then you destroyed it... i can't yet understand WHY...

Please again, LISTEN US, i don't ask to have any thing fixed in the first dominion patch, is too late, but PLEASE, at least reply here... care at us please..

Liam Fremen
Sys-k Executor and "Sad Panda" Titan Pilot.

Rivek
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2009.11.29 16:41:00 - [876]
 

I'll again echo the sentiments of other titan pilots.

As they are now, with 100% dmg bonuses to large guns and **** poor tracking & range, Titans are simply pathetic.

Large blasters can barely fire the distance equivalent of the length of the ship? So a turret on the front quarter of the ship can't reach a target on the rear quarter? LOLZ? XLarge rails struggle to reach the distance of typical sniper BS? LOLZ?

Tracking is so terrible that you can only hit capital sized targets, unless the target and shooter are both absolutely still... LOLZ?

With the 100% per level damage bonus, DPS is so terrible that you can NEVER break the tank of another capital, which happens to be the only ship you can hit.

As stated by others, Titans now have three potential uses: a) gang booster hiding in a POS giving bonuses to the fleet, b)Jump bridge hiding in a POS, or c) drive by DD against inferior forces where there is no chance of getting tackled.

I thought you wanted Titans to be used on the battlefield? 200%/level + no tracking nerf + 5 min ROF DD + HP Boost accomplished that (the only thing missing IMO was range on XL Weapons). If one side of a conflict ups the ante by bringing a titan onto the battlefield, that titan should have the potential to turn the battle. As it is now, there is NO POINT to deploying a titan into a fight and NO POINT to keeping it on the battlefield.

And just think, the original damage bonus on Titan's primary weapons was 5% letting them achieve epic DPS similar to a BS (i.e. CCP not only misses the mark but fires at the wrong target). Titan pilots hoped that with Dominion they might have a major combat role to play ON THE BATTLEFIELD but apparently will still be relegated to drive-bys and POS hugging. Congrats!

Rivek
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2009.11.29 16:51:00 - [877]
 

By the way, what was so unbalanced about a titan pilot volley'ing BS one at a time?

CCP you originally release titans with REMOTE AOE DOOMSDAYS that let the titan WIPE OUT THE FIELD from OFF OF THE GRID and/or TUCKED AWAY SAFELY IN A POS and (possibly) NOT IN THE SAME SYSTEM?? and yet now you are scared of letting them kill stuff with their big guns.

Right...

Flying Scotsman
Posted - 2009.11.29 17:37:00 - [878]
 

When ccp deployed dominion on a test server, i was really happy with my new brand levi. Removin aoe ddd made our ships VERY vulnurable to sub caps, but ability to deal massive amounts of damage to capitals could make us stay on the battlefield.
Current situation is confusing me. I dont want to use my ship as a garland full of shiney lights, and from what i heard from you, dear ccp, you wanted to give us a role. So at this momemnt ANY titan fails at everything except jump bridging. Levi cant even deal proper amounts damage to capitals (thanks to capital missile/torp nerf). So, just tell us, what we gonna do with our multibillion toys? They've become big toys with no role at all. Atleast they look kewl, especially in your new ad's you've placed everywhere on internet :).
Bring back original bonuses please.

Serena Ku
Gallente
Posted - 2009.11.29 18:29:00 - [879]
 

Originally by: Rivek
I thought you wanted Titans to be used on the battlefield? 200%/level + no tracking nerf + 5 min ROF DD + HP Boost accomplished that


Well said, devblog clearly states CCP intention of having Titans staying in the battlefield and inflict fear and chaos to our enemies.

But in Sisi at the moment it's a laughingstock.

Succubine
Caldari
Succubine Dynasty Technologies
Posted - 2009.11.29 20:17:00 - [880]
 

If you want more dps, range, or tank then you must make sacrifices just like every other ship.

Originally by: Rivek

As stated by others, Titans now have three potential uses: a) gang booster hiding in a POS giving bonuses to the fleet, b)Jump bridge hiding in a POS, or c) drive by DD against inferior forces where there is no chance of getting tackled.


You're absolutely right. Too much hiding in POS and not enough reason to be on the battlefield.

I suggest fleet bonuses only be in effect when the titan is on grid with the rest of the fleet. Also, change titan bridges so that they must be activated 100km+ away from celestials, POS, station, gate, etc.

Now you have a reason to get away from those silly POS and put your sh** on the line.

Corinae
Gallente
Insurgent New Eden Tribe
Systematic-Chaos
Posted - 2009.11.29 20:52:00 - [881]
 

Originally by: Succubine
If you want more dps, range, or tank then you must make sacrifices just like every other ship.

Originally by: Rivek

As stated by others, Titans now have three potential uses: a) gang booster hiding in a POS giving bonuses to the fleet, b)Jump bridge hiding in a POS, or c) drive by DD against inferior forces where there is no chance of getting tackled.


You're absolutely right. Too much hiding in POS and not enough reason to be on the battlefield.

I suggest fleet bonuses only be in effect when the titan is on grid with the rest of the fleet. Also, change titan bridges so that they must be activated 100km+ away from celestials, POS, station, gate, etc.

Now you have a reason to get away from those silly POS and put your sh** on the line.


This remember me someone who say "hey guys i don't have a titan, there are about 0 chances i will ever have one so i complain and say stupid things about something i don't understand"

Natasha Nikolaev
Posted - 2009.11.30 01:41:00 - [882]
 

Edited by: Natasha Nikolaev on 30/11/2009 01:43:21
Originally by: Succubine
Now you have a reason to get away from those silly POS and put your sh** on the line.


Incentive, not limitation, is the proper way to get someone to do something. Making them WORTH taking on the field is the way to get them to put sh*t on the line.

I believe titan pilots want to have a reason to take their ships into a fight much more than they want to sit in a pos and jump bridge/give gang bonuses.

Zeveron
Exiled Gathering
HELL4S
Posted - 2009.11.30 07:29:00 - [883]
 

Quote:
Are you f***ing kidding me?



no they arent.......

Rexthor Hammerfists
Caldari
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
Posted - 2009.11.30 11:05:00 - [884]
 

Edited by: Rexthor Hammerfists on 30/11/2009 11:05:51
Originally by: Natasha Nikolaev
Edited by: Natasha Nikolaev on 30/11/2009 01:43:21
Originally by: Succubine
Now you have a reason to get away from those silly POS and put your sh** on the line.


Incentive, not limitation, is the proper way to get someone to do something. Making them WORTH taking on the field is the way to get them to put sh*t on the line.

I believe titan pilots want to have a reason to take their ships into a fight much more than they want to sit in a pos and jump bridge/give gang bonuses.



But thats the whole problem, isnt it. Two months ago a dev says they want to see titans staying on the battlefield. Now we read a devblog that says
Originally by: DevBlog
The Titans primary value should be as a fleet's logistical backbone
Link
You dont do logistics on a battlefield, its done at poses ninjad in quiet times / safe ways - ie titans are not supposed to be on the field now.

Thats a real loss for eve imo, having a friendly or hostile titan under fire puts the stakes very high, which is what this game is about, many of the greatest battles in eve have been around titans.

Even the trailer suggests that titans are the "endgame", id love to see the look of the video makers face when theyre asked to produce an "That`s Awesome" effect with titans doing logistics. Surely theres a way to balance titans in a way to give enough incentive for their pilots to warp into hostiles caps but at the same time to avoid overpowering them, or forcing alliances to have 50.

Zedone
Shiva
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2009.11.30 12:48:00 - [885]
 

Originally by: DevBlog
The Titans primary value should be as a fleet's logistical backbone


From the people who brought us the remote(LOL) doomsday, and now want to change the ship an oversized rorqual?

Your attempt to change the titan is, so far, terrible. You're basically trying to convert the carnivores into vegetarians.

It won't work, and you'll just end up with hungry and angry pilots.

Titan's don't need to be OMGWTFBBQ machines, but they do need to be scary and worth bringing into big LAGGY fights.

Fix the TERRIBLE XL turret tracking, bring back 200% damage bonus and reconsider the 5/10min DD timer. Please.

Flying Scotsman
Posted - 2009.11.30 13:41:00 - [886]
 

So at this point titans are doomed. Thank you ccp for screwing us. You had chance to give us (titan pilots) to have fun on battlefield, provoking an epic fights whenever titan comes on grid to shoot the targets. Potential titan and POS kills were always a good motivator for people to bring their ships in to the battlefield. Gj on removing most valuable kill for any PvP'er in eve. The future of eve is massive bs blobs, where dreadnoughts and carriers will become an easy prey for any respective bs blob. Sooner or later you'll understand this.
Tbh i am surprised with amount of angry titan pilots here... Looks like only bunch of ppl care about their big toys.

Oh wait, that's because most of them use their ships as intended - 2nd eve window for jump bridge/ship storage tool.

xttz
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2009.11.30 14:42:00 - [887]
 

Edited by: xttz on 30/11/2009 14:42:27
The best compromise I see is:

1) Revert to 200% damage bonus for XL weapons
2) Revert to old XL turret tracking
3) Change to DD to 2.5m flat damage
4) Change DD Operation to reduce DD cooldown by 1 minute per level
5) Give a heavy turret tracking penalty to the DD module when fitted (50-75%), in the same way cloaks have a scan res penalty no matter if they're offline. Titans can either choose to forego their DD and be able to hit BS, or keep one and become an anti-capital platform.

Serena Ku
Gallente
Posted - 2009.11.30 16:11:00 - [888]
 

Edited by: Serena Ku on 30/11/2009 16:17:39
Originally by: Rexthor Hammerfists
...(quotes of dev ping ponged statements and titans changed to uselessness)....

...Thats a real loss for eve imo, having a friendly or hostile titan under fire puts the stakes very high, which is what this game is about, many of the greatest battles in eve have been around titans.


Totally agree with this.

Originally by: xttz

1) Revert to 200% damage bonus for XL weapons
2) Revert to old XL turret tracking
3) Change to DD to 2.5m flat damage
4) Change DD Operation to reduce DD cooldown by 1 minute per level
5) Give a heavy turret tracking penalty to the DD module when fitted (50-75%), in the same way cloaks have a scan res penalty no matter if they're offline. Titans can either choose to forego their DD and be able to hit BS, or keep one and become an anti-capital platform.


Once again a fellow Titan pilot gives a decent suggestion based on actual experince on these ships, a potential change to give us incentive to use them ...a slow RoF instakill deathray itself is not a good incentive.

Natasha Nikolaev
Posted - 2009.11.30 21:50:00 - [889]
 

Edited by: Natasha Nikolaev on 30/11/2009 21:55:05
Originally by: Rexthor Hammerfists
But thats the whole problem, isnt it. Two months ago a dev says they want to see titans staying on the battlefield. Now we read a devblog that says
Originally by: DevBlog
The Titans primary value should be as a fleet's logistical backbone



I agree, that is the problem. I have a feeling Nozh or Hammer woke up in a sweat from a bad dream of all SC and titan gangs and went into panic mode. Sad The fact that CCP actually thinks 200% damage bonused titans would have any chance in hell of replacing/taking over dreads as the main dps of a cap fleet is superbly laughable.

Trenjeska
Chumly Incorporated
Posted - 2009.12.01 01:16:00 - [890]
 

Originally by: Natasha Nikolaev
Edited by: Natasha Nikolaev on 30/11/2009 21:55:05
Originally by: Rexthor Hammerfists
But thats the whole problem, isnt it. Two months ago a dev says they want to see titans staying on the battlefield. Now we read a devblog that says
Originally by: DevBlog
The Titans primary value should be as a fleet's logistical backbone



I agree, that is the problem. I have a feeling Nozh or Hammer woke up in a sweat from a bad dream of all SC and titan gangs and went into panic mode. Sad The fact that CCP actually thinks 200% damage bonused titans would have any chance in hell of replacing/taking over dreads as the main dps of a cap fleet is superbly laughable.


Patchnotes updated to add 100% per level now...

Aequitas Veritas
NibbleTek
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2009.12.01 13:23:00 - [891]
 

CCP should ask the FCs of the 0.0 sandbox if the Titan is now something they fear entering the field.

A ship that intimidates everyone upon entering the field is good for the game, adds a new layer to the fights. The current one will only intimidate mothershippilots and will continue to do so even after a HP upgrade, u simply need a few more Titans to nuke the mothership anyway. And as they are balanced now, thats the only thing theyll be used for. Mothership ganking and ganking other solo capitals... So much fun.

PL brought 10 Titans to a IT fight, getting close to killing a Titan even then...

Varrakk
Menace ll Society
Posted - 2009.12.01 13:58:00 - [892]
 

Edited by: Varrakk on 01/12/2009 13:58:17
Originally by: Aequitas Veritas
CCP should ask the FCs of the 0.0 sandbox if the Titan is now something they fear entering the field.

A ship that intimidates everyone upon entering the field is good for the game, adds a new layer to the fights. The current one will only intimidate mothershippilots and will continue to do so even after a HP upgrade, u simply need a few more Titans to nuke the mothership anyway. And as they are balanced now, thats the only thing theyll be used for. Mothership ganking and ganking other solo capitals... So much fun.

PL brought 10 Titans to a IT fight, getting close to killing a Titan even then...


Very true.
The fear of a Titan entering the playing field is a exhilarating experience. Such weapons of mass destruction is healthy for the game.
They should have been nerfed in other ways.
Who cares nowdays if you get blown up by a Titan and lose a fleet ship?

It's not hard to get them replaced in the modern 0.0.
Jump Freighters and Jump Bridges has dumbed down 0.0 logistics so much.

Amy Wang
Posted - 2009.12.01 18:32:00 - [893]
 

from patch notes:

Quote:
# Titans will receive a boost to all primary hit point buffers by 300%, all secondary buffers by 150%, and all structure by 100%. It should be noted that Titan pilots logging into Tranquility post Dominion deployment will see that shields on their Titan will require time to recharge to reach full strength.


So yet another pre-nerf snuck in at last minute? I'm pretty sure the hp increase was 400%/200%/200% before which was bad enough.

Not that it matters much as with all the combined pre-nerfs the ships are never going to see frontline combat, gotta do some better then this if you want to encourage them actually fighting.

Teshelai Pryde
Posted - 2009.12.01 19:59:00 - [894]
 

Man, this is a tough issue. I feel for you, CCP. I'm in a small alliance and REALLY want to grab some sov, but if titans are too powerful then that's just not possible! So basically, titans need to be useful in LARGE fights but not overpowered in SMALL fights. And honestly I think the current balance changes accomplish this pretty well.

A titan fleet WILL dominate a dread fleet while costing a lot more, that's the point of EVE. What you should be looking at is a fight with 4 titans and some dreads vs 1 titan and some dreads.

There are tons of options for balancing out titans, so I'll only talk about my most unusual and difficult one:

A directional shield. The titan deploys a bloom in front of it that absorbs most or all of the damage coming from that area, possibly even negating damage vs ships behind or right next to it.

This would make titans operate the way they should: Monsters of the capital world that require large modifications to the enemy's strategy to counter, yet NOT really bullies that can come in and eradicate the hopes and dreams of a sub-capital fleet.

Other options include a "reinforced mode" that only lasts a few seconds, forcing large dread fleets to lose precious time retargeting but not really hurting small fleets.

The most controversial idea I've had I think would help the game a lot but kind of hurt its players...is to give the TCU a special bubble that holds one titan and makes it invulnerable, then make it so titans NEVER leave the grid. Thus only one titan per system can be kept safe, and the overall number is limited. At first this would hurt the dreams of many titan pilots, but there are so many titans in production, eventually it would motivate large alliances to get out there and USE them, 'underpowered' or not.

Tillakna
Gallente
Rim Collection RC
Test Alliance Please Ignore
Posted - 2009.12.01 20:00:00 - [895]
 

Edited by: Tillakna on 01/12/2009 20:02:23
nevermind Embarassed

Julio Torres
Di-Tron Heavy Industries
Atlas.
Posted - 2009.12.01 20:32:00 - [896]
 

Judement item Description:

The ultimate expression of God's Divine wrath, this weapon projects a beam of the Lord's holy light, designed to put sinners in their proper place.

Notes: You will be immobile for 30 seconds after firing this weapon. You will be unable to activate your jump drive or cloaking device for ten
minutes after firing this weapon.

Dr 0wnage
The Dark Tribe
Posted - 2009.12.01 21:56:00 - [897]
 

Originally by: Julio Torres
Judement item Description:

The ultimate expression of God's Divine wrath, this weapon projects a beam of the Lord's holy light, designed to put sinners in their proper place.

Notes: You will be immobile for 30 seconds after firing this weapon. You will be unable to activate your jump drive or cloaking device for ten
minutes after firing this weapon.



Well they're kinda getting the idea... now all they have to do is change the firing time and penalty duration to 5 minutes and add "warp drive" in there as well.

What would we have then? A ship worth taking to battle that would actually have to STAY on the field. Interesting as thats exactly what everybody is saying they want...

Natasha Nikolaev
Posted - 2009.12.01 22:18:00 - [898]
 

Edited by: Natasha Nikolaev on 01/12/2009 22:21:32
Originally by: Trenjeska
Patchnotes updated to add 100% per level now...


Yes, and it was 200% per lvl.

Originally by: Teshelai Pryde

A titan fleet WILL dominate a dread fleet while costing a lot more, that's the point of EVE. What you should be looking at is a fight with 4 titans and some dreads vs 1 titan and some dreads.


As soon as I saw the phrase "titan fleet" my suspicions of you being clueless were solidified. Stop posting, ty.

Originally by: Amy Wang

So yet another pre-nerf snuck in at last minute? I'm pretty sure the hp increase was 400%/200%/200% before which was bad enough.


Unfortuantely, I believe you are correct. Sad

OrDeR
Caldari
Muppet Factory
Northern Coalition.
Posted - 2009.12.02 17:12:00 - [899]
 

Edited by: OrDeR on 02/12/2009 17:16:03
What happened to the tracking bonus on my ragnarok ?! still giving out the old fleet bonus for sig rather then the new one. Fix the the bloody titans.

FIX THE ****ING TITANS EMO EMO EMO RAGE RAGE RAGE

Teshelai Pryde
Posted - 2009.12.02 22:17:00 - [900]
 

Let me clarify what I said before: this is a FORUM. It has no bearing on either reality or EVE. Since everyone else has useful tips on small details, I submitted only radical, extreme-case scenarios and solutions.

It's the undying rule of EVE, if it costs a lot of money, players will have an undying fear of losing it, and they will gravitate to large groups in an attempt to negate the risks. I don't give a damn if they do it now or have ever done it, CCP has to think about stupid things like a titan fleet and how it would balance out.

The only thing more useless than abstract ideas like mine are posts insulting said abstract ideas. Come to think of it, this post here is almost as useless. Too bad.


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