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Kaylee Juuna
Posted - 2009.09.13 07:14:00 - [1]
 

It's not too much trouble, but I don't really like warping back and forth between belt and station, so I need to find a hauler. The problem is, I don't know how. Rather, I don't know how to find a trustworthy hauler. Also, I'd rather not join a corp.

What's a good profit share (miner/hauler) ratio? I've heard 50/50, 60/40, and even 70/30. Which is most common?

Signore Kaeota
Caldari
Terra Incognita
Posted - 2009.09.13 07:29:00 - [2]
 

honestly, most common is either as you said, a corp, or an alt account. As a miner / hauler myself, I'd say 70/30 (M/H) is a fair ratio - the miners mines constantly, the hauler is only needed every half hour or so.

BUT! When you get into a hulk, you can push it's cargohold up to like, 18k m3, so if you want to go dedicated miner then warping to / from the belt is easy enough.

That said, if you're positive you want to hire a hauler; have them give collateral to a trusted third party. Only way to make sure anyone in this game is honest unfortunately.

Vinelion
Gallente
V.D.S Mining Inc.
Posted - 2009.09.13 07:59:00 - [3]
 

I've been mining two or three times with random people, I never had a problem.
Just jump to the nearest belt, find a guy mining in a hauler and ask him to work with you. I share 50/50, it seems fair and you usually end up making friends,
with whom you can mine/mission run after.

That said, I'm an eve newborn, and I usually work with new players. Our lack of experience may explain why we trust each other easily Rolling Eyes...




Leather Jack
Kernite Commando
Posted - 2009.09.13 08:45:00 - [4]
 

Edited by: Leather Jack on 13/09/2009 08:51:23
Originally by: Vinelion
I've been mining two or three times with random people, I never had a problem.
Just jump to the nearest belt, find a guy mining in a hauler and ask him to work with you. I share 50/50, it seems fair and you usually end up making friends,
with whom you can mine/mission run after.

That said, I'm an eve newborn, and I usually work with new players. Our lack of experience may explain why we trust each other easily Rolling Eyes...


The value of keeping the 50% deal is also higher than a quick buck for the guy in his hauler.

Edit
Oh, another thing, just because you can't trust anyone in this game doesnt necesarily mean there are no honest ppl playing it. Cool

Ozone71
Caldari
Taishi Combine
Posted - 2009.09.13 16:17:00 - [5]
 

Originally by: Signore Kaeota

BUT! When you get into a hulk, you can push it's cargohold up to like, 18k m3, so if you want to go dedicated miner then warping to / from the belt is easy enough.


Hard to do when you're a serious miner and your low slots are full of MLU's :)

I would strongly suggest that you join a corp. You can still mine alone in a quiet system and haul for yourself (it takes time, but lets you mine alone) but, if you mine where your corpies hang out they will usually love the chance to jump on a can flipper.

Yes you will lose some ore to a can flipper now and then, but you won't have to give away half of it either.

If you want to mine, and share some with a hauler, then I suggest you experiment. Mine a full jetcan, then haul it yourself. Time how long it takes, work out how much ore you would get in 1 hour of mine + haul.

Then work out how much you mine if you never had to haul.

Try and strike a deal somewhere between the two.

Example:
If you can fill a can in 20 minutes, and haul it in 5 minutes. (Hulk + larger industrial)

In 1 hour, pure mining, you can mine 3 cans (haul by corpie or alt)
In 1 hour, mine + haul, you can mine 2.4 cans
In 1 hour, pure mining + 70/30 share, you can mine 2.1 cans
In 1 hour, pure mining + 50/50 share, you can only mine 1.5 cans

Don't give away your ore for an unfair profit share.

You will also need to factor in teh unfortunate risk of can flipping... you may lose 1 in 10 cans... 1 in 5 ... even every second can ... it all depends on how busy your system is.

Letrange
Minmatar
Red Horizon Inc
Cascade Imminent
Posted - 2009.09.14 20:27:00 - [6]
 

Your problem is that equivalently skilled haulers can support more than a single miner. So unless you're using a newbie who can't haul a full jet can, it's a waste for a hauler to support a single miner.

The usual rule of thumb is that in system a single jet can hauler can support up to 3-4 hulks, the ratio goes down based on the number of jumps between the mining spot and the dumping station.

This is one of the main reasons to be in a corp. Namely so that multiple miners can share a hauler for maximum efficiency for all involved. It's not one miner to one hauler it's one hauler to 2-4 miners depending on distance (number of jumps). The longer the trip between hauls the more the hauler gets in pay out.

Neme Nishta
Posted - 2009.09.15 02:32:00 - [7]
 

What you really need is an Orca alt. Industrial Command Ships 4 plus expander IIs and cargo rigs give you almost 180,000 m3 of total space. With the mining foreman mindlink and warfare link 4, you can mine to a distance of 22km and have a significant reduction in cycle time, which are also very useful. You can pretty much clean out a belt with minimal Hulk repositioning and 0-2 Orca roundtrips to station.

Valeronx
Celestial Horizon Corp.
Fallen Angels Alliance
Posted - 2009.09.15 05:44:00 - [8]
 

Originally by: Kaylee Juuna
Also, I'd rather not join a corp.


Then honestly, why are you playing an MMO ?


Kaylee Juuna
Posted - 2009.09.15 07:23:00 - [9]
 

Originally by: Valeronx
Originally by: Kaylee Juuna
Also, I'd rather not join a corp.


Then honestly, why are you playing an MMO ?




Because EVE is fun. No other reason.

Quazal Atreides
Gallente
Low Orbit Industries
Posted - 2009.09.15 10:46:00 - [10]
 

as a CEO of 3 corps (yep have lots of alts and reasons)

I gotta ask why dont you want to join a corp? Is it the taxrate loss etc? because this for normal empire corp is mostly a 5% loss, lots of corps and mine included dont ake any share of your mining, if you wanna be a solo player thats the joy of eve over other mmo, you can, but just dont understand why the dont want to join corps.

Many corps offer great oppurtinity in eve, low sec mining/mining ops/conversation and you can learn many things from players who have played the game and most likely have done everything that you are planning on doing, offer tips some corps even help out financially.

Just curious as CEO why dont you want to join one?

Merlin's Panzer
Posted - 2009.09.15 11:08:00 - [11]
 

As a hauler that can haul 35100km3 supporting just one miner is pretty much a waste for me. When I haul, I haul for corp mates. Unless you are in something that pretty much fills me up in a very short time then it is a waste of time for me unless there are two or three miners.



Panzer

Mara Rinn
Posted - 2009.09.15 11:55:00 - [12]
 

Best way to find a trustworthy hauler is to find lots of scoundrels first :)

Find someone who flies an Orca and talk to them about joining their mining operations. Just like the Colonel (of KFC fame), you'll probably get 99 "no" answers for every "yes", and at least four out of five of the "yes" answers will be from folks who will rip you off.

Just trust that eventually you'll find someone who will actually help. Just be aware that if the hauler is actually flying an Orca, they're boosting your yield/hr by about 60%, and saving you the multiple trips back to station, so they are within rights to ask more than 50% of your take.

Trebor DeCaldar
Caldari
State Protectorate
Posted - 2009.09.15 17:25:00 - [13]
 

I often offer to haul for random people if I am not really doing anything at the time. I'll just throw it in local "anyone need a hauler's help"

The plus is I have Mining Foreman 5 and Mining Director 2, plus several other leadership skills... so you get a nice little bonus too if I am made the booster.

Komatose
Caldari
Posted - 2009.09.16 02:33:00 - [14]
 

Originally by: Neme Nishta
What you really need is an Orca alt. Industrial Command Ships 4 plus expander IIs and cargo rigs give you almost 180,000 m3 of total space. With the mining foreman mindlink and warfare link 4, you can mine to a distance of 22km and have a significant reduction in cycle time, which are also very useful. You can pretty much clean out a belt with minimal Hulk repositioning and 0-2 Orca roundtrips to station.



You mine more, faster with 2x hulk than hulk + orca

Minimum needed for orca effectiveness is 2x hulk + orca

Yes you lose mining time warping. But its more than made up for by the extra hulk.

2x hulk, + orca = Actual gain, small, but present.

Amodeus Dralnalak
Posted - 2009.09.16 04:16:00 - [15]
 

I think that the share you have to give the hauler is going to be dependent on the local market and how much the hauler is making. As was stated above, one miner can't fill one hauler.

However, one solution to the "honest hauler" problem is to offer to sell them the ore right in the belt. See the ore for a percentage of market price. You give them the ore, they give you the money right there. This way they won't have multiple loads of your ore in their station that they can run off with.

Neme Nishta
Posted - 2009.09.16 17:16:00 - [16]
 

Originally by: Komatose


You mine more, faster with 2x hulk than hulk + orca

Minimum needed for orca effectiveness is 2x hulk + orca

Yes you lose mining time warping. But its more than made up for by the extra hulk.

2x hulk, + orca = Actual gain, small, but present.


While this is absolutely true Komatose, the OP is tired of running back and forth to station. The Orca is an excellent option in this case.

Mercurye
Nubian Sundance
Posted - 2009.09.17 10:23:00 - [17]
 


While I am not hauling as a "profession" I occasionally use a transport to do some hauling for people, either people from former corps or more often people new to the game. I dont really charge much, usually just a small set price as a token, and a smile in return does wonders aswell ^^ Its just to pass time and focus on helping instead of working on my own wealth. Call it relaxing :)

I did it 3 days ago with someone I met in local who was near a starter area. He was asking for some help and I couldnt resist, we started chatting a little yes, that was quite, casual, fun, and great for him :)

Just convo or message me in ingame and Ill see if I can do something


 

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