open All Channels
seplocked Features and Ideas Discussion
blankseplocked So you died? remove the clone SP loss
 
This thread is older than 90 days and has been locked due to inactivity.


 
Pages: [1] 2

Author Topic

Visir
Caldari
SniggWaffe
Posted - 2009.09.10 20:24:00 - [1]
 

edit]Edited by: Visir on 10/09/2009 20:26:28
2009.09.10 19:45
So you died? Well you have a Clone Grade Alpha at xxxxx Enjoy your afterlife. Note that 517805 skill points were lost from the skill Large Energy Turret.

You were last cloned at 2009.09.09 19:02:00

I died in 0.0 yesterday, logged of, logged on now, spotted a gang on a gate, was giving intel and didnt notice that i got bumped. Was poded and figured, well nvm. its only 650k for a new clone. Then i realized i didnt upgrade my clone. This has happened once before a couple of months ago with the same skill.

Now feel free to call me a noob, becouse i realize this isnt something that happens a lot to most people, but when it happens, you have **** learning skills, go a lot of solo in 0.0 and thus dont carry any implants, this basically kills my motivation, when i have to spend a total of 50 ******* days training ONE skill....

Now someone tell me this:

HOW EXACTLY DOES THIS **** IMPROVE GAMEPLAY? ITS JUST ANNOYING AND IT DOESN'T HELP ANYONE THAT YOU LOSE 2 WEEKS OF SKILLTRAINING EVERY ONCE IN A WHILE!
I DONT CARE IF ITS SOME PART OF THE HISTORY OF EVE!!! ITS JUST A HORRIBLE IDEA TO IMPLENT IN A GAME WHERE YOU CANT ACTUALLY IMPROVE YOUR SKILLS ANY OTHER WAY THAN LETTING TIME PASS! (TWO ******* WEEKS WORTH OF SKILLTRAINING THAT IS)

I realize most of u will just say im a ****** etc, but seriously, why was this ever implented in the game? in total due to my PVP career i have now lost a total of 1m SP in 2 months, and since i dont carry implants i allready have a **** sp/h ratio... (I would have to spend 40days to train bs lvl 5..)

Proposal: Remove this ****, or mate it so that instead of having to buy the clone manually, you automatically pay a set amount of ISK for each SP u have at the time you die.

_OR_ have some way of paying to get a 'brain recontruction' or something... Or simpy ad a somewhat usefull LP store item, like say, a booster that give u 200% skill training for a few days (for a price ofcouse..)

Discuss, **** in my face or whatever you want to do...

Please don't evade the profanity filter. Zymurgist


mchief117
Posted - 2009.09.10 20:31:00 - [2]
 

i fully understand how losing something that takes time to get be it ship or SP suchs the big one. and i agree , maybe make it so that instead of buying higher clones to save SP when you die it takes longer for your clone to grow the more SP you have and higher level clones are grown faster. hence you have 10M SP it takes 30 Min's with a basic clone to be able to play again while a good level clone reduces this to 5 Min's ( just generating random numbers )

Lythane
Posted - 2009.09.10 20:37:00 - [3]
 

No. Dying should be a very bad thing, shouldnt be made easier.

Visir
Caldari
SniggWaffe
Posted - 2009.09.10 20:43:00 - [4]
 

Well i agree that it shouldn't be risk free, but this was simply a case of forgetting to update the clone.. should i be punished with losing 2 weeks of training loss for not remembering this ONE SMALL WORTHLESS FETURE?

Its not like it cost anything to lose a pod if its actually insured, so actually your point is invalid. If you want to make it costly to lose pods all the time, then make it cost 0.5 ISK for each SP u have if u get podded to whoever makes the pods to make u a new one.

Tokyo Vigilante
Amarr
Blue Republic
RvB - BLUE Republic
Posted - 2009.09.10 21:05:00 - [5]
 

I like the Pod buying idea Vis might make the bounty system more viable if they cost a lot depending on what type you have. We could have cool ones with go faster stripes and stuff.

But what happens if you have not got the ISK to get a new one?

Pother
Ordnance Tech Systems
Posted - 2009.09.10 21:07:00 - [6]
 

It's part of one of the largest facets this game has, and that's the fact that there are consequences to your actions in this game. With everything you do you put yourself, your assets, and sometimes others at risk, and it isn't always something to be taken lightly. If this game teaches anyone anything it should be patience, attention to detail, and how to deal with actual losses.

I see no issues with this facet of the game, and I feel developers could make better use of their time elsewhere.

Visir
Caldari
SniggWaffe
Posted - 2009.09.10 21:35:00 - [7]
 

I dont need cpt. obvious to come tell me that there are risks in this game. Its actually the one reason why i think its better than any other MMO out, but when it goes as far as removing basically the ONLY thing you cant replace no matter how hard you try, then thats killing the gameplay. If i lose a 200m BS, then thats basically internetspaceshipgamemoney. i can replace that by buying a GTC, doing mission, you name it. When i lose 2 weeks of skill training time, then thats taking away 2 week that i cant buy or reproduce in any way! The only thing i can do is to wait two new weeks, and se my entire skillplan for something beeing delayed another two weeks. If there was some way of earning SP ingame other than having to simply wait, then this would be perfectly OK, but the system that is currently in the game is so invisible and literally serves NO other purpose than to upgrade your clone or make a jump clone.

I sort of guess this is how CCP does griefing. I kill **** and **** in peoples faces when im bored. I guess they make you pay for it, then take away what you have buildt up during some of that time.

VoiceInTheDesert
Inroads
Posted - 2009.09.10 21:39:00 - [8]
 

Good compromise would be to have a warning screen "you are about to undock with an outdated clone. Continue: Yes/No?"

Then it would be more about knowing risk than simply punishing players for forgetting to spend a rather arbitrary amount of money.

Mad Maulkin
Posted - 2009.09.10 21:46:00 - [9]
 

or when you die, buy a new clone, should be easy, you are allready in a medical facility...

Santiago Fahahrri
Gallente
Galactic Geographic
Posted - 2009.09.10 21:49:00 - [10]
 

Actions -> Consequences

Lack of Action -> Consequences

Wrong Actions -> Consequences

Working as designed and should not be changed.

Terianna Eri
Red Federation
RvB - RED Federation
Posted - 2009.09.10 22:26:00 - [11]
 

Originally by: Visir
Now feel free to call me a noob, becouse i realize this isnt something that happens a lot to most people, but when it happens, you have **** learning skills, go a lot of solo in 0.0 and thus dont carry any implants, this basically kills my motivation, when i have to spend a total of 50 f*cking days training ONE skill....

noob

part of game, won't make same mistake again, you were already in a station with a med facility when you died the first time, consequences, etc.

Tarron Sarek
Gallente
Biotronics Inc.
Initiative Mercenaries
Posted - 2009.09.11 00:02:00 - [12]
 

I agree, it's annoying.
But there are many potentially annoying things in EVE. Losing SP is not the only reason among them which has the potential to make someone stop playing.
So where to start? Where to stop?
Removing all of them is impossible, without degrading the game to mining or L3 mission running in a drake in empire.
You can lose ships, very expensive ships. You can lose all your assets. You can be scammed. You can be backstabbed. You can lose skillpoints. It's all annoying. It's part of the harsh world.

That's EVE.

Metalcali
Posted - 2009.09.11 00:14:00 - [13]
 

Originally by: Visir
Well i agree that it shouldn't be risk free, but this was simply a case of forgetting to update the clone.. should i be punished with losing 2 weeks of training loss for not remembering this ONE SMALL WORTHLESS FEATURE?

Obviously it doesn't seem that worthless seeing as you need it or take a penalty for your forgetful mind. After all, you are brought back where you clone resides, doesn't seem that hard to just purchase a new one on the spot. But I can imagine how stressful that is, bringing up a small menu and clicking a button, must be just as hard as turning on a computer to play said game Rolling Eyes

Tau Dades
Caldari
Even End of the Universe
Posted - 2009.09.11 01:16:00 - [14]
 

Edited by: Tau Dades on 11/09/2009 01:17:11
Originally by: Visir
should i be punished...for not remembering this ONE SMALL WORTHLESS FETURE?


If I get permajammed by a falcon should I be punished for not remembering to fit eccm?

If I lose training time should I get punished for forgetting to set up my skill queue?

If I get podded because I got bubble camped, should I get punished because I forgot to fit a mwd?

If I sell an item worth 1,000,000 ISK for 10,000 ISK should I get punished because I forgot to put in some extra zeroes?

If I lose my CNR in a mission should I get punished for forgetting to turn my tank on?

would you like me to continue? or did you get the picture?


update your clone.

xOm3gAx
Caldari
Stain of Mind
Posted - 2009.09.11 01:33:00 - [15]
 

Originally by: Tau Dades
Edited by: Tau Dades on 11/09/2009 01:17:11
Originally by: Visir
should i be punished...for not remembering this ONE SMALL WORTHLESS FETURE?


If I get permajammed by a falcon should I be punished for not remembering to fit eccm?

If I lose training time should I get punished for forgetting to set up my skill queue?

If I get podded because I got bubble camped, should I get punished because I forgot to fit a mwd?

If I sell an item worth 1,000,000 ISK for 10,000 ISK should I get punished because I forgot to put in some extra zeroes?

If I lose my CNR in a mission should I get punished for forgetting to turn my tank on?

would you like me to continue? or did you get the picture?


update your clone.


^^
LoL you stole my post! Shocked

Seriously man, in all my years of playing this game i have never once forgotten to update my clone. Its not that hard really. You wake up in a med station.

I mean i've been playing nearly 6 years now and never, i mean never have i forgotten even when i was a noob. This game does not cater to the player. You make this game and other players cater to you. If you die and lose sp thats your own fault not ccp's.

To fix your sp/hr ratio try doing 2 things, first train up your learning skills... all of them to at least level 4, and then remap! That will fix that.

Also, you think thats bad? every time i die it costs me 30mil + 10 implants, yeah it sux but it doesnt happen often =P and yeah i replace them get back in another ship and go get even. Its a solid feature that makes a way for isk to LEAVE the game which is needed. And tbh i wouldnt want it any other way, death needs to have serious consequences to give meaning to yourself in the game.

Craeder
Posted - 2009.09.11 02:36:00 - [16]
 

How hard would it be to code EVE to gank your wallet everytime your podded at the last grade of clone you set it at? You choose Mu, which is twice your current SP and cost 5 million to upgrade, but every time you die (say 10 times in a day) it auto charges you 5 million and you don't have to think about it. With the adding of a skill que, CCP made one thing easier. Why not something like this idea to make life easier, otherwise remove the skill que right now.

DitchDigger
Posted - 2009.09.11 02:47:00 - [17]
 

The problem with skill loss is that it is absolutely unrecoverable given EVE's passive training system. No matter what, you will now always be X points behind. I like the passive training but I think there should be some way to regain points lost in this way.

Saju Somtaaw
Kagan-Kincaid Enterprises
Posted - 2009.09.11 03:08:00 - [18]
 

Working as intended, leave it alone. My problem isn't forgetting to get a new one the few times I am podded, but updating it when I surpass the SP it saves. One thing I think would work was the option to sign a long term contract that would update the clone when your podded, and check and update as necessary when you surpass what it saves. Of course it would cost extra ISK, and should be done for x period of time like insurance.

Diabolyc
Amarr
Tea Club
Posted - 2009.09.11 03:41:00 - [19]
 

i cant stop laughing LaughingLaughingLaughing

BeanBagKing
Terra Incognita
Intrepid Crossing
Posted - 2009.09.11 04:13:00 - [20]
 

Edited by: BeanBagKing on 11/09/2009 04:14:09
Originally by: VoiceInTheDesert
Good compromise would be to have a warning screen "you are about to undock with an outdated clone. Continue: Yes/No?"

Then it would be more about knowing risk than simply punishing players for forgetting to spend a rather arbitrary amount of money.



This is the only post I've seen in here worth 2 cents. I agree that action, or lack thereof, should have serious consequences. However, we have warning dialogs for entering low sec, and for entering wormholes. If we try to shoot someone in high sec we get a dangerous action warning. There are times people simply forget to and make a noob mistake.

If we could simply say "awww @#$@ now I have grind rats to buy skills back" then I'd say no warning screen. However, when you could lose months, or potentially years, of time just from one mistake I think that's a little much. No one single mistake should cost you 6 months of paying $15 a month.

I'm NOT voting to remove punishment for not updating your clone, just a "your about to do something stupid" warning. If you continue after that, then it isn't a mistake and you have nobody to blame but yourself and your own stupidity.

If nobody wants this, then I vote instead we remove warnings for EVERYTHING else (low sec, wormhole, firing on someone in high sec, etc).

ThaDollaGenerale
North Eastern Swat
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2009.09.11 04:27:00 - [21]
 

Oh man, the OP is a beautiful collection of tears.

Quoted for posterity.

Quote:
dit]Edited by: Visir on 10/09/2009 20:26:28 2009.09.10 19:45 So you died? Well you have a Clone Grade Alpha at xxxxx Enjoy your afterlife. Note that 517805 skill points were lost from the skill Large Energy Turret. You were last cloned at 2009.09.09 19:02:00 I died in 0.0 yesterday, logged of, logged on now, spotted a gang on a gate, was giving intel and didnt notice that i got bumped. Was poded and figured, well nvm. its only 650k for a new clone. Then i realized i didnt upgrade my clone. This has happened once before a couple of months ago with the same skill. Now feel free to call me a noob, becouse i realize this isnt something that happens a lot to most people, but when it happens, you have **** learning skills, go a lot of solo in 0.0 and thus dont carry any implants, this basically kills my motivation, when i have to spend a total of 50 ******* days training ONE skill.... Now someone tell me this: HOW EXACTLY DOES THIS **** IMPROVE GAMEPLAY? ITS JUST ANNOYING AND IT DOESN'T HELP ANYONE THAT YOU LOSE 2 WEEKS OF SKILLTRAINING EVERY ONCE IN A WHILE! I DONT CARE IF ITS SOME PART OF THE HISTORY OF EVE!!! ITS JUST A HORRIBLE IDEA TO IMPLENT IN A GAME WHERE YOU CANT ACTUALLY IMPROVE YOUR SKILLS ANY OTHER WAY THAN LETTING TIME PASS! (TWO ******* WEEKS WORTH OF SKILLTRAINING THAT IS) I realize most of u will just say im a ****** etc, but seriously, why was this ever implented in the game? in total due to my PVP career i have now lost a total of 1m SP in 2 months, and since i dont carry implants i allready have a **** sp/h ratio... (I would have to spend 40days to train bs lvl 5..) Proposal: Remove this ****, or mate it so that instead of having to buy the clone manually, you automatically pay a set amount of ISK for each SP u have at the time you die. _OR_ have some way of paying to get a 'brain recontruction' or something... Or simpy ad a somewhat usefull LP store item, like say, a booster that give u 200% skill training for a few days (for a price ofcouse..) Discuss, **** in my face or whatever you want to do... Please don't evade the profanity filter. Zymurgist

Heroldyn
Posted - 2009.09.11 07:29:00 - [22]
 

today i approched someone in 1on1 but i forgott my ammunition and so i could not shoot. why require ammo ? its a bad system that is not fun to anyone. changeplz?

Sidus Isaacs
Gallente
Posted - 2009.09.11 07:53:00 - [23]
 

Originally by: Visir
edit]Edited by: Visir on 10/09/2009 20:26:28
2009.09.10 19:45
So you died? Well you have a Clone Grade Alpha at xxxxx Enjoy your afterlife. Note that 517805 skill points were lost from the skill Large Energy Turret.

You were last cloned at 2009.09.09 19:02:00

I died in 0.0 yesterday, logged of, logged on now, spotted a gang on a gate, was giving intel and didnt notice that i got bumped. Was poded and figured, well nvm. its only 650k for a new clone. Then i realized i didnt upgrade my clone. This has happened once before a couple of months ago with the same skill.

Now feel free to call me a noob, becouse i realize this isnt something that happens a lot to most people, but when it happens, you have **** learning skills, go a lot of solo in 0.0 and thus dont carry any implants, this basically kills my motivation, when i have to spend a total of 50 ******* days training ONE skill....

Now someone tell me this:

HOW EXACTLY DOES THIS **** IMPROVE GAMEPLAY? ITS JUST ANNOYING AND IT DOESN'T HELP ANYONE THAT YOU LOSE 2 WEEKS OF SKILLTRAINING EVERY ONCE IN A WHILE!
I DONT CARE IF ITS SOME PART OF THE HISTORY OF EVE!!! ITS JUST A HORRIBLE IDEA TO IMPLENT IN A GAME WHERE YOU CANT ACTUALLY IMPROVE YOUR SKILLS ANY OTHER WAY THAN LETTING TIME PASS! (TWO ******* WEEKS WORTH OF SKILLTRAINING THAT IS)

I realize most of u will just say im a ****** etc, but seriously, why was this ever implented in the game? in total due to my PVP career i have now lost a total of 1m SP in 2 months, and since i dont carry implants i allready have a **** sp/h ratio... (I would have to spend 40days to train bs lvl 5..)

Proposal: Remove this ****, or mate it so that instead of having to buy the clone manually, you automatically pay a set amount of ISK for each SP u have at the time you die.

_OR_ have some way of paying to get a 'brain recontruction' or something... Or simpy ad a somewhat usefull LP store item, like say, a booster that give u 200% skill training for a few days (for a price ofcouse..)

Discuss, **** in my face or whatever you want to do...

Please don't evade the profanity filter. Zymurgist




Whats funny is that this happend to you not only once, but twice! Laughing

EVE is harsh, and death should have implications unless you take appropriate steps and make sure you got your cloe ok. This is not hold-your-hand-carebear-WOW.

You got what you deserved, and the games runs as it should.

Ovous
Posted - 2009.09.11 08:39:00 - [24]
 

first of all the author needs to calm down :P

and secondly the game is designed to be unforgiving simply put you character is not an extension of yourself in a game it is subject to as much realism as they can engineer into the game and as such the in game reality stipulates cloning technology, but we aren't talking in absolutes here this is no ideal civilisation, these are people pulled away from mother earth and left to their own devices for a shed load of years. science doesn't have all the answers and unless you scan in and copy your neural patterns how can you expect the clone bays to know what to clone to keep your skills up to date if they only have an outdated scan of your brain?

perhaps you should invest in some implants, there cheap and kind of a necessity here for training, that thirty days will go down to like 25 depending on what your baser stats are

also invest in EVE mon, it tells you when your clone is out of date, and by the sounds of it, you need reminding

and also do relax a little, so what is two weeks training? if i want to fly battleships effectively it tells me i need 190 days training >_> im happy to wait,

lastly, paid for training boosts? no not at all, that just broadens the gap between rich and poor and gives even more purpose to ISK traders. once you cap a certain ability level you will be light years ahead of anyone else training up, and the older players who had to train prior to implants, double xp when starting or the second tier learning skills would be absolutely justified in rage quitting if that little doozy ever came out

moral of the story, this was your mess up, the rest of us don't need to have it done for us, why not have our items automatically set there prices so their always the best on the market by that fabled .01 ISK or have it so our pod auto warps away the second it can do it with no input from players? <-- player error is a factor here, your that minority group that thought they could ignore it, or forgot it, and now you have a reason to remember YARRRR!!

Fullmetal Jackass
Posted - 2009.09.11 08:52:00 - [25]
 

Your clones cost you 650k? LOLOLOLOLOLOL poor thing. Mine are like 13 mil a pop. (It's been a while since I had to buy one.) If I pvp even moderately out in 0.0 I buy 2 or 3 a month at least. I've been playing over 3 years, never lost a single skill point to being podded. Check your clone before you undock. Every time. Period. Ya might housing your clone in a station that has a med bay too. That way when you do get podded, you can buy a new one first thing.

Now I can at least understand where you are coming from. I can be a bit absent minded and forget important things. It's cost me a few ships over the years. It might be nice if there was a pop up warning if you are about to undock with only an alpha grade clone backing your sp up.

I personally would prefer if they lowered the price of high end clones. It costs me way too much to get podded now a days.

Veliria
Posted - 2009.09.11 09:20:00 - [26]
 

You clumsy pilot Razz

Saithe
Caldari
Posted - 2009.09.11 09:47:00 - [27]
 

ive been drunk too many times and got podded, then get on the next day with a hangover and go casually pvp, only to realize i forgot to update my clone after my pod gets tackled. talk about adding insult to injury. maybe ccp should just add a button you can click when you first log in that asks if your drunk or not. if you are, anything you do doesnt matter and the next time you log in everything is perfect in your perfect little world.

imo, go the **** back to wow.

Visir
Caldari
SniggWaffe
Posted - 2009.09.11 12:01:00 - [28]
 

I was in a rage mood when i wrote this, no doubt.

This is not about being stupid or something, also i DO not make this mistake often. However i think that when there is a system that allows absolutely no way of regaining these skills, there should atlest be some kind of warning about it. This was as im sure atleast SOME of you were able to see, a situation where i simply wasn't paying attention to it becouse i was omw to a tradehub when i spotted this gang. (lowsec so i didt really think about it.. who would?)

To all of u still saying that everything has consequences in this game, thats fine. I have no problem with losing a ship or 20 in a day. If i forgot to bring ammo, OK. I ****ed up. Ill get a new ship. No harm done, just lost some virtual money. I lose my pod that isnt updated; Harm is actually done here since no amount of effort can replace whats lost. Thats really my point. Im not quiting becouse of this, i know that i will probably forget this atleast a few more times. All i ask is that there is SOME kind of warning and ill be happy with that. Also to the guy who said 'get some implants' l2read. If i lose my clone 5-10 times a day, then +3's are going to be expensive to replace all the time. If you dont do solo in 0.0 and lose your pod as often as me, then tbh im not interested in hearing how awesome you are. Fact is that its VERY easy to forget just once when your not really interested in surviving on ur roam, and mostly after the GF's.

Nikola Tessla
Posted - 2009.09.11 12:41:00 - [29]
 

Its a n00b mistake.

In almost 4 years of playing I've never lost a single SP on any of my characters due to being podded.

You just need to remember to upgrade your clone if you get killed. It should be the FIRST thing you do.

THey can't remove this. Like was mentioned above, its one of the key things in the game. That's one of the things that makes this game so much better than other MMOs, you are actually penalized for dying and penalized again if you aren't paying attention.

Nika Dekaia
Posted - 2009.09.11 13:03:00 - [30]
 

Originally by: Nikola Tessla
Its a n00b mistake.

In almost 4 years of playing I've never lost a single SP on any of my characters due to being podded.

You just need to remember to upgrade your clone if you get killed. It should be the FIRST thing you do.

THey can't remove this. Like was mentioned above, its one of the key things in the game. That's one of the things that makes this game so much better than other MMOs, you are actually penalized for dying and penalized again if you aren't paying attention.
This.

And no, NO warning. You could actually not forget it anymore, which would defeat the point in having that loss mechanic in the first place.

A pal of mine lost BS V not once, but twice. He did not run to the forums crying about his own dubness. I'm looking forward to his third screw-up, actually. Laughing


Pages: [1] 2

This thread is older than 90 days and has been locked due to inactivity.


 


The new forums are live

Please adjust your bookmarks to https://forums.eveonline.com

These forums are archived and read-only