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Lian Ming
Posted - 2009.09.02 16:16:00 - [1]
 

Edited by: Lian Ming on 02/09/2009 16:17:16
I am trying to determine the interest in a SuperCap Parking Corporation (SCP Corp).

I have the following idea and wondered if anyone would be interested in either buying in or storing their suprcapital ship.

I posted this in CAOD to get the response from alliances and corps, now I am wondering what the market people think.

Mission Statement-
This corporation exists to provide secure supercapital parking to any customer regardless of alliance or history. The full value of the ship will be fully secured by third parties and the ship will always be available to the owner upon request.

Corporate Rules-
Any pilot seeking parking for his/her Titan or Mothership will bring the ship to a low-security POS, the cyno will be provided if asked for.

TheOwner Pilot will be given a password to pilot the ship inside the shields. After ejecting from the ship a suitablestoring pilot of SCP Corp will then enter the ship and jump it to an unknown destination and log off, securing the ship. The storing pilot will not log in again until the ship is ready to be picked up. The Pilot Owner of the ship will be given the pilots name and will be able to monitor his logged in status. Any skill changes needed on the storing pilot will be logged ont he website for the Owner Pilot to have access to.

If requested in advance and the storing pilot is available, a Pilot Owner may request the same storing pilot.
The mineral cost of the parked ship will be deposited by SCP Corp with Chribba (if he agrees to this corporation idea) before the ship has been parked.

Upon request the Owner Pilot will be able to retrieve hsi/her ship by stating the time and system he/she would like to do the transfer in. Only the pilot character will be able to request a ship withdrawal and must be there to pick up the ship. A cyno chain must be provided by the Owner Pilot if the jump range is too far. The systems can be chosen by the Owner Pilot.

A scout from our corporation will then enter the system the pilot is requesting the ship in and will verify the owner is in system ready to take control of his ship. The scout will light a cyno and the ship will be brought in, the transfer may take place at a pos or not depending on the pilots request.

Retrieving a Ship-
Due to time zones involved all ship transfer will be available within 4 hours notice during the hours of 9am US Eastern time and 2am US Eastern time.

The retrievel request MUST be from the Owner Pilot, no alts allowed. The ship will ALWAYS be returned to the Owner Pilot, no one else regardless of request.

Requirements and Fees-
As the SuperCaps will have a pilot in them and they will be logged off, the location of the SuperCap will be unknown to everyone.

A website will exist for Owner Pilots to track their ships and bills.

Owner Pilots will be charged a parking fee and a storage fee. Parking fees apply everytime the ship is dropped off, storage fees will be applied on a weekly basis.

Owner Pilots will be billed every Sunday for parking. Parking fees will be for a minimum of a week, if a Pilot requests their ship before a week is up, the full week will be charged. A pilot may return his ship before the week is out for another Parking fee, but the storage fee wil roll over.

Fees-
A Parking fee of 1 billion isk will be required the first time an Owner Pilot parks his/her ship.

A Parking fee of 500 million will be required from previous Owner Pilot customers.

A fee of 300mil per week for motherships and 500million per week for Titans will be required for the Owner Pilot.
Any outstanding bills will be collected before the ship is returned to the Owner Pilot.

Emergencies-
We know that emergencies exist and sometimes, you just have to doomsday a bunch of people. If such a situation arises Owner Pilots will be given an email address that will be forwarded to the SCP Corps cell phones. SCP Corp directors will then log in and retrieve the ship for the user if possible.

Lian Ming
Posted - 2009.09.02 16:16:00 - [2]
 

Keep in mind we have jobs and lives, sometimes we just can’t make it back to the computer in time and request understanding.

IPO-
To raise the isk to fund such a venture (I cant pay the mineral cost of a titan myself) I am proposing the following IPO Sale

20,000 shares of the company at 10 million each.

This will allow the purchase of multiple Titan/Mothership Characters as well as the ability to pay the original deposits of the mineral cost to Chribba for the programs beginnings.

Again constructive criticism if you think something needs to change, but otherwise is there any interest among SuperCap pilots for a secure parking spot for your giant e-babies, or people interested in buying in to start the program.

Tsang Chou
Tsang Chou Bonds
Posted - 2009.09.02 16:20:00 - [3]
 

I think there'd be a ton of speculation on the viability of this venture, but I'd be willing to buy some shares.

Grendell
Technologies Unlimited
Posted - 2009.09.02 16:21:00 - [4]
 

Edited by: Grendell on 02/09/2009 16:23:09
Edited by: Grendell on 02/09/2009 16:21:34
What security do you provide?
If I was to say give you an fully fitted Erebus would you give me collateral since you are holding my ship and the expensive fittings?

Given you have 0 reputation, why would anyone simply hand over their super caps to you without any collateral?

EDIT:
I cant spell I know... I know..

Lian Ming
Posted - 2009.09.02 16:22:00 - [5]
 

Originally by: Grendell
Edited by: Grendell on 02/09/2009 16:21:34
What security do you provide?
If I was to say give you an Erebus would you give me collateral since you are holding my ship?

Given you have 0 reputation, why would anyone simply hand over their super caps to you without any collateral?

EDIT:
I cant spell I know... I know..


The collateral would be depositing the cost or mineral cost (havent decided which) of the ship with a trusted source (for instance my primary person of interest would be to ask Chribba to hold the deposits).

Grendell
Technologies Unlimited
Posted - 2009.09.02 16:24:00 - [6]
 

Originally by: Lian Ming
Originally by: Grendell
Edited by: Grendell on 02/09/2009 16:21:34
What security do you provide?
If I was to say give you an Erebus would you give me collateral since you are holding my ship?

Given you have 0 reputation, why would anyone simply hand over their super caps to you without any collateral?

EDIT:
I cant spell I know... I know..


The collateral would be depositing the cost or mineral cost (havent decided which) of the ship with a trusted source (for instance my primary person of interest would be to ask Chribba to hold the deposits).


Ok so you pretty much buy super caps at build cost.
What;s stopping you from going on thje forums and selling it and all the mods on it making a killer profit?

Lian Ming
Posted - 2009.09.02 16:28:00 - [7]
 

Edited by: Lian Ming on 02/09/2009 16:31:19
Originally by: Grendell

Ok so you pretty much buy super caps at build cost.
What's stopping you from going on the forums and selling it and all the mods on it making a killer profit?

Edit: Sorry the mods were discussed int he thread on CAOD, thats where I was talking about the mods, sorry.

Well, in the op i think i requested the mods be removed from the supercap before parking, but if we decide to go full market price of the ship as well as market price of the mods, then there would be no upsale to sell it.

Again the corp would need a trusted source to deposit the isk with... but i have no problem depositing the entire value of the ship and its mods with someone trusted. That way your fears would be allayed.

Although if you were parking the ship long term the mods could be used elsewhere while the ship is parked. So agian i would rather the mods be removed and onoly the hull be kept.

Sun Clausewitz
Posted - 2009.09.02 16:34:00 - [8]
 

you planning on buying up a bunch of supercap pilot characters??? Looks like you are saying you will need 1 character per ship parked.


iP0D
Posted - 2009.09.02 16:36:00 - [9]
 

People have done similar ventures in the past. The ship owners are still looking for their ships.

You do realise this is EVE, right? You cannot honestly expect this to be taken seriously :P

It doesn't matter what "collateral" or "scheme" is "offered", heck even the savings in infrastructural and structural investments for production would be worth "saving" :P Not to mention even the "savings" on production time for the folks who run off with the ships :P

Lian Ming
Posted - 2009.09.02 16:37:00 - [10]
 

Originally by: Sun Clausewitz
you planning on buying up a bunch of supercap pilot characters??? Looks like you are saying you will need 1 character per ship parked.




Yes I am, thats part of the reason for the 200bil startup cost... although any carrier pilot can fly a mothership with relative ease, titan pilots would have to be trained up, and a carrier pilot can get in a titan within 3 months.

Grendell
Technologies Unlimited
Posted - 2009.09.02 17:29:00 - [11]
 

Just getting through the collateral, but you do realise you would need about 120% collateral. As market values fluctuate drastically, as we can clearly see based on titan prices rescently. Not to mention the human factor, people will want access to their ships at time at a moments notice due to wars not eactly being predictable. You can't always be online, and even if you are chirbba or your third party has to also be online.

There are tones of loopholes in your plan, you really need to sit down and thinkk all this through. Tons of ways your business can go down the drain.

Whats stopping somebody from becoming a customer then cancelling at the last second once they know where the POS is u have then pop it, then camp the spot waiting for easy super cap kills from the other ships u are holding?

Endless problems and exploitable situations.


Lian Ming
Posted - 2009.09.02 18:23:00 - [12]
 

Edited by: Lian Ming on 02/09/2009 18:23:18
Originally by: Grendell
Just getting through the collateral, but you do realise you would need about 120% collateral. As market values fluctuate drastically, as we can clearly see based on titan prices rescently. Not to mention the human factor, people will want access to their ships at time at a moments notice due to wars not eactly being predictable. You can't always be online, and even if you are chirbba or your third party has to also be online.

There are tones of loopholes in your plan, you really need to sit down and thinkk all this through. Tons of ways your business can go down the drain.

Whats stopping somebody from becoming a customer then cancelling at the last second once they know where the POS is u have then pop it, then camp the spot waiting for easy super cap kills from the other ships u are holding?

Endless problems and exploitable situations.




I wouldnt do 120% collateral. I would deposit fair market value at the time. If people needed a titan on a moments notice this wouldnt be the service for them either. This is a storage solution for supercaps.

As well it wouldnt matter if they camped the drop off POS (which doesnt mean i have to use the same one over and over.)

The storage POSs would be multiple unknown alt corp POSs that would have no relation to the SCP Corp POSs for all the public would know. They would places the supercaps jump to, go inside the shileds and log off in.

I have thought of many of the loopholes. Especially the safety factor. This is the reason for the owner pilots being able to request the same pilot every time. No one would need to know the storing pilots name but the owners of the ships. The storing pilots character wont even be IN SCP Corp. Probably all be in a noob corp or un related alt corps.

The pilots can be sold as well for new pilots when they become too used or well known. The funds would then allow me to buy another pilot.

This isnt a thing on a whim i have tossed out there, I have thought it through.

glas mir
Reaction Scientific
Posted - 2009.09.02 18:24:00 - [13]
 

I think to make this viable.

120% collateral of market value of ship and modules posted with a third party. Though you could probably insist on t2 and simple faction fits for storage purposes.


the pick up point would need to be set. You basically need the third party to verfiy it at pick up and at delivery, and while your scout can go to any random system, asking the third party to do that as well might be pushing it. Also when you use a third party it introduces additional risk. There is then another person who can be hit by a bus.


Also 200 Billion is quite a bit given the current market conditions. Bad Bobby is having trouble raising 120B.


Have you considered mothership rental? Then you could use one pilot to store a ship that could be used by multiple parties.

Saartje Sarel
Posted - 2009.09.02 18:28:00 - [14]
 

This only appeals to stupid. You need to appeal to greedy AND stupid to win. Wink

Titans 4Me
Posted - 2009.09.02 21:36:00 - [15]
 

I had the exact same idea (kind of.)

The Punished
Posted - 2009.09.03 02:32:00 - [16]
 

Edited by: The Punished on 03/09/2009 02:34:00

I don't understand what the point of this is... being that there is stations and all? I just park my capital ship in my own hangar, that alleviates 2 concerns, one I won't lose my 100B isk super cap and 2 I don't have to pay any fees.... Maybe Im missing something please enlighten me...

HawkBlade
Posted - 2009.09.03 02:52:00 - [17]
 

Originally by: The Punished
I don't understand what the point of this is... being that there is stations and all? I just park my capital ship in my own hangar, that alleviates 2 concerns, one I won't lose my 100B isk super cap and 2 I don't have to pay any fees.... Maybe Im missing something please enlighten me...
Capital Ships can dock at a station. Super Capital Ships can not dock at stations. Simply put, they are as big as the stations.

Logistically, this can be problematic. In practice, most people with Super Capitals have it worked out. This service really is a non-starter though if asked I'd give the OP an A+ for theoretical effort.

The Punished
Posted - 2009.09.03 03:00:00 - [18]
 

so where can people park super caps?

HawkBlade
Posted - 2009.09.03 03:11:00 - [19]
 

Originally by: The Punished
so where can people park super caps?

They either log off inside the super cap or they store it inside an array at a POS in 0.0. Mostly they log off. In essence, that toon lives forever in that ship.

The Punished
Posted - 2009.09.03 04:20:00 - [20]
 

So then overall it would be a pretty feasible service... Provided that the trust is there...With the latest EBank collapse trust is going to be alot harder to earn

HawkBlade
Posted - 2009.09.03 04:37:00 - [21]
 

Originally by: The Punished
So then overall it would be a pretty feasible service... Provided that the trust is there...With the latest EBank collapse trust is going to be alot harder to earn
I'm going to try to say this quick before some alt throw's eBank into my teeth: Even before eBank trust on this kind of thing is a hard sell.

eBank basically limited people to a productive deposit amount of 3 billion @ 3% (if you were lucky) plus 6 billion @ 1.5% for a total of 9 billion maximum. Some people started accounts for their alts and secondary accounts + alts as well. But per toon, maximum was 9 Billion deposited. (It could only get bigger through interest deposits)

With this service, 1 toon = 10's of billions in one fell swoop. (Can't even guestimate the market value of a titan or mom right now.) It would only take a few customers to get this service to be holding 500 billion or so.. easy.

The other difference is: with eBank people should've only deposited "idle isk". I think it is a rare Titan that is idle. Many owners have them for forward deployment on the battlefield. After all, why have it if you are not going to use it.

The eBank drevaluation only makes the environment less accepting to an idea already marginally viable from the start.

Marie Sklodowska
Allied Logistics Transportation Services
Posted - 2009.09.03 04:41:00 - [22]
 

Much cheaper to buy a character who has the titan skill trained to lvl 1, than to use some crap service like this.

You can offer all the collateral you want, but you'll have one or the other party go running off with the isk/ship. Because you can't trade the isk and the ship at the exact same moment, someone will end up holding both. That person will then just jump out and *poof*, there goes the titan.

And how would you raise 120b + for each titan anyways? If you've made that much money then you've got to be way smarter than trying this scam..

cosmoray
Perkone
Posted - 2009.09.03 05:13:00 - [23]
 

Or you could just fly your Titan to a safe spot and log off.

What person in their right mind gets out of an 80B ISK ship plus officer mods.
If I recall only BOB shared their supercaps, and that was when they had more resources (ISK) than they could handle.

Most supercap pilots never leave their ship, so why bother. If you fly a Titan you certainly have other PVP/PVE toons.

Elenos
Posted - 2009.09.03 07:28:00 - [24]
 

Originally by: Lian Ming

Mission Statement-
This corporation exists to provide secure supercapital parking to any customer regardless of alliance or history. The full value of the ship will be fully secured by third parties and the ship will always be available to the owner upon request.



Define Secure parking. In free space is not secure as someone only needs to know where it logged off to be able to camp your location. In a POS is definitely not secure as we all know POS's can be destroyed. If i had a spare titan or two would i want to hand over this sort of investment to another party - whilst my collateral was held with a different third party !?

You mention security but there is almost no security involved in this. if you had 5 supercaps in your business you would need to raise collateral for 400B isk (more for mods) - plus have 5 supercap ready pilots - 70 - 100b isk if you buy them.

Say you ever got to 10 titans you would be exposed for 1 Trillion isk. IF, and this is just an if, your third party were to run with your 1 trill in collateral - would I get my ship back ?

How do you plan to make a decent ROI for your IPO dividends if the money is involved in character transfers and collateral held with a third party ?Neutral


 

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