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Nyota Sol
Center for Advanced Studies
Posted - 2009.08.25 22:10:00 - [61]
 

Originally by: Gypsio III
Originally by: Nyota Sol
Originally by: Malcanis

Remembering also that ISK farmers were a large source of demand for PLEXes as well...


Really?


It's no coincidence that after 22nd June all the nonsense farmer names disappeared from the GTC forum... or that the spike in PLEX-in-stock starts from mid-late June. Wink


It may explain why plex usage went flat to some extend, but plex creation was clearly driven by speculation and a frenzy over plex as a raw trading commodity.

Mr Dispatch
Posted - 2009.08.25 23:28:00 - [62]
 

I just ran an informal Poll In my Corp.

The General consensus was that If plexes went so low that one day of afk income (market sales, highsec trading, market manipulation) was enough to pay it you would have to be a fool to not buy plexes while other people were quite willing to put in as much as a week to even half a month of afk income.

The difference between how much a player is willing to invest was strongly correlated with wether or not the player intends to make large purchases or investments soon. players planning to buy lots of ships and things were not surprisingly unwilling to spend on plexes while players who's money level was "sufficient" didnt mind.

Im not exactly surprised by this honestly. Though the interesting correlation is that we should expect plex prices to go up at times of relative peace.

Also one of our corpmates runs an alt fleet of ice miners, 7 or 8 accounts, the amount of money he spends on plexes is fixe and lately hes added an extra account because of how cheap it is, since many of these accounts are ice miners and nothing else he dosent really lose much turning them off.

Bloody Rabbit
Posted - 2009.08.26 02:53:00 - [63]
 

Reading the news, one question that popped up in my head.

Say that the RMT buy the plex to hold isk to transfer to buyers, then the account holding the plex are frozen and deleted, what happens to the plex that are still in the system as shown on the charts but not really able to be reclaimed; think gift cards for retailers, they have to be accounted for but there is a high profit as 20-30% are never collected on.

LoreSpade Indigo
Posted - 2009.08.26 07:01:00 - [64]
 

It would be funny if plex investing coused the Trit prices drop. Any one used to trade trit regularly, now find yourselves fighting to sell your plex's to break even? Funny all the theory's on why Trit prices have dropped, Some say it has something to do with the banhammer on the Isk sellers. Perhaps these two issues Plex and trit prices are connected.

People mine and are not getting the full amount when selling means they wont get up to 300+ mil isk. I think if we were to get trit prices back up to the 4.00 isk per unit, There could be an increase in Plex prices. Mostly for the reason there will be more money going to the backbone miner's.

See if there is a market connection to the fall of trit and plex.

Saartje Sarel
Posted - 2009.08.26 10:12:00 - [65]
 

forgive my raging ignorance but how is a lower plex price good for ccp's proit margins?
if more people can afford not to pay ccp any money to play eve, is that not a bad thing?

right now it seems like eve cannot be making ccp a lot of money above their operating costs?


Vhiskey
Caldari
Imperial Forces
Posted - 2009.08.26 11:00:00 - [66]
 

Originally by: Saartje Sarel
forgive my raging ignorance but how is a lower plex price good for ccp's proit margins?
if more people can afford not to pay ccp any money to play eve, is that not a bad thing?

right now it seems like eve cannot be making ccp a lot of money above their operating costs?




every plex has been bought with RL money

Saartje Sarel
Posted - 2009.08.26 11:13:00 - [67]
 

Originally by: Vhiskey
Originally by: Saartje Sarel
forgive my raging ignorance but how is a lower plex price good for ccp's proit margins?
if more people can afford not to pay ccp any money to play eve, is that not a bad thing?

right now it seems like eve cannot be making ccp a lot of money above their operating costs?




every plex has been bought with RL money


oh right. told you I was ignorant. :)

Nyota Sol
Center for Advanced Studies
Posted - 2009.08.29 21:07:00 - [68]
 

Has it bottomed out?

280-285 averages all around.

Looks like we've avoided the sub-300m panic for now, which is great.

I still think prices will drop again, unless there's a sudden jump in actual plex usage (or intention to use). But at least we havent seen a sharp dive to 225m and hundreds of billions of new cash in the markets (my real worry)!!!

Lord Fitz
Project Amargosa
Posted - 2009.09.04 16:00:00 - [69]
 

Originally by: Helena C
Yes but who is gonna pay $15 bucks just to get 250 mil? That's barely a well fitted BS. While using ISk to buy plexes at under 300mil is a great deal. It's not such a great deal paying real money for such little isk at the current market costs of most items.


People had no problem paying $35 bucks for 300mil. The reason the price of plex rose is because isk became much easier to acquire in-game, thus reducing its real world worth. When you're pulling in hundreds of billions of isk worth of moon materials, isk is pretty much free, so any price is a price worth paying for it. Eventually of course, people paying for second, third or fourth accounts find that at above 300mil, it isn't worth maintaining that extra account, because the extra they make by using it doesn't pay for itself.

For each swap of a PLEX someone has to think that the real money is easier to make than the isk, and someone has to think that the isk is easier to make than the real money. Since it's not that hard for people even on modest incomes to earn $15/hr then you have to ask, how easy is it to make 250mil / hr ingame, every hour. Many people would rather work a little longer so they can come home and PvP without worrying about their wallet.

The same there are plenty of people in this world who can spend several hours in game to avoid having to pay $15 they can't afford, or what's causing most of the plex buying, people who enjoy the activity that makes the isk to buy the PLEX / people who can use it to make more isk.

stoicfaux
Gallente
Posted - 2009.09.04 17:15:00 - [70]
 

Originally by: Malcanis

I think what he's hinting at is that CCP can easily manipulate the price of PLEX buy creating buy orders at an arbitrary level. ISK doesn't cost them anything, after all.

PLEX are effectively a fiat currency.


What about inflation? On one hand pumping 'free' isk into the economy devalues isk, which would normally prompt people to invest in real items that preserve their value over time. On the other hand, time is a pretty stable and tangible asset (barring macroers) so buying time with your isk might help offset rampant inflation?

Disclaimer: Not an economist, just idle speculation on my part.

Presidente Gallente
Dark-Rising
Executive Outcomes
Posted - 2009.10.05 16:14:00 - [71]
 

Edited by: Presidente Gallente on 05/10/2009 17:02:05
Originally by: Dynast
Plenty of people; back when 30 day GTCs were under 100mil people sold them.. hell, they sold them for 60-70mil. Bear in mind that the relative value of ISK and dollars/euros will vary greatly from person to person.. and that fifteen or thirty bucks for a shiny adult toy is a perfectly reasonable expenditure.. especially compared to bar tabs. As long as there's an officially supported way to get ingame stuff for money, it'll be used.


When was that? I am playing EVE for 3 years now and started with 30d GTC 2 years ago and I sold them always from 190-250m, never lower.
For the latest 60d I got 700m few weeks ago.

The GTC market is not the same like the ingame market because it's strong related to rl money.

As someone who is willing or able to pay $35 for a 60d GTC I am in different position than someone who's paying ingame earned ISK for that.
Both sides have the choice: investing the time ingame or paying hard earned rl bucks. From a rl pov the advantage goes to the ones who can afford rl money.
Why? Because most of us, finally "all" of us - except millionares, kids of rich parents whatever - need to earn money in rl. Eventually some yonger player can invest 8 or more hours a day for EVE atm while older player with a profession, family etc. need to find a time-gap to play EVE and they have to invest rl money to stay ingame. If you just able to focus on one ingame profession like PvP you need time by time ISK by selling GTC depending what you lose or win. Other player have multiple accounts for mining or they just running missions all day long, those will invest ISK by investing time and buying GTC ingame.

Another logical calculation is: what do I get for $35? If I get 700m I am able to fit up to 3 Battleships for PvP. That means round about $12 for a BS. Losing that in PvP is like doing a rollercoaster ride on the fun fair. If you are a bad PvPer it's gonna be an expensive hobby :-)

When someone tells me not to pay more than 450m for a 60d GTC I just ignore that because $17.50 for a BS is out of question for a deal like that.
And I am sure that most of the other players investing rl money for GTC will think the same way.
That was my experience. While you have a lot of guys trying to get GTC for cheap you have some guys stupid or desparate for ISK selling them cheap but most of the people are just patient and finally they get the ISK they want. Eventually the situation would change if you get a discount for 60d GTC in rl. But you won't.

So my conclusion is that mainly the ones who buy GTC with rl money have more control over the value than the ones who earn ISK ingame.


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