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blankseplocked Idea for a new cloaking mechanic
 
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Lussac Trigalle
Posted - 2009.08.22 20:39:00 - [121]
 

Originally by: KentuckyFriedJedi

the main thing, at least to me, is that if you're not playing your character actively, you should log out. if logging out means doing so in a belt, awesome! when you come back, *log back in* and get your kill, more power to you. at least you were active during your playtime and *earned* your kill.


er..this is also an RPG right? It seems perfectly reasonable to me to be able to take a nap while cloaked in my frigate, or to go & repair the whatchyamacallits or to read a book with one eye on the scanners & listening to the local transmissions.

In fact I think being completely still & not using any systems is a much more realistic use of cloak - hence only the specially designed cov ops frigs & cov ops cloaks being able to move at a reasonable speed & warp cloaked. You don't keep a submarine undetected by having to turn on the engines every 20 minutes.

Needless to say, I don't think cloaks are broken. Personally I always feel exposed anyway simply because I know everyone can see I am in local somewhere.

Originally by: Mr Reason


"Actually local ADDS to the whole afk tactic, for if there cloakers wouldn't be seen in local, the 'fear' wouldn't be there.

The only difference between local or no local is that you wouldn't show up, the afk cloakers WANT to show up, that's the whole point."



- it seems to me you have your answer right there.

Irida Mershkov
Gallente
The Reformed
Chaos Theory Alliance
Posted - 2009.08.25 13:28:00 - [122]
 

There is no need for a new cloaking mechanic, remove local and problem is solved.

Mike Voidstar
Posted - 2009.08.25 14:12:00 - [123]
 

It's only sane to remove local if he onboard scanner becomes MUCH more effective, and there is a way to detect cloakers.

Joe Starbreaker
M. Corp
Posted - 2009.08.25 16:13:00 - [124]
 

Originally by: Mike Voidstar
It's only sane to remove local if he onboard scanner becomes MUCH more effective, and there is a way to detect cloakers.


What's wrong with the onboard scanner? Maybe you just don't know how to use it. As far as detecting cloakers, it's easy, just wait until they decloak and you'll be able to see them.

ThorpedoMk2
Gallente
The Empire of Humanity
Posted - 2009.08.26 14:41:00 - [125]
 

As I see it cloaking should remain exactly the same and we should remove local. Then I propose that there needs to be a way to detect ships in claimed systems, especially sov 3 and higher. If a group of people have to go through so much work to achieve sov of that level; then a system scanner should have the ability to detect cloaked vessels in its system at lvl 3. In a sov 4 system it should be able to pin point the offender to a point to where the target will decloak upon warp in the more targets cloaked in system the longer the scan time and the target ship(s) should get a warning that it is being actively scanned.

Cloakers should be able to do what ever they want any where else they choose. The time and effort invested in attaining sov should warrant something of this caliber. With out local there is no illusion of security anywhere. Yes, security is an illusion. So to maintain this illusion there must be something to benefit a group of people banding together to put up stations and that many pos to meet thier goals. So i propose we do not change cloaking, remove local, and make the system scanner more capable in its role. that way systems controlled by player alliances will have some means to combat lone afk cloakers in sysems of high importance. And if said alliance wants these ships detected there must be some one at the system scanner to operate it. So there are disadvantages to both sides. It gives a one to one ratio 1 afk cloaker 1 active player operating the scanner.

SocialPolice
Posted - 2009.08.26 15:08:00 - [126]
 

Originally by: ThorpedoMk2
As I see it cloaking should remain exactly the same and we should remove local. Then I propose that there needs to be a way to detect ships in claimed systems, especially sov 3 and higher. If a group of people have to go through so much work to achieve sov of that level; then a system scanner should have the ability to detect cloaked vessels in its system at lvl 3. In a sov 4 system it should be able to pin point the offender to a point to where the target will decloak upon warp in the more targets cloaked in system the longer the scan time and the target ship(s) should get a warning that it is being actively scanned.

Cloakers should be able to do what ever they want any where else they choose. The time and effort invested in attaining sov should warrant something of this caliber. With out local there is no illusion of security anywhere. Yes, security is an illusion. So to maintain this illusion there must be something to benefit a group of people banding together to put up stations and that many pos to meet thier goals. So i propose we do not change cloaking, remove local, and make the system scanner more capable in its role. that way systems controlled by player alliances will have some means to combat lone afk cloakers in sysems of high importance. And if said alliance wants these ships detected there must be some one at the system scanner to operate it. So there are disadvantages to both sides. It gives a one to one ratio 1 afk cloaker 1 active player operating the scanner.


Its called moongoo... and it makes people rich. THATS the reward.

That and showing up on the sov map waving your e-peen.

ThorpedoMk2
Gallente
The Empire of Humanity
Posted - 2009.08.26 16:18:00 - [127]
 

While the rewards you stated are nice. But with out a feasable way to "secure" or monitor your space without local and cloaking the same as it is. Makes no sense to me. There must be some sort of checks and balances if you will. As it is one can afk cloak in space of high importance for extended periods of time with no cost to themselves with no fear of reprisal. if there were some actual cost for the action I believe it would make more sense. With the changes I propose the location is the only thing a cloaker needs to worry about. That and do they have a system scanner.

KentuckyFriedJedi
Posted - 2009.08.27 10:10:00 - [128]
 

I'm not sure what the deal is with the 'remove local' idea, seems logical to me that systems in knownspace would have system scanners that can tell pilots in the space who is active. I suppose making cloaks remove players from local could be "a" solution to the issues that I see though. cloaking popping you out of local would have the same effect as logging off; active players know who the other active players are, and it would further fit the 'theme' of local being based off some kind of automatic system scanner.

That said, I don't like how much of a buff that would be to ships that can already use covert ops cloaks and warp while cloaked... stealth bombers and recons are already popular for a reason: they're good. I'd be hesitant to make any 'good' ship 'better' lest it break into the realm of overpowered...

ThorpedoMk2
Gallente
The Empire of Humanity
Posted - 2009.08.27 12:34:00 - [129]
 

From what I understand a vessel in a ss and cloaked is overpowered from several people's point of veiw. As the pilot is safe from any type of consequence. It takes far more effort to scan down the offender than it does to actually sit in a system. In lawless space where this tactic seems to have the most prevalence. I see no need for a local chat. There is no organization monitoring gate usage or anything for that matter. So we can keep local in high sec but as soon as you leave into lawless space local should be more of a wh option or not there at all. Local provides too much information as to whom is in system with nothing more than a glance. While i have seen many cryes for removing local i havent seen a widly proposed solution for the absence of local.

Ned Black
Posted - 2009.08.27 14:01:00 - [130]
 

I like the delayed local in WH space. It works great there, but I have also had the "pleasure" of cloaked AFK players.

I dont like the OP suggestions. What I would find pretty acceptable is something like

Prototype cloak: 5m before automatic decloak
Improved cloak: 30m before automatic decloak
COPS cloak: 5m "free" and after that the cloak uses fuel to keep running. The fuelbay can have enough fuel to keep the cloaking ship cloaked for 24 hours. Refueling can only be done while uncloaked.

AdmiraI Adama
Posted - 2009.09.01 01:28:00 - [131]
 

i have to disagree with the arguments that cloaks need nerfing because of AFKness

if a person in system is AFK, then he or she can do absolutely no physical harm to anything in the system whatsoever. enemys of the cloaked ship stay on their toes cus they know an enemy is there but they cannot find it. the AFK cloaker turns nonAFK the instant he pays enough attention to his computer to probe down a target, surprise him, and **** him. he earned his kill. i dont know where you get this premonition that AFK cloakers dont earn their kill because they are AFK. they have to be at their computer to kill the ship, unless they're using a super advanced macro and are thus bannable.

all this seems to me is that you dont like the fact that they can sit there and taunt u with their name in local, and you cant do anything about it except cower and die when someone gets left to the feeding. if you want to fix the AFK cloaker problem, bait the sob and kill him and make HIM afraid to be in your system.

as for removing local, that would help AFK cloakers even more because you wouldnt know a cloaked ship was in there until he appeared next to you saying "hai*boom*kthanksbai". he could fly from belt to belt finding all the ratter and miners that are by themselves because they feel safe knowing that somehow the cloaker couldnt find him without local chat.

but anyway this is just how i see the matter. not trying to pick a fight with anyone, just voicing my opinion

AmechWorrior
Origin.
Black Legion.
Posted - 2009.09.01 04:52:00 - [132]
 

This is one of the better ones I have seen. I dont think cloaking is "broken" it just needs a few tweeks. First off I fly force recons all the time and their awsome and my alt flies covert ops scouting. But I do have to say once you are in system with a safe *unless u do something stupid* you are pretty much invulnerable. Is that balanced? No. Does it cause great hardship *afkers*? No not really. But everything in eve has a balance. People should not be able to sit not touching there computer for hours. But it should not be easy to find something that has purposefuly hidden either.

If your going to scout ok there is no reason to use anything but a coc capable ship if your going to be truly scouting. So you should have a huge amount of time in between movement times. I think this would greatly inhance the game if I knew that my ship was not 100% safe, that i had to actualy play.

Ok im sitting off the gate with my alt. Like i do all the time. Is it realy all that bad to have to move him once every 30 min honestly. And thats before even the PERFECT probers can begin to find a trace of him not to mention the time it would take to scan down something with that small of a signal.

Now to the t1, t2 cloaks
They are still great for the bio brake, GTFO they are on to me Smile, But nothing should be 100% safe. If your going to be sitting with a proto cloak for 30 min your signal should start to leak out. Giving probers a lest say 15% "dificulty in scanning u down, once on grid finding u* chance of finding you after 30 min. That is enough to discourage people from just afking for any amount of time. But if your actively playing all you would have to do is deactivate it reactivate it or warp to a different safe and reactivate. I would love to see someone who can probe out someone in a safe in the 30s it takes to reactivate. And if you can do that please teach me how.

This will add a little challenge into the scouting, which I welcome, and get rid of the afkers. If you want to encite trouble for a corp/alliance by mearly being in system you should still atleast be at your computer to do so. Because if your going to scout you should be PLAYING THE GAME. And as such there should be some requirements on you the player to remain undetected.

In any instance of stealth there are things that have to be done. That does not mean when a sub runs quiet everyone goes and takes a nap. That means everyone is on high alert and are taking steps to keep themselves hidden. The same should be true for the cloak. When you cloak you should have to take certain steps to keep your self cloaked. This does not mean press the following keys in this order, im talking about if you are in a ship cloaked you should have to defuse your ships exaust as to remain unseen. So that those pretty lines that use to stream from the engines of your ship do not alert the probes.


And if you want to argue anything you should not argue weather afkers should be punished, but is being 100% safe balanced.

Ok if u want to get technical and say that someone could land on the same grid as you at the same place in the grid at some random grid you chose when making a safe then ok it is 99.999999999999% safe. Its almost the same when i sit +100km off a station from the direction of one of my safes you then have are 99.99% safe.


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