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blankseplocked Rant of the Month: Salvaging
 
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Marcus Gideon
Gallente
Federal Defense Operations
Posted - 2009.07.08 20:34:00 - [1]
 

Pirates vs Ninjas, hmm?

Well it would seem that the Care Bears don't like having someone "steal" their wrecks, because they think they earned them (ammo spent, damage taken, etc.)

I'd be inclined to agree.

Ninjas, and anyone else who repeats the propaganda CCP spreads, would have you believe that Salvaging is a profession like Mining or Trade. They fire off such witty responses as "Salvage is public property noob!" whenever one of these threads pops up.

Of course, these are the same players who ritually whip themselves while chanting "Risk vs Reward" in their basements.


So HERE is how to solve the dilemma.

Salvage -could- be a profession of its own. But it's not. It's a side effect of shooting stuff. Mission runners shoot stuff a lot, as do miners (belt rats). Anyone who blows up a ship has the opportunity to salvage.

The "ninjas" are seen as stealing, because the mechanics currently in place are inappropriate. You don't scan for wrecks to salvage, you scan for a player in the middle of killing.

Then you invade his mission space, and go to work on the wrecks before he's even finished killing them all.


Magnetometric sites, found by using the very common Core Probes, are full of wrecks and cans which are just waiting to be salvaged. You just get in range, use a Salvager on the floating container, and open for your reward.

1) When a wreck forms, several things need to appear in space.
- A corp labeled Jet Can, containing the modules and such that rightfully belong to the victor.
- A neutral wreck, able to be tractored and salvaged by anyone.

2) The first wreck on each grid spawns a Mag site beacon. This allows anyone with Core probes to locate recent battlefields to salvage.

3) While this is optional, I believe it would only be fair. The deadspace formed by missions is said to obscure signatures. This should extend to the newly formed beacon, giving the runner "first dibs" on the wrecks. Not to say they can't be probed down with effort by anyone... but they were there first.


Separating wrecks from loot will make it plainly obvious to everyone that "This jet can is yours, the wreck is free."

Encouraging salvagers to look for Mag sites rather than players, will also let them discover there are more sources of Salvage out there besides following runners.

And while obscuring the beacon initially may seem "unfair", the fact that wrecks are currently undetectable is worse. Many players are more concerned with running missions for the bounties and rewards, than they are for the loot. They hand in and take up another, not even bothering to bookmark their wrecks.

Giving those runners who would take the time "first dibs" validates their effort, while the beacon allows for salvagers to scour the mission hubs for recent battlefields and collect what would have otherwise been lost to the 2hr timer.


Complain if you must, but realize that it's a "fair" suggestion to all those involved. What you may whine about, is only how you would suffer while others benefit for a change.

Robot Robot
Posted - 2009.07.08 21:58:00 - [2]
 

so.... if i'm reading this right it doesn't sound like SO bad of an idea (if scan probe filters worked). I think it would be kind of neat if wreck fields could be scanned down (though it might take ALL of the risk out the salvaging profession and flood the rig market).

however, since this starts of sounding like another "salvaging is theft" whine , I feel like I must be missing something.

to the OP:

could you confirm that you are proposing a new second way for ninja salvagers to probe down mission runners with core probes without in any way taking away or watering down their current ability to do so with combat probes?

Also, the two cans thing seems unnecessary. Sure, the differing ownership rules of salvage and loot is what causes all the drama in the first place, but I have a feeling that just dropping two cans wouldn't make the mission runners complain any less when a ninja came into their mission.

Marcus Gideon
Gallente
Federal Defense Operations
Posted - 2009.07.08 23:08:00 - [3]
 

Edited by: Marcus Gideon on 08/07/2009 23:09:45
Originally by: Robot Robot
so.... if i'm reading this right it doesn't sound like SO bad of an idea (if scan probe filters worked). I think it would be kind of neat if wreck fields could be scanned down (though it might take ALL of the risk out the salvaging profession and flood the rig market).
I don't think it would "flood" the rig market, especially since they're getting ready to release sized rigs. We're going to need all the rig components we can get, if we're going to start producing Trimarks for every frigate 1v1 that gets popped outside the hubs.

Quote:
however, since this starts off sounding like another "salvaging is theft" whine , I feel like I must be missing something.

to the OP:

could you confirm that you are proposing a new second way for ninja salvagers to probe down mission runners with core probes without in any way taking away or watering down their current ability to do so with combat probes?
Personally, I'd like to see the Combat probe approach go away. As I stated, Salvaging (the profession) should be about finding the wrecks, not the players.

However, if Combat probes were unable to find a player anymore, then everyone could hide in missions and never be found. So no... I suppose Combat probes would still work. However, I'd like to see Core Probes given priority through some mechanic.

Quote:
Also, the two cans thing seems unnecessary. Sure, the differing ownership rules of salvage and loot is what causes all the drama in the first place, but I have a feeling that just dropping two cans wouldn't make the mission runners complain any less when a ninja came into their mission.

Runners complain because they are still (incorrectly) assuming the wrecks are theirs. That is further reinforced by the fact that only the runner and their fleet can tractor the wrecks, if only to retrieve the loot and leave the rest.

So... a Corp tagged Jet Can could only be tractored by the runner, while a neutral wreck could be accessed by anyone. When a "ninja" shows up in your mission, only to start dragging away wrecks and leaving the BS modules, you know they're a Professional, instead of a D!ck.

Either way, the Wrecks and Jet Cans would expire after the usual 2hrs. So there wouldn't be any unnecessary lag produced from too many items in space.

Robert Caldera
Posted - 2009.07.08 23:19:00 - [4]
 

Edited by: Robert Caldera on 08/07/2009 23:21:43
nice suggestion, but why should a ninja scan for abandoned battlefields with probably sorted out and worthless salvage instead of continuing probing straight for the mission runner, where all unsorted, "fresh" and therefore potentially valuable wrecks are??

Marcus Gideon
Gallente
Federal Defense Operations
Posted - 2009.07.08 23:28:00 - [5]
 

Originally by: Robert Caldera
Edited by: Robert Caldera on 08/07/2009 23:21:43
nice suggestion, but why should a ninja scan for abandoned battlefields with probably sorted out and worthless salvage instead of continuing probing straight for the mission runner, where all unsorted, "fresh" and therefore potentially valuable wrecks are??

Which is why I said I'd prefer for the Combat Probe approach to go away.

Perhaps a tweak to Combat Probes, so a mission runner is obscured by the deadspace, unless they are a war target?

I'm not sure how it could be done... and until I start collecting a paycheck from CCP, I'm not going to do their job for them.

I'd like to see Salvaging become a real profession of its own, instead of piggybacking off other peoples accomplishments. How that gets done...

Blastrodamus
Posted - 2009.07.08 23:49:00 - [6]
 

Originally by: Marcus Gideon
Anyone who blows up a ship has the opportunity to salvage.


this is wrong, it should say "Whoever gets to the wreck first has the opportunity to salvage."

Marcus Gideon
Gallente
Federal Defense Operations
Posted - 2009.07.09 00:02:00 - [7]
 

Originally by: Blastrodamus
Originally by: Marcus Gideon
Anyone who blows up a ship has the opportunity to salvage.


this is wrong, it should say "Whoever gets to the wreck first has the opportunity to salvage."


That is not in dispute. What I'm arguing against, is the current approach professional salvagers have to use in order to find wrecks.

Yes, mission runners are a great source of wrecks. However, an honorable man would make a deal with a runner rather than stalk them like vultures. But that's just my 0.02 ISK.

If wrecks were easier to find, instead of the runners themselves, then players would be more inclined to look for the loot instead. I guess that's what I'm getting at.

I'd like to see a Mag site beacon deployed off of the first wrecks, and that beacon to be more powerful than the signature of a runner inside a deadspace pocket. Then it'll take less scanning to find recent battlefields, than it would to find a busy runner.

Khalia Nestune
Mad Stacks
Posted - 2009.07.09 00:47:00 - [8]
 

Edited by: Khalia Nestune on 09/07/2009 00:47:05
You know what's awesome?

CCP supports and approves of people salvaging other people's wrecks.

Buh-bye.

Kahega Amielden
Minmatar Ship Construction Services
Ushra'Khan
Posted - 2009.07.09 01:12:00 - [9]
 

Edited by: Kahega Amielden on 09/07/2009 01:12:21
A mag site? That's a ****ing horrible idea.

Mag sites are exploration sites. Exploration would be entirely removed as a viable profession aside from deep 0.0 because you have to scan down a crapton of extra hits that are really just NPC wreck fields.

It's a decent idea -if- they are a new type of sig that requires a separate probe

Sobon
Caldari
Phantom Squad
Posted - 2009.07.09 01:15:00 - [10]
 

Making wrecks spawn their own magnometric site would help, no change to the combat probe mechanic needed, make the site atleast little easier to scan then the ship and those just after abandoned salvage fields have a easier time. It also does not discourage ninjaing as well, keeping the only real threat to highsec missioners in place. Bringing back the old mutispec probe (In spirit) would help explorers filter out the noise from the signals they are after.

Khalia Nestune
Mad Stacks
Posted - 2009.07.09 01:28:00 - [11]
 

There isn't really any reason to spawn any sort of "site" for wrecks; they're just **** lying around in space. At least the magneto sites have other structures there...

This isn't a broken system. Mission runners have plenty of counters to salvaging:

1) Fit a salvager and salvage as you go
2) Get a buddy to salvage as you go, split the profits
3) Stop shooting when a salvager arrives, and/or warp out and return later

But mission runners are LAZY, and GREEDY. So they don't want to wait, they don't want to split profits, and they don't want to go slower. They want EVERYTHING and they WANT IT NOW.

CCP has deliberately made it so that if you want to do well, you should play *gasp* with other people! Team work pwns all other skills in this game.

Even Ninjas know this: One ninja can salvage alone, but we frequently form fleets and have a dedicated scanner generate mission runner hits while everyone else goes and salvages. We can hit 30 or 40 missions and hour this way, and make a good profit for everyone.

Sobon
Caldari
Phantom Squad
Posted - 2009.07.09 01:36:00 - [12]
 

Being able to find abandoned fields (Not sure at all how common those are) Would not be a nerf to the salvaging crowd being my point, rather a somewhat neutral if not slight boost (No deadspace to the pocket and the like, and more sites to hit), no change is needed to ninjaing it self.

Space Pinata
Amarr
Discount Napkin Industries
Posted - 2009.07.09 05:23:00 - [13]
 

Edited by: Space Pinata on 09/07/2009 05:24:13
Who would guess that a ninja salvaging corp would be opposed to changes to ninja salvaging.. Laughing

Sure, you'd still be able to make as much (probably plenty of abandoned wrecks out there to salvage, maybe even easier with a specific exploration site that would take you directly to them.), maybe even more, with these changes.

But that's not what ninja salvaging is about.

Changing it to a viable profession that doesn't tread on other peoples income would take away the grief aspect of salvaging. Why make money salvaging if you can't talk smack and get 'tears' from the carebears?

Oh, and before someone comes back with a "Salvaging is a viable profession, we do it for ISK, it's a good way to make money" etc etc etc....

Linky

This appears to be a blog about your corp and the people you've griefed. (Yes, most of them were stupid and probably deserved it, but that's not the point. The point is, your motivation is not to make salvaging a viable profession, but to harass people as much as possible while making a bit of ISK.)

tl;dr: Ninja salvagers don't want salvaging to be it's own profession, separate from other people. If they aren't getting a way to grief people with immunity, they'll just find something more lucrative to do. Laughing


Pvt Public7
Amarr
Imperial Academy
Posted - 2009.07.09 06:37:00 - [14]
 

Redirect bookmarks when mission is turned in. That way, mission runners have to either salvage as they go (lol marauders) or probe down their own wrecks.
Even just a few million km off target would be enough.

Khalia Nestune
Mad Stacks
Posted - 2009.07.09 06:57:00 - [15]
 

Originally by: Space Pinata

Linky

This appears to be a blog about your corp and the people you've griefed. (Yes, most of them were stupid and probably deserved it, but that's not the point. The point is, your motivation is not to make salvaging a viable profession, but to harass people as much as possible while making a bit of ISK.)



Yup! We do indeed do it for the tears, much of the time. Twisted Evil

So do pirates, suicide-gankers, and can flipping. Are you also proposing to make those things impossible?

Also, saying that "some people salvage for grief => salvaging is about griefing" is a FAIL grade on Logic 101. It's fun AND it makes money! And for lots of the noobs without good PvP/grief skills... just money.

The last fix to griefing was when CCP made cans have ownership, and gave agro rights to people who steal (and then flip) from those cans. This was widely hailed as a solution to the problem and it hasn't been an issue since.

OH, WAIT.

In fact, if CCP wants to "level the playing field" by making salvaging an aggression offense like stealing from cans, they can BRING. IT. ON.

My PvP ships, and my entire corp, is just salivating over the idea of more mission runners shooting at us:

1) Your PvE ship is pwned by our PvP ship
2) You return in a PvP ship and we're off to to grab a CovOps and camp the mission site until you get frustrated and return with your PvE ship... and then we go back for PvP
3) Agro runs out and we go back and salvage again!
4) You leave the mission for a while or logoff. We bookmark it, move on, and hit it up later... at which point we can salvage again, and either way we've wasted your time.

But in any case, it's still true that CCP supports and approves of people salvaging other people's wrecks.

Who would guess that a mission runner would propose changes to salvaging that just happen to make life easier for mission runners! Unheard of! Laughing



Phantom Phenix
Psykotic Meat
Slightly Inappropriate.
Posted - 2009.07.09 07:04:00 - [16]
 

I'd just like to mention something, If the wrecks are "public property", why the hell does it have the name and info of the player that killed whatever created the wreck on it? There's even a corp ticker in the wreck name for crying out loud.

IMO ninja salvaging is basicly stealing and should count as if someone has taken the loot. Salvaging if very profitable, I loot and salvage all my mission sites and make a killing from it so why should some fool too lazy to do his own missions profit at my expense?

Khalia Nestune
Mad Stacks
Posted - 2009.07.09 07:08:00 - [17]
 

Originally by: Phantom Phenix


IMO ninja salvaging is basicly stealing and should count as if someone has taken the loot. Salvaging if very profitable, I loot and salvage all my mission sites and make a killing from it so why should some fool too lazy to do his own missions profit at my expense?


Really, you're sure that's what you want? Let me quote myself:

Originally by: Khalia Nestune

In fact, if CCP wants to "level the playing field" by making salvaging an aggression offense like stealing from cans, they can BRING. IT. ON.

My PvP ships, and my entire corp, is just salivating over the idea of more mission runners shooting at us:

1) Your PvE ship is pwned by our PvP ship
2) You return in a PvP ship and we're off to to grab a CovOps and camp the mission site until you get frustrated and return with your PvE ship... and then we go back for PvP
3) Agro runs out and we go back and salvage again!
4) You leave the mission for a while or logoff. We bookmark it, move on, and hit it up later... at which point we can salvage again, and either way we've wasted your time.




Phantom Phenix
Psykotic Meat
Slightly Inappropriate.
Posted - 2009.07.09 07:14:00 - [18]
 

Edited by: Phantom Phenix on 09/07/2009 07:16:03
But why bother? go to low sec and pirate or do plexes if u have a gang, it seems like a waste of time to get a fleet together just to salvage someones mission. Would it help if I proposed u get concorded for salvaging? (Not even I want that but anyway...)

Or is it your just after a cheap kill coz u can't handle real pvp?

Khalia Nestune
Mad Stacks
Posted - 2009.07.09 07:20:00 - [19]
 

You want to know why?

This is Why.

shadeow > sdfsdfs
shadeow > dfsdf
shadeow > sdfsdfsdfsdfsdf
shadeow > sdadasasdasda
drucore > go furck ur mom
shadeow > sdasdasdas
Sel誰a Rey > ninja and lose are like the same
shadeow > dasdasdasdasd
shadeow > asdasdasdasd
shadeow > asdasdasdasd
shadeow > asdasdasd
shadeow > asdasdasdas
shadeow > fdfgfghtygjyhjuk
shadeow > yrtwerqwer
shadeow > qwrqwrqwe
shadeow > qwrwerwer
shadeow > werwerwerwer
shadeow > wererdfgghjhj
shadeow > 5676
shadeow > rhrthrther
shadeow > gt
shadeow > erg
Sel誰a Rey > alallaa
shadeow > sfdgdfhfgh
Sel誰a Rey > aladlsfja
shadeow > fghfghf
Paul Clavet > shadeow is having a seizure
Sel誰a Rey > ajdlfajds
shadeow > ghfghsfdhs
Sel誰a Rey > jfa;lsdfja
shadeow > dfhsfdghfgh
Sel誰a Rey > sdfjalsdjfasdfjad
shadeow > fhjyhjkhj
Sel誰a Rey > fasjlk


My buddy Paul has successfully reduced three other people to the point that they can only mash on their keyboards in rage.

And that is worth it. Every. Single. Time. Twisted Evil

Phantom Phenix
Psykotic Meat
Slightly Inappropriate.
Posted - 2009.07.09 07:27:00 - [20]
 

Edited by: Phantom Phenix on 09/07/2009 07:30:08
You can get the same result from pirating...I think I still have some hate mails laying around.

Maybe as a Simple fix the mission sites could only be accessable by the runner or members of his gang.

I'm not a full time carebear, I live in 0.0 and love pvp but every so often I come to empire and mission run to buy more ships, I'd just rather be left in peace so I can get back out fighting again faster.

Herzog Wolfhammer
Gallente
Sigma Special Tactics Group
Posted - 2009.07.09 07:30:00 - [21]
 

Lots of wrecks on the D-scanner though.

There are a lot of areas not well attended by the ninjas, and in those systems you can see wrecks all over the D-scanner.

Makes wrecks scannable and that seperates the griefbears from the true salvagers.

Why don't jump gates to mission deadspaces only unlock for the missioner? Lock the deadspaces and make wrecks scannable and I think that's a way to make salvaging an actual profession.

And that website is pure proof that the salvaging effort is really all about getting on peoples' nerves. I have seen in local many times missioners offering to give BMs of mission rooms to salvage and getting no reply, begging. Because an experienced player knows that more salvage means cheaper rigs for everybody, and that's a good thing.

And what is with this "go back to WOW" crap? Nobody here ever played a WOW PVP server? Tell me, in which game do you have an easier time sneaking past the "guards" and ganking noobs at will, en masse, camping their corpses, and even taking out the "agent" they must meet to finish their jobs? I have seen entire regions shut down. NO MMO police force has the power of Concord.

You want real tears, make EVE more like WOW. Imagine coming back after a long mission to find the station destroyed and the agent dead. That would suck - but be interesting too. Twisted Evil

Khalia Nestune
Mad Stacks
Posted - 2009.07.09 07:33:00 - [22]
 

Originally by: Phantom Phenix
I'd just rather be left in peace so I can get back out fighting again faster.


And we would rather you not be left in peace.

Wait, did you think "high security" space was supposed to be... safe? Buwhaha.

Phantom Phenix
Psykotic Meat
Slightly Inappropriate.
Posted - 2009.07.09 07:38:00 - [23]
 

Originally by: Khalia Nestune
Originally by: Phantom Phenix
I'd just rather be left in peace so I can get back out fighting again faster.


And we would rather you not be left in peace.

Wait, did you think "high security" space was supposed to be... safe? Buwhaha.


Now your just being childish, save it for somone else.

On a different subject, I'm starving and it's BBQ time, Laters.

Khalia Nestune
Mad Stacks
Posted - 2009.07.09 07:39:00 - [24]
 

Originally by: Herzog Wolfhammer

Why don't jump gates to mission deadspaces only unlock for the missioner? Lock the deadspaces and make wrecks scannable and I think that's a way to make salvaging an actual profession.



Except that CCP has stated before they want missioning, and salvaging, to be competitive. They encourage cramming some form of PvP down your throat, even if you <cry> don't wanna </cry>.

Originally by: CCP PrismX

I have nothing against brainstorming on the forums. However, I'm going to let you in on a little CCP non-secret which is: "NPE" [No Problem Exists].

EVE is a really hostile game. We love how hostile it is.. we never meant for it to be a breeze.




Space Pinata
Amarr
Discount Napkin Industries
Posted - 2009.07.09 07:54:00 - [25]
 

Originally by: Khalia Nestune
You want to know why?

This is Why.

shadeow > sdfsdfs
shadeow > dfsdf
shadeow > sdfsdfsdfsdfsdf
shadeow > sdadasasdasda
drucore > go furck ur mom
shadeow > sdasdasdas
Sel誰a Rey > ninja and lose are like the same
shadeow > dasdasdasdasd
shadeow > asdasdasdasd
shadeow > asdasdasdasd
shadeow > asdasdasd
shadeow > asdasdasdas
shadeow > fdfgfghtygjyhjuk
shadeow > yrtwerqwer
shadeow > qwrqwrqwe
shadeow > qwrwerwer
shadeow > werwerwerwer
shadeow > wererdfgghjhj
shadeow > 5676
shadeow > rhrthrther
shadeow > gt
shadeow > erg
Sel誰a Rey > alallaa
shadeow > sfdgdfhfgh
Sel誰a Rey > aladlsfja
shadeow > fghfghf
Paul Clavet > shadeow is having a seizure
Sel誰a Rey > ajdlfajds
shadeow > ghfghsfdhs
Sel誰a Rey > jfa;lsdfja
shadeow > dfhsfdghfgh
Sel誰a Rey > sdfjalsdjfasdfjad
shadeow > fhjyhjkhj
Sel誰a Rey > fasjlk


My buddy Paul has successfully reduced three other people to the point that they can only mash on their keyboards in rage.

And that is worth it. Every. Single. Time. Twisted Evil


At least you're willing to admit it's more about the grief than the money; not even about making money despite the grief, but about griefing as much as possible. That's the difference between ninja salvaging someones mission.. or ninja salvaging the mission while smacking them and pretending to be some clueless and innocent person who is 'just cleaning up'.

Of course, some peoples fun is based solely on annoying others. I'm not really one to judge, mostly as I can't help but laugh at some of the reactions people give. "Because it makes someone mad." is hardly a reason to remove something from the game. The only 'problem' is that a ninja salvager does not have to take even the slightest risk in order to harass someone.

Even if salvaging did cause aggression, they'd shoot (and miss) at a salvage ship, only to get ganked by a pvp ship. PVE ships are not going to do well in pvp; unless they change missions to mimic pvp more, theres really nothing that can be done. Even if salvage did cause aggression.

The only change salvage aggression would bring? Suddenly people would be whining to remove the ability to scan missions down at all, as they'd now have the same ninja salvage plus plenty of lost ships when they tried to shoot back.

So, I guess my whole thought on the matter comes down to this:

Ninja salvaging is a pretty obnoxious, but not invalid, way of making money. Without making it impossible (which is a bad idea), there is no way to make people happy. Unless people think shooting at them in a pve ship is a good idea; or, on the contrary, think they'll have time to warp, change ships, and warp back... all before the ninja simply warps out.

And, I also like to point out that adding random salvage sites is a bad idea, because no one ninja salvages just for the salvage. Without the tears, they'd do something else entirely.

Thus: I think salvagers are annoying (mostly the smack; I've only had my salvage stolen once, and don't really run missions unless I'm bored or need sec status), but there isn't a change to be made that doesn't 1) Change nothing or 2) Unfairly favor the mission runners, making it a bad change. (Things are changed for overall game balance, not to please one group.)

Maybe try scanning for combat probes and warping out if they're closing in on you? I know I'm too lazy, but then again, I'm not getting hit by ninjas. (Suddenly or otherwise.)


Jint Hikaru
OffWorld Exploration Inc
Posted - 2009.07.09 08:01:00 - [26]
 

Rant of the month...????? If only this came up once a month.

At least you are not just here crying about someone 'stealing' 'your' salvage.

I dont think turning salvagers to Magnetronic sites is going to help... have you ever been to a Mag site? After the hassle of scanning one down, you maybe get 20 pieces of salvage. Now if I was to choose one system, there may be a mag site there once every fre days????

Salvage is totally about who gets to it first. The sooner everyone accepts that the better.

Oh and just so you know, I am a carebear mission runner / miner and in the past 6 months I have mhad 2 missions invaded by a ninja.

There are a number of ways to counter it,so the ninja leaves and botheres someone else.

Jint Hikaru
OffWorld Exploration Inc
Posted - 2009.07.09 08:08:00 - [27]
 

Edited by: Jint Hikaru on 09/07/2009 08:23:13
I think what Khalia Nestune said sums up this whole argument...

Quote:
But mission runners are LAZY, and GREEDY. So they don't want to wait, they don't want to split profits, and they don't want to go slower. They want EVERYTHING and they WANT IT NOW.


If mission runners took a little time to take steps to counter the ninja, then the ninja would leave to find another target.

But, most runners want to get the mission done as quickly a possible to they can get their 'lewtz', rewards, bounties, LPs and get to the next mission. Thats why they are in mission hubs, with the best agents.... and thats why the ninjas are there.

Forge Lag
Jita Lag Preservation Fund
Posted - 2009.07.09 08:21:00 - [28]
 

Salvage ninjas are pathetic, trying to compete vs specialized rigged ships that have huge cargo, can tractor the wrecks and lose no time probing anything down. They are as annoyin as hobos impersonating ninjas. They steal too but the most harm comes from the fact that if you are not carefull you get terminal disease touching them.

CCP does not want salvage to be proffesion any more than wreck looting is proffesion. It is annoying and boring looting with a cooldown and needs to be done by masses or rig prices skyrocket.

Khalia Nestune
Mad Stacks
Posted - 2009.07.09 08:22:00 - [29]
 

Originally by: Space Pinata

At least you're willing to admit it's more about the grief than the money; not even about making money despite the grief, but about griefing as much as possible. That's the difference between ninja salvaging someones mission.. or ninja salvaging the mission while smacking them and pretending to be some clueless and innocent person who is 'just cleaning up'.



But I am just cleaning up! All those wrecks, they make so much lag! Very Happy

But really, I have to correct you. It's about the money (which is good!) and the tears (which are sweet). They both are a vital part of much of the ninja way of life.

If it made peanuts I'd probably be in 0.0 space as a pirate. If no one ever cried... I'd probably be in 0.0 space as a pirate.

Khalia Nestune
Mad Stacks
Posted - 2009.07.09 08:27:00 - [30]
 

Originally by: Forge Lag
fact that if you are not carefull you get terminal disease touching them.


Sweet. This is going in my Bio. Razz

Originally by: Forge Lag

CCP does not want salvage to be proffesion any more than wreck looting is proffesion.



O RLY?

Originally by: GM Faolchu

This is an intended game mechanic and is in no way an exploit. People salvaging your missions npcs or the player you just blew up are doing nothing wrong. The players are salvaging what is effectively floating rubbish in space and Concord places no value on this wreckage.

Eve is a harsh place you won't always have everything go your way, its a do or die world and people do what they can to get along. If salvaging some wreckage gets them a few more ISK someone will do it, it doesn't matter who just blew it up.



Originally by: GM Ytterbium

Also, this change has nothing to do with salvaging rights themselves as they remain untouched. Players are still completely free to salvage other pilot wrecks at will, no matter if they belong to the same corporation or not and doing so is not considered as an exploit.



Originally by: CCP PrismX

If you're surprised as to why the server does not consider it your stuff, it's because it's a mini profession designed for people who want to roam and look for salvage, not to further increase the revenue from mission grinding.. I doubt anyone with a perspective thinks we need to high-sec increase mission grinding any further.



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