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Grista
Caldari
Science and Trade Institute
Posted - 2009.05.14 19:42:00 - [121]
 

Edited by: Grista on 14/05/2009 19:42:46
The hilarious thing about the Cloak change is, as implemented, it would constitute more of a boost than a bane to the Falcon. Rationale follows:

1) You uncloak in your falcon, attempt to jam one or more targets, and all your jams fail.
2) You cloak, cutting off your ECM modules mid-cycle
3) You immediately cycle your cloak off, enabling you to target again 10 seconds from initially cloaking
4) You lock and start jamming, 11-12 seconds from when your jams failed, instead of waiting the full 20 second module cycle. The act of cloaking has also interrupted any initial attempts to lock you, including target-back auto locking.

edit: Enterprising individuals are testing whether cloaking will interrupt a siege cycle, in the meantime.

Solomunio Kzenig
Amarr
Indicium Technologies
Hephaestus Forge Alliance
Posted - 2009.05.14 19:46:00 - [122]
 

So CCP has ****ed up a patch despite HUGE player feedback for several weeks prior to the change (EVE players using SISI to test the changes, unlike the lazy ass Devs IMHO).
Who would have thought eh? Its not like this has not happened sooooo many times before...EVE is a massively complex game and even the DEV's probably don't understand every nuance and tweak of the game, BUT the combined player base DOES understand EVE better than the DEV's, the warnings posted on several thread about the game breaking machanism and other unintended effects show that CCP is seriuosly remiss in not utilising this resource (the player base).

I'm studying Complexity Theory and Systems analysis and in umpteen case studies I've discovered that organisations responsible for complex products allways fail to understand how these self same products are used by their clients (they adopt a top down and technical-determanistic attitude to the use of their products by their clients). CCP needs to understand that with a product like EVE (internet based and with a client base of mianly tech-savvy people) its going to be unable to either hide its mistakes or fully understand the various ways in which players 'stress test' the game mechanics. For a company that uses the internet as a fundamental pillar of its business model CCP is appalingly unaware of the power of organisation and information diffusion that the internet is now finally maturing into.

Kazaji
Caldari
The Python Cartel.
The Jerk Cartel
Posted - 2009.05.14 19:47:00 - [123]
 

It seems that players with sec status <-5 are no longer flashy. What is the deal with this? We pirates miss our flashyness.

Feilamya
Pain Elemental
Posted - 2009.05.14 19:55:00 - [124]
 

Originally by: CCP Chronotis
Hi folks, firstly an apology from all of us for screwing up and letting this slip through the cracks despite many of you trying very hard to indicate the serious gameplay fallout in the threads you linked previously Crying or Very sad. This started out life as a minor defect where a code fix was made to stop the ECM jamming continuing to work after you had cloaked.

Let's hope this will be dealt with soon then.

Xessej
Posted - 2009.05.14 19:55:00 - [125]
 

Apocrypha was a great expansion with a great new scanning mechanic as the core of wormhole exploration. Apocrypha 1.1 broke the shiny new scanning system. Apocrypha 1.2 is released and the scanning system is still broken in exactly the same way as it was for the last month.

So is it reasonable to assume that the devs do not consider fixing the brand new scanning system that all of wormhole exploration relies upon to be a priority?

Taanu
Posted - 2009.05.14 19:58:00 - [126]
 

After 5 years of playing Eve and watching blob tactics get stronger every patch I've had enough. Old alliances like Ushra'khan whole reason to play is to fly deep into enemy territory heavily outnumbered and try to survive. This patch has rendered a huge part of the game useless. No more solo roams, a complete class of expensive ships rendered useless and a big slap on the back for blobbage.

I can't even begin to express my anger and frustration with CCP's product development process. A very sad day and one where my subscription will no longer be renewed.

SELENA Sebiestor
Sacred Templars
RED.OverLord
Posted - 2009.05.14 20:00:00 - [127]
 

I despise having to wait 3 seconds to recloak in any ship. Not only does it have the delay in 0.0 but ive seen it happen to me in low sec as well.

Gaskin Ravenwing
Posted - 2009.05.14 20:04:00 - [128]
 

I wish the corporation blueprints view would stay static when installing a job and delete the used blueprint instead of jumping to the top at each install as installing 10 bpos in a row from mid way dow the screen can be time consming, fiddley and offputting

Ta'jek
Angels Of Death EVE
Free Worlds Alliance
Posted - 2009.05.14 20:05:00 - [129]
 

anyone else notice players set to red by corp/alliance that have the yellow low sec bar are not showing the lil red square with the -.... only saw it on overview and jumped before I could check it on screen

Wongdong
Minmatar
Posted - 2009.05.14 20:12:00 - [130]
 

Edited by: Wongdong on 14/05/2009 20:55:02
seeing as alot of this current patch is fubar i will wait till sunday to update to see if this all gets fixed when my frig 5 is done.if this big flubup is still there it seems i will have to give up on the only game other than shadowbane that i have ever enjoyed playing.(and shadowbane is free till they close on 7-1-09)

please ccp,i beg you to read the epic words from ccp whisper in my sig.and to reaffirm "IT'S ALL BECAUSE OF FALCON".great game tho,i hope you'll keep me as a paying customer.

Feilamya
Pain Elemental
Posted - 2009.05.14 20:15:00 - [131]
 

There is definitely a delay for activating the cloak now after decloaking on a gate. It's not 3 seconds, maybe not even 1 second, but still very annoying, because it is very hard to time. Even if you know how long the delay is, the actual delay will vary because of lag, which depends on many unpredictable factors.

Also, if you have hit the cloak button too early for 1 time, you don't know if it worked when you hit it again, because the message is still there. This means activating the cloak becomes a chance game. You may hit the cloak button too early several times and never cloak. Or you may hit it again after you cloaked and uncloak again, which means you are ****ed. Only if you are lucky, you hit it just in time so you cloak as soon as possible without uncloaking again.

A chance-based cloak. Yay!

If there HAS to be a delay for activating the cloak, at least make it possible to "queue" module activation, i.e. you press a button once, and the module will activate as soon as possible. No more "you can't do this now, wait a few microseconds and try again" messages. This is a long overdue feature anyway, because it is a must in every game that is played on the internet with its inherent and unavoidable lag.

Either that, or remove this delay. I'm sure it was just another side effect of a side effect of another change.

Vaerah Vahrokha
Minmatar
Vahrokh Consulting
Posted - 2009.05.14 20:44:00 - [132]
 

Quote:

This started out life as a minor defect where a code fix was made



Boot.ini anyone?

How good does following innovative software engineering paradygms and agile programming, when you end up smacking face so hard?


Quote:

---------------------------
Microsoft Visual C++ Runtime Library
---------------------------
Runtime Error!

Program: C:\Program Files\CCP\EVE\bin\ExeFile.exe

R6025

- pure virtual function call


---------------------------
OK
---------------------------



Ok. CCP, Real money is at stake here, what do I do to fix this?



Good luck, I have this since months.


Quote:

The company i worked some years ago didnt listen to they clients when they hired some harvard marketing genius and in less than a year they where closed...
Again i'm very worried!!!



Meh, a cyclone in a sig. Does anyone still fly that thing?

Exec Rev
Elite Privateers
Posted - 2009.05.14 20:47:00 - [133]
 

Been away for a while, installed patch & got a black screen, uninstalled including settings & cache, downloaded 2gb, installed again and I got a new BLACK SCREEN!

If it's a joke it's not fun, moreover I wouldnt call it a successful deployment. Theat's ****ting on us. You should have rollbacked.




Captain Campion
Viziam
Posted - 2009.05.14 20:58:00 - [134]
 

because of falcon?

Nyphur
Pillowsoft
Posted - 2009.05.14 21:14:00 - [135]
 

Edited by: Nyphur on 14/05/2009 21:33:29
Originally by: Captain Campion
because of falcon?

Funny enough, yes, this is all because of falcon. They wanted ECM to end as soon as you cloak as they figured this was exploitative. Instead of making the effect on the enemy end but keep the cycle going, they put in a wide-scale hack to make all module cycles end when the cloak is activated. That's what's caused all these problems. Also, as people have mentioned earlier in the thread, this may actually allow you to recycle failed jamming attempts by cloaking and decloaking again. That's a hell of a lot worse than jamming and then cloaking. I'm surprised they thought this was a complete and sufficient solution to implement and didn't forsee the obvious side-effects but at least it's being rolled back.

Originally by: Exec Rev
Been away for a while, installed patch & got a black screen, uninstalled including settings & cache, downloaded 2gb, installed again and I got a new BLACK SCREEN!

If it's a joke it's not fun, moreover I wouldnt call it a successful deployment. Theat's ****ting on us. You should have rollbacked.

Did you read the thread entitled "Important information for players experiencing a black screen."? It solved the problem for me.
http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1072133

ThiIsTheMan
Posted - 2009.05.14 21:35:00 - [136]
 

Gallente control tower lol
watch the contol tower :D

Zostera
Minmatar
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2009.05.14 21:53:00 - [137]
 

Originally by: ThiIsTheMan
Gallente control tower lol
watch the contol tower :D



Amarr towers have had bits flying around them loose in space since Apocrypha 1.1 I think in a similar way. Haven't seen the tower itself move though.


ThiIsTheMan
Posted - 2009.05.14 21:58:00 - [138]
 

Edited by: ThiIsTheMan on 14/05/2009 22:02:01
Edited by: ThiIsTheMan on 14/05/2009 21:59:10
Originally by: Zostera
Originally by: ThiIsTheMan
Gallente control tower lol
watch the contol tower :D



Amarr towers have had bits flying around them loose in space since Apocrypha 1.1 I think in a similar way. Haven't seen the tower itself move though.



i don't know ,i haven't noticed this before the 1.2 patch.
The tower itself isn't moving the lights and the glass are still below my hauler
the tower is normal when i zoom out but when i zoom in that happens

Hiroshima Jita
Posted - 2009.05.14 22:06:00 - [139]
 

Bull****. Fine MWD + Cloak trick is gone. Fine agility nerf.

But you screwed up bad. Really bad. People now cannot activate modules imediately after decloak. They cannot mwd. They cannot activate cloak and slowboat around. They either warp or sit there and die.

In 0.0 with a bubble and an inty with a web and a point youre dead. And its suicide for an fc to jump a fleet into an enemy gang because the fleet will sit around like ducks being tackled an unable to shoot on uncloak for seconds. The advantage to the defender is massive.

Its completely unfair and broken that you cannot activate modules when you are uncloaked and your enemies can.

Right now we're going to go camp a gate in 0.0 with a bubble.

Nyphur
Pillowsoft
Posted - 2009.05.14 22:14:00 - [140]
 

Originally by: ThiIsTheMan
Gallente control tower lol
watch the contol tower :D


They use discrete distance-based LOD on the control tower model and it looks like the highest level representation is screwed up. What it looks like is that the viewmatrix is somehow being broken for only that model but I doubt that's what's going on. The amarr one is funnier, there are little metal bits that spin around it and it looks like the POS is clapping. :D

Hermosa Diosas
Posted - 2009.05.14 22:35:00 - [141]
 

I had an issue where I undocked, i was able to be locked before i could dock again and got killed! then when i tried to redock the undocking timer reset again meaning i couldnt redock the pod, thus losing my pod also!! arrggghh

ViolenTUK
Gallente
Demolition Men
Posted - 2009.05.14 22:43:00 - [142]
 

My client simply will not load. After the Apocrypha mini screen my client turns fullscreen to black and then hangs. Well done CCP how useless you are.

Khalina Drakona
Posted - 2009.05.14 22:47:00 - [143]
 

Since I have not seen it mentioned anywhere else (still early in the search though)

Where's my money man?! /stewie voice

Seriously, I had about 15-20 market orders set to expire today, logged in expecting to see my wallet fat with returned isk and....nothing.

No record of orders expiring and returning isk, no record of any purchases on transaction log, no large isk transfers to show a hacked account or anything. And I'm short about 15-20 buy orders. Anyone else get something like this?

William Clarque
Gallente
Free Traders
Posted - 2009.05.14 22:55:00 - [144]
 

Edited by: William Clarque on 14/05/2009 22:58:02
Originally by: ViolenTUK
My client simply will not load. After the Apocrypha mini screen my client turns fullscreen to black and then hangs. Well done CCP how useless you are.

If you'd posted this where you were supposed to-- in the "issues" thread rather than in the "feedback" thread-- you'd have seen that they already have a fix for that.
Now who's useless?


LtCol Laurentius
Caldari
Digital Fury Corporation
Northern Coalition.
Posted - 2009.05.14 23:16:00 - [145]
 

Originally by: CCP Chronotis

Hi folks, firstly an apology from all of us for screwing up and letting this slip through the cracks despite many of you trying very hard to indicate the serious gameplay fallout in the threads you linked previously Crying or Very sad. This started out life as a minor defect where a code fix was made to stop the ECM jamming continuing to work after you had cloaked.

The intention was for only this to be fixed, however as many of you are now acutely aware, the fallout from that supposedly minor defect fix to a single issue is rather massive and game breaking for many. This was very much not an intended gameplay change from us.

The change that caused this to all happen is being reverted at the earliest possible opportunity with a hotfix (no ETA yet) but we will make this right as soon as possible.



I knew it! This happend BECAUSE OF FALCON! Laughing

Karn Mithralia
Neh'bu Kau Beh'Hude
Ushra'Khan
Posted - 2009.05.14 23:24:00 - [146]
 

Originally by: CCP Chronotis
Originally by: Zostera
Many players made a significant effort both prior too and post patch to offer moderate, thought out, reasonable feedback. Would CCP please respond to that feedback on this issue please with a reasoned explanation of their intentions and consideration of the results we now have on TQ?


Hi folks, firstly an apology from all of us for screwing up and letting this slip through the cracks despite many of you trying very hard to indicate the serious gameplay fallout in the threads you linked previously Crying or Very sad. This started out life as a minor defect where a code fix was made to stop the ECM jamming continuing to work after you had cloaked.

The intention was for only this to be fixed, however as many of you are now acutely aware, the fallout from that supposedly minor defect fix to a single issue is rather massive and game breaking for many. This was very much not an intended gameplay change from us.

The change that caused this to all happen is being reverted at the earliest possible opportunity with a hotfix (no ETA yet) but we will make this right as soon as possible.






\o/


Horrific Testicle
Posted - 2009.05.14 23:44:00 - [147]
 

Originally by: CCP Navigator
EVE Online: Apocrypha 1.2 has been successfully deployed on Tranquility and we are now open for business. This patch introduces fixes to ships and modules, agents and missions, user interface and much more. For a more comprehensive list of what has been added and fixed, please check the patch notes.

We would appreciate hearing your feedback which can be posted in this thread. Please note that this is for general feedback, not issues or bugs. A separate thread for issues is available here.



Successfully? WTF. Not even close. What isn't ****ed up in this game at the moment.

Jabb3r01
Posted - 2009.05.15 00:19:00 - [148]
 

Edited by: Jabb3r01 on 15/05/2009 11:01:51
Ok.

Simply I was playing eve last night fine I applied patch through update and get the black screen error too.

I tried the full download installing to a different directory and same deal.

I'm On XP Pro that ran the previous build fine. Say what you want but I'm telling you as a good many people have already......it's broke :(

Edit: Also want to mention I'm using an ATI X600 Mobility with the hp speciffic drivers. It could be an ATI issue so thought I'd add me specs.

How you can call this successful is beyond me.

CursedEagle79
Wrecking Shots
Wildly Inappropriate.
Posted - 2009.05.15 00:32:00 - [149]
 

Keep up the good work, CCP. Honestly. Bugs and such here and there, and I'd love to be able to use my blockade runner again, but there's some steps in the right direction. Really happy that the Naglfar is finally gettin some love, though the weapons bonuses/slots may still need to be changed around a bit. But a sweet shield tank is a good thing :D Also, thanks for getting the Linux/Wine fix up so fast, not many companies would do that, especially not the same afternoon as the release. All in all, keep up the good work, keep listening to us, and stay honest (like I see you have). And thanks in advance for the cloak fix Smile

Elia Berran
Posted - 2009.05.15 01:02:00 - [150]
 

The best part about CCP screwing up a patch like this and then requiring a new hot patch, is their lovely install will corrupt many of our installs once again.

Just like the last time, when it took me 5 days to get the game working on my PC. I'm still today left downloading client after client hoping one will work with out the corruption issue.

If I do magically happen to get a good install on my windows box, then it's likely the hot patch will screw it up in the next few days. I think I'm just going to sell off my money making mining alts. It's just not worth the effort to try and multi box with the constant patching issues that get ignored time after time.


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