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Demeterus
Caldari
Posted - 2009.04.26 11:32:00 - [1]
 

Edited by: Demeterus on 26/04/2009 11:35:24
I - for some reason - went to Eve Offline and there it was. The data for the Serenity cluster. I did a search, but perhaps i did it sloppily because I couldn't really find the answer to the question that the visit to Eve Offline raised:

Why is there a seperate cluster called Serenity?

There were concerns about the resources poured into maintaining separate codebases and such. But from the statistics, it seems that a more pressing resource concern would be maintaining a completely separate "shard" for the chinese market.

Not that i begrudge the chinese this, of course. I'm just curious about this. And isn't that a break with the idea of one universe for all players?

Grez
Neo Spartans
Laconian Syndicate
Posted - 2009.04.26 11:33:00 - [2]
 

It's the China cluster.

They have their own due to laws about MMO gaming.

Leaving Eve
Aliastra
Posted - 2009.04.26 11:35:00 - [3]
 

Originally by: Grez
It's the China cluster.

They have their own due to laws about MMO gaming.


That doesn't stop them farming TQ though.

Grez
Neo Spartans
Laconian Syndicate
Posted - 2009.04.26 11:36:00 - [4]
 

Originally by: Leaving Eve
Originally by: Grez
It's the China cluster.

They have their own due to laws about MMO gaming.


That doesn't stop them farming TQ though.


Idd :(

Demeterus
Caldari
Posted - 2009.04.26 11:44:00 - [5]
 

Well, CCP obviously has reasons for a seperate shards. I don't deny they might be very valid, such as laws and regulations here and there. But it would be interesting to find out what the reasoning behind the departure from the "one server to rule them all, and in darkness bind them"-rule. :)

Grez
Neo Spartans
Laconian Syndicate
Posted - 2009.04.26 11:52:00 - [6]
 

Originally by: Demeterus
Well, CCP obviously has reasons for a seperate shards. I don't deny they might be very valid, such as laws and regulations here and there. But it would be interesting to find out what the reasoning behind the departure from the "one server to rule them all, and in darkness bind them"-rule. :)



I just told you... Laws in China forced them to make a separate shard.

Jana Clant
New Dawn Corp
New Eden Research.
Posted - 2009.04.26 11:58:00 - [7]
 

Originally by: Demeterus
Well, CCP obviously has reasons for a seperate shards. I don't deny they might be very valid, such as laws and regulations here and there. But it would be interesting to find out what the reasoning behind the departure from the "one server to rule them all, and in darkness bind them"-rule. :)



They never departed from the one-server rule. It's just that with China, there was no way to have them connecting to TQ with the laws they have, so CCP had to either completely abandon a potentially large customer base or open an exception to the rule.

Let's put it this way, the chinese cluster wouldn't affect TQ in any way since chinese players can't connect (by the standard means) to it, so the all-players-in-one-shard ideology isn't even affected by this, TQ would be exactly the same with either choice CCP took, and since they're also out to make money, not just a great MMO, the choice is obvious.

Hariya
Posted - 2009.04.26 12:16:00 - [8]
 

Originally by: Jana Clant
They never departed from the one-server rule. It's just that with China, there was no way to have them connecting to TQ with the laws they have, so CCP had to either completely abandon a potentially large customer base or open an exception to the rule.


Also, most of the Chinese interwebs is connected with two paper cups and a string. They probably have at least some arrangements with the other cluster to make sure it actually can be accessed by the Chinese players...

Ruze Ahkor'Murkon
Amarr
No Applicable Corporation
Posted - 2009.04.26 20:09:00 - [9]
 

Serenity is as much a separate shard of EvE, as all those homebrew servers are separate shards of WoW. CCP doesn't control it or run it, and can't make changes to it without a lot of overseeing by the Chinese government. It doesn't have the same empires, and they don't mean the same things. Gallente are VERY different on the Serenity cluster.

It also has severe limitations on trade laws and what constitute a players 'rights', limitations which aren't shared in the rest of the western world.

So, CCP loaned their code to a completely separate company, and get a regular payment. It's not EvE, it just kinda resembles EvE.

Lui Kai
Better Than You
Posted - 2009.04.26 20:22:00 - [10]
 

Originally by: Ruze Ahkor'Murkon
Serenity is as much a separate shard of EvE, as all those homebrew servers are separate shards of WoW. CCP doesn't control it or run it, and can't make changes to it without a lot of overseeing by the Chinese government. It doesn't have the same empires, and they don't mean the same things. Gallente are VERY different on the Serenity cluster.

It also has severe limitations on trade laws and what constitute a players 'rights', limitations which aren't shared in the rest of the western world.

So, CCP loaned their code to a completely separate company, and get a regular payment. It's not EvE, it just kinda resembles EvE.


Amazing. Complete madeup bull-**** on almost every word. Origionally, I was going to mock the racist posts above - but your complete fictionalization was worse.

Ruze Ahkor'Murkon
Amarr
No Applicable Corporation
Posted - 2009.04.26 20:28:00 - [11]
 

Originally by: Lui Kai
Originally by: Ruze Ahkor'Murkon
Serenity is as much a separate shard of EvE, as all those homebrew servers are separate shards of WoW. CCP doesn't control it or run it, and can't make changes to it without a lot of overseeing by the Chinese government. It doesn't have the same empires, and they don't mean the same things. Gallente are VERY different on the Serenity cluster.

It also has severe limitations on trade laws and what constitute a players 'rights', limitations which aren't shared in the rest of the western world.

So, CCP loaned their code to a completely separate company, and get a regular payment. It's not EvE, it just kinda resembles EvE.


Amazing. Complete madeup bull-**** on almost every word. Origionally, I was going to mock the racist posts above - but your complete fictionalization was worse.


Good to know. You say I'm wrong. Could you enlighten this poor, lonely soul into exactly WHAT I got wrong?

I'm all for learning from my mistakes. Fire away. Tell us what Serenity is, and why it's hosted in China by a separate gaming group than CCP. I think we'd all like to know.

Nova Fox
Gallente
Novafox Shipyards
Posted - 2009.04.26 20:36:00 - [12]
 

Serenity also has alot of things censored and redid on it. namely all four races mantras about economy, religion and polotics had to be taken out and replaced.

Ruze Ahkor'Murkon
Amarr
No Applicable Corporation
Posted - 2009.04.26 20:38:00 - [13]
 

Originally by: Nova Fox
Serenity also has alot of things censored and redid on it. namely all four races mantras about economy, religion and polotics had to be taken out and replaced.


According to Mr. Lui Kang over there, that's a boldfaced lie and we are creating fictions.

Sjobba
Posted - 2009.04.26 21:44:00 - [14]
 

Is the Chinese government seriously censoring EVE?
For what possible reason?

Arkhan Bayne
Posted - 2009.04.26 21:53:00 - [15]
 

Originally by: Grez
Originally by: Demeterus
Well, CCP obviously has reasons for a seperate shards. I don't deny they might be very valid, such as laws and regulations here and there. But it would be interesting to find out what the reasoning behind the departure from the "one server to rule them all, and in darkness bind them"-rule. :)



I just told you... Laws in China forced them to make a separate shard.


indeed, I believe it is something to do with all international businesses, etc, have to go through a third party company based in china, I can see why, it's supporting the local economy, but it does force separation of games like this which kind of sucks for the single-shard theory, but, never mind, I guess they're happy there's not alot of English/russian spam filling up their chat, and there's one less language barrier for us as well.

Xenoxide
Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2009.04.26 22:02:00 - [16]
 

Edited by: Xenoxide on 26/04/2009 22:02:50
Originally by: Sjobba
Is the Chinese government seriously censoring EVE?
For what possible reason?


The Chinese Government censors the entire internet for the Chinese population. The want to control the entire flow of information leaving and entering China via the internet. From news reports, to blogs, to videos available on YouTube. Pretty much any interaction with the rest of the world, they censor.

I guess since EVE provides methods of communication across the net, CCP had no choice but to create a seperate, cut-off, cluster for the Chinese market - one where the Chinese people cannot freely interact with people across the world.

I refer you to this article on "The Great Firewall of China": http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_censorship_in_the_People%27s_Republic_of_China.

VicturusTeSaluto
Gallente
Metafarmers
MeatSausage EXPRESS
Posted - 2009.04.26 22:06:00 - [17]
 

The only problem with Serenity is that they don't force ALL the people from non-western countries to play there. I'd pay double if they got all the chinese/russians etc off of TQ.

Ruze Ahkor'Murkon
Amarr
No Applicable Corporation
Posted - 2009.04.26 22:38:00 - [18]
 

Originally by: VicturusTeSaluto
The only problem with Serenity is that they don't force ALL the people from non-western countries to play there. I'd pay double if they got all the chinese/russians etc off of TQ.


That's the difference in ethics. We don't prevent them from playing with us ... they prevent us from playing with them.

It's a little bit of moral high-ground, but not much. Besides, many players who are characterized as 'chinese macro players' are in fact from the many other nations of that continent, some even from our own society. It's a gross exaggeration, and one that is most definitely seated in racism.

DigitalCommunist
November Corporation
Posted - 2009.04.26 22:41:00 - [19]
 

Serenity exists because CCP thought they could accomplish something in that market.

It doesn't exist because of Chinese laws, Chinese players can still play on TQ if they wanted to and nobody is forcing CCP to run a server out of mainland China. I very much doubt they'd get blacklisted by the government because EVE isn't any more dangerous to play than the thousands of other games. If anything, it'll make you more cynical towards concepts like democracy, freedom and capitalism.

For the most part though, I'm be skeptical if the EVE China project has broken even. But because of EVE China, we do have better localization for other languages (prompted them to use unicode instead of ascii) and I guess a third bloodline if you see that as a benefit.

But overall, Serenity has only hurt progress on the game.

Sjobba
Posted - 2009.04.26 22:45:00 - [20]
 

Originally by: Xenoxide
Edited by: Xenoxide on 26/04/2009 22:02:50
Originally by: Sjobba
Is the Chinese government seriously censoring EVE?
For what possible reason?


The Chinese Government censors the entire internet for the Chinese population. The want to control the entire flow of information leaving and entering China via the internet. From news reports, to blogs, to videos available on YouTube. Pretty much any interaction with the rest of the world, they censor.

I guess since EVE provides methods of communication across the net, CCP had no choice but to create a seperate, cut-off, cluster for the Chinese market - one where the Chinese people cannot freely interact with people across the world.

I refer you to this article on "The Great Firewall of China": http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_censorship_in_the_People%27s_Republic_of_China.

Wow, I had no idea China was so messed up Neutral
Kind of makes me glad I'm not Chinese Wink

Ruze Ahkor'Murkon
Amarr
No Applicable Corporation
Posted - 2009.04.26 22:52:00 - [21]
 

Originally by: DigitalCommunist
Serenity exists because CCP thought they could accomplish something in that market.

It doesn't exist because of Chinese laws, Chinese players can still play on TQ if they wanted to and nobody is forcing CCP to run a server out of mainland China. I very much doubt they'd get blacklisted by the government because EVE isn't any more dangerous to play than the thousands of other games. If anything, it'll make you more cynical towards concepts like democracy, freedom and capitalism.

For the most part though, I'm be skeptical if the EVE China project has broken even. But because of EVE China, we do have better localization for other languages (prompted them to use unicode instead of ascii) and I guess a third bloodline if you see that as a benefit.

But overall, Serenity has only hurt progress on the game.


That's where I'm a little confused. I have met players in this game and others who admit to having to use proxies to get onto games outside of china, so that they wouldn't get in trouble. But I'm not sure if they were telling the truth or not, as I don't read chinese and don't live there myself.

Bestofworst
Gallente
Posted - 2009.04.26 22:53:00 - [22]
 

Originally by: Xenoxide
Edited by: Xenoxide on 26/04/2009 22:02:50
Originally by: Sjobba
Is the Chinese government seriously censoring EVE?
For what possible reason?


The Chinese Government censors the entire internet for the Chinese population. The want to control the entire flow of information leaving and entering China via the internet. From news reports, to blogs, to videos available on YouTube. Pretty much any interaction with the rest of the world, they censor.

I guess since EVE provides methods of communication across the net, CCP had no choice but to create a seperate, cut-off, cluster for the Chinese market - one where the Chinese people cannot freely interact with people across the world.

I refer you to this article on "The Great Firewall of China": http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_censorship_in_the_People%27s_Republic_of_China.


http://current.com/items/89455963_see-the-internet-through-chinas-eyes.htm#89455990

Another good video about the China's great firewall.

Fat Buddah
Posted - 2009.04.27 01:38:00 - [23]
 

why China then? Right next door is S. Korea, a big MMO paradise.

Neo Omni
Gallente
Posted - 2009.04.27 01:57:00 - [24]
 

Originally by: Fat Buddah
why China then? Right next door is S. Korea, a big MMO paradise.


good point

Shane Darman
Gallente
The Scope
Posted - 2009.04.27 02:16:00 - [25]
 

Originally by: Fat Buddah
why China then? Right next door is S. Korea, a big MMO paradise.


S. Korea rejected Eve for Spore.

Commander Aeris
Caldari
Galactic Trade Guild
Posted - 2009.04.27 07:31:00 - [26]
 

Originally by: Sjobba

Wow, I had no idea China was so messed up Neutral
Kind of makes me glad I'm not Chinese Wink


Being Chinese has nothing to do with it, an American living/working in China would suffer the same problem ugh

Originally by: Fat Buddah
why China then? Right next door is S. Korea, a big MMO paradise.


As has been said before, South Korea just logs into TQ. Only the people in China have no direct link out of the country, hence the "government run" server. Rolling Eyes

Lui Kai
Better Than You
Posted - 2009.04.27 07:50:00 - [27]
 

Originally by: Ruze Ahkor'Murkon
Good to know. You say I'm wrong. Could you enlighten this poor, lonely soul into exactly WHAT I got wrong?

I'm all for learning from my mistakes. Fire away. Tell us what Serenity is, and why it's hosted in China by a separate gaming group than CCP. I think we'd all like to know.


If, by "VERY different" you mean the meaningless fluff text is changed, then yes - they're different. The ships, mechanics, and world are exactly the same as ours, excepting that they tend to be 1-2 expansions behind TQ. In my world, backstory drivel doesn't constitute a major game change.

Equally, the code wasn't "loaned" out - it was licensed under very strict and ongoing terms, which generate revenue for CCP every quarter.

As to different trade mechanics or "player rights" - I have no idea what you're even on about here. It's vague and nonsensical, and I can think of nothing on Serenity that matches up to what you're trying to allude to.

It doesn't "kinda resemble eve" - it is eve, just 1-2 expansions behind. And only behind due to the delay in localizing the patches. CCP does control it, could make whatever changes they chose, and could shut it down if they so decided. While they don't run the physical server plant, they still write the code that goes to it. The only thing done to that code by someone other than CCP is said localization changes.

Ruze Ahkor'Murkon
Amarr
No Applicable Corporation
Posted - 2009.04.27 07:52:00 - [28]
 

Originally by: Lui Kai
Originally by: Ruze Ahkor'Murkon
Good to know. You say I'm wrong. Could you enlighten this poor, lonely soul into exactly WHAT I got wrong?

I'm all for learning from my mistakes. Fire away. Tell us what Serenity is, and why it's hosted in China by a separate gaming group than CCP. I think we'd all like to know.


If, by "VERY different" you mean the meaningless fluff text is changed, then yes - they're different. The ships, mechanics, and world are exactly the same as ours, excepting that they tend to be 1-2 expansions behind TQ. In my world, backstory drivel doesn't constitute a major game change.

Equally, the code wasn't "loaned" out - it was licensed under very strict and ongoing terms, which generate revenue for CCP every quarter.

As to different trade mechanics or "player rights" - I have no idea what you're even on about here. It's vague and nonsensical, and I can think of nothing on Serenity that matches up to what you're trying to allude to.

It doesn't "kinda resemble eve" - it is eve, just 1-2 expansions behind. And only behind due to the delay in localizing the patches. CCP does control it, could make whatever changes they chose, and could shut it down if they so decided. While they don't run the physical server plant, they still write the code that goes to it. The only thing done to that code by someone other than CCP is said localization changes.


I guess it's a matter of definition. Changing the backstory and storyline of EvE would constitute a 'major difference' in my book.

Same mechanics, same skin, different universe.

Lui Kai
Better Than You
Posted - 2009.04.27 08:59:00 - [29]
 

Then allow me to present you with a brand new game - entirely different from anything you have ever encountered before. It's nothing like anything on the market, and while the code for it was only loaned to me - I expect that my complete creative control over the product will allow me great latitude in any future changes.

RaTTuS
BIG
Gentlemen's Agreement
Posted - 2009.04.27 09:10:00 - [30]
 

Why: - Chinese Laws
When: - forever
Where: - China

What's different
limited time allowed in game during a 24hr period
religion backgrounds removed
no podding
everything in Chinese
lower numbers

that's about it really





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