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blankseplocked It's official, attribute respec twice a year
 
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Joh Lan
MIAPICSA
Posted - 2009.02.10 11:07:00 - [61]
 

Originally by: Rodj Blake
Originally by: Joh Lan


So in the same time they could have a maxed level toon in another mmo they find out they have screwed it and there is no way back.



The reason a lot of us love Eve is precisely because it isn't like other games.


Indeed. But that doesn't change the fact some new players might screw attributes badly and waste a lot of time with that.

RaTTuS
BIG
Gentlemen's Agreement
Posted - 2009.02.10 11:27:00 - [62]
 

noobs can still gimp themselves by re-mapping their attributes and then they are stuck for 6mnths


Shan'Talasha Mea'Questa
Minmatar
The Perfect Harvesting Experience
Posted - 2009.02.10 12:12:00 - [63]
 

Rodj Blake and Rattus.... thanks for voicing my thoughts. Wink

Synoxion Zek
Posted - 2009.02.10 12:33:00 - [64]
 

I personally think that this is a great move for CCP, though I do think that they should put some limitations on it. Making it a one time thing would significantly lower its potential for abuse. But since it would be a one time thing it should only be available to toons that are older than 6 months (TBH a toon that is younger than 6 months with bad stats should just be rerolled).

I started playing eve at the recommendation of a friend who was not very knowledgeable about the game. I told him that I was only interested in combat related stuff and was not interested in mining or trading. He told me to put all my points in to perception and willpower saying that it was all I would need since I would be going for combat related skills. This has made training the much more important skills such as cap and tanking skills a complete nightmare. I also have more of an interest in combat support which is heavily seeded in memory and intelligence as opposed to pure dps which my toon was originally designed for.

I am sure that there are many other players out there with similar stories who would all welcome the opportunity (even if only once) to reset their attributes to at least be balanced. This way at least we wont regret our attributes when training a particular skill.

Joh Lan
MIAPICSA
Posted - 2009.02.10 13:54:00 - [65]
 

This would actually result in shorter training times overall since people could optimize what they mostly train in 6 months.

But ofc some of the "I trained bs5 for 70000 days back back in '03" will disapprove this just as they did with advanced learning skills and Achura race.

Joseph Dredd
Mega City One
Posted - 2009.02.10 14:37:00 - [66]
 

Edited by: Joseph Dredd on 10/02/2009 14:44:47
A good idea I think especialy for the older players before thigs like leadership came in.
When you created your player back in 03 there were not many skills and even less good ones that used charisma so that was left behind.
Along came the 15.8 mil sp you can get in leadership and a great help to fleet combat to boot so at last the older players can give it some loving for a few months.
Thankfully my atributes were well rounded but a lot of people have missed this line of skilling at a decent rate.

There will be people who say well thats tough luck for the players they should have balanced their skills at the start or had one toon for pvp and one for trade etc but how were they to know when they started that a whole 15.8 mil sp section useful to pvp would pop up a couple of years later.

Osric Wuscfrea
Gallente
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2009.02.10 15:56:00 - [67]
 

Intelligence 19
Perception 22
Charisma 19
Willpower 18
Memory 17

Like many others I had no idea what they did when I created my char, so are we saying I get to drop Char to 14 or 5? I'd like to boost Memory & Willpower (having already trained all the leadership skills I'm likely to need). I would simply aim to level them out as much as possible.

Florio
Miniature Giant Space Hamsters
Posted - 2009.02.10 16:36:00 - [68]
 

There's something fishy about this. It makes a mockery of the whole attribute system. May as well boost all attributes to the max (which is silly of course).

I most certainly would be happy with a respec system but only on a one-off basis. And I think that is all the majority of people have been asking for. That is necessary I'd say.

What will happen under current proposals is more of the learning skills fiasco, where people devise "ultimate" skillplans where all core int/mem skills get trained up first over (eg.) 8 months then all core perc/wp skills get trained up for 10 months etc etc, meaning more people leave the game in frustration because they end up with recon V and engineering II and can't do anything.

RisenPhoenix
Shadowyn Corp.
Posted - 2009.02.10 17:32:00 - [69]
 

A ONE TIME respec is good but every 6 months is bad

nether void
Caldari
Brotherhood of Suicidal Priests
R.A.G.E
Posted - 2009.02.10 17:54:00 - [70]
 

I love you CCP! I started this character back when either battleships weren't even out yet, or were not out for long. There weren't many long skill trains back then, so stats were not as uber important.

This rocks! My character won't have the gimp train times anymore. lol

Fritz Ionar
Minmatar
LifeLine Solutions
Posted - 2009.02.10 21:15:00 - [71]
 

Originally by: RisenPhoenix
A ONE TIME respec is good but every 6 months is bad

Agreaed

Yelan Zhou
Amarr
Ba.theen Aljannatal Asaakitah
Celestial Imperative
Posted - 2009.02.10 21:22:00 - [72]
 

Originally by: RisenPhoenix
A ONE TIME respec is good but every 6 months is bad

bff Jill
Posted - 2009.02.10 21:37:00 - [73]
 

Edited by: bff Jill on 10/02/2009 21:46:36
This is a horrible idea.

You people thinking its great because you can undo your broken stats dont understand what this means. Your stats wont even matter!

You will have 15 in one stat, 9 in another, 5 in the others, and spend 6 months training up skills that have that stat as primary.

Then you will respec your stats, and spend 6 months training skills that have that as primary.

While it will result in people being able to train up much more quickly than they currently can, its more or less the end of stat spreads entierly, because they just dont matter.

Only people who want to end up training skills at like, 2/3rds the speed of everyone else will keep their stats distributed one way or another.

And further it will limit someones skills. A new character will now be useless for a year and a half until they have had time to go through a 6 month Int cycle, a 6 month memory cycle, and a 6 month perception cycle.

A ONE TIME RESPEC to let people work out good stats for their character, thats fine. But constant respecs are just a horrible idea.

If this goes live im quitting. I dont want to, but i can not be hassled to have to train up skills like this. And yes i DO HAVE TO! saying you dont is like saying you can try to break a gate camp with a civilian omnitanked covetor. You can try, but you will fail, horribly.

I HATE mmos that force you to do this sort of thing.

Dray
Caldari
Euphoria Released
HYDRA RELOADED
Posted - 2009.02.10 21:38:00 - [74]
 

I've said this in another thread before the change was announced, I'm a 2003 char and I balanced my stats becuase back then we just didnt know how the game would proceed, with max learning and +5 imps my two lowest attribs are perception and charisma with 23 points, of my 90m sp 60m are primary perc skills I'm glad they've allowed this but it might be too little too late for me but I'm going to make good use of it.

About time the vets got some love tbh.

Yelan Zhou
Amarr
Ba.theen Aljannatal Asaakitah
Celestial Imperative
Posted - 2009.02.10 21:54:00 - [75]
 

Originally by: Dray
I've said this in another thread before the change was announced, I'm a 2003 char and I balanced my stats becuase back then we just didnt know how the game would proceed, with max learning and +5 imps my two lowest attribs are perception and charisma with 23 points, of my 90m sp 60m are primary perc skills I'm glad they've allowed this but it might be too little too late for me but I'm going to make good use of it.

About time the vets got some love tbh.

I think noone would have said anything against a one time respec.But that system is ridiculous.

bff Jill
Posted - 2009.02.11 00:18:00 - [76]
 

Originally by: Raymon James
Originally by: Pestilent Industries
No, it is not. It is possible to create a 5 5 5 5 15 though. New characters are not going to be like old ones. Only old characters will have an attribute lower than 5. New characters will all be 5 minimum in each stat.
ok so thoes old annoying Achuras who still have a cha of three will still have an edge over the rest of us.


No, they wont. Because they wont have 15/9 primary/secondary attributes for every skill they ever want to train ever in their entire character life, provided they tediously plan their training in a horribly frustrating and boring way.

I guess of all possible characters, 3 charisma achuras will be the 'least gimped' if you dont do the whole exploitable min/max thing. But least gimped is still gimped.

motomysz
Nexus Advanced Technologies
Fidelas Constans
Posted - 2009.02.11 05:08:00 - [77]
 

I am going to set myself per/will heavy and train 6 months of gunnery/spaceship command, then set mem/int heavy and train 6 months of electronics/mechanic/engineering.

I hate to do it, but everyone else will, and I'm not going to put myself at a disadvantage.

bff Jill
Posted - 2009.02.11 05:15:00 - [78]
 

Originally by: motomysz
I am going to set myself per/will heavy and train 6 months of gunnery/spaceship command, then set mem/int heavy and train 6 months of electronics/mechanic/engineering.

I hate to do it, but everyone else will, and I'm not going to put myself at a disadvantage.


Going to be really tough on newbies who want to be combat characters. Ive looking forward to it on my new mining/industry/trading alts though. Super carebear buff patch! ughugh

Calleb
Posted - 2009.02.11 08:22:00 - [79]
 

I generally agree with the fact that re-allocating attributes every 6 months is stoopid. Maybe they consider this to be the average lifespan of a character and therefore think it will spark some longevity to the game for more peeps.

Personaly I feel as it has been said above that it is a good idea, as long as you can only do it once (to fix gimped problems caused at creation when you simply dont know any better) any more than this is just wrong

Aliedora
Caldari
Science and Trade Institute
Posted - 2009.02.11 09:19:00 - [80]
 

I honestly don't understand what's wrong with being able to respect every 6 months. don't you want to train faster as opposed to slower? don't you want to be better as opposed to worse?

one would think that a change like that would gain unanimous support from players, both old and new, but nooo, people still whine and moan and conjure up a myriad of reasons against those changes.

Zhanja
Posted - 2009.02.11 09:37:00 - [81]
 

So when will this come live ingame?
All i have seen is this post. Shocked

Krell Moset
Posted - 2009.02.11 09:50:00 - [82]
 

Edited by: Krell Moset on 11/02/2009 09:50:50
As a new player (1 month-ish) I think a one time re-spec is a good idea, I spent ages reading guides and trying to figure out what attributes to go with whilst retaining some kind of choice (ie not just playing caldari archura) and still ended up re-reolling twice and even now am not 100% happy!

Before anyone say's it no I am not going to re-roll having missioned and salvaged the 18 million I spent on advanced learning skills...no way...I would rather be stuck with low attributes than grind missions for isk/standings for another month...

After having played for a month I have a feel for what i like and what i don't, knowing what I know now I would have put at least one more point into perception and 2 or more into willpower seeing as I want to train for covert ops leading on to recons. So a one time respec would let me trim the few charisma I don't need and balance out my attributes and get me where I want to go a little faster.

It should be one time, and one time only otherwise it will be open to abuse.

Kessiaan
Minmatar
Vagrants Inc
Posted - 2009.02.11 10:49:00 - [83]
 

Originally by: Fritz Ionar
Originally by: RisenPhoenix
A ONE TIME respec is good but every 6 months is bad

Agreaed


*jumps on the quote train*

One-time is good. Once every 18 months or so is good too. But once every six months seems a bit too much to me - new chars can balance their attributes (as they have to train a diverse set of skills), after that focusing on specific skillsets and maxing the attributes for them is quite doable if the respec period is once every six months.

Shaemell Buttleson
Posted - 2009.02.11 10:57:00 - [84]
 

Considering how easy it is to get +5 implants and that you can buff any attribute by 10 points with learning skills I cannot see why this is really needed tbh.


StarStryder
WISE OUTCASTS
Posted - 2009.02.11 10:59:00 - [85]
 

This is listed in the Apocrypha release notes on Sisi:

Quote:
New characters are now able to redistribute their attribute points at will any time after character creation (Twice for free). This option is available on the Character Sheet’s Attributes screen. Pilots pick their character attributes in a way that supports their expected gameplay. With Attribute Respecification, players will be able to change their core attributes (charisma, intelligence, memory, perception, willpower) within the game. Older characters can now redistribute their attribute points once every six months.


So yeah, confirmed.

Jagga Spikes
Minmatar
Spikes Chop Shop
Posted - 2009.02.11 11:28:00 - [86]
 

i think this is a good way.

try to see attributes not as "set in stone" (as they are in most game systems, where they usually determine success chance and not learning speed), and consider remapping as shifting learning dedication. people grow tired of certain activities and interested in others, and it does affect their learning.

will this allow min/maxing? yes, but min/maxing existed since forever. system might require some tweaking (I would love to see different racial/ancestry minimums), but is a good idea.

what is a bigger issue, are learning skills. sooner ccp gets rid of them, sooner this game will pick up the pace for everyone. effectively mandatory, month of training doubles character's learning speed, but adds absolutely nothing to fun factor.

remember, it's a game. play for fun.

Damith d'Estelas
Gallente
Aliastra
Posted - 2009.02.11 11:58:00 - [87]
 

My first thought reading this was wtf?

EVE Online = "a massively multiplayer online roleplaying game".... oh hell what's the point? Those of you who like to look down on and sneer at "stupid roleplayers" like me won't understand (and yes, it really p*sses me off that you come into a roleplaying game then sneer at those who roleplay), and those of you who do roleplay in any sense of the word don't need me to tell you why this is a really awful idea. I'd have thought that that would include CCP, but seems not. Sad

As a "once per character" option, for those who really screwed their initial attributes, fair enough I guess. Anything more than that, and why bother with racial characteristics and attributes at all?

And as for the notion "if you don't like it don't do it" - stupid. You're missing the point. The point is it's an awful idea because it further nerfs the whole roleplaying side of this game (which roleplaying was, once upon a time, one of the things that set EVE apart from other so-called roleplaying universes), and plays to the teenage power player gallery who couldn't care a [insert your own censorable words of choice here] about anything that remotely resembles roleplaying.

I guess all I can do is post this so at least there's another "no" vote on record. Meh...

Ralitge boyter
Minmatar
Posted - 2009.02.11 12:40:00 - [88]
 

Edited by: Ralitge boyter on 11/02/2009 12:46:13
I like the whole idea of being able to move my skill points around a bit, it gives me the ability to push my characters skills just that little bit further, the only problem is that a lot of people will be training only certain skills for half a year and then only certain others for half a year simply because it would be a waste of time to do it in any other way.

Having messed about with it on SISI I am very glad I made my skill points as evenly distributed as I could possibly make them it seems to give the best available respec posibilities.

All that are quitting please remember this friendly Brutor Wink

bff Jill
Posted - 2009.02.11 19:13:00 - [89]
 

Oh I definitely am looking forward to this. Now that ive been playing for a while and am somewhat 'established' this is nothing but a min/maxing dream for me, make those SPs climb even faster!

I can confirm however that if i was a total newbie this would prevent me from playing eve. I would hate to have to put off training a certain kind of skill for 6months+.

Maybe it will work out. Someone said that new characters created will get TWO respecs right off the bat (not having to wait 6 months between them). This may make it easier to exploit the stats for optimal sp/second even for a newbie who has a lot of different skills that need to be trained up at the start. We will see.

Emorius
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2009.02.11 19:33:00 - [90]
 

I have to say this is a WELCOME addition to eve. Being able to put your attributes in a more spec status then you originally designed, perhaps of rookie mistake, no knowledge and what not..........is just great. However, after thinking it through, and like so many others here, the whole 6 month time frame to be able to respec again........and again 6 months after.....and again......etc, something is wrong there.

I really think this is completely destroy diversity, and uniqueness between each character. If they do implement this i recommend the following:

1. Its a one time respec, and only one - This corrects everyones mistakes they have made in the past
2. They keep the attribute changes to only the choices you had at creation......as in your 5 pts you had to place, and only those you can switch around.
3. They need to make Charisma alot more useful as its one of the biggest reasons why everyone even cares to respec.

Overall im excited about it, cant wait, and hopefully it goes through some more tweaks before it hits live. Peace.


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