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xxxak
Caldari
Intergalactic Syndicate
Nulli Secunda
Posted - 2009.01.26 19:33:00 - [1]
 

Edited by: xxxak on 26/01/2009 21:51:20
Edited by: xxxak on 26/01/2009 19:33:50
Now that I can fly all 4 races:

Is this accurate: Amarr cruisers are worse for PVP than Gallente / Minmitar cruisers?


Is this also true for T2 cruisers? (I think no..)

I have about 22 mil SP. I don't fly BS in PvP unless there is a very specific situation calling for it. I also only have about 500k in Amarr right now, just got it today, hence the post.

Thx for the info the on Arbitrator. I had written it off, but it does look like a decent T1 fun boat.

Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS
IDLE EMPIRE
Posted - 2009.01.26 19:36:00 - [2]
 

t1 cruisers, maybe but I don't care enough to really find out. t2 cruisers no

P'uck
Posted - 2009.01.26 19:38:00 - [3]
 

Arbitrator is pretty damn nifty.

Eldern Minderhost
Posted - 2009.01.26 19:48:00 - [4]
 

In my experience (I often fly gallente, caldari, and amarrian cruisers) the cruisers are remarkably balanced. Yes they all have different strengths so someone trying to fly a Maller as a DPS ship will obviously find it weaker than a DPS focused Thorax. Similarly a pilot who tries to fly a blackbird as an ECM ship will find it weaker than the blackbird.

In terms of Amarrian cruisers specifically that I fly regularly:

-Arbitrator: one of the more versatile ships I've ever flown. Wonderful to play in and is able to utilize any number of different setups effectively.
-Omen: Glass cannon, this ship has great DPS for a cruiser but it's durability is sadly lacking, a general strategy is simply to melt the other guy very quickly.
-Maller: Good tank for a T1 cruiser but leaves much to be desired otherwise.

Cedric Diggory
Perfunctory Oleaginous Laocoon Mugwumps
Posted - 2009.01.26 19:55:00 - [5]
 

The arbitrator is the equal of any ship in it's tier, but the others are a bit... lacking. The Maller makes a good cyno ship and if you can guarantee not getting shot, the Omen can put out some serious damage but neither can perform particularly well when you try to get a balanced fit.

Spaztick
Terminal Impact
Kairakau
Posted - 2009.01.26 20:02:00 - [6]
 

Is this accurate: Minmatar battleships are worse for PVP than Amarr/Caldari

Answer: If you're trying to make a ship do something it wasn't designed to do, then yes.

xxxak
Caldari
Intergalactic Syndicate
Nulli Secunda
Posted - 2009.01.26 20:11:00 - [7]
 

Originally by: Spaztick
Is this accurate: Minmatar battleships are worse for PVP than Amarr/Caldari

Answer: If you're trying to make a ship do something it wasn't designed to do, then yes.


Like I said, I fly all 4 races. I just want to know which T1 cruiser I should fly most regularly.

P'uck
Posted - 2009.01.26 20:18:00 - [8]
 

The one that you enjoy the most. And since we dont know you, it's kind of hard to tell.
I for one like em all. Cruisers are just nice to fly. Every single one of them.

Willow Whisp
Sadist Faction
Posted - 2009.01.26 20:23:00 - [9]
 

Originally by: P'uck
Every single one of them.

Even the Exequror? Shocked

Julius Romanus
Amarr
Posted - 2009.01.26 20:25:00 - [10]
 

Amarr Cruisers:

Omen: Reasonable glass cannon. Also able to fit a somewhat decent 'balanced' fit if you use an afterburner

Maller: Able to engage on gates/stations in the right situation. I absolutely hate flying this ship, I'd rather fly a prophecy for like 10-15mil isk extra.

Arbitrator: Lots of options here. Good gang support ship. I like going with TD's and a drone link aug in a gang. Solo you can run either plate/mar hybrid, or dual mar cap boosted tanks. Really with a 4/4/4 slot layout you can do a lot of things, but arent going to excel at much. Decent solo boat, though beware roaming in the plate versions, can get caught at gates by anything with a sensor booster and twitch reflexes.

Woulvesbaine
Posted - 2009.01.26 20:25:00 - [11]
 

Is your account new? You say you fly all 4 races. This is a good thing as you get into high SP as flexibility in choice is really fun. But if you are under 20mil sp I would still be pouring SP in areas that will help support 2 or 3 ships you enjoy the most.

This being said, I can fly all 4 races cruisers and have > 20 mil SP on more then on account. Arbi as many above posters is probably my favorite t1 cruiser of all time. Tracking disruptors or even sensor damps in the middle with some drones are a nice combo in a small gang. Just stay aligned because you dont want to be tanking in one.

Vexor is for me its equal but I fly it differently. I like it armor tanked and plated for a combo of tanking but enough ehp to not insta pop.

Thorax is my faovrite gun t1 cruiser in the game - making it my third choice. Can take a beating and lay out nice dps. Can lay it out for tank, gank, or a bit of a combo. I used to fly them nano with rails in large gangs for a hoot but well now that is not such a great setup.

Omen is fun but not the rax's equal in my experience. I seem to pop faster in them.

I used to fly rupture/stabber a long time ago and to be honest I am not sure how I would fly them now. I tend not to like Minnie for t1 cruisers so much anymore even though this is where I am specced highest. I really am kind of down on minnie right now tbh.

Some people I know say you can armor tank a rupture - but if you can fly all 4 races, I might sooner armor tank a vexor/rax.

Caracal is a good stand off t1 ship but I feel like paper in it. No idea how it compares in eft - I just feel like I die fast in them so its kind of last on my list.

Play around a bit and lose a few cruisers - they are cheap. Then see what you have the most FUN in and pour SP that will support those ships as you move towards t2 ships or other desires.

GL.

bff Jill
Posted - 2009.01.26 20:27:00 - [12]
 

rupture arbitrator stabber

depending

P'uck
Posted - 2009.01.26 20:29:00 - [13]
 

Originally by: Willow Whisp
Even the Exequror? Shocked

Heck, yes, and I can even top that with liking the Augoror. Laughing

bff Jill
Posted - 2009.01.26 20:29:00 - [14]
 

Edited by: bff Jill on 26/01/2009 20:30:30
Originally by: Willow Whisp
Originally by: P'uck
Every single one of them.

Even the Exequror? Shocked


neuts and a whole lot of cap charges

VoiceInTheDesert
Inroads
Posted - 2009.01.26 20:31:00 - [15]
 

Originally by: xxxak
Originally by: Spaztick
Is this accurate: Minmatar battleships are worse for PVP than Amarr/Caldari

Answer: If you're trying to make a ship do something it wasn't designed to do, then yes.


Like I said, I fly all 4 races. I just want to know which T1 cruiser I should fly most regularly.

If you fly all 4 races up to BS, you should have about 40m SP at least and if you don't, you're doing it wrong and it's no wonder that they do not seem "balanced"

Corwain
Posted - 2009.01.26 20:33:00 - [16]
 

Originally by: xxxak
Originally by: Spaztick
Is this accurate: Minmatar battleships are worse for PVP than Amarr/Caldari

Answer: If you're trying to make a ship do something it wasn't designed to do, then yes.


Like I said, I fly all 4 races. I just want to know which T1 cruiser I should fly most regularly.


The one you enjoy flying best. What's with everyone flying whatever boring ship will "make me invincible."

Julius Romanus
Amarr
Posted - 2009.01.26 20:36:00 - [17]
 

Originally by: Woulvesbaine
Is your account new? You say you fly all 4 races. This is a good thing as you get into high SP as flexibility in choice is really fun. But if you are under 20mil sp I would still be pouring SP in areas that will help support 2 or 3 ships you enjoy the most.

This being said, I can fly all 4 races cruisers and have > 20 mil SP on more then on account. Arbi as many above posters is probably my favorite t1 cruiser of all time. Tracking disruptors or even sensor damps in the middle with some drones are a nice combo in a small gang. Just stay aligned because you dont want to be tanking in one.

Vexor is for me its equal but I fly it differently. I like it armor tanked and plated for a combo of tanking but enough ehp to not insta pop.

Thorax is my faovrite gun t1 cruiser in the game - making it my third choice. Can take a beating and lay out nice dps. Can lay it out for tank, gank, or a bit of a combo. I used to fly them nano with rails in large gangs for a hoot but well now that is not such a great setup.

Omen is fun but not the rax's equal in my experience. I seem to pop faster in them.

I used to fly rupture/stabber a long time ago and to be honest I am not sure how I would fly them now. I tend not to like Minnie for t1 cruisers so much anymore even though this is where I am specced highest. I really am kind of down on minnie right now tbh.

Some people I know say you can armor tank a rupture - but if you can fly all 4 races, I might sooner armor tank a vexor/rax.

Caracal is a good stand off t1 ship but I feel like paper in it. No idea how it compares in eft - I just feel like I die fast in them so its kind of last on my list.

Play around a bit and lose a few cruisers - they are cheap. Then see what you have the most FUN in and pour SP that will support those ships as you move towards t2 ships or other desires.

GL.


Spot on post. Omen is fun times, but you pop quicker than the other fun gunboat cruisers. Cara is a 'neat' but ineffective t1 cruiser. Arbi is made of funsauce, but not very tough(i swear by drone link aug/TD fit).

Omara Otawan
Posted - 2009.01.26 20:48:00 - [18]
 

Originally by: xxxak

Like I said, I fly all 4 races. I just want to know which T1 cruiser I should fly most regularly.


Thorax and Arbitrator are without doubt the best t1 cruisers around.

xxxak
Caldari
Intergalactic Syndicate
Nulli Secunda
Posted - 2009.01.26 21:50:00 - [19]
 

I have about 22 mil SP. I don't fly BS in PvP unless there is a very specific situation calling for it. I also only have about 500k in Amarr right now, just got it today, hence the post.

Atius Tirawa
Minmatar
Sebiestor Tribe
Posted - 2009.01.26 22:36:00 - [20]
 

You need to focus your training a little more.

Pick one ship, train the support skills (tanking, engeneering, electronics) and whatever wepon system you are gonna use. In the case of Amarr - lazers and drones, tracking disruptors and noss/neut skills. After you have all mastered a particular wepon system/ship - then you train for the next one while flying your previously chosen ship and so on.

Deschenus Maximus
Amarr
Digital Fury Corporation
Ushra'Khan
Posted - 2009.01.26 22:37:00 - [21]
 

Arbi is very nice. T2, all of 'em are pretty good.

Hirana Yoshida
Behavioral Affront
Posted - 2009.01.26 22:49:00 - [22]
 

In the grand scheme of things: Yes.

Arbitrator's stand out as a powerhouse when it comes to Amarr T1 PvP cruisers. Drone based damage just leaves so much versatility for the slots on the ship itself, learn to respect it and it will serve you well.

Maller's and Omen's can be rather nasty in the right hands, but those hands are few and far between.
The Omen and Maller generally have too many shortcomings to compete with the Gallante and Minmatar on an equal footing.

T2 and the picture flips almost 100%. Zealot, Sacrilege, Curse, Guardian, Pilgrim are all near or at the top when it comes to PvP.
Amarr is very much a case of "you get a turd in left hand, and a gold nugget in the right"


xxxak
Caldari
Intergalactic Syndicate
Nulli Secunda
Posted - 2009.01.26 23:00:00 - [23]
 

Originally by: Atius Tirawa
You need to focus your training a little more.

Pick one ship, train the support skills (tanking, engeneering, electronics) and whatever wepon system you are gonna use. In the case of Amarr - lazers and drones, tracking disruptors and noss/neut skills. After you have all mastered a particular wepon system/ship - then you train for the next one while flying your previously chosen ship and so on.


I know you are kind of right, although I can full T2 fit all sub BS minmitar ships, and full T2 almost all sub BS Caldari (including Falcon). I also have T2 everything but guns for Gallente and Amarr now.

So, I am doing OK. I have zero SP in anything non combat related.

My weaknesses are in gunnery support skills, and that is my next train. That.. and Caps.

Tzar'rim
Posted - 2009.01.26 23:06:00 - [24]
 

Amarr, in general, tends to do well at medium range while not really being mobile or capable of controlling a short range fight or soloing.

This means that shipsizes/classes who mostly rely on short range tactics don't favour Amarr, this goes for frigs and cruisers. So unless you're talking T2; the best frigs/cruisers Amarr has are the ones which don't use lasers as a main weapon system.

Ofcourse there's roles where they're very good but in general if you wanto solo PVP other races have the advantage.

Ottersmacker
Genos Occidere
HYDRA RELOADED
Posted - 2009.01.26 23:30:00 - [25]
 

in b4 the infamous pulse thorax > pulse omen numbers

Merin Ryskin
Peregrine Industries
Posted - 2009.01.26 23:48:00 - [26]
 

Amarr T1 cruisers just plain suck. The Maller is a joke (T1 cruiser "tank" is pure comedy), the Omen is impossible to fit properly (but would be a solid ship otherwise), and it's kind of a hint when none of the setups for your ewar cruiser involve using ewar. Of course none of this really matters, since ALL T1 cruisers suck, with the exception of the Blackbird, so it's really not much of a loss.

On the other hand, the Amarr T2 cruisers are pure awesomeness. The Zealot is the second-best HAC (losing only to the Phantasm, another Amarr ship), the Sacrilege is pretty solid 1v1, the Curse is still dangerous as hell, and the Pilgrim... well, it's good with lasers. Oh well, 3 out of 4 isn't too bad.

Yashiri
The Scope
Posted - 2009.01.26 23:51:00 - [27]
 

Originally by: Merin Ryskin
Amarr T1 cruisers just plain suck. The Maller is a joke (T1 cruiser "tank" is pure comedy), the Omen is impossible to fit properly (but would be a solid ship otherwise), and it's kind of a hint when none of the setups for your ewar cruiser involve using ewar. Of course none of this really matters, since ALL T1 cruisers suck, with the exception of the Thorax, so it's really not much of a loss.

On the other hand, the Amarr T2 cruisers are pure awesomeness. The Zealot is the second-best HAC (losing only to the Phantasm, another Amarr ship), the Sacrilege is pretty solid 1v1, the Curse is still dangerous as hell, and the Pilgrim... well, it's good with lasers. Oh well, 3 out of 4 isn't too bad.


fixed

Raniss
Posted - 2009.01.26 23:52:00 - [28]
 

Originally by: Merin Ryskin
Amarr T1 cruisers just plain suck. The Maller is a joke (T1 cruiser "tank" is pure comedy), the Omen is impossible to fit properly (but would be a solid ship otherwise), and it's kind of a hint when none of the setups for your ewar cruiser involve using ewar. Of course none of this really matters, since ALL T1 cruisers suck, with the exception of the Blackbird, so it's really not much of a loss.

On the other hand, the Amarr T2 cruisers are pure awesomeness. The Zealot is the second-best HAC (losing only to the Phantasm, another Amarr ship), the Sacrilege is pretty solid 1v1, the Curse is still dangerous as hell, and the Pilgrim... well, it's good with lasers. Oh well, 3 out of 4 isn't too bad.


Hi troll welcome back from your ban, working on your second ban i suppose?

Thenoran
Caldari
Tranquility Industries
Posted - 2009.01.26 23:59:00 - [29]
 

Cruisers are fine, it's what people expect from them for 5mil or less that's out of whack.
Thorax makes a great ship, ofcourse it beats the Omen, it has shorter range weapons that deal more damage on top of the fact EM/Thermal doesn't work as great on armor as Kinetic/Thermal AND on top of the fact that the Thorax is a Tier 3 Cruiser, and the Omen is not.

Tzar'rim
Posted - 2009.01.27 00:01:00 - [30]
 

T1 cruisers dont' suck, they have their role and place. They are cost effective and work well under the right circumstances. What you say is kinda like "carriers suck, mom's are so much better". No sh!t sherlock, really?

Apart from that, there IS a decent Omen setup that works reasonably well although it won't be on par with a Thorax, but that's more an issue with the Thorax than it is with the Omen.



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