open All Channels
seplocked Market Discussions
blankseplocked [Atima Industries] Expansion plan 40bn, 4-10% return 80% secured!
 
This thread is older than 90 days and has been locked due to inactivity.


 
Pages: first : previous : 1 2 3 [4] 5 6 7 8 9 ... : last (12)

Author Topic

Namco
Quantum Cats Syndicate
Posted - 2009.01.13 19:51:00 - [91]
 

25 shares/250mil for myself, please.

Raskaloth
Posted - 2009.01.13 20:25:00 - [92]
 

I would like to reserve 50 shares, will be sending iskies some time later when I get back home.

-Rask

Atima
Minmatar
House of Marbles
Posted - 2009.01.13 20:50:00 - [93]
 

Originally by: Amarr Citizen 155

If after 3 months you changed your business plan and started getting 50% returns, would you still only pay out 4-10%?


If that situation ever occurs i would propose changes to the current payout system which would be left to a shareholder vote.

Atima
Minmatar
House of Marbles
Posted - 2009.01.13 21:01:00 - [94]
 

Originally by: Sen Gyounen

Good question. I had a lot of questions upon first reading the topic. Most of them have been answered throughout the thread. However, one thing that isn't clear, is the original investment going to be treated the same as the new issue, in terms of dividends?



Yes, the new shares are going to be treated the same as the original investment. There has only been one change and that is that the buyback has been increased to 115% and this applies to all shares.

Biohit
Amarr
Biohit Corp
Posted - 2009.01.13 21:05:00 - [95]
 

250 shares please

Shavana
Made in Canada
Posted - 2009.01.13 21:26:00 - [96]
 

I'd like to reserve 30 shares/300m for me..

Isk to be sent later tonight when I get home

nether void
Caldari
Brotherhood of Suicidal Priests
R.A.G.E
Posted - 2009.01.13 21:50:00 - [97]
 

The reason this looks like a bond and not an IPO is because in real IPOs dividend payments are a percentage of profits; not a percentage of initial investment (a percentage of initial ivestment is interest - a bond, loan, or interest bearing account).

So if he said he was going to pay out 50% of profits every month, that would work out fine and would have variability built in (as a real IPO). For the first 3 months, obviously dividends will be small or nil due to research and ramp up. Slim or no profits are being made. But the real draw of an IPO is that you're gambling that the next three months afterward might have 50% margins on investment, at which point the dividend rate would be 25% of initial investment (half of the profits). At that point, yeah you're loving the IPO.

In the case we have here, the dividends are not tied to the profits. This is a bond. It can never be an IPO, because dividends are supposed to be generated from profits; not on initial investment like interest.

Namco
Quantum Cats Syndicate
Posted - 2009.01.13 21:59:00 - [98]
 

Actually, I'd like to change mine up from 25 shares to 50 shares, please.

Chaos Dreams
Posted - 2009.01.13 22:00:00 - [99]
 

2 shares/20 million, please

Sending ISK to Kazuo

Thoraemond
Minmatar
Far Ranger
Posted - 2009.01.13 22:01:00 - [100]
 

Originally by: nether void
The reason this looks like a bond and not an IPO is because in real IPOs dividend payments are a percentage of profits; not a percentage of initial investment (a percentage of initial ivestment is interest - a bond, loan, or interest bearing account).


This is where the IPO/Bond terminology of Market Discussions starts to cause some confusion. Colloquially, you could have an 'initial public offering' (IPO) of either 'equity' (shares, residual ownership and profit participation) or 'debt' (bonds, contractually defined payments of interest and principal).

(In the real world, the term 'initial public offering' is commonly defined in securities regulations and hence has become a term of art associated with equity offerings, but obviously there is no such unary regulator in New Eden to tell an issuer that they are 'doing it wrong' or to officially reject a prospectus, so the term is not so strictly defined.)

Basically, just knowing that an offering is the first public opportunity to participate in an enterprise doesn't tell you whether it's equity or debt that you're buying.

nether void
Caldari
Brotherhood of Suicidal Priests
R.A.G.E
Posted - 2009.01.13 22:10:00 - [101]
 

Originally by: Thoraemond
Originally by: nether void
The reason this looks like a bond and not an IPO is because in real IPOs dividend payments are a percentage of profits; not a percentage of initial investment (a percentage of initial ivestment is interest - a bond, loan, or interest bearing account).


This is where the IPO/Bond terminology of Market Discussions starts to cause some confusion. Colloquially, you could have an 'initial public offering' (IPO) of either 'equity' (shares, residual ownership and profit participation) or 'debt' (bonds, contractually defined payments of interest and principal).

(In the real world, the term 'initial public offering' is commonly defined in securities regulations and hence has become a term of art associated with equity offerings, but obviously there is no such unary regulator in New Eden to tell an issuer that they are 'doing it wrong' or to officially reject a prospectus, so the term is not so strictly defined.)

Basically, just knowing that an offering is the first public opportunity to participate in an enterprise doesn't tell you whether it's equity or debt that you're buying.



Regardless of the terminology used, I would still say that a dividend payment is a percentage of profits and is linked to equity financing, while a percentage returned on initial investment is debt financing. That means this is debt financing regardless of what name you put on top of it.

Still, thanks for that post. I'm still learning. =D

Akilum
Gallente
Macabre Votum
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2009.01.13 22:11:00 - [102]
 

Edited by: Akilum on 13/01/2009 23:44:57
I would like to reserve 25 shares, 250m ISK. Sending the ISK to Kazuo Ishiguro in aprox. a couple of hours.

(ISK sent)

Odessayeti
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2009.01.13 22:52:00 - [103]
 

Reserve 10 (isk sent)

Impolite Andevil
New Dawn Corporation
Circle-Of-Two
Posted - 2009.01.13 23:06:00 - [104]
 

Edited by: Impolite Andevil on 13/01/2009 23:08:54
I would like to reserve 20 shares for 200 mil isk total, isk to be sent within an hour.

Isk has been sent to Kazuo Ishiguro

Atherin Gaius
Caldari
Macabre Votum
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2009.01.13 23:12:00 - [105]
 

I wish to reserve 50 shares for 500mil. Isk to be sent this evening when I get home.

Dagda Morr
Evolution
The Initiative.
Posted - 2009.01.14 00:14:00 - [106]
 

50M sent for 5x shares - see page2 of thread for reservation.

Murixo
M. Corp
-Mostly Harmless-
Posted - 2009.01.14 01:03:00 - [107]
 

Edited by: Murixo on 14/01/2009 01:04:47
Edited by: Murixo on 14/01/2009 01:03:51
5 bill sent for my 500 shares, also 300 mill sent for cosmoray's buybacks that I swiped ;)

Edit: The latter was sent directly to Atima, not Kazuo Ishiguro.
Edit again: Have already received the shares for the latter.

John Hedon
Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2009.01.14 01:38:00 - [108]
 

I'm going to have to cut my amount down to 5 shares. 50 mil has been sent.

Trading Bunnz
Equatorial Industires
Barely-Legal
Posted - 2009.01.14 01:54:00 - [109]
 

Just out of interest, what does this expansion give you access to, unsecured? About 9.5b or so? For a newcomer?

Atima
Minmatar
House of Marbles
Posted - 2009.01.14 02:00:00 - [110]
 

Yes, i will have access to 8bn isk from this expansion. Never more than this at any given point.

Remember if i was to scam this Kazuo will disclose all of my characters that have been playing for up to 4 years each, the reputation of these characters is worth much more than 8bn to me. Also have it known that my personal assets are in excess of 8bn and i have also invested one month into this project so far which i would not be willing to throw away.

Gorobei Shimada
Posted - 2009.01.14 02:17:00 - [111]
 

I am prepared to purchase 100 shares @ ten million ISK per share, for a total price of one billion ISK.

ISK is now being sent to Kazuo Ishiguro.

Please contact me if shares are unavailable.

Thank you for your time.

Gorobei Shimada
Shimada Corporation

Namco
Quantum Cats Syndicate
Posted - 2009.01.14 03:07:00 - [112]
 

500M ISK sent to Kazuo Ishiguro for 50 shares.

alexxr
Gallente
Black Marsh X
Blazing Angels Alliance
Posted - 2009.01.14 03:25:00 - [113]
 

if shares are still availble i would like to reserve 10 shares please :D

Krathos Morpheus
Legion Infernal
Posted - 2009.01.14 03:31:00 - [114]
 

Edited by: Krathos Morpheus on 14/01/2009 03:38:17
20 shares for me, please.
200M sent to Kazuo Ishiguro.

Togen Lei
Gallente
Abyssal Heavy Industries
Posted - 2009.01.14 06:50:00 - [115]
 

I would like another share (total 2 shares). I will send the isk to Kazuo as soon as I get home from work.

Shar Tegral
Posted - 2009.01.14 07:00:00 - [116]
 

Originally by: Trading Bunnz
Just out of interest, what does this expansion give you access to, unsecured? About 9.5b or so? For a newcomer?
Originally by: Atima
Yes, i will have access to 8bn isk from this expansion. Never more than this at any given point.
Now that was disingenuous. "From this expansion" and "at any given point". The actuality is that you will have access to 12 billion isk.

Now, how much of the original 4 billion is still available is unknown to us but side stepping a direct question like that is ... umm... disingenuous at best.

Ambo
I've Got Nothing
Posted - 2009.01.14 08:42:00 - [117]
 

Can you please let us know when the vote completes and the result. I figure it's pretty ponitless sending my isk until it's confirmed that the expansion will actualyl be going ahead.

Kazuo Ishiguro
House of Marbles
Posted - 2009.01.14 09:26:00 - [118]
 

The vote ends tomorrow, the 15th, at 20:44 eve time.

Kazuo Ishiguro
House of Marbles
Posted - 2009.01.14 11:02:00 - [119]
 

After allowing for Waseem withdrawing his reservation of 500 shares, and all the other reservations made (both publicly and privately), there are currently 332 shares remaining out of the original 4000.

Jackie Fisher
Syrkos Technologies
Joint Venture Conglomerate
Posted - 2009.01.14 11:22:00 - [120]
 

Originally by: Kazuo Ishiguro
... there are currently 332 shares remaining out of the original 4000.

I'll reserve the remaining 332 shares please.


Pages: first : previous : 1 2 3 [4] 5 6 7 8 9 ... : last (12)

This thread is older than 90 days and has been locked due to inactivity.


 


The new forums are live

Please adjust your bookmarks to https://forums.eveonline.com

These forums are archived and read-only