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White Ronin
Gallente
Aliastra
Posted - 2008.11.26 13:58:00 - [1]
 

Edited by: White Ronin on 26/11/2008 14:22:59
There are lots of faction ships of all sizes. But no faction based drone ship.
Drones only have 3 modules (sub capital, 4 counting the capital module) that affect drones.
While there are a lot of different types of drones, most ships can use them as effectively as dedicated drone ships.
And all the different variations of drones (webber, sd, energy neut, ect) have such severe stacking penalties that using them is a waste. ECM drones are the only exception to this rule and every ship, including caldari, can use them as effectively as any dedicated drone boat. More so in that they use drones to supplement their normal weapons system while dedicated drone ships have to sacrifice damage to gain utility.
There are implants for almost everything, from bpo research to exploration and of course the dozens for each weapons system. But not ONE for drones. And while CCP has actually acknowledged this and said they will do something about it "someday", it just doesnt seem to be happening.
The drone regions were created and faction drones were promised. But only the gal version have been released. They are rare as hens teeth, cost an arm and a leg in rare components to make. Where are the min, amarr and cal faction versions?
Overall, drones are not high on the priority list but when was the last time they got real loving?

Where are the drone ships that enhance something other then damage, shield and armor? Maybe a bonus to webber drone str, sensor dampening or energy neut str? Lower sig radius? Something to make a dedicated drone ship want to use anything other then damage drones? Yet not ONE faction ship for droners.

Where are the implants to better control drones? Better tracking, lower sig radius, greater control range or even (as mentioned above) something to make the use of noncombat drones an option (outside ECM's)?

Where are the modules the enhance drone use? Allowing your drones to slowly regen armor, to use noncombat drones better... something.

Personally I would love to see something done to expand the role of DEDICATED drone ships. And I understand that by adding to general drone effectiveness you really give a boost to all ships using drones. But ignoring them is not the way to go.

They are the only weapons system that can be destroyed. Crying cause you have to change your fit to actually combat drones is really not worth crying about. Drone ships are not all powerful as to use noncombat drones we have to give up damage.

Could some attention be paid to this weapons system?
Could some promises be kept about releasing the rest of the faction drones?
How about differant bonuses to dedicated drone ships outside of a bonus to damage, shield and armor or their drones?
How about some implants for drone use, seeing as how most weapons systems have 3-8 dedicated to them?
What about a faction ship or two based around drones and their use?
How about restrict some types of drones to being used by only dedicated drone boats?

Or just tell us you want them to be support systems only and some of us who are dedicated to our drones can start down and differant trainging path.
As it stands now, there are many of us training our drone skills in hopes that someday you might show them love.
Stupid I know given that drones are the least developed system in the game and yet the easiest to diable.

Thank you for your time.


Scagga Laebetrovo
Failure Assured
Posted - 2008.11.26 14:08:00 - [2]
 

Originally by: White Ronin



Supported?

White Ronin
Gallente
Aliastra
Posted - 2008.11.26 14:25:00 - [3]
 

Sorry, hit the ENTER typing the title and posted a blank.
Supported.

Haldir Ravenclaw
Aliastra

Posted - 2008.11.26 17:11:00 - [4]
 

/signed

Drones in general need to be looked at, and especially drone ships (Vexor/Domi etc). While they are pretty good at their role, they are not true dedicated drone ships. I see a dedicated drone ship have minimal/zero turret slots, instead replaced by utility slots and a bigger/better drone bonus for the skills.

A few other things worth mentioning that's relevant here:

- First off, no T2 drone modules. Every other weapon system has T2 stuff, so why not drones?
- Coming straight from point one, faction drone modules? Shadow Serpentis and Gallente Navy drone modules from faction spawns/LP store.
- Mentioned before, no drone implants at all (although CCP highlighted they are possibly thinking about making some - check this link for more info and put your ideas forward).
- 'Improved' and 'Augmented' drones. Plain rubbish. Only the Gallente drones are available, extremely difficult to get and overall not worth it over normal T2 drones. How about empire faction drones with slight damage/HP/etc buff from LP store (maxe X-run bpc perhaps)? Make the Improved and Augmented more powerful than what they are now if they are to be kept that rare - so long as other races ones come out, otherwise make them more available.
- Direct drone damage modules. We have ones that improve drone control range, speed and tracking but no damage. How about a low slot module (like mag stabs, BCU's etc) that increase ALL drones' damage? Faction variants would be good here too.
- Better drone rigs. Mainly drone damage rigs that aren't sentry damage rigs.
- Fighters in general. Only 2 skills (1 if you don't have Gallente Carrier with Thanatos) and 1 module that affects these. Can we get more modules for them? Make the other drone skills useful to fighters? T2 fighters? The list goes on.

Once tech-3 comes out I really, REALLY hope we can make ourselves a proper dedicated drone ship, with, for example, bonuses to just drone stuff if we want to (e.g. Gallente Battleship bonus - same as Dominix drone bonus and whatever skill to fly T3 ship either the same bonus, or things like better HP/speed etc). Of course, I would love to have a dedicated ship with a monster drone damage bonus (mini-Moros anyone? YARRRR!!) while foregoing guns etc.

That is all. Very Happy

Mister Xerox
Posted - 2008.11.26 17:11:00 - [5]
 

I'm not a heavy drone user, but I agree 100% - drones seem to have been forgotten, but they are effective weapon systems.

Yes, the faction drones need to have a higher concentration of drops for all 4 racial types.

Yes, there needs to be at least one faction drone boat (granted, no NPC uses drones, but...)


Drake Draconis
Minmatar
Shadow Cadre
Shadow Confederation
Posted - 2008.11.26 17:12:00 - [6]
 

/signed

Bellum Eternus
Gallente
The Scope

Posted - 2008.11.26 18:09:00 - [7]
 

Big Fat SIGNED.

Not to derail the thread or anything, but can we make sure any awesome new drone ships DON'T use the Dominix model? It's quite possibly the worst in Eve.

InfamousOne
Posted - 2008.11.26 19:57:00 - [8]
 

I am mainly a missile user, but I do love my T2 mediums :-)

Tusko Hopkins
HUN Corp.
HUN Reloaded
Posted - 2008.11.27 09:23:00 - [9]
 

Signed, because of the EW part.
I do not think that drone damage should be increased tho... so if it was up to me, I would add hardwirings, but not those for rof and base damage.


Kahetha
Posted - 2008.11.27 09:36:00 - [10]
 

supported

Ankhesentapemkah
Gallente
Posted - 2008.11.27 10:37:00 - [11]
 

I brought up drone implants the last time, and we still haven't seen any of that in the game.

So unless Tusko insists on having this issue, I'll bring it up!

Zhula Guixgrixks
Increasing Success by Lowering Expectations
Posted - 2008.11.27 10:52:00 - [12]
 

I would not priorize drone ships atm. A drone boat can switch weapon size and dmg type in fight ! In fact QR stealth boosted drone boats. Just look at those threads like "my bigbutt ship cannot hit afterburning whatsever with ultralarge guns/missiles". A droneboat user can effectively hit all sizes of ships, while gun/missile guys are stuck to same size and bigger targets. Drone boats are so cool now ! :-)

What I mean is not a general critics. I love some of your ideas, but I would not implement them until somekind of natural balance is established in current combat system.


Junmar
Posted - 2008.11.27 13:57:00 - [13]
 

That would be interesting. Supported.

White Ronin
Gallente
Aliastra
Posted - 2008.11.27 14:15:00 - [14]
 

Originally by: Zhula Guixgrixks
I would not priorize drone ships atm. A drone boat can switch weapon size and dmg type in fight ! In fact QR stealth boosted drone boats. Just look at those threads like "my bigbutt ship cannot hit afterburning whatsever with ultralarge guns/missiles". A droneboat user can effectively hit all sizes of ships, while gun/missile guys are stuck to same size and bigger targets. Drone boats are so cool now ! :-)


Trust me, they lose the total "cool" thing once they get destroyed and you are left without any dps. Doesnt sound "cool" now do they. Missile launchers do they same thing and you cant destroy them and they always hit.
There are TONS of things for missile users.
Quote:

What I mean is not a general critics. I love some of your ideas, but I would not implement them until somekind of natural balance is established in current combat system.


Um, drones are a primary weapons system and they are part of the current combat system, which (btw) works pretty well now. Lets try not to continue treating them as secondary and start treating them as a primary weapons system that many players have great interest in.

Dariah Stardweller
Gallente
NO U111 Enterprises
Posted - 2008.11.27 14:37:00 - [15]
 

Supporting the drone cause Smile

Crinela
Posted - 2008.11.27 15:21:00 - [16]
 

signed, totaly agree with your points of view.

Karentaki
Gallente
Oberon Incorporated
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2008.11.27 20:07:00 - [17]
 

/signed

Originally by: Bellum Eternus
Big Fat SIGNED.

Not to derail the thread or anything, but can we make sure any awesome new drone ships DON'T use the Dominix model? It's quite possibly the worst in Eve.


Nooo, my domi is pretty!!! Just imagine a faction drone ship using the rogue-drone dominix model... now that would be sexy!

Hooded Person
Amarr
Posted - 2008.11.27 20:08:00 - [18]
 

Supported - also confirming I'm Chribba's alt! Laughing

Rutger Centemus
Phantom Squad
Atlas.
Posted - 2008.11.28 01:02:00 - [19]
 

supported

FunzzeR
Legion of the Scottish Fold

Posted - 2008.11.28 01:24:00 - [20]
 

Supported

Irida Mershkov
Gallente
The Reformed
Chaos Theory Alliance
Posted - 2008.11.28 01:50:00 - [21]
 

Edited by: Irida Mershkov on 28/11/2008 01:51:18
Edited by: Irida Mershkov on 28/11/2008 01:51:08
Supported 100%. Drones are awesome, give us m0ar.YARRRR!!YARRRR!!
Edit: Navy Issue Dominix too pls. In Deimos camo.
Second Edit: Forgot to bloody tick.

Mulco
Dark Star Mining and Industry inc.
Posted - 2008.11.28 01:59:00 - [22]
 

signed, this is something that i have wanted the last four years.

Bunyip
Gallente
Center for Advanced Studies
Posted - 2008.11.28 05:08:00 - [23]
 

While the other representatives have already stated an interest in these issues, I'd just like to support the option myself. I fly drones often, and they're a weapon system that has been ignored (except in the case of rampant nerfs) for far too long.

Haldir Ravenclaw
Aliastra
Posted - 2008.11.28 16:05:00 - [24]
 

Originally by: Irida Mershkov
Navy Issue Dominix too pls. In Deimos camo.


I object! If there's going to be a Navy Dominix it should be black like the Megathron Navy Issue! Very Happy

Speaking of Navy Domi's, wasn't there some reward for a tournament or something like it a good while back where the reward was originally a Navy Dominix but they swapped the reward at the end? Who knows.

Anyway... Even though I've signed, I do hope we'll see changes when T3 ships come out and all manner of new stuff comes out in next big expansion next year, would be a good time to add things like this. I can see people hating them for the lag they make, but they are easily destroyed and need constant replacements, so any new modules to boost them would be great to make them a proper primary weapon system.

PS - Drones are still stupid, even after their so called "memory upgrade" as it was called Shocked

Omber Zombie
Gallente
Frontier Technologies

Posted - 2008.11.28 16:55:00 - [25]
 

Originally by: Haldir Ravenclaw

Speaking of Navy Domi's, wasn't there some reward for a tournament or something like it a good while back where the reward was originally a Navy Dominix but they swapped the reward at the end? Who knows.


the gallente election event (which they wouldn't let me run as a candidate for) was supposed to award navy domi's but we got navy thron's instead. I was not happy.

supporting this too tho as I am a rabid domi pilot

Kiotsu Adler
Posted - 2008.11.28 18:32:00 - [26]
 

we want moar drone love

Efferil
Posted - 2008.11.28 23:12:00 - [27]
 

Yes more love for the drones would be nice.

Laechyd Eldgorn
Caldari
draketrain
Posted - 2008.11.29 00:23:00 - [28]
 

I find it hilarious that already ship having primary weapon system something else than drones, like missiles!, and has very limited drone bay, still has to rely on drones providing significant amount of dps. Usually around 30% even on missileboat!

So no, drones don't need boost. They are already overpowered in so many ways.

If there would be any new additions to drones those should be very carefully NERFED accordingly to keep all that stuff in balance.



galphi
Gallente
Furnulum pani nolo
THE SPACE P0LICE
Posted - 2008.11.29 00:29:00 - [29]
 

I agree that drone dps is fine, but all the other drone abilities need some love. Implants and tech 2 fittings would be nice too!

White Ronin
Gallente
Aliastra
Posted - 2008.11.29 01:08:00 - [30]
 

Originally by: Laechyd Eldgorn
I find it hilarious that already ship having primary weapon system something else than drones, like missiles!, and has very limited drone bay, still has to rely on drones providing significant amount of dps. Usually around 30% even on missileboat!

So no, drones don't need boost. They are already overpowered in so many ways.


I dont think their use should be enhanced in any way, shape or form on none drone specialized ships. Personally I would limit their use a lot more for non drone dedicated ships but that is not the point of this thread.
Drones are now being used to fill gaps in ship balance for missile and gun boats but this "everyone gets some" method means those drone dedicated ships cant be augmented, no new drone modules or implants can be added without boosting 80% of the ships out there.
And I agree that on non dedicated drone boats they are just right in dps and such. Overpowered even. But dont nerf the domi or myr cause you want to reign in the Raven or Thorax.
For the dedicated drone users and their drone specialized ships it means we get ignored cause our beloved drones have been pimped out onto almost every ship ever made.
But just to clarify, I am not asking for ANY added utility or whatever for NON DRONE DEDICATED SHIPS.
I am asking for the same attention to be given to dedicated drone users that has been given to gun and missile users since day one.
If it were up to me I would limit what drones could be used on gun and missile boats.
Why should a caldari Raven use ecm drones as well as a ship built around the use of ALL drones?
Why do you have to nerf every other utility drone so bad that using them is stupid because they are allowed to be used by every ship with a big enough drone bay?
I am asking for ccp to make up their mind and show some love to us drone users, not buff drones as a secondary weapons system for anyone else.
Quote:

If there would be any new additions to drones those should be very carefully NERFED accordingly to keep all that stuff in balance.


That is what has happened with every utility drone out there and look what you get. They are worthless to use, even on drone spec'd ships. When was the last time you saw energy nuet drones being used? How about TD drones? Well?
You see tons of ecm drone used BY NON DRONE SPECIALIZED SHIPS! Why? Cause if my myr or domi uses 5 ecm drones of any size I will be blown to bits cause my major bonus is to drones and their damage.
Personally I would double the drone control cost on non drone spec'd ships. I would add bonuses to all the drones when used by a dedicated drone boat. I would make their use of advanced drones on a Raven or a Typhoon difficult and basic so that the more complicated drone drones could be used by the ships that are built around them.
Using them to fill a gap in ship design has screwed us. If you add damage mods for normal drones you boost 80% of the ships in service. NOt because no damage mod is needed, but because drones are *****d out to every ship in the universe now days.
But this is not about that.
It is about ccp realizing they need to pay attention to them and stop whoring them out. Fix it so that if you boost drone ships you dont end up boosting every ship in EVE. Balance drones to work well on drone spec'd ships and give those who train for it fun and interesting toys that every other weapons system has had from the beginning.
Dont get me wrong. It is a big job. CCP will have to make some changes in the basic use of drones by EVERY SHIP IN THE GAME to begin adding drone based content.
There is a flaw in drone implementation.
It effects every drone capable ship in EVE (80%+ ships in use).
And if it isnt addressed, drones will fall into a "add-on" role, forever religated to a secondary role. No new drones or implants or mods will be successfully introduced. They will become ho hum.
I would prefer that doesnt happen.


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