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Yakia TovilToba
Halliburton Inc.
Posted - 2008.11.12 13:39:00 - [1]
 

Edited by: Yakia TovilToba on 12/11/2008 13:48:57
Noone needed that nerf, and noone was asking for it.
It just doesn't make sense to me, why did you break something, that was fine ?

edit: To be more specific: ludacris speed was broken, an adjustment was a neccessary move.
But missiles were no way overpowered. I have an alt that is highly specialized in cruise missiles. When he was in a 0.0 alliance, he was constantly told that noone wanted to see his cruise missile raven, he was asked to bring other ships where he didn't have good skills for. So what exactly was so much asking for a missile nerf ?

Why didn't you adjust it in a way that missiles are the same after the the speedchange at least for rats ?

I just had to shoot over 20 volleys on a spider drone and around 10 volleys on an elite frig. With a char that has perfec missile skills, ~13 million sp. With 3% precision, rof and cm damage implants, with a navy raven and 3 caldari navy ballistic controls.
It wasn't doing full damage even on a machariel hull rat, that was approaching with ~250m/s (from the missions "damsel in distress").

Do you really think it's a wise move to frustrate a huge part of your customer base for fun, dear CCP, when other MMOs are bringing out nice expansions, like Mines of Moria for LotRo, is that your christmas present for us ? That missile nerf was completeley unneccessary and way beyond the adjustment that was needed because of the speedchange.

o0TuNa0o
The Littlest Hobos
Damu'Khonde
Posted - 2008.11.12 14:13:00 - [2]
 

Edited by: o0TuNa0o on 12/11/2008 14:13:31
Learn about sig radius.
Learn about using the correct type of weapon against it's ship class.
Learn about sig radius again, because it just got a lot more important.

Firing cruise missiles at a spider drone. lol.

TuNa


Gypsio III
Dirty Filthy Perverts
Posted - 2008.11.12 14:17:00 - [3]
 

Originally by: o0TuNa0o

Firing cruise missiles at a spider drone. lol.


Someone else summed this up nicely.

Furb Killer
Gallente
Posted - 2008.11.12 14:22:00 - [4]
 

Quote:
just had to shoot over 20 volleys on a spider drone

Fail...

Pippan
Gallente
Jupiter Force
Posted - 2008.11.12 14:24:00 - [5]
 

Quote:
just had to shoot over 20 volleys on a spider drone

This just made the entire nano/missile/blaster/drone nerf worth it LaughingLaughingLaughingLaughing

Mordekai Bloodwake
Gallente
Posted - 2008.11.12 14:26:00 - [6]
 

Originally by: o0TuNa0o
Edited by: o0TuNa0o on 12/11/2008 14:13:31
Learn about sig radius.
Learn about using the correct type of weapon against it's ship class.
Learn about sig radius again, because it just got a lot more important.

Firing cruise missiles at a spider drone. lol.

TuNa




agreed also add Learn to use Scout Drones, hell even having the skill to 1 will pop spider drones.


Malcanis
Caldari
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
Posted - 2008.11.12 14:27:00 - [7]
 

Originally by: Yakia TovilToba
Edited by: Yakia TovilToba on 12/11/2008 13:48:57
Noone needed that nerf, and noone was asking for it.
It just doesn't make sense to me, why did you break something, that was fine ?

edit: To be more specific: ludacris speed was broken, an adjustment was a neccessary move.
But missiles were no way overpowered. I have an alt that is highly specialized in cruise missiles. When he was in a 0.0 alliance, he was constantly told that noone wanted to see his cruise missile raven, he was asked to bring other ships where he didn't have good skills for. So what exactly was so much asking for a missile nerf ?

Why didn't you adjust it in a way that missiles are the same after the the speedchange at least for rats ?

I just had to shoot over 20 volleys on a spider drone and around 10 volleys on an elite frig. With a char that has perfec missile skills, ~13 million sp. With 3% precision, rof and cm damage implants, with a navy raven and 3 caldari navy ballistic controls.
It wasn't doing full damage even on a machariel hull rat, that was approaching with ~250m/s (from the missions "damsel in distress").

Do you really think it's a wise move to frustrate a huge part of your customer base for fun, dear CCP, when other MMOs are bringing out nice expansions, like Mines of Moria for LotRo, is that your christmas present for us ? That missile nerf was completeley unneccessary and way beyond the adjustment that was needed because of the speedchange.



The old days of warping in to a mission point and sitting stationary (or being aligned to station at 2/3 speed if you're L33t like me) and then just pressing F1-F6 until the ISK-ballons stop bursting are over. Deal with it. I freely admit that I abused the procedure for my own profit, and to be candid, I'm relieved it's gone. So much the better for the game, tbh.

Now you'll actually have to fly your ship. If that makes you quit EvE, then bluntly, it's just as well that you're doing it now before you waste any more time and money.

PS I'll offer you 10M each for those worthless CN BCUs.

Fenix12
Doom Guard
Wildly Inappropriate.
Posted - 2008.11.12 14:29:00 - [8]
 

use a drake, 2 volleys and the frigs are dead.

Meiyang Lee
Gallente
Azteca Transportation Unlimited
Gunboat Diplomacy
Posted - 2008.11.12 14:31:00 - [9]
 

Edited by: Meiyang Lee on 12/11/2008 14:32:28
Originally by: Fenix12
use a drake, 2 volleys and the frigs are dead.


or better yet, make use of that dronebay on the Raven your flying. A pack of light drones will shred that Spider Drone in moments, leaving your Cruise Missiles to chew on the cruisers and above. (although the cruisers might need a target painter to get hit effectively)

Welcome to what Gunship pilots have done for a long long time. (Drones on small stuff, guns on big stuff)

Derek Sigres
Posted - 2008.11.12 14:32:00 - [10]
 

Originally by: Fenix12
use a drake, 2 volleys and the frigs are dead.


I have to seriously hope that this isn't an assertion that BC's are now superior for mission running than BS's because of missile wackyness.

Dracthera
Minmatar
Posted - 2008.11.12 14:33:00 - [11]
 

Honestly people are making way too big of a deal about this change. It just means you'll have to actually get some higher skills before you plop into a BS and run AFK L4s or PvP. It was kinda ridiculous that folks with 3 mil SP would get into a Raven or CNR and rake it in. Just stay in your Drake for a bit longer and everything will work out OK.

I also think moving the L4 agents from the Laah quadrangle was probably a good idea. As much as I hate it personally, I can see the advantages to the game. These two changes combined should quell the cries from PvP'ers who wanted to move L4 agents to losec exclusively because carebears like me were making ISKies too easily. This way everyone's equally miserable methinks until people get used to the new paradigm.

This too shall pass. Wink

Meiyang Lee
Gallente
Azteca Transportation Unlimited
Gunboat Diplomacy
Posted - 2008.11.12 14:34:00 - [12]
 

Originally by: Derek Sigres
Originally by: Fenix12
use a drake, 2 volleys and the frigs are dead.


I have to seriously hope that this isn't an assertion that BC's are now superior for mission running than BS's because of missile wackyness.


Well, the drakes Heavy Missiles should have less trouble swatting frigs, although a TP will help loads there too.

Washell Olivaw
Posted - 2008.11.12 16:05:00 - [13]
 

Originally by: Yakia TovilToba
edit: To be more specific: ludacris speed was broken, an adjustment was a neccessary move.
But missiles were no way overpowered.


In answer to the question in the title: Adjusting ludicrous speed made missiles overpowered. So nerf A led to nerf B.

Yakia TovilToba
Halliburton Inc.
Posted - 2008.11.12 16:16:00 - [14]
 

Originally by: o0TuNa0o
Edited by: o0TuNa0o on 12/11/2008 14:13:31
Learn about sig radius.
Learn about using the correct type of weapon against it's ship class.
Learn about sig radius again, because it just got a lot more important.

Firing cruise missiles at a spider drone. lol.

TuNa



I'm going to quote you since you was the first, but this goes to the other "cm vs spiderdrone fail"-trolls in this thread aswell:

This is a level 4 missions. It is supposed to be done in a battelship, not in a battelcruiser cruiser or frig, it contains numerous battelship alongside this spiderdrones. Same counts for other missions, they have that elite frigs AND cruisers AND battelships. To advice to use another ship/weapon for level 4 missions is pointless.

Also this is in 0.0. I can't use drones there, the system is probed in a regular basis, using drones would result in a quick death, so i am dependant on cruise missiles and their abilitiy to kill any ship. It was fine before. That was the tradeoff for the general low damage of CM compared to torps.


Originally by: Dracthera
Honestly people are making way too big of a deal about this change. It just means you'll have to actually get some higher skills before you plop into a BS and run AFK L4s or PvP. It was kinda ridiculous that folks with 3 mil SP would get into a Raven or CNR and rake it in. Just stay in your Drake for a bit longer and everything will work out OK.


Why do you try to play a smart ass when you even didn't read my post. I said the character that i use has PERFECT missile skills. Everything to 5, even CM specialization. It CAN'T be improved with skills anymore.

Sofia Kyodai
Caldari
Perkone
Posted - 2008.11.12 16:22:00 - [15]
 

Originally by: Yakia TovilToba
Originally by: o0TuNa0o
Edited by: o0TuNa0o on 12/11/2008 14:13:31
Learn about sig radius.
Learn about using the correct type of weapon against it's ship class.
Learn about sig radius again, because it just got a lot more important.

Firing cruise missiles at a spider drone. lol.

TuNa



I'm going to quote you since you was the first, but this goes to the other "cm vs spiderdrone fail"-trolls in this thread aswell:

This is a level 4 missions. It is supposed to be done in a battelship, not in a battelcruiser cruiser or frig, it contains numerous battelship alongside this spiderdrones. Same counts for other missions, they have that elite frigs AND cruisers AND battelships. To advice to use another ship/weapon for level 4 missions is pointless.

Also this is in 0.0. I can't use drones there, the system is probed in a regular basis, using drones would result in a quick death, so i am dependant on cruise missiles and their abilitiy to kill any ship. It was fine before. That was the tradeoff for the general low damage of CM compared to torps.


Originally by: Dracthera
Honestly people are making way too big of a deal about this change. It just means you'll have to actually get some higher skills before you plop into a BS and run AFK L4s or PvP. It was kinda ridiculous that folks with 3 mil SP would get into a Raven or CNR and rake it in. Just stay in your Drake for a bit longer and everything will work out OK.


Why do you try to play a smart ass when you even didn't read my post. I said the character that i use has PERFECT missile skills. Everything to 5, even CM specialization. It CAN'T be improved with skills anymore.



You call him a troll coz he pointed the obvious (ie, using drones vs frigates), and her a smart ass for doing something quite simple (like, fit a target painter-> tadah!!! missiles still deal damage).

I ran a few missions earlier today in my torp-Golem, results? Only a few minutes added to the time it takes me to complete a mission. Why? Coz i know, like everybody else here (well except you apparently), how to fit my ships....

Dark Voynix
Gallente
Garoun Investment Bank
Posted - 2008.11.12 16:25:00 - [16]
 

psss .. ill tell you a hidden feature on ravens, but dont tell anyone !!!!!



Ravennn...


have ...

a drone bay ...

use it, but pls.. dont tell anyone, it's SECRET !!!!!

Sofia Kyodai
Caldari
Perkone
Posted - 2008.11.12 16:26:00 - [17]
 

Originally by: Dark Voynix
psss .. ill tell you a hidden feature on ravens, but dont tell anyone !!!!!



Ravennn...


have ...

a drone bay ...

use it, but pls.. dont tell anyone, it's SECRET !!!!!


Oh man!!! You blew it!!! Laughing

Vrabac
Zawa's Fan Club
Posted - 2008.11.12 16:30:00 - [18]
 

I hereby thank the amarrian god for making me create amarr char back when they were crap so I can now laugh at all these cnr flying achuras from my mount- I mean from my mega pulse navypoc. Laughing

Sofia Kyodai
Caldari
Perkone
Posted - 2008.11.12 16:34:00 - [19]
 

Originally by: Vrabac
I hereby thank the amarrian god for making me create amarr char back when they were crap so I can now laugh at all these cnr flying achuras from my mount- I mean from my mega pulse navypoc. Laughing


Laugh away, your prerogative... too bad most other Achuras with CNRs cant think a bit further than cookie cutter CNR fits, give us all a bad name ugh

Jefferson Dubois
The Walkmen
Posted - 2008.11.12 16:36:00 - [20]
 

Originally by: Yakia TovilToba
Originally by: o0TuNa0o
Edited by: o0TuNa0o on 12/11/2008 14:13:31
Learn about sig radius.
Learn about using the correct type of weapon against it's ship class.
Learn about sig radius again, because it just got a lot more important.

Firing cruise missiles at a spider drone. lol.

TuNa



I'm going to quote you since you was the first, but this goes to the other "cm vs spiderdrone fail"-trolls in this thread aswell:

This is a level 4 missions. It is supposed to be done in a battelship, not in a battelcruiser cruiser or frig, it contains numerous battelship alongside this spiderdrones. Same counts for other missions, they have that elite frigs AND cruisers AND battelships. To advice to use another ship/weapon for level 4 missions is pointless.

Also this is in 0.0. I can't use drones there, the system is probed in a regular basis, using drones would result in a quick death, so i am dependant on cruise missiles and their abilitiy to kill any ship. It was fine before. That was the tradeoff for the general low damage of CM compared to torps.


Originally by: Dracthera
Honestly people are making way too big of a deal about this change. It just means you'll have to actually get some higher skills before you plop into a BS and run AFK L4s or PvP. It was kinda ridiculous that folks with 3 mil SP would get into a Raven or CNR and rake it in. Just stay in your Drake for a bit longer and everything will work out OK.


Why do you try to play a smart ass when you even didn't read my post. I said the character that i use has PERFECT missile skills. Everything to 5, even CM specialization. It CAN'T be improved with skills anymore.



I did not fire cruise missiles at spider drones before this patch. That's why I carried drones.

Adapt already

Tsual
Minmatar
Posted - 2008.11.12 16:37:00 - [21]
 

Edited by: Tsual on 12/11/2008 16:38:20
Edited by: Tsual on 12/11/2008 16:38:06
Originally by: Yakia TovilToba

This is a level 4 missions. It is supposed to be done in a battelship, not in a battelcruiser cruiser or frig, it contains numerous battelship alongside this spiderdrones.



Well I guess this means Mordus Bounty hunters lvl 4 must then be supposed to be finished in two mostly t1 fitted BCs.Rolling Eyes

Lisento Slaven
The Drekla Consortium
Posted - 2008.11.12 16:43:00 - [22]
 

So you're not willing to *risk* using your drones in order to get the *reward* from the mission in a speedy manner?

Enjoy shooting 20 vollies per frig.

Malcanis
Caldari
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
Posted - 2008.11.12 16:45:00 - [23]
 

Originally by: Dark Voynix
psss .. ill tell you a hidden feature on ravens, but dont tell anyone !!!!!



Ravennn...


have ...

a drone bay ...

use it, but pls.. dont tell anyone, it's SECRET !!!!!


Great, now we're gonna get another nerf because of you.

Nice going Crying or Very sad

Ghengis Tia
Posted - 2008.11.12 16:59:00 - [24]
 

The spider drones IIRC are in the last spawn of the last room in Angel Extravaganza (not including bonus room). You kill the BS, wait for them to close on you, then launch drones. Should only take literally 60 - 90 seconds.

If you can't stand to use the drones as you're in 0.0, just tank them until you're done looting or whatever, then use drones if you haven't gotten the "Objective Completed" on your mission briefing screen. Then hightail it out of there.

I've flown Minmatar BS's on Level IV's, and the CNR/Raven certainly makes missions much easier. Hard to believe the nerf will increase your mission running time more than, say, 10-15%. Which is still superior to a what the other races have to endure.

Yakia TovilToba
Halliburton Inc.
Posted - 2008.11.12 17:00:00 - [25]
 

Originally by: Lisento Slaven
So you're not willing to *risk* using your drones in order to get the *reward* from the mission in a speedy manner?

Enjoy shooting 20 vollies per frig.


If you hit the scanner in that system, you often see probes. You see a lot of corpses aswell. Not to use drones in 0.0 while doing missions is one of the basic rules in order to survive.
But at least you've read my 2nd post, look at all that fail-trols that still recommend drones without having read that I CAN'T USE DRONES BECAUSE IT'S 0.0 AND ITS DAMN EASY TO FIND A MISSIONRUNNER WITH PROBES WHEN HE DEPLOYS DRONES

Furb Killer
Gallente
Posted - 2008.11.12 17:02:00 - [26]
 

If they are like you say scanning all the time, you are doing missions in wrong system and you will be found anyway, with or without drones.

A megathron also cant destroy spider drones, deal with it.

Annowyn
Ammatar.
Posted - 2008.11.12 17:05:00 - [27]
 

Originally by: Yakia TovilToba

...
This is a level 4 missions. It is supposed to be done in a battelship, not in a battelcruiser cruiser or frig, it contains numerous battelship alongside this spiderdrones. Same counts for other missions, they have that elite frigs AND cruisers AND battelships. To advice to use another ship/weapon for level 4 missions is pointless.
...





Hmm, actually I think level 4's were designed to be done in small gangs. But then everyone bought ravens instead to squash the need of smaller ships to support them.

MyOwnSling
Gallente
Macabre Votum
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2008.11.12 17:05:00 - [28]
 

Originally by: Yakia TovilToba
Originally by: Lisento Slaven
So you're not willing to *risk* using your drones in order to get the *reward* from the mission in a speedy manner?

Enjoy shooting 20 vollies per frig.


If you hit the scanner in that system, you often see probes. You see a lot of corpses aswell. Not to use drones in 0.0 while doing missions is one of the basic rules in order to survive.
But at least you've read my 2nd post, look at all that fail-trols that still recommend drones without having read that I CAN'T USE DRONES BECAUSE IT'S 0.0 AND ITS DAMN EASY TO FIND A MISSIONRUNNER WITH PROBES WHEN HE DEPLOYS DRONES
Two options: take the risk and use drones; leave 0.0.

Annowyn
Ammatar.
Posted - 2008.11.12 17:06:00 - [29]
 

Originally by: Yakia TovilToba
Originally by: Lisento Slaven
So you're not willing to *risk* using your drones in order to get the *reward* from the mission in a speedy manner?

Enjoy shooting 20 vollies per frig.


If you hit the scanner in that system, you often see probes. You see a lot of corpses aswell. Not to use drones in 0.0 while doing missions is one of the basic rules in order to survive.
But at least you've read my 2nd post, look at all that fail-trols that still recommend drones without having read that I CAN'T USE DRONES BECAUSE IT'S 0.0 AND ITS DAMN EASY TO FIND A MISSIONRUNNER WITH PROBES WHEN HE DEPLOYS DRONES



Risk vs Reward. Welcome.

Sofia Kyodai
Caldari
Perkone
Posted - 2008.11.12 17:09:00 - [30]
 

Edited by: Sofia Kyodai on 12/11/2008 17:09:18
Originally by: Yakia TovilToba
Originally by: Lisento Slaven
So you're not willing to *risk* using your drones in order to get the *reward* from the mission in a speedy manner?

Enjoy shooting 20 vollies per frig.


If you hit the scanner in that system, you often see probes. You see a lot of corpses aswell. Not to use drones in 0.0 while doing missions is one of the basic rules in order to survive.
But at least you've read my 2nd post, look at all that fail-trols that still recommend drones without having read that I CAN'T USE DRONES BECAUSE IT'S 0.0 AND ITS DAMN EASY TO FIND A MISSIONRUNNER WITH PROBES WHEN HE DEPLOYS DRONES


"When he was in a 0.0 alliance, he was constantly told that noone wanted to see his cruise missile raven, he was asked to bring other ships where he didn't have good skills for."

Those are your exact words. And they are about fleet ops, where a cruise-Raven is indeed useless. Did you say anywhere about 0.0 mission running? And when you edit it to show you did, also remember that in a 0.0 area owned and patroled by your alliance, you dont get mission scanners... And then they grief us poor old carebears.... Rolling Eyes


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