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Highwind Cid
Posted - 2008.11.05 16:24:00 - [361]
 

Simply put nothing. It's about as hard coded as the number of most available module slots being 8.

Also why do you want them in lowsec?
What would this accomplish other than more war targets.
Seems like a one way conversation.

It's been beaten to death. So why is this thread still going.

Again the game just so evolved in such a way that high secers will stay where they are.

Also why don't the low sec people just go to 0.0? Oh that's right you'll get blown up.

Cat Molina
Minmatar
Intransigent
Posted - 2008.11.05 16:45:00 - [362]
 

Originally by: Rhatar Khurin
I often have level 4 missions in low sec really. but it's usually in a very quiet part of the map. In fact yesterday whilst doing a 8 jump courier mission through lowsec, i only saw one person and he'd just warped off as i arrived at the gate.


That, good Sir, must be completely and totally false. For as others in this thread have shown, entering low-sec is a Sentence of Death which cannot, by any methods known to man, be avoided. Many posters here have proven that no amount of planning or information gathering or luck can save your life the moment you leave Empire. Therefore, it is impossible that you have successfully run a mission in low-sec, and I am forced to call shenanigans.

[/sarcasm]



Seriously; kudos to you for taking the path less traveled. It is a sad fact that it becomes increasingly rare to find one who will brave risks in this game. Given the timidity I have seen, I cannot imagine what many people's real lives are like.


Originally by: Highwind Cid
Also why don't the low sec people just go to 0.0? Oh that's right you'll get blown up.


Sometimes I do. Believe it or not, one can survive out there semi-solo. Just requires a scout alt, gut instincts, and a quick eye.

Tsual
Minmatar
Posted - 2008.11.05 19:33:00 - [363]
 

Originally by: Highwind Cid
Simply put nothing. It's about as hard coded as the number of most available module slots being 8.

Also why do you want them in lowsec?
What would this accomplish other than more war targets.
Seems like a one way conversation.

It's been beaten to death. So why is this thread still going.

Again the game just so evolved in such a way that high secers will stay where they are.

Also why don't the low sec people just go to 0.0? Oh that's right you'll get blown up.


Perhaps it is related to the fact that the simple discussion risk versus reward overlooks that controll and ammount of work or hassle play a very vital role when making decission in an open pvp or maybe any pvp environment.

In so far terms get confused what the one pvp means with risk is more a complaint of having too much controll while the pve oriented player moans about low-sec being too much hassle or ammount of work to actually acomplish anything there and yet again a pirate like Cpt. Branko is happy with how much controll and thus power he has in low sec.

While others wonder why the stepstone to null-sec is not becoming more then a workhouse/poor house - thus working as intendet - and due to the low controll industrialists have over their environment and high risks it eventually just lowers the controll of any serious alliance when inviting industrialists thus the high fees and the talk of getting a 0.0 system as place bheing an honour. It isn't not from a industrialists point of view it is a lot of social, organisatorical, and logistical work. Not to mention the hassle due to the one or other gank squads comming through.

Very stalemate situation and a very borked discussion if you ask me.

Want a beer or popcorn?

Jarvis Hellstrom
Gallente
The Flying Tigers
United Front Alliance
Posted - 2008.11.05 19:44:00 - [364]
 

Originally by: Cat Molina
But only a covert ops, recon, inty, or brave fool would attempt any long journey in 0.0 without a scout alt.


Oh it's not quite so bad as all that. I've made a bit of a reputation in my corp for routinely doing it in smallish Industrials, cargo cruisers and the like. I can't fly any of what you list above. And I do it without any kind of alt and only very rarely do I call for or need a scout (when I do it's always another player).

Just remember, the map has some very good free intel on it. Your cloak is your friend and luck is your mistress and if you hit a bubble it's a battle of wits between you and the camp. Sometimes you can win.


Cat Molina
Minmatar
Intransigent
Posted - 2008.11.05 20:14:00 - [365]
 

Originally by: Jarvis Hellstrom
Originally by: Cat Molina
But only a covert ops, recon, inty, or brave fool would attempt any long journey in 0.0 without a scout alt.


Oh it's not quite so bad as all that. I've made a bit of a reputation in my corp for routinely doing it in smallish Industrials, cargo cruisers and the like. I can't fly any of what you list above. And I do it without any kind of alt and only very rarely do I call for or need a scout (when I do it's always another player).

Just remember, the map has some very good free intel on it. Your cloak is your friend and luck is your mistress and if you hit a bubble it's a battle of wits between you and the camp. Sometimes you can win.


Yeah. In my quote, I'm kinda referring to running a battle-fit non-cloak Hurricane through 0.0 hunting targets. Without some type of scout alt, you'll generally end up in a mess.

Many cruisers (the Stabber in particular) and frigs are fine.

Blastil
Posted - 2008.11.05 20:20:00 - [366]
 

Originally by: Revolution Rising

Yap Yap Yap, self aggrandizement.



Find yourself better CEOS, or alliance leaders. I wouldn't (and don't) fly under CEO's and alliance leaders that irrational, or that egotistical. Our corp HAS moved to 0.0 for more interesting combat. We're doing everything possible to improve our PVP prospective. We have very smart and intelegent alliance leaders. I apologize if you keep on having bad judgement and picking ****ty alliances, or not founding your own corp if your fed up with other problems. Maybe before whining about the problem, you should go become a solution to it.

Oh wait, taht would require work. Go back to whining.

SPIONKOP
Caldari
Macabre Votum
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2008.11.05 23:44:00 - [367]
 

Having read all the posts in this thread and many other threads of this type over the last 5 years the answer is quite simple.

There has to be more reasons for carebears to go into low sec as I can not think of a single reason I need to go into low sec. Everything I need is in empire as follows.

  • I can mine without a fleet to protect me.
  • I can AP to any place in empire so long as I am not dumb and fill the ship with too much good stuff.
  • I can do most high level'4s missions without help.
  • I can buy anything I need off the market.
  • I can sell all I have built on the market safe in the knowledge there are enough customers in the region.
  • I can conduct research and invention in my empire labs.
  • I am reasonably sure that when I jump into the next gate a bunch of flashy reds are not going to pop my ship.


So far as I can tell by avoiding low sec and 0.0 space I am missing out on :

  • Fleet Blobs
  • Gate Camps
  • Station Camps
  • High Corp and Alliance Tax's that fund the GTC's, Titans and other general game play of those most senior alliance members.
  • The loot and salvage rights to my ships wrecks ganked by pirates.
  • High End mining of which at least 20% goes in tax's to the corp/alliance bods never to be seen by corp / alliance members again.
  • PVP


Now if I wanted PVP then my character would have been trained for PVP and as it happens I have one trained just for PVP. It seems that most pirates have an industrial/hauler alt so seems only fair I should have a combat alt.

So can anyone tell me why my carebear characters should want to go into low sec or 0.0 space?

The answer you looking for is that there is simply no reason a character skilled in mining, hauling, building should ever need to go into low sec.

There is no safe mining, no market and no reason.

So lets not be negative and look for how to get my characters into low sec or 0.0 space.

Something for low sec thats inbetween an alliance and simply setting standing. If the pirates (or whoever) control a region of low sec fine by me, By joining their "alliance" we pay tax's, docking/refine fee's (if they "own" the station) maybe a membership fee set by the "alliance". We are not a formal alliance so we avoid war dec's unless specifically war dec'd. We are however flagged as blue to the "alliance" but thats not to stop them or anyone else shooting us in low sec. I didn't say is was not without risk.

Gate Station Guns that do real damage. We want to open up a trade route but can't because the guns just tickle the pirates shields and the use of capitals at gates is a little overkill. Give us the right of travel and we will open up the systems. Sure you can still gank us in the belts and probe out the missions but at least let us gate and dock in peace. If this was implemented then reduce or even eliminate sec hits and empire kill rights.

Increase the value of low sec. Add better roids, better loot drops. Basically either nerf empire or boost low sec. Give people a reason in terms of ISK to come to low sec.

They could improve POS in low sec. Maybe add mods that can only be used in low, more efficient labs and factories for example.

If people can make ISK in low sec with a balanced risk, they will come.

Cpt Branko
Retired Pirate Club
Posted - 2008.11.05 23:51:00 - [368]
 

Originally by: SPIONKOP
Give us the right of travel and we will open up the systems. Sure you can still gank us in the belts


Of course. Let your freighters and haulers with hundreds of millions come through while we get T1 cruisers with T1 fits in belts, awesome.

Stay in high-sec.

Lady Katrana
Wild Jokers
Posted - 2008.11.06 00:01:00 - [369]
 

low sec: nothing will get them there

nul sec: a decent number are already there

Cpt Branko
Retired Pirate Club
Posted - 2008.11.06 00:06:00 - [370]
 

Edited by: Cpt Branko on 06/11/2008 00:06:34
Originally by: Lady Katrana
low sec: nothing will get them there



A lot of industrials are in low-sec, moon mining. They're elusive and hard to catch.


Lady Katrana
Wild Jokers
Posted - 2008.11.06 00:12:00 - [371]
 

Originally by: Cpt Branko
Edited by: Cpt Branko on 06/11/2008 00:06:34
Originally by: Lady Katrana
low sec: nothing will get them there



A lot of industrials are in low-sec, moon mining. They're elusive and hard to catch.




very true, i did not think of them.

still i doubt you could move large numbers of 'bears into low sec and actually have them live there on a semi permanent basis without some massive boost to low sec security which i hope will never come.

ramification
Posted - 2008.11.06 00:35:00 - [372]
 

Originally by: Cpt Branko

A lot of industrials are in low-sec, moon mining. They're elusive and hard to catch.


They're not the only ones.

Of course, if Pirate corps don't catch us, that means we're not there - and that nothing will get carebears out of high-sec, etc. It's a pretty sweet state of affairs if you ask me.

(/warps to zero, jumps back into high-sec)

Souvera Corvus
THE PAROXYSM
Session Changes
Posted - 2008.11.06 00:49:00 - [373]
 

Quote:
if Pirate corps don't catch us, that means we're not there


This pretty much, although I'd probably put the word 'bad' in front of 'pirate corps'.

Essentially most of the people who carebear bash in these threads are bemoaning a lack of hauler ganks. The rest is a excuse.




Cyprus Black
Caldari
Perkone
Posted - 2008.11.06 00:52:00 - [374]
 

Edited by: Cyprus Black on 06/11/2008 00:59:18
Edited by: Cyprus Black on 06/11/2008 00:54:37
I'm gonna **** a lot of people off when I say that EvE's PvP is badly designed. It's so badly designed that newbies and carebears will NEVER experience a fair fight. It's almost always extremely lopsided. 0.0 is filled with other players who take joy in griefing others.

What incentive do newbies and carebears have to go to 0.0?
Maybe mining the rare stuff.

What dissuades newbies and carebears from going to 0.0?
Pirates, excessive griefing, completely unfair fights, gate campers, and a general territorial hatered of other players on a corps turf.

The risk is very high and the reward is very low.

Cpt Branko
Retired Pirate Club
Posted - 2008.11.06 00:56:00 - [375]
 

Originally by: Cyprus Black
Edited by: Cyprus Black on 06/11/2008 00:54:37
I'm gonna **** a lot of people off when I say that EvE's PvP is badly designed. It's so badly designed that newbies and carebears will NEVER experience a fair fight.


My second PVP kill was when I was 3 months old in a Rifter, charged into two -10 Rifters in Egghelende. Killed one, second ran away.

Your point was?

Olleybear
Minmatar
I R' Carebear
Posted - 2008.11.06 01:13:00 - [376]
 

Originally by: Cpt Branko

A lot of industrials are in low-sec, moon mining. They're elusive and hard to catch.



Considering the original question of the OP was, 'What would it take to get carebears out into low sec/0.0', I think Branko's statement above and mine earlier says it all. ( mine was about changing game mechanics back to the way they were so you cant scan out mission runners )

Moon mining is getting more bears into low sec. 2 Reasons that I can see for that. 1st: Its a good way to make isk now and, wait for it.... 2nd: its pretty SAFE! You make an insta undock, it wont matter if the station isn't insta-redock, that pirate camp will have a hard time getting you. Afterwards, you warp to your pos.

So, I think we can deduce that not getting killed AND making isk are two good incentives to get some bears into low sec.

Moon mining is one way, exploration sites that take you two hours to scan out that also take the pies 2 hours to scan out when your in them is another ( as it is, its trivial to scan out someone using quest probes ). same goes for missions. Change it back so you cant scan out mission runners again.

I'd also like to add that having sooo many systems that are travel routes is a disincentive. Most of eve is setup so that one system is connected to 2 to 5 other systems and are a main travel route. You cant do a thing with systems like that and makes for alot of wasted space that noone uses. Arrange the jump gates so there are more dead-end systems/clumps of systems.

What other constructive ideas do both the pies/alliances/bears have?

Note: For those that will never ever for-freaking-ever leave his-sec. This post isn't for you. Very Happy

Cpt Branko
Retired Pirate Club
Posted - 2008.11.06 02:10:00 - [377]
 

Edited by: Cpt Branko on 06/11/2008 02:10:16
Originally by: Olleybear
2nd: its pretty SAFE


I have been on 4 moon mining large POS kills and stole one while it was being unanchored. So, no, not exactly safe, but let's put it like this: chances are, if you're smart, that you will make a good profit easily.

Before we moved places, people were paying our corporation a rough total of 500-700M/month to keep their POS-es 'safe' (read: not blow them up). POS people are one kind of industrial who have a actual incentive to work out a business deal with pirates really.

Another group of industrials was supplying us with discounted T1 ships + rigs in exchange for scouting/protection for their freighters/haulers.

Of course, you can't get anything in low-sec which you couldn't get in high sec except for moon mining and the opportunity to trade with lazy pirates (like the buy my loot at 10% discount and give me ISK up front which we had with some guys for a while, was good business).


Olleybear
Minmatar
I R' Carebear
Posted - 2008.11.06 02:45:00 - [378]
 

Yes, I agree with you Cpt Branko. Its not 100% safe.

Lets not get off track. Lets come up with more ideas on how to answer the OP instead of just making points. Its much more interesting to hear peoples ideas on how to do something, or at least I think it is.

Cpt Branko
Retired Pirate Club
Posted - 2008.11.06 02:48:00 - [379]
 

Originally by: Olleybear
Yes, I agree with you Cpt Branko. Its not 100% safe.

Lets not get off track. Lets come up with more ideas on how to answer the OP instead of just making points. Its much more interesting to hear peoples ideas on how to do something, or at least I think it is.


To be honest, I don't see anything which needs to be done, because the problem does not really exist.

Of course, you could put some more low-sec/0.0 only stuff in low-sec, but I don't see any real need for that.

Daan Sai
Polytrope
Posted - 2008.11.06 03:19:00 - [380]
 

Originally by: Cat Molina

Yeah. In my quote, I'm kinda referring to running a battle-fit non-cloak Hurricane through 0.0 hunting targets. Without some type of scout alt, you'll generally end up in a mess.


I agree! I'm not having a go at you for using alt scouts, but at the design of a game where it is necessary to use an alt scout. Having to use meta-gaming to make up for design deficiencies is at the core of many problems here.


Norrin Ellis
Venture Racing
Posted - 2008.11.06 03:50:00 - [381]
 

Originally by: Cpt Branko

My second PVP kill was when I was 3 months old in a Rifter, charged into two -10 Rifters in Egghelende. Killed one, second ran away.

Your point was?


I attacked a Tristan in a Velator and sent him running for his life.

Plenty of people have a tale to tell, but that doesn't make their story the rule; it's usually the exception if it's cool enough to share with everyone.

I'm surprised this topic is 13 pages long. As a carebear, there's nothing CCP could do to make me want to move out of the comfortable, relaxing life of high sec for the paranoid life of lowsec/nullsec; that's too much like work, and I'm paying to play a game.

Matting
Capital Storm.
Reverberation Project
Posted - 2008.11.06 04:12:00 - [382]
 

Edited by: Matting on 06/11/2008 04:24:14
I haven't read this whole thread as its a bit too long, this is my ramble about low sec and getting people there I guess itís a little off topic but I already am in low sec mostly now. I would like to see more targets of course but not haulers more structured corps trying to hold a couple systems before they move in to 0.0 as a training ground for them and with decent rewards for doing so. This mainly is a rant on low sec as its normally not as protected as 0.0 space is and you canít actively defend it without the system making you an outlaw.

First I really want to know what CCP intended low-sec to be, I sort of see it as the training ground or stepping stone to 0.0..

Rewards definitely need to be increased; this can be done by "changing" high sec a bit and giving more to low sec areas to help them become a bit more desirable. I know a lot of high sec players will just not go to lowsec/0.0 even if the rewards are good because of the risk and the chance of getting ganked/killed, Some people just don't see that as fun and prefer other types of PVP within the game. These types of people we won't get but there are a lot who would risk more in low sec for better rewards. Just a few quick examples of changes that might help:

1. NPC corps having a tax rate of some kind to try encourage players to be more social or to create their own corp (wardecs fit in to this as well). This makes joining a player corp better and more chance of them getting in to combat PVP from others within the corp. Other incentives below may give a corp more reasons to go to low sec.
2. Maybe efficient stations in low sec, higher refining rate or even bonus to production efficiency for select modules, different stations have different bonuses.
3. Loot drops and salvage - Make loot table a bit more dynamic or have more chance to drop good loot when mission running/plexing in lowsec and 0.0. Salvage is another thing that needs addressing but I will get to that later.
4. Rat damage and tanking - Change mission rats in low sec to be a bit more like pvp simply by making most against either mercs or special rats who fit a more omni tank as well as random damage types (but lower damage). This doesn't really fit in to the storyline and having mission thoraxes shoot explosive sounds stupid BUT they don't get drones and a lot of PVPers will use drones to diversify their damage types. This would help players fit a PVP tank to run missions in and be able to compete while moving around without having to change fits for travel.
5. Ore - This is hard as you don't want the really good ores in low sec but over time the low sec ores have became more and more worthless to mine compared to high sec roids. Increase size and density of some ores maybe to at least make them better than high sec roids.

They are some quick changes I just thought of and expect holes in them for sure. A few things about low sec that I want to keep, station/gate guns are already quite strong in my mind and really only BS's can tank them well without dying when someone else shoots at them. CS's might be okay too but anything smaller has trouble tanking them solo or even with a few of them. In a big gang its like having a ******ed BC shooting at you so generally can ignore them, increasing the amount of sentrys or DPS they do will just create bigger camps. Hics in some sense are too good BUT with all the extra jump capable ships being released in thats less logistics that have to go through low sec. I really think this is a big issue that CCP overlook, if they intended pirates to annoy large alliances/corps on a logistical point its not working as they now can jump everything (mostly) from high sec to their low sec base.

Matting
Capital Storm.
Reverberation Project
Posted - 2008.11.06 04:12:00 - [383]
 

Edited by: Matting on 06/11/2008 04:13:02
Continued from above...

As a boost to pirates and to make them roam a bit more instead of sitting at a gate I liked a suggestion about making the GCC a little shorter to 5mins or so. More mobile gangs are better for eve then static camps in my mind.

I donít like the idea of ďnerfingĒ high sec (my mission alt gets money this way) but in some aspects I think its required to help even the balance between high/low/null sec space

Now the big issue I have with low-sec/0.0 and PVE content... PROBES! These two parts of the game just don't work together very well and is a pain for low sec (0.0 to a certain degree) mission runners. Mr high sec mission runner has a nice ship (maybe even a little pimp to help run missions faster), goes to his level 4 agent (low sec could use more level 4 agents) gets his mission, fits for it and goes in to do it. Kills the rats with fairly good bounties finishes the mission objective, bookmarks the mission, hands it in and comes back to loot/salvage with his special ship and gets to use a mwd because the mission is handed in.
The low sec mission runner will generally use a more disposable ship so no pimp gear, goes to the mission to collect the same bounties while taking longer than the pimp ship and scanning for probes (FFS CCP let us add them to overview). Finishes mission but canít hand it in else he can be scanned down in under 30 seconds while collecting loot/salvage. Hands mission in and gets slightly more isk and LP for doing it in low sec. The big issues are that probes canít be added to overview, you generally take longer because your using a cheaper fit because of the risk so more time for them to scan you down in the mission and after all that you get maybe 1m isk more worth LP (depending on store) and maybe half a mil extra reward. For all the extra risk AND time to do the mission and to get the loot/salvage which makes up a big chunk of mission runners income. This is even worse for missions with tags and no bounties as a low/null sec mission runner. Salvage can be a very large amount of money and with marauders it makes it an even better reason to stay in high sec with this expensive 600M+ uninsurable ship.
Also there are those stupid missions with no dead space which means my scanning alt will find you under 30 seconds, this is a mission you may have to reject that you would not have had to in high sec. Making the loot or bounties a bit more dynamic depending on if your in 0.0 - 0.4 and .5 Ė 1.0. could help a fair amount I reckon. Really for mission runners I donít see 0.0 being much more dangerous than low sec. The rewards for most low sec exploration sites (complexes as well) just doesnít seem high enough for the risk either. Most of the ones you can find using the onboard scanner are just normal space not dead space so you are very vulnerable and you can make more doing 1 level 4 which is safer. Proper exploration can be rewarding and is normally dead spaced so itís not as bad but maybe your ship cannot be found while in these and the prober has to find the site just like you did.

There is another aspect and that is protecting your self, in low sec you canít do with without taking security status hits unless you only take a -5 as a threat (yeah right). A lot of people in low sec looking to fight or kill easy targets are normally -2 to +5. I cannot envision a system that is balanced where you can be aggressive in systems to actively defend your self while not allowing pirates abuse it. I have a couple ideas but they seem very hard to implement and Iím sure have a lot of holes in them.

ďWhat would get YOU into Low and Nullsec?Ē
I am already there (low sec) but what I would like is while there arenít targets for me to shoot or when I do need to make money, for there a reason for me to stay logged in and do something in low sec to survive instead of logging on the mission alt that gets to fly a marauder in the safely of high sec.

Sorry for the big long rant

Cat Molina
Minmatar
Intransigent
Posted - 2008.11.06 05:43:00 - [384]
 

Originally by: Olleybear
Lets not get off track. Lets come up with more ideas on how to answer the OP instead of just making points. Its much more interesting to hear peoples ideas on how to do something, or at least I think it is.


Most people don't like this idea; but you asked.

Mining is a no-go in low-sec. Both sides will tell you that. Missions are really not worth the hassle there... only those who need a thrill do those. Increasing rewards cannot, IMO, measurably change this. So you're never going to get the die-hard mission runners and miners into low-sec.

But some only run missions because they have few entry points into PvP. They feel can-flipping is dishonest, aren't ready to say goodbye to Empire and go pirate, and not sure they want to live in 0.0. Faction Warfare was to address this, but the way it is set up (decentralized nature and locations, standings, etc.) seem to create as many problems as it solves.

Bear with me: Replies here seemed to indicate that many pilots are unaware of the tactics used to survive in low-sec. Scanner tactics and undock instas and all that stuff.

Add to that: many seem to fear they'll be laughed at for being popped. They tried it once or twice, got popped, felt foolish, and decided to never go back again. But that's how everyone learned to PvP. I get popped all the time. Pirates get popped all the time... even the damn good ones. That's the nature of combat.

Empire people need a place where they can learn how to fight. Where they can learn not to get butt-hurt over getting popped, and pick up the tactics to survive in both low-sec and 0.0. And it should be easier than the current FW stuff. To that end, I suggested this.

I've been in Eve University and seen these pilots come through. They grind missions for months, and want to learn how to PvP, but dislike blob-fest sov battles and not sure they can hack it as a pirate.

So, that's the idea. I believe increased methods of PvP education would increase the traffic/combat in low-sec.

Flame away... I can take it. Wink





SPIONKOP
Caldari
Macabre Votum
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2008.11.06 07:17:00 - [385]
 

Originally by: Cpt Branko
Originally by: SPIONKOP
Give us the right of travel and we will open up the systems. Sure you can still gank us in the belts


Of course. Let your freighters and haulers with hundreds of millions come through while we get T1 cruisers with T1 fits in belts, awesome.

Stay in high-sec.



The question, directed to the carebears, was:

Quote:
What would get YOU into Low and Nullsec?


I was simply attempting to answer that question.

Part of the problem with low sec is trying to reason with dumb pirates like you who see every ship that enters the system as being a pay cheque. With narrow minded single focused child like pirates camping the gates you wonder why you have less targets to shoot. If you had the ability to think outside the box you would see that low sec, if managed with some comonsense has lots more oppertunities than simply ganking a hauler or two.

Cooperation is the key to low sec but with most pirates and carebears with differing needs and a flawed game design thats not going to happen anytime soon.

By having a safe or safer right of travel that will in turn increase the number of people in low sec. I didn't say that the pirates would like it.



Allen Ramses
Caldari
Zombicidal Mania
Posted - 2008.11.06 07:27:00 - [386]
 

The best solution to get more pilots in LoSec is to redesign the method of travel in EVE. The largest (and some say only) threat to carebears lies in gatecamps. Not belts, not missions, gatecamps. What's the point of trying to do anything in the system you wish to visit if you cannot even get there?

But this is a pipedream, and it will probably never happen.

Krxon Blade
Posted - 2008.11.06 08:28:00 - [387]
 

Cookies.
A lot!

IncognitoX23
Posted - 2008.11.06 09:32:00 - [388]
 

Edited by: IncognitoX23 on 06/11/2008 11:27:05
First off, allow me to introduce myself. I'm a new player (two accounts but actually only a couple of 3 to 5 hour sessions a week on my nights off - I'm a night shifter).

My intentions have always been to establish myself and become fairly self sufficient before ultimately venturing into low/null-sec space. Sooo, for the first two months I mined. Mined and tried trading (not very successfully but it's an evolutionary process :))

I now have a few alts, a couple with retrievers, and a couple more flying around in Battlecruisers. Just started missioning and am only to level II's (albeit with multiple alts).

I'm been podded and lost a few ships, some at the exact wrong time and under terrible circumstances for myself financially.

I actually WANT to come out to low/null-sec space. With the lack of in-game community (Ambulation I think is an attempt to mitigate this), It can be very difficult to find a group of people who just aren't out to "haz your stuff"

I saw the commercial on TV, downloaded the client, played for a couple of days and when I attempted to do something or other (I forget at this point exactly what), got the "Not trainable on Trial Accounts" message and proceeded to subscribe TWICE as I enjoy the sandbox called EVE. I'm 46, and there was a time that I dreamed of thier being something like EVE. I grew up with electric football games, you know Bzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz, yeah those.

The environment is uber cool. Many of the players?, Not so much so.

Those of you in dangerous space, ganking vulnerable players without any chance of even escaping, It's good to have friends you can trust? :) "So and so was in the corp for over 4 years and a trusted friend blah blah blah, only to end up having a hissy and stealing billions of the corps resources.

Some of us don't have a lot of EVE mates. For some of us, invisibility is the answer (at least until we sort out a way to change that successfully for us.)

Even posting in a public thread is not a great idea lol.

I got can flipped awhile back. I think it was a Pilgrim (or something or other). I came back and the can was yellow.

Ok, I can dig it. I go and grab my Caracal (knowing I'm probably about to lose it), and proceed to play the game (although knowingly as I understand the process).

I squared off, brought in my industrial, and proceeded to play the game.

Almost got him. Had his structure down to almost nothing. He got both lol my Industrial and my Caracal.

I still felt ok with it. He had to experience a twinge. He didn't beat me by much.

In order to get us to come more freely into dangerous space, forego the gatecamps. Allow us free entry and exit (for the most part).

The trick to hunting deer is to not thin the population too much and allow the "herd" to think it has a sense of safety. More traffic in system (unhindered by pirates), will make for more targets. Snag us out of warp and kill us in deep space. Leave the gates alone or at least don't monopolize the space around them and we will come.

Personally, I still do, but the others are right. I've never made that much doing so as the price for doing so either usually negates any gains I may have made, and in most cases actually sets me back.

And by the way <GRIN>

I'm not really a carebear.

More of a Sweet Honey Poohbear thank you very much :)

Incog out

Del Narveux
Dukes of Hazard
Posted - 2008.11.06 10:01:00 - [389]
 

What they need to do to get people into 0.0 is make it more practical to live out there without being an alliance lackey. A lot of the people in high sec aren't opposed to a little pew pew, but they don't want to have to deal with all the drama queenery and mandatory blah-blah-blah that tends to come along with .0 politics.

As for low sec, they need to add in gas clouds or something that's not available in highsec or .0, to encourage people to go there. Key point being not in .0, or it will get devalued enough by alliance farming that it makes more sense to just keep doing lvl4 missions in Motsu.

Thirzarr
Posted - 2008.11.06 11:24:00 - [390]
 

Originally by: Del Narveux
What they need to do to get people into 0.0 is make it more practical to live out there without being an alliance lackey. A lot of the people in high sec aren't opposed to a little pew pew, but they don't want to have to deal with all the drama queenery and mandatory blah-blah-blah that tends to come along with .0 politics.

As for low sec, they need to add in gas clouds or something that's not available in highsec or .0, to encourage people to go there. Key point being not in .0, or it will get devalued enough by alliance farming that it makes more sense to just keep doing lvl4 missions in Motsu.


Pretty much this. And the chance to survive in freakishly expensive mission boats.


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