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blankseplocked Titans - Whats the game going to be like in 12 months?
 
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Diehard Si
0utbreak
Outbreak.
Posted - 2008.10.24 11:50:00 - [1]
 

Edited by: Diehard Si on 24/10/2008 12:00:36
I mean its already happening now.

4 titans DD'd a fleet and completely killed it. With every alliance with space gaining titans every month. I mean in several months there's going to be over 100 probably.

Therefore the titan in its doomsday form is going to be the death of eve.

First gang to let off 10 DD's wins the field. A huge battle between 400 people fought by 10 clicking a button once. To me there is something wrong here. It will be impossible to ANY entity to ever take space, because they won't have any titans.

And with the nano nerf as well, no-one has any power to do anything except be DD's.

Titans as a concept are good. A limitied number of titans on each side makes it tactical, makes it interesting. However we're now starting to reach cut off point. Its going from being a tactical deployment and usage of these things, to just, land as many as we can, DD and everything dead.

How long before cap fleets taken down by DD's? Its VERY unrealistic at the moment, but in 6 months its too late to worry about it.

So what can be done?

1.) Less damage?
2.) Restrict DD's to be let off per system per period of time? ( ok, not really practical )
3.) Make DD's focused? Instead of a 250km kill all bubble, how about to focus it on one point and give it splash damage of say 30km in all directions of the target?

I'm sure there's plenty more ideas that people can come up with.

I must admit i don't follow every dev blog religiously, or scour the forums constantly, so if there has been something said on this already i apologies. But as a paying customer, i'd like to think there is a future to the game.

Esmenet
Gallente
Posted - 2008.10.24 12:57:00 - [2]
 

A DD nerf is inevitable. Its just a question of how many titans we will have before it finally hits. The biggest problem for ccp is probably finding some other thing to give titan pilots.

Diehard Si
0utbreak
Outbreak.
Posted - 2008.10.24 13:14:00 - [3]
 

But even just nerfing the damage poss isn't enough.

I think they need a little rethink. The idea of a huge smart bomb going forward is just very basic. They need something that will still make them worthwhile, and make their prescence in the battle noticable, but without the crazy effect they have now.

How about a focused DD? somethink like 1million damage, aimed straight at 1 target? With a x minute cool off. Idea being they insta pop hostile caps.


Maybe make them mobile cyno jammers, jam a cyno being lit on grid ( but not in system ).

Maybe some sort of logistics side, like automatic armor and hull reps to gang members within x radius.

Daygore Aracnus
Syber Squirrel Army
Posted - 2008.10.24 14:50:00 - [4]
 

Edited by: Daygore Aracnus on 24/10/2008 14:51:22
you could just make DD add a "localised spatial distortion" that makes DDs before the cool off have a "stacking" pelty but the "stack" drop in its effect as you reach DD refire point ie:
1 100% damage
2 at same time 100% damage, 50% damage
3 at same time 100% damage, 50% damage, 25% damage
but then 1 then the next at 50% of the refire time.. 100% damage, 75%


fair enough you could just make it 20% of the refire time etc but the effect would be the same they aready have "fields" that make warp scrambling so why not (exept those that dont want it to be nerfed lol)?

Nuts Nougat
SniggWaffe
FREE KARTTOON NOW
Posted - 2008.10.24 15:08:00 - [5]
 

Originally by: Diehard Si
How about a focused DD? somethink like 1million damage, aimed straight at 1 target? With a x minute cool off. Idea being they insta pop hostile caps.


This would be awesome if:
1. they were cheaper since dreads already kill caps quite fast.
2. they could do it from outside normal lock range, so they don't get instatackled by fast dictors (this might not be a problem after speed rebalance)
3. If an alliance has 100 (any large number) titans, what stops them from vaporizing whole enemy cap fleets? This is just postponing the problem.

Love the death starish idea though.

Imo keep titans as huge logistics ships. They should be better at it, not at wiping out support. That's what you should bring anti-support for :P

Originally by: Diehard Si
Maybe some sort of logistics side, like automatic armor and hull reps to gang members within x radius.


Burst armor rep/shield rep. Kinda like burst ecm. I like it :P

teji
Ars ex Discordia
Here Be Dragons
Posted - 2008.10.24 15:36:00 - [6]
 

Quote:
4 titans DD'd a fleet and completely killed it. With every alliance with space gaining titans every month. I mean in several months there's going to be over 100 probably.


Hey guys welcome to 9ish months ago. Back then it was L2P and you can tank DD's when BOB was the only one jacking around with this many titans. The real solution is to pump out so many titans the nerf comes faster.

Why is this even news besides the fact that it happened to you?

Diehard Si
0utbreak
Outbreak.
Posted - 2008.10.24 15:39:00 - [7]
 

Originally by: teji
Quote:
4 titans DD'd a fleet and completely killed it. With every alliance with space gaining titans every month. I mean in several months there's going to be over 100 probably.


Hey guys welcome to 9ish months ago. Back then it was L2P and you can tank DD's when BOB was the only one jacking around with this many titans. The real solution is to pump out so many titans the nerf comes faster.

Why is this even news besides the fact that it happened to you?


This isn't CAOD, so cut the smack.

And it didn't happen to me, and i don't care who's doing it to who. The problem isn't now anyway, its looking ahead to what WILL happen

DeadDuck
Amarr
Cutting Edge Incorporated
RAZOR Alliance
Posted - 2008.10.24 16:21:00 - [8]
 

I quite like the idea of a focused DDD with the coold down period. It would be THE instrument to deal with Capital Blobs. Target, lock, Titan/MS/Dread/Carrier down. I dont see the Titan pilot even bother to waiste time locking a BS.

And I completly agree you when you say that unless something is done, in a matter of months 0.0 warfare will just be reduced to a series of DDD's.


Sky Grunthor
Minmatar
Conflagration.
Wildly Inappropriate.
Posted - 2008.10.24 16:44:00 - [9]
 

Simply turn it into a mobile, jumpable OUTPOST.

Allow people to dock up in it, log in it etc.... and allow it to jump with people in it as well.

Give the pilot the capability to put it into a Dock Mode where he can safely leave the ship and have services etc continued and have a password lock on it so that others can't get into it.

That is a true super capital.

HeavensGuard
Amarrian Retribution
Posted - 2008.10.24 17:20:00 - [10]
 

i think the simple idea is to just limit the amount of titans for each alliance

Shard Merchant
Minmatar
Posted - 2008.10.24 17:25:00 - [11]
 

There will be more titans in 12 months, but for all intensive purposes.. it won't be any different.

Titans have already lost their relevance, their uniqueness, and exclusivity. Hell, the new gates they're putting into the game will probably dwarf them on scale too.

Deva Blackfire
Viziam
Posted - 2008.10.24 17:26:00 - [12]
 

Originally by: DeadDuck
I quite like the idea of a focused DDD with the coold down period. It would be THE instrument to deal with Capital Blobs. Target, lock, Titan/MS/Dread/Carrier down. I dont see the Titan pilot even bother to waiste time locking a BS.

And I completly agree you when you say that unless something is done, in a matter of months 0.0 warfare will just be reduced to a series of DDD's.




Question: how long when you will see 10 man dread gangs (small corps/alliances) engaged by 10 titan gangs?

Oh yea and problem is not new - people said how it will end BEFORE first titan entered tranquility.

Deva Blackfire
Viziam
Posted - 2008.10.24 17:27:00 - [13]
 

Originally by: HeavensGuard
i think the simple idea is to just limit the amount of titans for each alliance


And what will stop people from creating alt-titan holding alliances?

gallminin
Gallente
White Star Line 2010
DEM0N HUNTERS
Posted - 2008.10.24 23:17:00 - [14]
 

lol..not so much as putting a limit, but have something that will help against the power of a DD..like a bigger ship then a titan. of course im just babbling on aboutit. even tho if they were to create such a class wtf would they call it? even tho they wont. anyway.if you fear of getting dd...bring your own titain? i know there a ***** too make, just bring more then the enemy or dont come?Confused

Deva Blackfire
Viziam
Posted - 2008.10.24 23:20:00 - [15]
 

Bringing your own titan is just escalating existing problem. Some people alreayd witnessed 2 fleets running wild in system trying to bait second fleet into getting DD'd. And tbh it might be fun once or twice but when most of engagements look like this it gets boring and sad.

shoot me
Posted - 2008.10.24 23:37:00 - [16]
 

How about making the DD a weapon of last resort. 1 Titan can only fire a DD once in its lifetime. The titan will survive the DD but can never fire another one without exploding.

Or even better make it chance based whether the titan explodes each time its fired from day one
1 chance in 5
Very Happy

Megan Maynard
Minmatar
Navigators of the Abyss
Posted - 2008.10.25 00:01:00 - [17]
 

Originally by: Sky Grunthor
Simply turn it into a mobile, jumpable OUTPOST.

Allow people to dock up in it, log in it etc.... and allow it to jump with people in it as well.

Give the pilot the capability to put it into a Dock Mode where he can safely leave the ship and have services etc continued and have a password lock on it so that others can't get into it.

That is a true super capital.


THIS TBH.

Machine Delta
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2008.10.25 04:39:00 - [18]
 

Cry more. Maybe if you had skill and tactics to play through lag you wouldn't get doomsdayed. Clearly the only shortcomings lie with you not the game.

Disteeler
Perkone
Posted - 2008.10.25 08:19:00 - [19]
 

Originally by: Daygore Aracnus
Edited by: Daygore Aracnus on 24/10/2008 14:51:22
you could just make DD add a "localised spatial distortion" that makes DDs before the cool off have a "stacking" pelty but the "stack" drop in its effect as you reach DD refire point ie:
1 100% damage
2 at same time 100% damage, 50% damage
3 at same time 100% damage, 50% damage, 25% damage
but then 1 then the next at 50% of the refire time.. 100% damage, 75%


fair enough you could just make it 20% of the refire time etc but the effect would be the same they aready have "fields" that make warp scrambling so why not (exept those that dont want it to be nerfed lol)?


I like this. Also, something along the lines "after a doomsday, the space continuum is so distorsioned that no other doomsday from any other titan can be fired in the next 10 minutes".

Ziester
Caldari
Perkone
Posted - 2008.10.25 08:35:00 - [20]
 

Originally by: Daygore Aracnus
Edited by: Daygore Aracnus on 24/10/2008 14:51:22
you could just make DD add a "localised spatial distortion" that makes DDs before the cool off have a "stacking" pelty but the "stack" drop in its effect as you reach DD refire point ie:
1 100% damage
2 at same time 100% damage, 50% damage
3 at same time 100% damage, 50% damage, 25% damage
but then 1 then the next at 50% of the refire time.. 100% damage, 75%


fair enough you could just make it 20% of the refire time etc but the effect would be the same they aready have "fields" that make warp scrambling so why not (exept those that dont want it to be nerfed lol)?


Not the most elegant solution but I can see CCP actually doing this since it doesn't require as much coding work as actually reworking the mechanic. Excellent thinking Aracnus.

Del Narveux
Dukes of Hazard
Posted - 2008.10.25 09:59:00 - [21]
 

Titans, moms and carriers all need a major overhaul on the order of the nanonerf. They should not be the ships of the line that they have become, rather they should be support ships backing up a fleet of regular ships. As it stands now, once the capital fleet rolls out all sub-capitals are useless outside of cyno alts and maybe dictors. Nano, lame as it is, at least provides an option that didnt involve spidertanking capital blobs.

POSes need some major work too.

Zondran
FinFleet
Posted - 2008.10.25 12:18:00 - [22]
 

Edited by: Zondran on 25/10/2008 12:19:21
you can easily avoid getting doomsdayed. Take into consideration that there is alwayws the chance that you loose a multi-billion isk ship when doing it.

Talking about this topic should be done be those who actually have experience with fights with Titans. You are not an expert about doomsdays because you were killed 1-2 times by one (omg, nerv the rats, they killed my NPC Raven).

Look at the fight in the north. Both parties have multiple titans. Noone whines "nerv the titans". Both parties know how to use/avoid Titans. Sooner or later the first titans will die and one partie can claim a big partial victory then.


Originally by: Del Narveux

POSes need some major work too.


qft

Pipecock Jackxon
Gallente
Posted - 2008.10.25 12:48:00 - [23]
 

so, instead of giving (Example) the Leviathan a DD, give it a nuclear missile instead C:

Inturist
FSB-ALFA
RED.OverLord
Posted - 2008.10.25 18:50:00 - [24]
 

Well i think Titans should get more roles .

Some ideas .

Make it something like transformer :

Titan go in some kind of 'siege mode ' and turning into station with cyno jammed system , ect ect , like normal outpost where peeps can dock , build refain ect ect .

Would also love to c some upgrades for Outposts where supercaps would be able to dock .

Just some idea Rolling Eyes

Nuts Nougat
SniggWaffe
FREE KARTTOON NOW
Posted - 2008.10.25 19:00:00 - [25]
 

Originally by: Sky Grunthor
Simply turn it into a mobile, jumpable OUTPOST.

Allow people to dock up in it, log in it etc.... and allow it to jump with people in it as well.

Give the pilot the capability to put it into a Dock Mode where he can safely leave the ship and have services etc continued and have a password lock on it so that others can't get into it.

That is a true super capital.


Thread over.

Diehard Si
0utbreak
Outbreak.
Posted - 2008.10.27 13:16:00 - [26]
 

Originally by: Inturist
Well i think Titans should get more roles .

Some ideas .

Make it something like transformer :

Titan go in some kind of 'siege mode ' and turning into station with cyno jammed system , ect ect , like normal outpost where peeps can dock , build refain ect ect .

Would also love to c some upgrades for Outposts where supercaps would be able to dock .

Just some idea Rolling Eyes


That got me thinking, titan needs to 'siege' to fire DD?

Dex Nederland
Caldari
Lai Dai Infinity Systems
Posted - 2008.10.27 13:38:00 - [27]
 

Originally by: Sky Grunthor
Simply turn it into a mobile, jumpable OUTPOST.

Allow people to dock up in it, log in it etc.... and allow it to jump with people in it as well.

Give the pilot the capability to put it into a Dock Mode where he can safely leave the ship and have services etc continued and have a password lock on it so that others can't get into it.

That is a true super capital.


YES! /signed and can we have Motherships have the similar capabilities?

Kagura Nikon
Minmatar
Emptiness.
Posted - 2008.10.27 16:25:00 - [28]
 

late.. there is already over 100 titans in game.


But CCP wil eventually nerf them.

cyborg579
Posted - 2008.11.06 05:36:00 - [29]
 

Originally by: Sky Grunthor
Simply turn it into a mobile, jumpable OUTPOST.

Allow people to dock up in it, log in it etc.... and allow it to jump with people in it as well.

Give the pilot the capability to put it into a Dock Mode where he can safely leave the ship and have services etc continued and have a password lock on it so that others can't get into it.

That is a true super capital.

/signed

Kadoes Khan
Posted - 2008.11.06 06:57:00 - [30]
 

Quote:

How about a focused DD? somethink like 1million damage, aimed straight at 1 target? With a x minute cool off. Idea being they insta pop hostile caps.

Well first off 1M damage isn't going to insta pop capitals, secondly insta-kills are something to be avoided at all costs in a pvp game. 1 Shot kill removes any resemblance of skill from the game to simply first person to click their iWin button. Some things are unavoidable due to escalation(IE getting shot from 500 dreads in siege is likely to insta-kill you but that is reasonable due to the sheer numbers).

I like the idea of essentially turning them into mobile outposts. The entire idea of DDDs imo has been bad due to the above mentioned problems with 1 shot kills and DDDs effects on sub-capital ships.

Quote:

Maybe some sort of logistics side, like automatic armor and hull reps to gang members within x radius.

They already have gang bonuses(some really nice ones to), don't really think they need to have a bigger in-combat role.


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