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blankseplocked Idea i had regarding Blobs/Sov
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Glach Duwat
Posted - 2008.08.29 14:46:00 - [1]

The issue is, It is simply always effective to have more people. Even in a situation where there are multiple areas you have to defend, more people is always better.

To be honest, we're at kind of an intersting puzzle when considering the blob.

To counter a blob under current mechanics, It would be wise hit multiple targets, but the problem is the critical points to hit are relatively few in number, and require a lot of fire power. Take the NOL-M9 offensive. GoonSwarm took it's large force and attacked a single point. Because in eve, you can fight a Jominian War, a war in which destroying a few Critical locations will win the war. These end up being station systems most of the time.

So the Goons had to decide what systems to hit, strategically, there may have been better places to attack, but NOL being a station system and having some heavy hardware in it, was the place to hit. Hitting multiple systems at once would be a good idea. Take a 300 man fleet and send 6 50 man fleets to different locations. Hit different critical locations and force the Enemy to Respond to all at once.

But this simply isn't feasible.

First off, Well-Fit Pos's take considerable time to attack with no defending forces other than Gunners/automated POS defence, especially in cyno jammed systems. So it's possible for the defender to Split their forces and defend the POS's before the attackers are able to destroy it, or, the blob may be able kill off each fleet at a time, before the pos's are destroyed, as each system will have many pos's. Or that blob will simply defend the system it's in, and then plow in and counter attack an undefended system. There are simply too many targets in each system to attack, and splitting your forces will simply make a lot of weak fleets that will have little success.

But to be honest, that doesn't matter. Reinforced timers cause this problem. If you were successful if attacking multiple fronts, and put multiple systems into reinforced, the Defender will then have a list of systems needed to be defended, and their Timers. They can simply defend in order. Particularly with the cynojammers able to be online even on reinforced towers, the defender can stick capitals in system making a fight for the pos's even more difficult.

So the more efficient way of attacking is to gather a large force, destroy the defending fleet, and take out one system at at time.

A System that requires attacking multiple points and defending multiple points will only make Titans and Capitals more effective, particularly in cyno-jammed systems. As the Attackers can get thwarted even easier in smaller numbers.

With Cyno-jammers, jump bridges, POS hit points being so high, and sov based on pos count, the Goons saw, rightfully, that attacking one system at a time is much more efficient then trying to attack multiple points.

So how to change this? Have a different way of fighting wars.

Jomini, was a solider for france during napoleon times, he wrote a book detailing that you could win a war by winning battles. Capture the big city, and the war is won. That is how it is done in eve.

Clausawitz(SP?) wrote a similar book saying that it is more complicated. He argued that a war on economy is more effective. This was illustratd multiple times in history.

Both can work in different situations, but in Eve, you cannot set up embargo's, you cannot stop an alliance from supplying itself. They have alts to make money, they have cyno ships to re-supply, and some times they are self sufficient in space.

I have been thinking of a way to fix this.

What if you added a new mechanic required for Keeping starbases online? Perhaps a "communication array"

Glach Duwat
Posted - 2008.08.29 14:46:00 - [2]

Once you have captured a system by throwing up a POS, this system becomes your Constellation Base of operation. This first pos would be different then others. It would be a "controller pos" that controls sov in the area, It would allow for special modules to be attacked, cyno jammers, Jump bridges, etc etc, only this system in the constellation could hav these modules. The Pos has power requirments. As opposed to fuel however, you would use power generated by the systems star. Using "Dyson spheres" or an array of solar collectors around the star that would generate power to the POS.

At first, the pos would be relatively weak. It would only be able to mount standard items like hangar arrays or mining gear, and defences. In order to improve it's abilities, or to have the ability to raise towers in other systems you would need to have more power. So you would need to anchor solar collectors in other systems. And then set up a "Energy transfer" pos to send the power to the Base of operations POS.

The more suns you control for power, the more your base of operations can do. Set up Capital ship contstrucion, Jump Bridges, cyno jammers, etc etc.

If your solar collectors are destroyed, the transfer POS will stop transfering power once it's "storage batteries" die out. And once the power dies, you lose the power necessary to run your modules. The BOP would have storage batteries so that power may last up to 48 hours , giving you time to re-route power to what you want to keep online. Certain modules, like cyno jammers, may require multiple suns worth of energy to run.

Multiple Bases of operations POS's would naturally have stacking penalties, as the power requirments for multiple would not allow you to fit a lot to them.

So Basically the idea would be:

1) You erect a Base of operations POS (BOP).
To initialize power, you deploy solar collectors at that systems star. Once the POS is online, it starts the SOV ticker, these would only be mountable in systems with no sov, so you'd have to reset sov to neutral to deploy. The Solar collectors would fuel the BOP and the other pos's in system.
2) The BOP (base of operations POS) is a Controller, it controls your pos's in the area. So erecting this BOP allows you to start anchoring pos's in this constallation.
3) The pos must be online to gain sov, when pos's go offline, the sov drops.
4) To add modules to the BOP, you would require more power than one systems moon, so you would set up Solar collectors on another systems star, and erect a "transer pos" to transmit energy to the BOP. The Transfer pos would be invulnerable while the collectors in the system are online. So in order to cut power you must destroy the collectors in the system. This would cut power from that system to the BOP, and allow the transfer pos to be destroyed. Once the Solar collectors are destroyed, other pos's in the system would enter re-inforced.

5) As power fails, defenders will have to decide which modules to keep online.

How does this stop Blobs? Well, it allows multiple attack points to keep things running smoothly. The idea would be that the Defenses for the collectors and the HP would be reasonably low, so that a group of smaller forces could destroy solar collectors and starve the BOP. Allowing for attack.

Grim Mercy
Heretic Logistics
Heretic Nation
Posted - 2008.08.29 15:47:00 - [3]

This sounds like a neat idea, and would revolutionize POS warfare... hell, it might even make it fun.

However, I'm not going to lie- it will never come about because of the system already in place. It's such a radical departure from 'the norm' that those with extensive POS networks will ***** and moan louder and longer than anything else you ever seen. This would make holding territory much more dynamic and involved, and those that hold territory (the big alliances anyway), like static and passive.

Now, I know fueling a POS network is anything but passive an uninvolved, and the stront timers help integrate the global audience and make it 'fair' to engage in somebody's downtime, but an extensive network leads to a more passive defense, and this is what I meant by passive. You can time when to defend, and a huge amount of resources gives you a huge amount of POSes to challenge the other guy to take down, ie: I'm already here, I'm rich, I'm dug in, and it'll take you weeks or months to dislodge me(!)- this is boooooooooooooooooooooooring!

Those with lots of space and moons and POSes have basically 'won' already, and really only face the challenge of maintaining and managing their player base. They will resist, I would imagine, with every ounce of their strength, any change to the existing system.

Eternum Noctem
Posted - 2008.08.29 17:04:00 - [4]

Holy Mother!
I like it Shocked

Let this be an example for all the NERF this NERF that nubins in this forum of a well thought idea to IMPROVE the game.

definately, most whole heartedly

Amarrian Retribution
Posted - 2008.08.30 01:56:00 - [5]

a hint:

go to the pos-related posts on the assembly forums, either make a new topic, or post ur ideas there.

Post this in the sticky about pos's above.

Keep bumping till ur satisified with the issue :D


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