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denpeng
Stormfront B.O.A.
Stormfront J.U.N.T.A.
Posted - 2008.08.07 15:23:00 - [421]
 

Giving the grand scoop to that eve has (from marketing and trading to alliance and corp management) I would like to see a lawyer skill added to the skill list. I figured we could bring Concord up in a class action law suit for failure to provide the protection that everyone seems to think they pay for.


It could open the door for awhole new type of player. They could train in Law, Felony and Misdemeanors, and could fly around in cloaked ships that could instantly warp to anytime someone gets killed.


lol

Gienah Corvus
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
Posted - 2008.08.07 15:34:00 - [422]
 

Edited by: Gienah Corvus on 07/08/2008 15:40:50


I've been suicide ganked once, learned my lesson and moved on. I have mixed feelings about these changes. While I agree that suicide ganking should be more challenging, I think CCP is going to far. They're changing four different mechanics, when one or two of them would probably balance it.

Originally by: CCP Fear

We will also count the standings of the two players involved; this extra variable can affect the total penalty received by a few percent. For example, if an aggressor has a high standing, and the victim negative standing, the aggressor get less of a penalty hit. This works in reverse, too. If you have low and the victim high, you will get an increased penalty


I think this is way too much. I agree with taking down the insurance and increasing CONCORD response time. But I see no point to making the security hit relative to player security standings. My friends and I occasionaly go to lowsec looking for Pew Pew (to give the pirates something to do). I like the decrease in security hit in lowsec, but I think the security hit you take for aggro should remain based on location, and not on player standings. This change effectively extends additional protection to carebears who enter lowsec.

I also think the massive increase in security standings penalty in the higher security systems is way too harsh, especially combined with the other changes.

I'm happy to see CCP trying to balance the issue of highsec suicide ganking, but I think they're going to far with this.

Karando
Random Goods
Posted - 2008.08.07 15:45:00 - [423]
 

Requesting balance in EVE, CCP has to implement the following changes in order to improve the game.
1) Disband the CSM and ban all of it's members with no interest in PvP from EVE
2) Fire newly hired CCP employees (employeement time < 6 months) (Including, but not limited to CCP Fear and CCP Nozh)
3) Restrict forum access to accounts with over 100 player kills.

The Economist
Logically Consistent
Posted - 2008.08.07 15:48:00 - [424]
 

Edited by: The Economist on 07/08/2008 16:23:31
Hey, I've got an idea!

Let's take an aspect of the game that's been unchanged, widely accepted for four years and that we've said many times was an intended part of the game and was working fine and start to re-design it and re-think the underlying principles that we've always claimed informed our vision of eve so that we can appease a vocal minority of players that happen to like posting the same whine threads every week because they're too lazy/weak/stupid to adopt the tactics necessary to avoid being ganked in high sec that everyone's been happily using for years.

To the dev blog!

Seriously though, I think, more than anything else, the perceived problem is due to high sec lvl 4-no-risk-missions, isk buying (not just illegally but also gtcs etc), the ease with which one can grind missions in safety as a newer player and convert lp's into fast cash and faction ships/mods; which they then feed back into their missions until you have characters a couple of months old flying around high sec in faction/deadspace/officer fit cnr's who don't know much about the mechanics of eve, don't know how to recognize an incoming gank, don't know how to defend themselves and feel cheated because they were under the impression that high sec was carealot. Haulers getting ganked are a non-issue, no-one with a brain carries anything of worth in a t1 hauler, and those that do quickly learn not to. Freighter ganks can be spotted a mile off if you keep your wits about you. Move all lvl 4 agents to low sec and I think a lot of the perceived problem will take care of itself [you've been talking about it for bloody long enough, why not do it before you start messing with **** that's been working fine for years].

Tbh though, it's not so much the letter of the changes that bothers me (aside from the faster concord spawn meaning you need more people per kill which means less profit, which combined with the pot luck involved in the module drops makes the whole thing massively less worth-while. Oh and the bigger sec hits meaning it takes even longer and is even more boring to recoup sec status. Incidentally I think the sec status mechanic needs altering; at the moment recovering sec just involves grinding npc's, which is basically punishing piracy with soul-crushing tedium, not only that but one thing ccps's always been against is mindless grinding in mmo's. Well the sec treadmill is exactly that and has been for years.) but rather the spirit, the implied switch from ccp's attitude of "eve is cold and dark, high sec ain't safe, if you died you made a mistake and should learn from it not whine to us" to one of appeasement, one of catering to vocal minorities and making tiny incremental steps towards the pink and fluffy side.

For shame.

Eve is meant to be a brutal and unforgiving universe.

Edit: Just remembered an appropriate line from ccp (paraphrase); "concord is there to punish, not prevent". With quickers concord response times the line between punishment and prevention begins to blur. Thought it was worth mentioning.

Rawr Cristina
Caldari
Naqam
Posted - 2008.08.07 15:58:00 - [425]
 

good changes on the whole IMO. Good to see CCP are finally fixing their game.

Ahzara Zhin
Posted - 2008.08.07 16:03:00 - [426]
 

Edited by: Ahzara Zhin on 07/08/2008 16:05:11
Way to go CCP, great fixes for pvp-crazed Jarhead ***holes.

Sethose Olderon
Gryphon Chancellery
Gryphon League
Posted - 2008.08.07 16:04:00 - [427]
 

Edited by: Sethose Olderon on 07/08/2008 16:22:46



HAHA! Looks like the Jarheads aren't liking this one too much.

I'm loving this.

Also, Empire space is supposed to be secure folks, if you want to gank each other, you should have to go to low-sec and 0.0.

Jarheads prey on noobies, and easy targets in empire simply because they are easy targets, and they think it's funny to watch someone loose a billion isk everytime their freighter is ganked.

If it weren't for industrialists you'd be sitting in dock with nothing to fly. THINK ABOUT IT!

These changes are badly needed, and appreciated.


Personally, I find it rather annoying that Jarheads get all the Goodies. They get something in every patch and whine about what they think they should have regardless.

Rarely do the Industrialists get anything worthwhile, and mostly its something else for Jarheads to shoot at.

Jarheads in this game have it pretty easy, so can the Indies get a few Goodies, huh?

/rant

Marlona Sky
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2008.08.07 16:06:00 - [428]
 

Originally by: csebal
Originally by: Marlona Sky
More suicide ganker emo rage quit tears please. EVE is a cruel and harsh place and you just lost your ISK button. Grow up! Rolling Eyes


The point of your post is..

what exactly?

This isnt just about suicide ganking. This is about the way CCP approaches problems. Instead of making fine adjustments to the system and watch how it reacts, they constantly keep going to the extremes.. Hell even for newly added stuff, they add is 'pre-nerfed' so that they make sure its not unbalanced, but the fact that it is pre-nerfed usually makes it unbalanced and worthless to begin with.

This is a clear sign that people over there are either unwilling (lazy) or just plain unable (incompetent) to make proper game design decisions.

None of those options are really promising.

So please, for f..s sake.. go troll somewhere else and let the honest people shout the living s..t out of CCP for what they are doing. Not that it matters anyway, but at least they can't say noone told them they are wrong.


Mmmmmmmm... the tears taste so good. Laughing

General Paul
Atomic Heroes
The G0dfathers
Posted - 2008.08.07 16:14:00 - [429]
 

a solution to suicide gankign already exists =/ a buffer tanked vulture.

Now thats secure space will be so much more secure and hundreds will flock to this lovely place what happens to the lag caused by all the invicible noobs grinding agents in there 6 billion isk ratting ships?

This seems in effect to be a boost to unethical people who exploit third world countries populations to farm isk and change it into real world cash. People should live in fear or defend themselves.

Rawr Cristina
Caldari
Naqam
Posted - 2008.08.07 16:22:00 - [430]
 

Originally by: General Paul
a solution to suicide gankign already exists =/ a buffer tanked vulture.


lol

Ahzara Zhin
Posted - 2008.08.07 16:24:00 - [431]
 

Originally by: Karando
Requesting balance in EVE, CCP has to implement the following changes in order to improve the game.
1) Disband the CSM and ban all of it's members with no interest in PvP from EVE
2) Fire newly hired CCP employees (employeement time < 6 months) (Including, but not limited to CCP Fear and CCP Nozh)
3) Restrict forum access to accounts with over 100 player kills.


You can take that and stick it in your ***!

Lucy'Lastic
Posted - 2008.08.07 16:38:00 - [432]
 

Originally by: General Paul
a solution to suicide gankign already exists =/ a buffer tanked vulture..


lol. Please post when you know what you are talking about.

Originally by: General Paul

Now thats secure space will be so much more secure and hundreds will flock to this lovely place what happens to the lag caused by all the invicible noobs grinding agents in there 6 billion isk ratting ships?



No extra lag will be created by making it more difficult to suicide gank someone and those 6 billion isk ships will not be invincible.

Originally by: General Paul

This seems in effect to be a boost to unethical people who exploit third world countries populations to farm isk and change it into real world cash. People should live in fear or defend themselves.


Oh dear. You really are bitter.

General Paul
Atomic Heroes
The G0dfathers
Posted - 2008.08.07 16:46:00 - [433]
 

do many gank squad do 300K damage against a command ship hull ? I always transport expensive goods in tanked ships.

Not bitter either, im not a suicide ganker, I just feel empire space should be clsoed down forever, you would get less clustered sectors of space and so less lag. Everyone wins.

CliveMerric
Posted - 2008.08.07 16:58:00 - [434]
 

i feel hurt, i believe that eve is a 'cold dark place' that should be fundamentally unsafe. And as it now stands there are numerous counters to ganking, like not using ap with expensive cargoes or just paying attention. Ive never ganked but i strongly oppose this MASSIVE change in gameplay. Please do not make high sec into totally safe space

CCP please oh please when you want to change something MAJOR please change 1 thing at a time not 4 and hope the place dosent go to hell.


Sal Alo
Minmatar
Pane e Panelle
Posted - 2008.08.07 17:00:00 - [435]
 

I feel the fear

Raneru
Combat and Recon
Posted - 2008.08.07 17:16:00 - [436]
 

Originally by: Karando

3) Restrict forum access to accounts with over 100 player kills.


Loving that idea! Very Happy

Dominatus Crispus
Nation of Muppets
Posted - 2008.08.07 17:29:00 - [437]
 

i agree with this change, and for the whiners...

learn to adapt... Wink

Axhind
Caldari
Ars ex Discordia
Test Alliance Please Ignore
Posted - 2008.08.07 17:31:00 - [438]
 

Originally by: CliveMerric
i feel hurt, i believe that eve is a 'cold dark place' that should be fundamentally unsafe. And as it now stands there are numerous counters to ganking, like not using ap with expensive cargoes or just paying attention. Ive never ganked but i strongly oppose this MASSIVE change in gameplay. Please do not make high sec into totally safe space

CCP please oh please when you want to change something MAJOR please change 1 thing at a time not 4 and hope the place dosent go to hell.




How about you try and play the other side before all the whine? Manualy flying the freighter doesn't help against the suicide ganks. Nor do almost free torp ravens. Hulks are also easy target as they can not perform their function without exposing them selves to any ganker with half a brain cell.

I know it's nice to have an ISK button that is almost as risk free as trading but that doesn't make it balanced. At least traders have to suffer the isk wars.

But don't let reality interupt your whine.

PS: I've never thought I would agree with a member of DOOM but tears are real tasty in here (almost as good as the EPIC nano whine).

Hero Crane
Caldari
Posted - 2008.08.07 18:25:00 - [439]
 

Originally by: General Paul

This seems in effect to be a boost to unethical people who exploit third world countries populations to farm isk and change it into real world cash. People should live in fear or defend themselves.


....

WHAT!?!?!

~_^

Lyria Skydancer
Amarr
Gunship Diplomacy
Posted - 2008.08.07 18:28:00 - [440]
 

This is nothing but a boost to high sec money making. Sorry but ccp is hoe'ing for money again.

Kurann
Tribe of One
Tribal Conclave
Posted - 2008.08.07 18:38:00 - [441]
 

Edited by: Kurann on 07/08/2008 18:39:26
Originally by: Sethose Olderon
Edited by: Sethose Olderon on 07/08/2008 16:22:46



HAHA! Looks like the Jarheads aren't liking this one too much.

I'm loving this.

Also, Empire space is supposed to be secure folks, if you want to gank each other, you should have to go to low-sec and 0.0.

Jarheads prey on noobies, and easy targets in empire simply because they are easy targets, and they think it's funny to watch someone loose a billion isk everytime their freighter is ganked.

If it weren't for industrialists you'd be sitting in dock with nothing to fly. THINK ABOUT IT!

These changes are badly needed, and appreciated.


Personally, I find it rather annoying that Jarheads get all the Goodies. They get something in every patch and whine about what they think they should have regardless.

Rarely do the Industrialists get anything worthwhile, and mostly its something else for Jarheads to shoot at.

Jarheads in this game have it pretty easy, so can the Indies get a few Goodies, huh?

/rant


and what exactly are we supposed to shoot in low sec? have you been there recently? there is no one but bored pirates there. Once in a while you will get some random noob, but thats about it.

As a career pirate (posting with my main...OMG?!?!?!?) i am spending most of my time sitting around waiting for that 1 in a million chance a noob will enter low sec.

My solution (compiled from other posts and my own thoughts):
Since CCP likes doing the extreme, move all level 4's level 3's to low sec, have say a 30% chance of level 2's take you to low sec (and you can decline the mission if you want to stay in pink fuzzy high sec with concord giving you a reach around anytime you want), move all hidden belts to low sec, spawn some good roids in low sec, spawn faction ships in low sec, and forget the sec changes. I don't want to work harder to get to -10, that would be silly. The reason i pirate is for the -10, and cause i like pew pewing anything i see.

you want to populate low sec? there ya go. you can't solo mine, or you will get ganked. you can't solo mission, cause you will get ganked. both forces "players" into player corps, because noob corps are just that, full of noobs. and please, bring your shiny faction gear too, i has to feeds my pirate babiez.

k thnx bai

Akiko Reikio
Intergalactic Squad
Posted - 2008.08.07 18:56:00 - [442]
 

To balance this, how about you disallow players from staying in NPC corps indefinetly, or make them war decable. The later would really just be funny.

Just a thought.

Ironnight
x13
IT Alliance
Posted - 2008.08.07 19:46:00 - [443]
 

Originally by: Sethose Olderon
Edited by: Sethose Olderon on 07/08/2008 16:22:46



HAHA! Looks like the Jarheads aren't liking this one too much.

I'm loving this.

Also, Empire space is supposed to be secure folks, if you want to gank each other, you should have to go to low-sec and 0.0.

/rant


Its supposed to be safer, not safe, well that was the way it was, before the hello kitty online people took over. Go back there please.

Dray
Caldari
Euphoria Released
HYDRA RELOADED
Posted - 2008.08.07 20:13:00 - [444]
 

Bottom line is cash flow, back in the day when eve kicked off people were drawn to it for the very reasons most cry on the forums, losses hurt, and there was no real safety beyond the safety you and your friends gave each other.

Now eve is a different beast, theres a lot of money in this game and people want safety and no risk, they are in the majority, for me the galling thing is CCP wont admit this so f**k them, but i dont blame them, catering to the needs of the few wont keep subs up, and ultimately thats what pays the bills, and that what feeds the kids.

I'd rather they just came out and admitted this.

Joey Meow
MURAKAMI INDUSTRIES
Posted - 2008.08.07 20:49:00 - [445]
 

Originally by: Dray
Bottom line is cash flow, back in the day when eve kicked off people were drawn to it for the very reasons most cry on the forums, losses hurt, and there was no real safety beyond the safety you and your friends gave each other.

Now eve is a different beast, theres a lot of money in this game and people want safety and no risk, they are in the majority, for me the galling thing is CCP wont admit this so f**k them, but i dont blame them, catering to the needs of the few wont keep subs up, and ultimately thats what pays the bills, and that what feeds the kids.

I'd rather they just came out and admitted this.


Pretty much what it is. CCP needs to make money, majority of people want "safer" environment, CCP needs to accommodate in order to continue to make money. EVE will never revert to the 20k Online, unless it enters the decline, as all games do eventually. The way things are going, we will only see more growth and more "mainstream" player coming in, which is all good.

Solomon XI
Hidden Souls
Posted - 2008.08.07 21:13:00 - [446]
 

CCP is epic fail.

Nuff' said.

Shinigami
Gallente
Shinra
Posted - 2008.08.07 21:25:00 - [447]
 

Edited by: Shinigami on 07/08/2008 21:27:11
Originally by: Joey Meow
Pretty much what it is. CCP needs to make money, majority of people want "safer" environment, CCP needs to accommodate in order to continue to make money. EVE will never revert to the 20k Online, unless it enters the decline, as all games do eventually. The way things are going, we will only see more growth and more "mainstream" player coming in, which is all good.


It's a good way to pay back all those people who have been loyal over the years, and those who came because they wanted something different. You know the guys who kept them from going bankrupt before they could afford ads on BSG.

Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS
IDLE EMPIRE
Posted - 2008.08.07 21:31:00 - [448]
 

but I always liked reading the whines, moving a billion isk, coming back and reading more whines. Looks like I won't be able to do that anymore Sad

Minessis
Aliastra
Posted - 2008.08.07 22:59:00 - [449]
 

well these changes would be fine and dandy if the population of low sec (0.3 - 0.1) wasn't approaching zero...

fact of the matter is that there really are no benefits to carebearing in lowsec atm and so as it stands, low sec is virtually uninhabited...

maybe if crokite and bistot spawned in lowsec systems... spawning more and more depending on the systems ship losses?

but again, as it stands now... lowsec populations are way way too low and pushing the penalties of ganking in higher sec won't push the carebears into lowsec... it'll only push the pvpers out of highsec.

SPIONKOP
Caldari
Macabre Votum
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2008.08.07 23:34:00 - [450]
 

Oh Joy.

About bloody time this was done.

For those about to leave the game cos of this can I have your stuff, it may have been mine once upon a time.


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