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blankseplocked Open letter to CCP - a serious response to the nano changes
 
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Megan Maynard
Minmatar
Navigators of the Abyss
Posted - 2008.08.01 02:39:00 - [61]
 

Originally by: Lyria Skydancer
Originally by: Megan Maynard
The reclassifying of ship speeds was good on CCP's part.

Boosting AB's was a good thing.
Nerfing webs was a good thing.
Nerfing snakes and Polys was a good thing.
Boosting warp scrams was a good thing.

BUT nerfing the MWD as hard as they did was NOT a good thing.

The patch would be absolutely perfect in my opinion if the MWD nerf wasn't so nasty. Nerf the **** going 10 km/s or more, rebalance the ships, but don't get rid of the speed that most fly at and use. (The 4-7 km/s range.)


Yeah, but lets see how it works out once they adjust/nerf missiles accordingly to the new speeds.


Maybe. But really the game is not as fast paced with the patch, and therefore in my view, not as fun.

It was fun screaming around in a frigate going 5000+ m/s easily.

Zarnak Wulf
Posted - 2008.08.01 02:51:00 - [62]
 

Originally by: Megan Maynard
Maybe. But really the game is not as fast paced with the patch, and therefore in my view, not as fun.

It was fun screaming around in a frigate going 5000+ m/s easily.


It's even more fun hanging onto a HAC in close orbit with a Wolf. Try it. Good times.

Deschenus Maximus
Amarr
Digital Fury Corporation
Ushra'Khan
Posted - 2008.08.01 04:34:00 - [63]
 

To you "it's only a nano game at the moment" ******s: GET A ****ING CLUE! I've PvPed in ALL CLASSES over the past two years. Guess what? Nano HACs are not the end all of Eve. They are just another tool in the toolbox. Want to roam? Yeah, speedHacs are good for that. But Fleet battles -> Sniper BS, gatecamp busting -> gank BS, disruption ops -> Force Recons... use the right tool for the right job... and that includes killing nanoships.

Minmatar are going to be epically ****ed by these ******ed changes, Gallente too, but to a lesser degree... good ****ing thing I have Amarr BS V and large e-turrets T2, to be ****ing honest.

BiggestT
Caldari
Amarrian Retribution
Posted - 2008.08.01 08:14:00 - [64]
 

Originally by: Pheonix Kanan
Edited by: Pheonix Kanan on 31/07/2008 12:15:26
I agree with you entirely. Unfortunately, as I have stated to many fellow eve players, CCP has a past history of over-nerfing (Nos, Damps, Carriers, for example). And there current eve community of a vocal minority is not helping the situation. Average nano pilots do not own snakes, not even low grade ones. Yet CCP based at lot of the nerfs on a vagabond with a HG snake set.

(Before I get into a rant)

It's kind of sad to CCP do something so detrimental, but alas. As PVP'ers, it's kind of our choosen lifestyle to have to always change tactics when a carebear loses his Rail-Raven to a smarter player


what about the M in MWD meaning mandatory?
what about the hsips that cant nano and are therefore dreafull?
what about the invincable nano's that, no mater how much isk they have, shld never ever be invincable?

Chaos Incarnate
Faceless Logistics
Posted - 2008.08.01 09:01:00 - [65]
 

Originally by: Deschenus Maximus
To you "it's only a nano game at the moment" ******s: GET A ****ING CLUE! I've PvPed in ALL CLASSES over the past two years. Guess what? Nano HACs are not the end all of Eve. They are just another tool in the toolbox. Want to roam? Yeah, speedHacs are good for that. But Fleet battles -> Sniper BS, gatecamp busting -> gank BS, disruption ops -> Force Recons... use the right tool for the right job... and that includes killing nanoships.

Minmatar are going to be epically ****ed by these ******ed changes, Gallente too, but to a lesser degree... good ****ing thing I have Amarr BS V and large e-turrets T2, to be ****ing honest.


When your head explodes after your next epic outpouring of e-rage over pixels, can I have your stuff?

McDonALTs
Posted - 2008.08.01 09:04:00 - [66]
 

CCP did the best thing which was to ignore what people "SAY" and look at what people actually "DO".

The real issue is that people have forgotten how to pvp without a MWD. AB's are now boosted so AB's are serious MWD replacements now.

Captain Crimson
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2008.08.01 09:48:00 - [67]
 

Originally by: McDonALTs
CCP did the best thing which was to ignore what people "SAY" and look at what people actually "DO".

The real issue is that people have forgotten how to pvp without a MWD. AB's are now boosted so AB's are serious MWD replacements now.


I have to agree with this. CCP really dont too much of a damn about the forums as a small percentage of EVE players post there. They just look at their stats as it gives a more general view of things.

Ships and forums is now the new Rogue forum in WoW. You should be worried.

Gunner Chick
Posted - 2008.08.01 10:47:00 - [68]
 

Edited by: Gunner Chick on 01/08/2008 10:47:52
i love taking in the whines before the stormTwisted Evil

guess its time to drop ship sizes to maintain that invulnerability for small gang warfare/incursionsQuestion

the nano ***s think...

navy ravens going 9600 m/s are fine.

interceptors with hg slaves going faster than warp speed are fine(ok, slight exageration but it might as well be warp speed hehe).

6-10 man roaming gangs filled with pure death(falcons, vagas, rapiers, dictors etc) that cant be touched are fine. p.s. this constitutes blobbage since they pwn one to 2 peeps at a time usually or run easily from equal to bigger groups even though their main arguement is that the nerf will promote blobbageRolling Eyes

plus much more and this all after a already midget size nano nerf.

me, a 4 year player, being a forced nano pilot but one who trully enjoys playing my races like they are supposed to be played is welcoming this change..big time.

im hoping alot of players will exitArrow that way because tbh, im sick of all the desire for invulnerability bs.

Deschenus Maximus
Amarr
Digital Fury Corporation
Ushra'Khan
Posted - 2008.08.01 12:11:00 - [69]
 

Originally by: Chaos Incarnate


When your head explodes after your next epic outpouring of e-rage over pixels, can I have your stuff?


No. Like I said, Amarr BS V + Large energy turret tech 2, so...

I just can't stand people who have their heads so firmly up their asses that they can't see how terrible this nerf is. Did speed need rebalancing? Yeah, nerf Snakes, nerf polycarbs, but don't REMOVE a whole playstyle alltogether for god's sake!

Esmenet
Gallente
Posted - 2008.08.01 12:52:00 - [70]
 

The speednerf is ridiculous as it does not only nerf the extremely expensive faction BS speed setups but also the normal 3-4km hacs that is the majority of speed ships. I wont pay billions to make a viable speed hac so its back to the old BS's for me but i wonder how much roaming gangs i will go to with that. Its a gigantic nerf of small gang pvp in 0.0 that makes me wonder if ccp has even tried to consider the implications. Not to mention that this will also be the final nail in the coffin for blaster ships.


Lyria Skydancer
Amarr
Gunship Diplomacy
Posted - 2008.08.01 12:53:00 - [71]
 

Originally by: Megan Maynard


Maybe. But really the game is not as fast paced with the patch, and therefore in my view, not as fun.

It was fun screaming around in a frigate going 5000+ m/s easily.


Imo slowing everything down gives more room for manouvers in fights. More skill instead of random overshoot or no overshoot luck webs.

H Lecter
Gallente
The Black Rabbits Academy
The Gurlstas Associates
Posted - 2008.08.01 13:03:00 - [72]
 

Originally by: Lyria Skydancer
Yeah, but lets see how it works out once they adjust/nerf missiles accordingly to the new speeds.
Please don't - it will only start a vicious circle of speed and missile nerfs due to the everlasting whine of ratters caught in a beltSad...

Lyria Skydancer
Amarr
Gunship Diplomacy
Posted - 2008.08.01 13:31:00 - [73]
 

Originally by: H Lecter
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer
Yeah, but lets see how it works out once they adjust/nerf missiles accordingly to the new speeds.
Please don't - it will only start a vicious circle of speed and missile nerfs due to the everlasting whine of ratters caught in a beltSad...


But missiles are overpowered now. Need to adjust them explo velocities you know.

Chaos Incarnate
Faceless Logistics
Posted - 2008.08.01 13:33:00 - [74]
 

Edited by: Chaos Incarnate on 01/08/2008 13:33:05
Originally by: Deschenus Maximus
Originally by: Chaos Incarnate


When your head explodes after your next epic outpouring of e-rage over pixels, can I have your stuff?


No. Like I said, Amarr BS V + Large energy turret tech 2, so...

I just can't stand people who have their heads so firmly up their asses that they can't see how terrible this nerf is. Did speed need rebalancing? Yeah, nerf Snakes, nerf polycarbs, but don't REMOVE a whole playstyle alltogether for god's sake!


I just can't stand people whose entire response to a perceived unjustified game change is to stamp and scream all over the forum like angry eight year olds. Get on Singularity, test the changes, find new ways around things; post feedback on what is still speed tankable, where you think the nerfs went too far, whatever.

AstroPhobic
Minmatar
Holding Corp
Posted - 2008.08.01 13:46:00 - [75]
 

Originally by: Chaos Incarnate
rabble rabble rabble


Dude... your face.

Yar0
Russian Thunder Squad
Against ALL Authorities
Posted - 2008.08.01 13:48:00 - [76]
 

Originally by: Chaos Incarnate
Edited by: Chaos Incarnate on 01/08/2008 13:33:05
Originally by: Deschenus Maximus
Originally by: Chaos Incarnate


When your head explodes after your next epic outpouring of e-rage over pixels, can I have your stuff?


No. Like I said, Amarr BS V + Large energy turret tech 2, so...

I just can't stand people who have their heads so firmly up their asses that they can't see how terrible this nerf is. Did speed need rebalancing? Yeah, nerf Snakes, nerf polycarbs, but don't REMOVE a whole playstyle alltogether for god's sake!


I just can't stand people whose entire response to a perceived unjustified game change is to stamp and scream all over the forum like angry eight year olds. Get on Singularity, test the changes, find new ways around things; post feedback on what is still speed tankable, where you think the nerfs went too far, whatever.


Then dont stand ! Better f... ... ! Because ppl had this play style for a very long time ! Because someone couldnt play, they used forums to screw other ppl ! Where did all the training go, minmatar ships, gallente ? No one has any rights to screw ppl that much !

Chaos Incarnate
Faceless Logistics
Posted - 2008.08.01 14:27:00 - [77]
 

Edited by: Chaos Incarnate on 01/08/2008 14:27:52
Originally by: AstroPhobic
Originally by: Chaos Incarnate
rabble rabble rabble


Dude... your face.


That's all anyone ever says anymore Sad

Juleko
Posted - 2008.08.01 15:22:00 - [78]
 

Probably worth noting that the prices of Snakes, Polys, etc will come down following a speed nerf - so posts like "I'm not spending billions to only go 5km/sec!" are kinda short-sighted.

fmercury
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2008.08.01 16:15:00 - [79]
 

Edited by: fmercury on 01/08/2008 16:16:06
Edited by: fmercury on 01/08/2008 16:15:17
Originally by: Baudolino

I see both mistakes as a possible indication of GMs and developers having less intimate knowledge of game mechanics then they had only 2 years ago. I see CCP relying in both cases on players with even less understanding of the mechanics they are discussing.




With a well constructed, grammatically sound argument, there are only a few ways to shine here as a complete idiot. Telling CCP you know EVE better than they do is one of them. EVE was here before everyone was traveling 5 Kms or docking in a pod, and it will be there after. As the Nanoers have been telling everyone for some time: Adapt or die.

Barsexual
Castle Greyskull
Posted - 2008.08.01 16:28:00 - [80]
 

Edited by: Barsexual on 01/08/2008 16:28:12
Originally by: McDonALTs
CCP did the best thing which was to ignore what people "SAY" and look at what people actually "DO".

The real issue is that people have forgotten how to pvp without a MWD. AB's are now boosted so AB's are serious MWD replacements now.



it seems like most things that had a chance to escape a t2 bubble camp now will have almost no chance after the changes since mass has increased on most ships which affects acceleration

AB to escape something like that is just lol

Stab Wounds
Caldari
State Protectorate
Posted - 2008.08.01 16:35:00 - [81]
 

Originally by: Barsexual
Edited by: Barsexual on 01/08/2008 16:28:12
Originally by: McDonALTs
CCP did the best thing which was to ignore what people "SAY" and look at what people actually "DO".

The real issue is that people have forgotten how to pvp without a MWD. AB's are now boosted so AB's are serious MWD replacements now.



it seems like most things that had a chance to escape a t2 bubble camp now will have almost no chance after the changes since mass has increased on most ships which affects acceleration

AB to escape something like that is just lol


poeples like you make me sick. all you want to do is run run runn. at least after patch you have to commit to the fight. you aren't supposed to escape bubble camps. try bringing your own fleet to figth them or blow up the bubble. tactics and brains get some.

AstroPhobic
Minmatar
Holding Corp
Posted - 2008.08.01 16:37:00 - [82]
 

Originally by: Stab Wounds

poeples like you make me sick. all you want to do is run run runn. at least after patch you have to commit to the fight. you aren't supposed to escape bubble camps. try bringing your own fleet to figth them or blow up the bubble. tactics and brains get some.



Right, bigger blob wins. That makes eve FUN! You want a 5 man roaming gang? They should COMMIT to a fight with your 40 man gate camp because you have a bubble.

Seriously, that's stupid.

Hanso Sparxx
Deep Penetration Inc.
Predatory Instincts
Posted - 2008.08.01 16:39:00 - [83]
 

Most people complaining about the nano nerf have never been on the test server.

True story.

Stab Wounds
Caldari
State Protectorate
Posted - 2008.08.01 16:41:00 - [84]
 

Originally by: AstroPhobic
Originally by: Stab Wounds

poeples like you make me sick. all you want to do is run run runn. at least after patch you have to commit to the fight. you aren't supposed to escape bubble camps. try bringing your own fleet to figth them or blow up the bubble. tactics and brains get some.



Right, bigger blob wins. That makes eve FUN! You want a 5 man roaming gang? They should COMMIT to a fight with your 40 man gate camp because you have a bubble.

Seriously, that's stupid.


if you don't have friends you lose. just like in real life. if you don't have friends and family in real life you deserve what you suffer too

Baudolino
Gallente
Royal Crimson Lancers
Posted - 2008.08.01 16:49:00 - [85]
 

Edited by: Baudolino on 01/08/2008 16:50:03
Originally by: Stab Wounds


...you aren't supposed to escape bubble camps....




This is a perfect example of what i call "starcraft" gaming in EVE. This frame of mind that is utterly hostile to the inherent fluidity of EVE. A black and white understanding that organizes ths games' content in finite categories in such a way as to have it make permanent sense.

I`m not against a re-organization of how speed works. I think CCP is going to far though and i have stated why.

"Nano" as clearly defined in my previous thread on "nanos" is a valuable asset to the tactics and gamestyles of EVE, and there are others ways of bringing it closer in line with other styles beyond this total revamp. The change reeks of the fact that the nano discussion is void of an understanding of the 3 different speed categories in EVE flight and their underlying mechanics.

AstroPhobic
Minmatar
Holding Corp
Posted - 2008.08.01 16:56:00 - [86]
 

Originally by: Stab Wounds

if you don't have friends you lose. just like in real life. if you don't have friends and family in real life you deserve what you suffer too


'Cause EVE is modeled after real life, right? That's what makes games fun, modeling them after real life?

It's a game, it should play like a game and be fun like a game. Fun games don't say 40 > 20, you all die. It's stupid. Rolling Eyes

Stab Wounds
Caldari
State Protectorate
Posted - 2008.08.01 17:01:00 - [87]
 

Edited by: Stab Wounds on 01/08/2008 17:04:01
Originally by: Baudolino
Edited by: Baudolino on 01/08/2008 16:50:03
Originally by: Stab Wounds


...you aren't supposed to escape bubble camps....




This is a perfect example of what i call "starcraft" gaming in EVE. This frame of mind that is utterly hostile to the inherent fluidity of EVE. A black and white understanding that organizes ths games' content in finite categories in such a way as to have it make permanent sense.

I`m not against a re-organization of how speed works. I think CCP is going to far though and i have stated why.

"Nano" as clearly defined in my previous thread on "nanos" is a valuable asset to the tactics and gamestyles of EVE, and there are others ways of bringing it closer in line with other styles beyond this total revamp. The change reeks of the fact that the nano discussion is void of an understanding of the 3 different speed categories in EVE flight and their underlying mechanics.

bubbles were made to stop people from warping away and having to COMMIT to the fight if they don't work or there's an easy way around them then they are broken.

like currently if you put up a bubble a macharial can easape easily back to gate with a mwd even with 2-3 90% webs on him, he just float back

Atlas Oracle
Minmatar
Colossus Enterprises
Posted - 2008.08.01 18:53:00 - [88]
 

Originally by: Stab Wounds
if you don't have friends you lose. just like in real life. if you don't have friends and family in real life you deserve what you suffer too


just, wow

Nathanial Victor
Minmatar
Posted - 2008.08.01 19:10:00 - [89]
 

Edited by: Nathanial Victor on 01/08/2008 19:11:06
Originally by: Stab Wounds
if you don't have friends and family in real life you deserve what you suffer too


bravo good sir. BRAV-O

/slow long loud clap

Deschenus Maximus
Amarr
Digital Fury Corporation
Ushra'Khan
Posted - 2008.08.01 19:49:00 - [90]
 

Originally by: Chaos Incarnate

I just can't stand people whose entire response to a perceived unjustified game change is to stamp and scream all over the forum like angry eight year olds.


Where did I see that behaviour before? Oh yeah, from the nerf nanos crowd.

Originally by: Chaos Incarnate
Get on Singularity, test the changes, find new ways around things; post feedback on what is still speed tankable, where you think the nerfs went too far, whatever.


There's no way around getting ass****d when your papertanked ship crawls around like a turtle. I strongly disliked HACs before I started nanoing them; looks like I'll strongly dislike them once more.


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