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Cogswin Iannyen
Caldari
Mafia Redux
Posted - 2008.07.22 12:17:00 - [31]
 

You need to bring moar cowbell.

ZeCamerone
Caldari
20th Legion
Posted - 2008.07.22 14:37:00 - [32]
 

Originally by: Elvor Dark
The fact that you apparently get insurance too for self destructing your ship, that seems wrong. You don't lose it, you purposely destroy it yourself. That's makes you fraudulent. :) No matter the circumstance.


Suicide gankers get insurance, this is no different; i.e. this is not RL. Although the satisfaction of blocking your e-peen would be payment enough. More gank next time.

Artemis Rose
Clandestine Vector
THE SPACE P0LICE
Posted - 2008.07.22 14:51:00 - [33]
 

Its cute when nano gangs do the whining that people self destruct and deny them killmails. Man those nano pilots sure have it tough.

Its also cute when nano-whiners cry that the ebil nano ships ran away and denied them the killmail.

You just can't stop the whining. Remove killmails....? Shocked

Endless Subversion
Genos Occidere
HYDRA RELOADED
Posted - 2008.07.22 15:15:00 - [34]
 

Mods moved this to crime and punishment? Wow..

When he starts his self-destruct you will get a warning in your combat messages, it's easy to miss with gun spam but it's there.

It's a bad game mechanic which I've posted about before. It encourages blobbing, screws cap warfare ships,ewar ships and small ships wearing bigger ships down and vastly favors buffer tanks and capitals since in the vast majority of situations they have the time to get it off.

It also has NO DOWNSIDE. There is no reason for a pilot not to self-destruct in every fight. He can cancel it at any time and loses no more than he'd lose normally, still collects insurance and denies his opponents loots and killmails. It's stupid and broken.

The thread is here

Matrix Skye
Caldari
State War Academy
Posted - 2008.07.22 15:26:00 - [35]
 

nano pilots complaining on how self destruct promotes blobs and is risk-free is priceless.

atleast you cost them their ship, unlike nanos which zoom away unharmed.

Tenacha Khan
TunDraGon
Posted - 2008.07.22 15:53:00 - [36]
 

Originally by: ZeCamerone
Originally by: Elvor Dark
The fact that you apparently get insurance too for self destructing your ship, that seems wrong. You don't lose it, you purposely destroy it yourself. That's makes you fraudulent. :) No matter the circumstance.


Suicide gankers get insurance, this is no different; i.e. this is not RL. Although the satisfaction of blocking your e-peen would be payment enough. More gank next time.


Well it isnt the same as suicide gankers, suicide gankers should get jack ****. Insurance companys would obviousley aplaud people that self destructed when being faced by pirates.

Grarr Dexx
Amarr
Kumovi
The G0dfathers
Posted - 2008.07.22 15:53:00 - [37]
 

Non-tech 2 guns on a vagabond? LaughingLaughingLaughingLaughingLaughingLaughing

Ki An
Gallente
The Really Awesome Players
Posted - 2008.07.22 17:13:00 - [38]
 

I would suppose that if CCP goes ahead with their stupid idea of removing insurance for suicide ganks, that self destruct would stop insurance payout as well. It's only fair.

Elvor Dark
New Dawn Corporation
Posted - 2008.07.22 21:23:00 - [39]
 

Originally by: Artemis Rose
Its cute when nano gangs do the whining that people self destruct and deny them killmails. Man those nano pilots sure have it tough.

Its also cute when nano-whiners cry that the ebil nano ships ran away and denied them the killmail.

You just can't stop the whining. Remove killmails....? Shocked


Lmao, very funny.

Elvor Dark
New Dawn Corporation
Posted - 2008.07.22 21:50:00 - [40]
 

New scenario anyone?

Ok, your in a system with your a couple of your corp mates, one of them is ratting and in comes some dude in an Absolution. He finds your mate immediately, locks him down and begins to beast him quite badly.

You have a couple of PVP ships ready and warp in on the guy that has almost destroyed your mate, time for revenge, right?

So you lock the guy down, one of you gets too close and hes got you webbed, your desperately trying to get away and manage to escape with hull bleed. Fortunately for you, you can just go back to the POS and repair. That's what you do and you get ready to come back.

Meanwhile your mate that was killed is already there helping to kill the Absolution. The Absolution pilot has no friends nearby though and so he decides after looting your mates wreck already that he wants to self destruct, after all it's been a few minutes already and this guy knows he is trapped here, permanently tanking you, or at least until the second mate he almost owned gets back.

So now, not only has he got the kill mail for owning your mate, but when he self destructs, you've not only lost your mates ship, but his loot too and you almost lost another ship trying to kill the Absolution. So to summarize, you've just gone and wasted 10 minutes trying to kill this guy that just self destructed.

You didn't get the killmail, but he got his and almost another. He stole the loot and therefore any reimbursement from the modules that you were hoping to get. Wow, he just ****** you all good and proper, what a guy!

Grandis Fustis
Destry's Lounge
Posted - 2008.07.22 21:51:00 - [41]
 

i got caught by a nano gang in 0.0 while i was ratting down my sec thats why i always carry a heavy newt on my pve raven just to ruin a nano's day so as for self-destructing....GET THE POD!!!!!!!!! when the lag hits as he explodes

Wind Ictiva
Delta Kappa Gamma
Posted - 2008.07.22 22:15:00 - [42]
 

Originally by: Cogswin Iannyen
You need to bring moar cowbell.



mooooooaaaarrrrr COWBELL

AltBier
Minmatar
Sebiestor Tribe
Posted - 2008.07.23 13:44:00 - [43]
 

Removing insurance for self-destruct seems fair.

THEHUNTER123
Stargate SG-1
Posted - 2008.07.23 13:59:00 - [44]
 

FYI self destruct is meant to deny you the km and lewt

MenanceWhite
Amarr
Emi Raaf's Corporation
Posted - 2008.07.23 14:02:00 - [45]
 

Not enough DPS.

It's not that hard, besides well done self destructs are people who manages to explode their stuff just after hitting structure, like that other golem that was on CP

Tenacha Khan
TunDraGon
Posted - 2008.07.23 14:07:00 - [46]
 

Originally by: AltBier
Removing insurance for self-destruct seems fair.


How so? If you look at it in character. Insurance companys would aplaud people for self destructing beacuse if it happened enough it would disuade pirates from blowing your ship up in the first place therefore the insurance companies would not have to dish out so much iskies.

Lily Cole
Posted - 2008.07.23 14:30:00 - [47]
 

Originally by: Elvor Dark
New scenario anyone?


Isn't that called losing any more?

This new breed of nano whinage is classic gold, and long overdue.

Matrix Skye
Caldari
State War Academy
Posted - 2008.07.23 16:07:00 - [48]
 

Edited by: Matrix Skye on 23/07/2008 17:13:22
If you self-destruct in game you have no honor and dignity in real life. You are also a coward in real life. Tell your family what you have done and face your consequences. You should not be allowed to join your country's armed forces or intelligence agencies, as you are a disgrace to your own people. Since you cannot be trusted under pressure quit your job. Do not have children as they will probably end up self-destructing anyway.

Shame on you. These gentlemen worked hard to gang-**** you only to have their e-tesicles ripped from them in such cruel way.

Grandis Fustis
Destry's Lounge
Posted - 2008.07.23 17:46:00 - [49]
 

Originally by: Matrix Skye
Edited by: Matrix Skye on 23/07/2008 17:13:22
If you self-destruct in game you have no honor and dignity in real life. You are also a coward in real life. Tell your family what you have done and face your consequences. You should not be allowed to join your country's armed forces or intelligence agencies, as you are a disgrace to your own people. Since you cannot be trusted under pressure quit your job. Do not have children as they will probably end up self-destructing anyway.

Shame on you. These gentlemen worked hard to gang-**** you only to have their e-tesicles ripped from them in such cruel way.



what ru talking about you say they fail at real life cause they wont sit there and wait for some nano gang with a huge lack of dps pop your ship, Carebears need revenge too and self-destruct is pretty funy. A coward would sit there and wait to die from the minimal amout of dps not self-destruct to luagh at nano's and go back to playing internet space ships. So dont compare eve to RL just get more COWBELL !!!!

Xorth Adimus
Caldari
Blackwater USA Inc.
Against ALL Authorities
Posted - 2008.07.23 19:16:00 - [50]
 

I hate it far more when people disconnect and do a log offski.. in their battleship or HAC.

Self destruct takes a while?

Most stuff I shoot at doesn't take that long to lose tank and then die.. YARRRR!!


Cybele Lanier
Amarr
Viziam
Posted - 2008.07.23 19:29:00 - [51]
 

Edited by: Cybele Lanier on 23/07/2008 19:28:48
Originally by: Grandis Fustis
what ru talking about you say they fail at real life cause they wont sit there and wait for some nano gang with a huge lack of dps pop your ship, Carebears need revenge too and self-destruct is pretty funy. A coward would sit there and wait to die from the minimal amout of dps not self-destruct to luagh at nano's and go back to playing internet space ships. So dont compare eve to RL just get more COWBELL !!!!


I know it's hard to tell on these boards, but I think he was being sarcastic.

Black Scorpio
Posted - 2008.07.23 19:40:00 - [52]
 

Insurance is already removed for Self destructs. A friend in-game self destructed about a couple of days ago and got just the basic insurance. He was 100% sure the ship was insured. Maybe additional testing with a cheap frig is needed...

Matrix Skye
Caldari
State War Academy
Posted - 2008.07.23 19:41:00 - [53]
 

Originally by: Cybele Lanier
Edited by: Cybele Lanier on 23/07/2008 19:28:48
Originally by: Grandis Fustis
what ru talking about you say they fail at real life cause they wont sit there and wait for some nano gang with a huge lack of dps pop your ship, Carebears need revenge too and self-destruct is pretty funy. A coward would sit there and wait to die from the minimal amout of dps not self-destruct to luagh at nano's and go back to playing internet space ships. So dont compare eve to RL just get more COWBELL !!!!


I know it's hard to tell on these boards, but I think he was being sarcastic.


The really scary part is that I bet there are some that actually believe and agree with every single one of my statements above Shocked.

Mika Meroko
Minmatar
Crayon Posting Inc
Posted - 2008.07.23 20:08:00 - [54]
 

Originally by: Matrix Skye
Originally by: Cybele Lanier
Edited by: Cybele Lanier on 23/07/2008 19:28:48
Originally by: Grandis Fustis
what ru talking about you say they fail at real life cause they wont sit there and wait for some nano gang with a huge lack of dps pop your ship, Carebears need revenge too and self-destruct is pretty funy. A coward would sit there and wait to die from the minimal amout of dps not self-destruct to luagh at nano's and go back to playing internet space ships. So dont compare eve to RL just get more COWBELL !!!!


I know it's hard to tell on these boards, but I think he was being sarcastic.


The really scary part is that I bet there are some that actually believe and agree with every single one of my statements above Shocked.


Well... it is C&P =P...

is a min CAOD!

Endless Subversion
Genos Occidere
HYDRA RELOADED
Posted - 2008.07.23 21:07:00 - [55]
 

Originally by: Black Scorpio
Insurance is already removed for Self destructs. A friend in-game self destructed about a couple of days ago and got just the basic insurance. He was 100% sure the ship was insured. Maybe additional testing with a cheap frig is needed...


It's not removed.

ManofFace
Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2008.07.23 21:18:00 - [56]
 

Sounds kind of like a serious case of blue balls to me....

Got you all hot and bothered your about to kill someone then WHACK kill gone and your stuck with the blue balls for the rest of the night.

Seriously sucks man but that's eve for ya.

Gruxella
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2008.07.23 21:26:00 - [57]
 

If you can't kill a ship before it self destructs you need to change your fit or pick on something that you CAN kill in 2 minutes.

I've lost 3 or 4 carrier kill mails because they self destructed. I didn't come whining. It's a part of the game and I personally wont sit there hopelessly tanking a gang that is going to take 20 minutes to kill me when I can just self destruct and get out.

Drop some nanos and fit some damage mods.

Or just fly a megathron tbh.


Asking for insurance to be removed when you self destruct is ridiculous. Fit your ships better.

Elvor Dark
New Dawn Corporation
Posted - 2008.07.23 21:43:00 - [58]
 

Originally by: Lily Cole
Originally by: Elvor Dark
New scenario anyone?


Isn't that called losing any more?

This new breed of nano whinage is classic gold, and long overdue.


I already stated that I thought it all over and I said the insurance should just be void and that both parties should lose out, it does seem a little messed up when someone can just self destruct and lose only his ship after being caught and trying to fight back also. So I suggested them not getting insurance, although somewhere deepdown, I would like to see something else done with the self destruct.

They try to fight back and when they can't win, they self destruct. That is in my opinion, if they fight back, a desperate move, they tried to win but couldn't and so they had a little whine to themselves and self destructed.

This is apparently a tactical move, funny how it works like that isn't it. He was in a mood and whining all to himself, he just didn't say it out aloud is all. Self destructing is a whiners move FULL STOP

ManofFace
Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2008.07.23 21:52:00 - [59]
 

Edited by: ManofFace on 23/07/2008 21:53:25
Originally by: Elvor Dark


I already stated that I thought it all over and I said the insurance should just be void and that both parties should lose out, it does seem a little messed up when someone can just self destruct and lose only his ship after being caught and trying to fight back also. So I suggested them not getting insurance, although somewhere deepdown, I would like to see something else done with the self destruct.

They try to fight back and when they can't win, they self destruct. That is in my opinion, if they fight back, a desperate move, they tried to win but couldn't and so they had a little whine to themselves and self destructed.

This is apparently a tactical move, funny how it works like that isn't it. He was in a mood and whining all to himself, he just didn't say it out aloud is all. Self destructing is a whiners move FULL STOP


I disagree actually. As may have been mentioned before it can be a useful tool for making sure your setups are right for people who are actually fighting. if you can't kill your target in 2 minutes then you most likely don't deserve the ship your in.

Scenario:

You go out and are about to grab a <insert random ship here> the moment you activate you modules you activate self-destruct, if you cannot kill your target in 2 minutes the ship goes. Yes insurance is returned if you did so and you make a bit of your money back but the money you do lose helps learn 2 lessons.

1. Check your fit make sure you got it right, check again a second time to make sure.
2. Make sure the target you did choose you actually can take out. If ya know you can't take em bring friends or you can just plainly **** em off for a while by ecm/web/scram. Your sure to get quite the interesting conversation out of them then. (and a few iskies to boot if ya do it right, and at this point you would want to turn off the self-destruct, but hey some people are crazy :) ).

Idealistic yes but might be a good idea for hardcore players or corporations that want to teach their members pvp the hard way with consequences.

Nekopyat
Posted - 2008.07.23 22:00:00 - [60]
 

Originally by: Endless Subversion

It's a bad game mechanic which I've posted about before. It encourages blobbing, screws cap warfare ships,ewar ships and small ships wearing bigger ships down and vastly favors buffer tanks and capitals since in the vast majority of situations they have the time to get it off.

It also has NO DOWNSIDE. There is no reason for a pilot not to self-destruct in every fight. He can cancel it at any time and loses no more than he'd lose normally, still collects insurance and denies his opponents loots and killmails. It's stupid and broken.


Well, one solution would be to make it an instant-button rather then that tank-favoring 2 minute countdown.

Scuttling it'self is a good, solid, time-honored military technique. The only real problem in EvE's implementation is that it is so slow and thus only available to big tank ships.

EvE is an attacker-advantage game... the one who attacks controls the engagement and much of the time there is not much the defender can do other then sit and wait for it to be over. Self destruct is one of the few tools the defender DOES have.


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