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blankseplocked [Issue] Bring back lofty scam!
 
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Ruben Rhemus
Posted - 2008.05.25 21:32:00 - [1]
 

I just noticed that the lofty "exploit" will be removed with Empyrean age. This obviously mean that the rampaging CNR plague will become even worse!
(ok it will be somewhat cool you can actually respond to people calling for help, but at this cost? I think not)

Ethaet
Gallente
Aliastra
Posted - 2008.05.25 22:18:00 - [2]
 

It will be removed?

do you have proof of that? I haven't heard anything

Ruben Rhemus
Posted - 2008.05.25 22:32:00 - [3]
 

Originally by: Ethaet
It will be removed?

do you have proof of that? I haven't heard anything


Indeed I do, http://myeve.eve-online.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=775266&page=2

In response to the question:

"As most of us are familiar, when you are invited to a gang you get the following dialog window;
[text]
What I am wondering is how will Factional Warfare affect this?"

CCPs Greyscale wrote:
"The "lofty scam" has been neutered in Empyrean Age (gang membership now has no bearing on aggression rules) so this is no longer an issue (!)"

Havohej
Du'uma Fiisi Integrated Astrometrics
Posted - 2008.05.25 23:42:00 - [4]
 

Originally by: Ruben Rhemus
I just noticed that the lofty "exploit" will be removed with Empyrean age. This obviously mean that the rampaging CNR plague will become even worse!
(ok it will be somewhat cool you can actually respond to people calling for help, but at this cost? I think not)


Posting in support of not giving into carebear demands for absolute highsec safety.

Cpt Branko
Retired Pirate Club

Posted - 2008.05.26 01:00:00 - [5]
 

Lofty scam needs to stay alive.

Zetjur Jilnou
Rapid Deployment Industries
Posted - 2008.05.26 01:19:00 - [6]
 

I am a PVPer, however I fail to understand the reason for not changing this.

Surely using some gang loophole in a way that provides the 'victim' no warning of any danger is a pretty bad thing? If it's wanted to keep it in, change it so warnings are given when new people are added to the gang as happens with the lofty scam (one that has to be accepted prior to it being possible for that person to be shot, clicking no would eject from gang).

Boknamar
Gallente
Quality Control.
Posted - 2008.05.26 02:31:00 - [7]
 

Edited by: Boknamar on 26/05/2008 02:36:06
Link For people who aren't in the mood for copypasta

I don't think this will be a huge boon to high sec dwellers or a huge blow to PvPers in the scheme of things. After all, if FW goes as planned, it could be the much-sought panacea for the ailing condition of lowsec space. In addition, I get the feeling that CCP is going to come out soon and declare corp-hopping to avoid wardecs to be an exploit.

So in summation, I don't think this will bring the game much closer to being "WoW in space."

Divad Ginleek
Gallente
New Eden Logistics and Trade.
Posted - 2008.05.26 06:37:00 - [8]
 

Anyone ever notice how much Pwners cry when CCP fixes loopholes that result from unintended game mechanics... but when rational human beings point out real problems (insurance, login traps, etc) they are flamed and called whiners and get the "welcome to eve" line flashed in their face?

odd.... Cool

aUTOKILL
Gallente
No.Mercy
Merciless.
Posted - 2008.05.26 06:43:00 - [9]
 

Though, i don't totally agree with them fixing it, i do understand why. It's a blantent loophole that hasnt been patched for a very, very long time...


oh, and it's not rly the "lofty trick" as he didnt figure it out... he just showed everyone how to do it... not nice if you ask me...

Ameliorate
Posted - 2008.05.26 06:45:00 - [10]
 

Not supporting this.

There is no reason why this should remain in the game, other than to grief players who don't know what is going to happen.

CCP want to keep people playing, and getting popped by somebody on your first day and not knowing what is going on is not going to be beneficial to this cause.

(And before anyone says it, no I have not fallen for this).

Frecator Dementa
Caldari
Perkone
Posted - 2008.05.26 08:32:00 - [11]
 

translation: waaaah, waaah, I can't kill mission ravens anymore, waaah, please CCP, let me kill whoever I want in highsec without getting concorded

lofty scam needs to stay dead and burried.
what's the point of ganging up to do missions if all you get is dead?

think of all the npc corp mission runners that will band together to do missions, then decide it's worth creating a corp to ease trasfers of loot

wardec THEM, and shoot them according to valid game mechanics, not some obscure qasi-exploit

Dreadchain
Gallente
Lavateinn
Posted - 2008.05.26 08:38:00 - [12]
 

It is a good change, many times i've had a mission really hard to do alone with no corpmates nearby, but can't find anyone to help because they think it's a lofty. As a reverse, I don't help newbies, because it might be a lofty.

Although, I thought that lofty was pretty hilarious, it reminded me of darwin awards.

Ankhesentapemkah
Gallente
Posted - 2008.05.26 08:47:00 - [13]
 

Not going to support this issue.

It was one of my campaign points to have the lofty scam removed in the first place, as people in any MMO should be able and even encouraged to group up with other players. In Eve, grouping up basically means you lost the rights to your ship. This is unacceptable and has no place in any MMO, not even Eve.

I'm glad this got fixed and will not undertake any action to bring it back.

Frecator Dementa
Caldari
Perkone
Posted - 2008.05.26 10:16:00 - [14]
 

Originally by: Ankhesentapemkah
Not going to support this issue.

It was one of my campaign points to have the lofty scam removed in the first place, as people in any MMO should be able and even encouraged to group up with other players. In Eve, grouping up basically means you lost the rights to your ship. This is unacceptable and has no place in any MMO, not even Eve.

I'm glad this got fixed and will not undertake any action to bring it back.


this

Exodus Alpha
EVE University
Ivy League
Posted - 2008.05.26 11:07:00 - [15]
 

Originally by: Ankhesentapemkah
Not going to support this issue.

It was one of my campaign points to have the lofty scam removed in the first place, as people in any MMO should be able and even encouraged to group up with other players. In Eve, grouping up basically means you lost the rights to your ship. This is unacceptable and has no place in any MMO, not even Eve.

I'm glad this got fixed and will not undertake any action to bring it back.


Scams definitely have their place in Eve.

The lofty scam is not one of them.

/100% agreed

Inanna Zuni
Minmatar
The Causality
Electus Matari
Posted - 2008.05.26 12:01:00 - [16]
 

By definition, a "scam" is something that is wrong and not beneficial to the majority. I cannot support this proposal therefore.

IZ

Dlardrageth
ANZAC ALLIANCE
Posted - 2008.05.26 12:01:00 - [17]
 

Originally by: Ankhesentapemkah
Not going to support this issue.

It was one of my campaign points to have the lofty scam removed in the first place, as people in any MMO should be able and even encouraged to group up with other players. In Eve, grouping up basically means you lost the rights to your ship. This is unacceptable and has no place in any MMO, not even Eve.

I'm glad this got fixed and will not undertake any action to bring it back.


Word!

Of course a total rework of war/gang game mechanics would be a totally different thing. One that does not leave open that many loopholes in the first place but enables still to get a fix on careless/clueless people.Cool

Shanur
Minmatar
Republic Military School
Posted - 2008.05.26 13:49:00 - [18]
 

Originally by: Ruben Rhemus
Indeed I do, Clicky



Fixed.

Cautet
Celestial Apocalypse
Posted - 2008.05.27 21:29:00 - [19]
 

If you want to kill a mission runner, there are better ways to do it.

This ****ed up helping new players, nothing more, nothing less.

Le Skunk
Low Sec Liberators
Chubby Chuppers Chubba Chups
Posted - 2008.05.28 04:42:00 - [20]
 

It always struck me as a bit naughty

SKUNK

Ishina Fel
Caldari
Terra Incognita
Intrepid Crossing
Posted - 2008.05.28 07:48:00 - [21]
 

Less griefplay is always good. If you want to shoot people, get out of highsec.

(Ever noticed the irony of how those who are complaining about this as a form of "cave-in to carebear whines" are all highsec jockeys themselves who want their zero-risk piracy back? Rolling Eyes)

Kivin San
Damage Unlimited Inc
INTERDICTION
Posted - 2008.05.28 12:52:00 - [22]
 

Originally by: Ankhesentapemkah
Not going to support this issue.

It was one of my campaign points to have the lofty scam removed in the first place, as people in any MMO should be able and even encouraged to group up with other players. In Eve, grouping up basically means you lost the rights to your ship. This is unacceptable and has no place in any MMO, not even Eve.

I'm glad this got fixed and will not undertake any action to bring it back.


^
|
o---- This.

Ruben Rhemus
Posted - 2008.05.28 13:04:00 - [23]
 

Originally by: Divad Ginleek
Anyone ever notice how much Pwners cry when CCP fixes loopholes that result from unintended game mechanics... but when rational human beings point out real problems (insurance, login traps, etc) they are flamed and called whiners and get the "welcome to eve" line flashed in their face?
Cool

Originally by: Ishina Fel

(Ever noticed the irony of how those who are complaining about this as a form of "cave-in to carebear whines" are all highsec jockeys themselves who want their zero-risk piracy back? Rolling Eyes)


Ok, just to set the record straight, this thing you claim you notice is actually not true. I have never used the lofty scam myself in any way, I haven't even ever attacked anyone who havent (by their own free will I might add) aggressed me first.
I am simply concerned with the ridiculous amount of CNRs you see in high sec these days, something needs to be done to limit the population. It was bad before and will get worse when this control mechanism is removed.

Allaria Kriss
Minmatar
Native Freshfood
Posted - 2008.05.28 13:44:00 - [24]
 

I suspect most of the CNRs you see are not going to be needing help with missions.

Arous Drephius
Caldari
Caldari Provisions

Posted - 2008.05.28 14:06:00 - [25]
 

High-sec should not be completely safe. This includes the lofty.

Thorradin
State Protectorate
Posted - 2008.05.29 03:11:00 - [26]
 

Originally by: Ruben Rhemus
I just noticed that the lofty "exploit" will be removed with Empyrean age. This obviously mean that the rampaging CNR plague will become even worse!
(ok it will be somewhat cool you can actually respond to people calling for help, but at this cost? I think not)


Considering the lofty scam only works due to a flaw in the gang mechanics, no.

Maybe if they had to fire on you before you leave the gang, but simply joining for a split second and leaving again to make you attackable was no less a flaw than Privateers and EVE Uni's war dec exploits.Confused

Aadi Grox
Perkone
Posted - 2008.05.29 03:41:00 - [27]
 

eat it carebears

Katini Ellegahn
Gallente
The Graduates
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2008.05.29 05:52:00 - [28]
 

R.I.P Good Riddance.

Vlad Cetes
Caldari
H A V O C
Cascade Imminent
Posted - 2008.05.29 05:57:00 - [29]
 

Edited by: Vlad Cetes on 29/05/2008 05:57:17
Lofty is good for making isk. The only people who hate it are either carebears or noobs and no one in their right mind should give 2 cents about their opinions.

Deviana Sevidon
Gallente
Panta-Rhei
Butterfly Effect Alliance
Posted - 2008.05.29 06:09:00 - [30]
 

I am not a carebear and I am certainly not a noob. But it is still a good thing that this gets removed. The scam was the use, or should I say, exploit of a gang-mechanic.

I have never fallen for this kind of trap, but it also resulted in the fact that older players like me became completely unwilling to help out new players outside their own corp and alliance.

Things like the lofty-scam, among other things, are the reasons why the once great community was destroyed and became something that better belongs in a counterstrike-forum.


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