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blankseplocked [Issue] POS: Flogging the Dead Horse Be Recommended for Implementation
 
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Jinx Barker
Caldari
GFB Scientific
Posted - 2009.07.03 17:06:00 - [571]
 

Edited by: Jinx Barker on 03/07/2009 17:07:20
Originally by: Kaylan Jahlar
The CSM already brought this to CCP and they said it was not going to be done. Why do you keep bringing it up?


1) CSM did not really bring it to CCP - there was a lot of double talk from certain CSM - who claimed that they have, when it turned out they devoted less than 5 minutes of time to it, because: "CCP said it was too hard, so we did not even bother discussing it, getting details."

2) CCP never said it was impossible - just that it will take a lot of work. Hence, we want CCP to take time, and do it properly, the way POS should have been done in the first place, not the half-arsed "junk-in-space-ala-deadh-horse."

3) Do some research on what CSM actually did, and you will find that that a discussion on "MUSICAL INSTRUMENTS IN EVE" took place, got approved, while the POS overhaul issue was barely mentioned as the "funky POS idea."

Now, be a good boy, and go conform somewhere else, with the rest of the CSMs who really did diddley-squat about this - longest running request in the history of EVE, yea mate, longest running, longest asked for, longest desired, and completely legitimate, and yet ignored request from the EVE community in the history of EVE.


Support the POS overhaul! Even if the "musical instruments" crowd would want you to give up!



Oam Mkoll
Caldari
Stealth Squad

Posted - 2009.07.03 18:05:00 - [572]
 


Sharp Feather
Gallente
POS Builder Inc.
Silent Requiem
Posted - 2009.07.03 18:24:00 - [573]
 

Shocked

loki gallach
Posted - 2009.07.03 23:09:00 - [574]
 

The lack of progress on this, and the awful state of the pos system as it is. IS THE REASON I'M CLOSING MY ACCOUNTS.

Xenon Barinade
Caldari
Helix Protocol

Posted - 2009.07.04 01:59:00 - [575]
 

Originally by: loki gallach
The lack of progress on this, and the awful state of the pos system as it is. IS THE REASON I'M CLOSING MY ACCOUNTS.


You'll be back

A Sinner
Muppet Factory
Posted - 2009.07.04 10:11:00 - [576]
 

signed

Maxsim Goratiev
Gallente
Imperial Tau Syndicate
POD-SQUAD
Posted - 2009.07.04 11:53:00 - [577]
 

Originally by: Jinx Barker
Edited by: Jinx Barker on 03/07/2009 17:07:20
Originally by: Kaylan Jahlar
The CSM already brought this to CCP and they said it was not going to be done. Why do you keep bringing it up?


1) CSM did not really bring it to CCP - there was a lot of double talk from certain CSM - who claimed that they have, when it turned out they devoted less than 5 minutes of time to it, because: "CCP said it was too hard, so we did not even bother discussing it, getting details."

2) CCP never said it was impossible - just that it will take a lot of work. Hence, we want CCP to take time, and do it properly, the way POS should have been done in the first place, not the half-arsed "junk-in-space-ala-deadh-horse."

3) Do some research on what CSM actually did, and you will find that that a discussion on "MUSICAL INSTRUMENTS IN EVE" took place, got approved, while the POS overhaul issue was barely mentioned as the "funky POS idea."

Now, be a good boy, and go conform somewhere else, with the rest of the CSMs who really did diddley-squat about this - longest running request in the history of EVE, yea mate, longest running, longest asked for, longest desired, and completely legitimate, and yet ignored request from the EVE community in the history of EVE.


Support the POS overhaul! Even if the "musical instruments" crowd would want you to give up!




I loled hard oer this. LOl, you've got a pint and i support.

Syberbolt8
Gallente
The Scope
Posted - 2009.07.06 02:32:00 - [578]
 

/me walks in, picks up stick, hits horse 10x, puts down stick, walks out.

XHolyAvengerX
Caldari
Posted - 2009.07.06 07:25:00 - [579]
 

/signed

Gnulpie
Minmatar
Miner Tech
Posted - 2009.07.06 09:52:00 - [580]
 

yep

Imiarr Timshae
Caldari
Funny Men In Funny Hats
Posted - 2009.07.06 14:15:00 - [581]
 


BeanBagKing
Terra Incognita
Intrepid Crossing
Posted - 2009.07.08 04:50:00 - [582]
 

I support this topic...

I'm pretty new, but it's clear to me that this has been the most supported topic around since before I got here.

CCP, I think most players realize this will take a lot of work and that other things will take a back burner while this gets done. WE STILL WANT IT DONE! Yes, I know that it's not your job to simply do everything the players want a ****-all on game mechanics and backend that we don't have to deal with or give two thoughts about. However, I think it's clear that the support that has been given to this idea deserve at least a days worth of CSM discussion. After which you should devote a dev blog to explaining exactly why you are either a) ignoring what seems to be an overwhelming majority of the player base (at least the ones posting on the forums) or b) exactly how and when you intend on implementing this.

CSM's (except the one who recently said he had words for CCP regarding POS's). We, the players who elected you, DEMAND that you discuss this with CCP. We realize you cannot force them to change anything in the game, but you -should- be forcing this into discussion each and every chance you get to talk with them. It's clearly the most supported idea, 60 pages between this thread and the OP. You didn't get elected to offer the excuses that I've read, you got hired to represent the players. This doesn't mean one 5 minute discussion, this means keep telling CCP, EVERY TIME you meet with them "Hey, the players still really want this, they won't @#[email protected] leave us alone about it, we need to discuss this again." then you can come back here and give us the notes on that meeting so we know your actually doing something to earn that trip to Iceland you apparently get.

To the CSM who said he'd have words for CCP on this a page or two back... Guess we'll have to wait and find out if your actions match your words. Don't disappoint us or we'll never believe you again.

drmurda
R E D E M P T I O N
Black Star Alliance
Posted - 2009.07.08 05:12:00 - [583]
 

Supported

Saladira
Last Stand Bulgs

Posted - 2009.07.08 05:16:00 - [584]
 

/signed

Jint Hikaru
OffWorld Exploration Inc
Posted - 2009.07.08 08:48:00 - [585]
 

Edited by: Jint Hikaru on 08/07/2009 08:47:47
Not going to do anything underhanded like making two posts from my two accounts.

Lets just say I am a 2 account player and I support this.

I really want to see better POSs.

Eskil Erlandsson
Posted - 2009.07.08 11:03:00 - [586]
 

Edited by: Eskil Erlandsson on 08/07/2009 11:03:43
/signed

Darod Zyree
Gallente
Zyree Holding

Posted - 2009.07.08 15:45:00 - [587]
 

Edited by: Darod Zyree on 08/07/2009 15:46:57
./signed

Syberbolt8
Gallente
The Scope
Posted - 2009.07.09 21:10:00 - [588]
 

Originally by: BeanBagKing
I support this topic...

I'm pretty new, but it's clear to me that this has been the most supported topic around since before I got here.

CCP, I think most players realize this will take a lot of work and that other things will take a back burner while this gets done. WE STILL WANT IT DONE! Yes, I know that it's not your job to simply do everything the players want a ****-all on game mechanics and backend that we don't have to deal with or give two thoughts about. However, I think it's clear that the support that has been given to this idea deserve at least a days worth of CSM discussion. After which you should devote a dev blog to explaining exactly why you are either a) ignoring what seems to be an overwhelming majority of the player base (at least the ones posting on the forums) or b) exactly how and when you intend on implementing this.

CSM's (except the one who recently said he had words for CCP regarding POS's). We, the players who elected you, DEMAND that you discuss this with CCP. We realize you cannot force them to change anything in the game, but you -should- be forcing this into discussion each and every chance you get to talk with them. It's clearly the most supported idea, 60 pages between this thread and the OP. You didn't get elected to offer the excuses that I've read, you got hired to represent the players. This doesn't mean one 5 minute discussion, this means keep telling CCP, EVERY TIME you meet with them "Hey, the players still really want this, they won't @#[email protected] leave us alone about it, we need to discuss this again." then you can come back here and give us the notes on that meeting so we know your actually doing something to earn that trip to Iceland you apparently get.

To the CSM who said he'd have words for CCP on this a page or two back... Guess we'll have to wait and find out if your actions match your words. Don't disappoint us or we'll never believe you again.


QTF

I agree with you 100%, CSM needs to take this back to CCP, even if they don't want to, its one of the most supported Idea's in the game.

TasMan HUN
Eveonauts
Posted - 2009.07.09 22:29:00 - [589]
 

/signed

Jinx Barker
Caldari
GFB Scientific
Posted - 2009.07.10 03:18:00 - [590]
 

Edited by: Jinx Barker on 10/07/2009 03:18:17
Originally by: BeanBagKing
I support this topic...

I'm pretty new, but it's clear to me that this has been the most supported topic around since before I got here.

CCP, I think most players realize this will take a lot of work and that other things will take a back burner while this gets done. WE STILL WANT IT DONE! Yes, I know that it's not your job to simply do everything the players want a ****-all on game mechanics and backend that we don't have to deal with or give two thoughts about. However, I think it's clear that the support that has been given to this idea deserve at least a days worth of CSM discussion. After which you should devote a dev blog to explaining exactly why you are either a) ignoring what seems to be an overwhelming majority of the player base (at least the ones posting on the forums) or b) exactly how and when you intend on implementing this.

CSM's (except the one who recently said he had words for CCP regarding POS's). We, the players who elected you, DEMAND that you discuss this with CCP. We realize you cannot force them to change anything in the game, but you -should- be forcing this into discussion each and every chance you get to talk with them. It's clearly the most supported idea, 60 pages between this thread and the OP. You didn't get elected to offer the excuses that I've read, you got hired to represent the players.

This doesn't mean one 5 minute discussion, this means keep telling CCP, EVERY TIME you meet with them "Hey, the players still really want this, they won't @#[email protected] leave us alone about it, we need to discuss this again." then you can come back here and give us the notes on that meeting so we know your actually doing something to earn that trip to Iceland you apparently get.


To the CSM who said he'd have words for CCP on this a page or two back... Guess we'll have to wait and find out if your actions match your words. Don't disappoint us or we'll never believe you again.


Hear hear... CSM so far has done a dismal job on a longest running, and most publicly supported issue in the existence of EVE.

MechaViridis
Amarr
The Program
Vanguard.
Posted - 2009.07.10 04:45:00 - [591]
 

DEOUGH EET...DOEUGH EET NAOOOOOOWWWW!!

Taladool
Minmatar
JIta-Hosting
Posted - 2009.07.11 01:00:00 - [592]
 

Must resist urge to beat dead horse!!, nvm, picks up stick and beats horse.

Jinx Barker
Caldari
GFB Scientific
Posted - 2009.07.11 14:43:00 - [593]
 

CSM - you were elected to represent the players - whatever your own, personal opinion might be on the matters.

As such, I think a thread which has run for 4 (four) years, asking CCP to get onto POS fix deserves to be brought to CCP, whatever the case might be. Furthermore, said 4-year-running request deserves more than 5 minutes of discussion, or silly names like "Funky POS Idea" - and sure as hell it deserves a detailed Dev Blog from CCP.

There is no other thread on this forums that has been as widely supported, and as often asked for, or as LONG RUNNING - as the "Dead Horse POS."


Daffyd Bowie
Posted - 2009.07.11 17:15:00 - [594]
 


Windryder
Posted - 2009.07.11 19:15:00 - [595]
 

Originally by: Syberbolt8
/me walks in, picks up stick, hits horse 10x, puts down stick, walks out.


/me walks in, picks up Syberbolt8's stick, hits horse 10x, puts down stick, walks out.

Then my 2 other accounts too.

Bunzan Cardinal
Ascendent.
Gentlemen's Agreement
Posted - 2009.07.11 22:54:00 - [596]
 

+1 supported

Jinx Barker
Caldari
GFB Scientific
Posted - 2009.07.12 02:41:00 - [597]
 

I am reposting something a former CSM, who supposedly supported the issue has said, and my response to him, in this thread.

Originally by: LaVista Vista
I see a whole lot rabble here.

So here's where we are standing:

CCP can not justify ripping out the whole POS system, to implement it in a modular style. It will take a lot of time, labour and considerable amounts of pain, when the POSes we have on TQ, has to be converted to the new ones.

So a full re-implementation is out of the picture.

CCP did agree to looking into the possibility of using this idea for personal anchor-able structures.

I see a whole lot of "Waah, this isn't good enough, raise this to CCP until they agree entirely.".

But what exactly should CCP say, in order to make you happy? That is pretty unclear.


LV, you have broken promises when you were a CSM on this issue. You tried, but you did not do your utmost, some of it might have been the NDA with which CCP pretty much controls the CSM, some of it may have been the "don't-rock-the boat" attitude you have adopted once CCP told you "NO" after CSM - I would say MISREPRESENTED - the issues community has with the POS. Whatever the case may be, water under the bridge.

Now, to answer the sensible question - since I see you seem to really want to obfuscate the issue - you learn quickly yongin:
"But what exactly should CCP say, in order to make you happy? That is pretty unclear"

1) When CSM brought a 4-year-running, (at the time 3-year-running) issue to CCP they should have presented it as what it was a POS upgrade and overhaul. A comprehensive one. Not a "Funky POS Idea" on which CCP and CSM barely spent any time - as we now know, and were not told at the time.

2) Taking into account the sheer length of time the request has been standing, CSM should have pushed for a comprehensive developer blog on the issue. When we had the massive Q&A session on forums - by CCP Zulupark barely touched it!

To summarize for those who would wish to cover their arse... and say things are not "clear"

A comprehensive developer blog. Taking into account the 4 years worth of discussions on the POS improvement, do not have to take it all in - you know, it might be "too much of work" for CCP and CSM - but most salient points would be enough. A blog that will cover, and show appropriate respect for the community that has been begging and crying for this change to the way POS system currently works.

We do not want the POS to be the "ugly step child" that CCP barely acknowledges. It has been way too many years that this has been going on.

This blog should clearly take into account most supported suggestion, outline a course of action, or course of possible action. It should explain in no uncertain terms the work that will go into implementing the requested changes, and tell the players if CCP actually devoted any time, other than maybe 8 man-hours to the feasibility study on this thing.

Clear enough? Yes/No?

I know the blog would have to be huge, but I am sure CCP Zulupark can manage it.

Bluebeard
Minmatar
LoneStar Industries
Comatose Alliance
Posted - 2009.07.12 13:10:00 - [598]
 

POS are desperately in need of an overhaul

Cookac
Posted - 2009.07.12 15:19:00 - [599]
 

/Signed

Khana Loaris
Seidh Technologies
Posted - 2009.07.12 16:28:00 - [600]
 

OMG - total win idea!

/signed


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