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Dierdra Vaal
Caldari
Veto.
Veto Corp
Posted - 2008.05.21 18:57:00 - [91]
 

hehe I think they accidentally output the alliance ID instead of the name.

:oops:

Venkul Mul
Gallente
Posted - 2008.05.21 19:06:00 - [92]
 

Originally by: Venkul Mul
Originally by: Akita T
Edited by: Akita T on 19/05/2008 08:17:55

Polls, polls ! Let's pay blackjack-a-ballot Twisted Evil
I'm betting.... 38572 votes total !

Not-so-stealth edit : make that non-abstain votes.



I make it 25278.


Quote:
There were 24,651 votes cast out of a pool of 222,422 eligible voters, amassing a turnout of 11.08%. Of the total votes cast, 869 voters (3.5%) chose to abstain.


Sad Would really have preferred to err as too low.

Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
Posted - 2008.05.21 20:02:00 - [93]
 

Edited by: Akita T on 21/05/2008 20:25:43
Originally by: DevBlog
There were 24,651 votes cast out of a pool of 222,422 eligible voters, amassing a turnout of 11.08%. Of the total votes cast, 869 voters (3.5%) chose to abstain.

Dammit Shocked So only 23,782 non-abstain votes Mad

Every last one of us "busted" (went over the total). Dang.
Dissapointing, TBQFH.


P.S.

4. Alexander Kravitz Bane Glorious United States 1536
5. Sean Conover Darius JOHNSON United States 1268

Heh, not even the Goons managed to get all their members to vote for their own candidates.
But they did manage to get two of them in the CSM.
Pity that Goumindong didn't even make it into the "reserves" tho'.

Admiral Nova
Strike Team Nova
Posted - 2008.05.21 20:38:00 - [94]
 

Less than 0.028% of members votes were required to elect a CSM member, I'm not sure what the CSM is representative of, but it doesn't look like it represents the players. The elected members represent less than 5% of accounts total.

Papa Ina
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
Posted - 2008.05.21 20:55:00 - [95]
 

Originally by: Admiral Nova
Less than 0.028% of members votes were required to elect a CSM member, I'm not sure what the CSM is representative of, but it doesn't look like it represents the players. The elected members represent less than 5% of accounts total.

Maybe we should force people to vote?

Fehn Gamin
Minmatar
Pator Tech School
Posted - 2008.05.21 20:59:00 - [96]
 

Waiting for opinion polls to feed CSM debates... I would also like to see opinion totals correlated with age of player account, and other metrics to see what part of player base is represented and is contributing their opinions.


Adonis 4174
Posted - 2008.05.21 21:07:00 - [97]
 

I would expect more votes next time around if this lot perform reasonably well.

A lot of people don't think it matters.

Inanna Zuni
Minmatar
The Causality
Electus Matari
Posted - 2008.05.21 21:18:00 - [98]
 

Originally by: Admiral Nova
Less than 0.028% of members votes were required to elect a CSM member, I'm not sure what the CSM is representative of, but it doesn't look like it represents the players. The elected members represent less than 5% of accounts total.


This is like in *every* election; those who make the effort to vote will select on behalf of those who don't. In the case of the CSM there was over 14 days in which someone could have spent less than a minute making two mouse clicks to choose their preferred candidate. That they did not is a sad reflection on the pod pilot masses but not something which demeans the mandate of those elected.

Originally by: Fehn Gamin
s to see what part of player base is represented and is contributing their opinions.


So far as I and other elected members I have spoken with so far are concerned, we are representing all of the player base there is no delegated decision-making here; we set out to serve all players whether they voted for us, for someone else, or not at all, and serve all pod pilots is exactly what we will be doing.

And to those unsuccessful this time around, the first council serves for six months - your time will come!

Thank you again to all pilots who voted in these elections, let's make it work ...

IZ


Kayscha
Posted - 2008.05.21 21:27:00 - [99]
 

Edited by: Kayscha on 21/05/2008 21:49:26
Funny to consider: if I had registered 800 trial accounts some six weeks ago, going on to pay subscription for each one of them for 1 month for a toal of slightly beyond a thousand bucks, I could have elected myself including a free trip to iceland and accomodation. I doubt I could have gotten a cheaper deal to visit the island anywhere else ;)

Edit: Oops - I miscalculated that a bit. *is embarassed* Still, for some EVE players, this is pocket change. Hmmm...

Proteus Doctorow
Gallente
University of Caille
Posted - 2008.05.21 21:31:00 - [100]
 

I'm very happy to see my elected rep, Inanna Zuni, win a position on the council. Congrats to the rest as well. This is only the beginning!

Pizi
Gallente
Posted - 2008.05.21 21:45:00 - [101]
 

Originally by: Kayscha
Funny to consider: if I had registered 800 trial accounts some six weeks ago, going on to pay subscription for each one of them for 1 month for a toal of slightly beyond a thousand bucks, I could have elected myself including a free trip to iceland and accomodation. I doubt I could have gotten a cheaper deal to visit the island anywhere else ;)


lol 800x 10 = 8k

i think you can get way cheaper to icland

Admiral Nova
Strike Team Nova
Posted - 2008.05.21 22:03:00 - [102]
 

Edited by: Admiral Nova on 21/05/2008 22:06:38
Originally by: Papa Ina
Maybe we should force people to vote?


Works in many countries. Even without that, if they had a preferential system the council would represent the 10% that voted instead of the 5% that voted for them.

Adonis 4174
Posted - 2008.05.21 22:18:00 - [103]
 

Originally by: Pizi
Originally by: Kayscha
Funny to consider: if I had registered 800 trial accounts some six weeks ago, going on to pay subscription for each one of them for 1 month for a toal of slightly beyond a thousand bucks, I could have elected myself including a free trip to iceland and accomodation. I doubt I could have gotten a cheaper deal to visit the island anywhere else ;)


lol 800x 10 = 8k

i think you can get way cheaper to icland


Plus it would probably be 16K since the system specified you had to have had a paid account for more than 30 days.

Daraasi
Amarr
PIE Inc.
Posted - 2008.05.21 22:32:00 - [104]
 

We should have seen such a low voter turn out coming.

When i encouraged local to get out and vote i mostly got people going "vote in what?" and "how do i vote" even though its on the front page !

Maybe eve players arnt as bright as we like to think.

Kelsin
Dirt Dog Trading Company
Posted - 2008.05.21 22:59:00 - [105]
 

Originally by: Daraasi
We should have seen such a low voter turn out coming.

When i encouraged local to get out and vote i mostly got people going "vote in what?" and "how do i vote" even though its on the front page !

Maybe eve players arnt as bright as we like to think.


It would be interesting if players could vote in-game as well - the participation would surely be much higher.

Lumen Atra
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
Posted - 2008.05.22 00:03:00 - [106]
 

Edited by: Lumen Atra on 22/05/2008 00:06:43
Edited by: Lumen Atra on 22/05/2008 00:06:22
Edited by: Lumen Atra on 22/05/2008 00:05:01
Most players of ANY game simply play the game. They don't visit the website beyond what is necessary (and there is no necessity to visit with automatic payments) and most players do not read the forums. Any game.

To think, however, that just because only 11% of people voted means that the majority of the eve population won't be represented is naive. Each representative is connected to a large player base (voters and nonvoters) and, through the grapevine effect, reach towards a general consensus. It is not perfect, but it is hardly bad representation. In any government, it is completely possible that the people elected are only going to work towards their own goals. This is a very pessimistic view, however, and I honestly would not encourage that - although as time goes on, faith in humanity is dropping.

And to the person that essentially said representatives in any government is simply about making money and that polling the populace is better - you're an idiot. Governments are never about what the individuals want. They are about groups of people and attempting to do what will benefit the group. It just so happens that people want those benefits to extend to each individual which usually is the case.

Because people are people, not everybody is going to even be heard. The way people get heard is by becoming a group with similar ideas! If you cannot understand this basic concept, you shouldn't be voting anyway. I'd rather a small sect of educated voters putting people into office than a large sect of uneducated voters. If you want uneducated voters to vote, you would do almost as well to just let a random number generator pick.

On CCPs part, they should have had something in game to place votes. Login screen with a voting panel with the list of candidates (randomized order for each person) that gives basic information and a radio button for voting.

Erotic Irony
0bsession
Posted - 2008.05.22 01:36:00 - [107]
 

Originally by: Lumen Atra
And to the person that essentially said representatives in any government is simply about making money and that polling the populace is better - you're an idiot.


The language of the whole thing was quite misleading given how virtually all the candidates save for darius and one or two others touted themselves as partisans set to preserve x program or y clientele rather than demonstrating their interpretive approach to what Eve was and how to imagine its deficiencies. They really shouldn't have called them candidates in the electoral sense, they are something closer to conflated pollsters than electoral or political agents.

In any event how could you realistically evaluate one candidate from another, based on their forum presence, how they characterized themselves?

All in all, a curious experiment.

Jade Constantine
Gallente
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
Posted - 2008.05.22 01:38:00 - [108]
 

Originally by: Kelsin
Originally by: Daraasi
We should have seen such a low voter turn out coming.

When i encouraged local to get out and vote i mostly got people going "vote in what?" and "how do i vote" even though its on the front page !

Maybe eve players arnt as bright as we like to think.


It would be interesting if players could vote in-game as well - the participation would surely be much higher.


Yeah have to admit, I'd have preferred that option too - anything to increase participation would have been a good thing.

Poreuomai
Minmatar
Mirkur Draug'Tyr
Ushra'Khan
Posted - 2008.05.22 10:35:00 - [109]
 

Edited by: Poreuomai on 22/05/2008 10:37:08

Congrats to all who got elected to the CSM. May the voices of the player base be heard.

Originally by: Lumen Atra
I'd rather a small sect of educated voters putting people into office than a large sect of uneducated voters.

Are you serious? That would be bad news for democracy in general. Shocked

LaVista Vista
Conservative Shenanigans Party
Posted - 2008.05.22 10:37:00 - [110]
 

Originally by: Poreuomai
Originally by: Lumen Atra
I'd rather a small sect of educated voters putting people into office than a large sect of uneducated voters.

Are you serious? That would be bad new for democracy in general. Shocked

Besides the fact that it would become an elitist system, I don't agree really.

Children(Not saying EvE players are kids, there's some very intelligent people in this game) don't know what's good for them.

Waterfowl Democracy
The Ministry of Indigenous Affairs
GoonSwarm
Posted - 2008.05.22 10:50:00 - [111]
 

Edited by: Waterfowl Democracy on 22/05/2008 10:55:49
Perhaps more Americans voted than Europeans because democracy is an American concept that was only later exported to the backwards Europeans. Europeans just don't have the grasp of democracy that Americans do. Their national elections are also run in an inferior way as any observer can see when comparing the American electoral system (with the Electoral Colleges and a bipartisan system) to the sub optimal multi party systems of the old world.

Poreuomai
Minmatar
Mirkur Draug'Tyr
Ushra'Khan
Posted - 2008.05.22 10:52:00 - [112]
 

Originally by: LaVista Vista
... it would become an elitist system ...

Well exactly.

The whole point of democracy is that the general population is in control.

Bael Thazor
Amarr
Posted - 2008.05.22 11:26:00 - [113]
 

Originally by: Avalira
Edited by: Avalira on 20/05/2008 16:16:34
Just got an email from CCP, the results can be seen here:

http://www.eve-online.com/CSM/results.asp

Note: the above won't work for those with the Firefox linkification plugin.

Edit: If the above link does't work you can get it here:
http://go-dl1.eve-files.com/media/corp/results.jpg



Anyone else get owned by that?

Sanche Tehkeli
Gallente
Bionesis Technologies
Electus Matari
Posted - 2008.05.22 11:35:00 - [114]
 

Edited by: Sanche Tehkeli on 22/05/2008 11:36:56
Originally by: Lumen Atra
Edited by: Lumen Atra on 22/05/2008 00:06:43
Edited by: Lumen Atra on 22/05/2008 00:06:22
Edited by: Lumen Atra on 22/05/2008 00:05:01
Most players of ANY game simply play the game. They don't visit the website beyond what is necessary (and there is no necessity to visit with automatic payments) and most players do not read the forums. Any game.

To think, however, that just because only 11% of people voted means that the majority of the eve population won't be represented is naive. Each representative is connected to a large player base (voters and nonvoters) and, through the grapevine effect, reach towards a general consensus. It is not perfect, but it is hardly bad representation. In any government, it is completely possible that the people elected are only going to work towards their own goals. This is a very pessimistic view, however, and I honestly would not encourage that - although as time goes on, faith in humanity is dropping.

And to the person that essentially said representatives in any government is simply about making money and that polling the populace is better - you're an idiot. Governments are never about what the individuals want. They are about groups of people and attempting to do what will benefit the group. It just so happens that people want those benefits to extend to each individual which usually is the case.

Because people are people, not everybody is going to even be heard. The way people get heard is by becoming a group with similar ideas! If you cannot understand this basic concept, you shouldn't be voting anyway. I'd rather a small sect of educated voters putting people into office than a large sect of uneducated voters. If you want uneducated voters to vote, you would do almost as well to just let a random number generator pick.

On CCPs part, they should have had something in game to place votes. Login screen with a voting panel with the list of candidates (randomized order for each person) that gives basic information and a radio button for voting.


Oh God, I truly follow you on this point. This is well told, I should lift up a bit the bad standing towards GS.

Grey Shadow
KIA Corp
KIA Alliance
Posted - 2008.05.23 09:08:00 - [115]
 

Big time grats to all you successful CSM candidates. I'm hoping you can all make this work in our favour.

Any idea if we'll get a full breakdown of the results?

My e-mail got me a "thanks - but no thanks" with no details of votes beyond those successful.


Andy

Thirzarr
Posted - 2008.05.23 13:26:00 - [116]
 


Jade Constantine
Gallente
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
Posted - 2008.05.23 13:29:00 - [117]
 

Originally by: Grey Shadow
Big time grats to all you successful CSM candidates. I'm hoping you can all make this work in our favour.


Thank you Grey, we'll do our best to make this Inaugural CSM all it can be and leave it in superb shape for the next bunch! Good luck next time Very Happy



Rodj Blake
Amarr
PIE Inc.
Posted - 2008.05.23 13:53:00 - [118]
 

Originally by: Waterfowl Democracy
Edited by: Waterfowl Democracy on 22/05/2008 10:55:49
Perhaps more Americans voted than Europeans because democracy is an American concept that was only later exported to the backwards Europeans. Europeans just don't have the grasp of democracy that Americans do. Their national elections are also run in an inferior way as any observer can see when comparing the American electoral system (with the Electoral Colleges and a bipartisan system) to the sub optimal multi party systems of the old world.


It took me a few seconds to realise you were being sarcastic.


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