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Helison
Gallente
Times of Ancar
Posted - 2008.01.28 12:02:00 - [61]
 

Edited by: Helison on 28/01/2008 12:02:42
Some great ideas around here and I hope that CCP can realize the best ones.

A few thoughts by me:

*) Boost the survey scanner: I want to see that the survey scanner is nearly as important as the mining laser. As first step it needs a much higher working distance (50-100km). As second step we need something to scan for (see next points).

*) Reduce number of asteroids per belt, but increase yield of each roid.

*) Make each roid a conglomerate of several ore-types, which can be targeted specifically. So each roid needs a set of ore amounts. With noob mining lasers you will get a normal amount of low ores and very small traces of the high ores. With specialised mining lasers you can target specific ores for increasing your income.

*) Roids get a structure-variable, which is compared to the volume of the whole roid. If a roid gets mined, both numbers go down. With special-ore mining the structure variable goes down much faster and if you don´t react fast enough the roid breaks apart or even explodes (and damages your ship).
At some time each roid crumbles, so you are NOT able to extract all the ore.

*) For controlling all of this aspects you might have to improve the UI, I would suggest using the roid-scanner window and adding here the additional features.
I might also be interesting to add a basic survey-scanner to each ship, but you need to fit a survey-scanner to be able to mine the high-value-ores.

*) Roids don´t grow, but are only respawned as full roids.

*) Remove the current +5 and +10% ores and add +50% and +100% oretypes. (Just changing might be abused).

I know that this is much more work than just adding new roid-types. But I think that this might improve the mining-process much.

kurikymoko yasai
Posted - 2008.01.28 12:03:00 - [62]
 

Okay Carebear mining dream on ugh

Mining inside asteroids/planetoids

First of all, in 0.0 you see lots and lots of huge vedlspar roids and some roids in missions are hollow. What about being able to go inside big asteroids or planetoids and being able to mine the rich picking inside it. So we could have a onion kinda of structure with the best stuff inside the roids and being able to scan for holes inside the roid to directly go there and mine the best stuff. Also it would mean that the hostiles would need to try to spot the hole before getting to you and it would be very hard to do. This idea would also annoy macrominers since they may have trouble navigating inside the roids. Another added benefit, it would appeal to the eve economy since all regions would have load of veldspar crusted roids but only the 0.0 low sec one would have decent hollowed roids.




Mining affecting you


Roids should have an effect on ships and really you need to add environment to belts. Let me explain, atm the miners have very little ways to protect themselves from pirates. Now make it that roids emit ecm burst radiation, damage shields, reduce scan resolution and that miners ships have specific shielding technology against it. It gives them an edge compared to the pirates. sure the pirates can compensate for it but they gimp their ships setup. Give miners ships a fighting chance to survive an hostile encounter so that for example while mining and being attacked the roid emit an ecm burst, the attacking ship is jammed while the minner can escape. Imagine many mining ships and having lot of different effects being applied to the attacking ships while the mining ships are not affected. It would also give a role to transport ships (the non blockade runenr version) who also enjoy the specific shielding technology.

Miners roids sculpting technology....

Miners should be able to sculpt roids with specific technology so that on scanner roids look like mining ship. Think of it as a roids pirate fool technology. The pirate land on a belt with fakes and real mining ship..... have fun spotting the real one in the split of a second


Mining reliability and you

Adding some spice to mining is nice like maybe encovering a locked can that need to be hacked while mining but yet again the main advantage of mining over other profit making adventure is the fact that it is quite reliable source of income. Indeed, if you have a full belt of roids, you know that you will mine x amount per minutes. Maybe allow the mining lasers to overheat slowly so that there is a chance to recover nicer ore....

Mining growing on you

Atm the only mining variable is the amount mined per minute. You really need to add skills to increase the quality of the stuff mined so instead of having the different mining ores, the skills of the miners determine the quality of the ore. So not only do you mine faster but also better with skills and you don't end up with having veldspar only belt and having the best veldspar roids gone.






I like the new ores, the ore vein , miners fool ideas....

Basically, mining should enjoy some of the same benefit of other professions such as chance for rich picking ..... Let spice it up.

Halycon Gamma
Caldari
The Flying Tigers
United Front Alliance
Posted - 2008.01.28 12:06:00 - [63]
 

I've wanted this one for awhile now...

Mini Moon.. Think big, really big.. a couple hundred km diameter big. Now imagine its riddled with a cave system, different ores are shot through the entire thing in clusters, and the largest thing you can fly into it with room to navigate easily is a frigate. With the sort of space I'm talking you could drop five to six 20-30-40km diameter caverns inside it, and have rats ambush you while your trying to get around, battles taking place inside the asteroid. Make it a huge maze, I want to get lost inside this thing my first few trips through. The payoff is, along with all sorts of ores inside of it, you can also mine tech 2 materials, buuuut.. only as much as a frigate will hold, haulers can't get in. You can pocket the outside of the thing with normal garden variety boring ore, but if you want the good stuff, you have to fly inside. There are a lot of engineering tasks to make it possible.. like drop scan range of everyone near one to 5-6km for being able to find anything(signal interference from being near such a huge unstable object)... won't see ships inside, they can't see you, and more importantly, won't be shot 40km through the asteroid by rats, would also make it more interesting, wouldn't ever know exactly what is coming up. Ideally though, its a mining op on its own. You'd need mining ships outside to mine its shell normally, mining frigates to get the good stuff inside, then a screening force outside to kill the pirates who randomly spawn(did I mention I want it controlled by pirates, in battleships or larger if possible), and a frigate screening force to run sweeps through the interior to kill randomly spawning pirates there too, even frigates with large cargo holds to try and keep up with the mining on the interior. I'm thinking 20-30man gang minimum just to mine this behemoth safely, or a few very very brave souls who just want to mine the interior and get out.

CCP Chronotis

Posted - 2008.01.28 12:07:00 - [64]
 

Originally by: Dalen III
Just to clarify you aren't saying these belts are instance type dungeons? If you are this is pretty huge.


They would be a new type of dungeon(s) which unlike current dungeons which have static contents would have the same variable contents you get in belts currently (ores and entities). The idea is currently to avoid too much upheaval to have the current system belts morphed to static new belts so the resources per system remain relatively unchanged when it comes to belts per system.

Though Just like Zarch suggests, we can have different types of belts similar to now with a grading between celestial beacon belts -> onboard scanner belts -> hidden exploration belts which establish baseline activity and then scaling difficulty and reward for those more elusive environments.

The great thing about using the content authoring system is the range of environments and scenarios which are possible like some of you suggested which could be NPC Mining outposts and radioactive clouds making much more difficult and interesting environments to mine or chase NPCs in and yes it does allow us to think about those comets we occasionally mention :)

Matthew, I agree entirely but only to the point where we have the balance between logistical value and economic value. The ability to source larger quantities of tritanium in lower sec space has a logistic value attached to it which does not mean it has to perfectly weigh pound for pound with megacyte in per hour income. Though the yields however that may be determined would be much larger than current as I do agree that there is no reason why we live in a tritanium limited universe and our aim has always been to balance that as best can be done alongside any additional possible changes to asteroid distribution across regions.

Whilst delivering new minerals with ores, is a whole different proverbial 'kettle of fish'. The idea batting around is that the special types of ores might reprocess to a new mineral which needs further reaction to regular tritanium or other minerals as one example alongside higher yield current ores. Again though this is all speculative thinking so far.

Adrielle Firewalker
Minmatar
Amarr Will Eat Itself
Posted - 2008.01.28 12:26:00 - [65]
 

I endorse this blog Cool

And I'll have a think Smile

gordon861
Minmatar
PROGENITOR CORPORATION
Intrepid Crossing
Posted - 2008.01.28 12:36:00 - [66]
 

Can we have some scripts for our Strip Miners ?

It would be good to be able to adjust the cycle time from 3mins to 1min when working on smaller rocks. Or just have the cycle end early when you've mined all the ore from a rock.

Clansworth
Good Rock Materials
Posted - 2008.01.28 12:44:00 - [67]
 

I like the idea of removing asteroid types, and giving each roid a composite makeup. For Instance, in high sec, you could find a roid that is 85% veldspar, with 10% scordite, and say 5% omber. When mining, you get a proportional mix of the minerals, so if you mined from this given roid, and had a 1000m³/cycle miner, you'd get 850m³ veld/cycle, 100m³ scord/cycle, and 50m³ omber/cycle. This would be scewed by using the proper crystal, which would help to filter out the non-desired ores, to get to the preferred type, thus boosting yield of the preferred type. So using an omber crystal on the above roid, you might end up getting 400m³ veld, 40m³ scord, and 200m³ omber. This would of course, lower the percentage of omber left in the roid, so you could mine out the omber before the roid is gone.

Survey scanner would need the overhaul to display the roid makeup. Also, for simplicity of display, the multiple ore grades should go away (which shouldn't have been there in the first place, as they just complicate things).

I have more detailed information (which of course, isn't balanced) in an older mining overhaul thread. My posts about this are here: http://myeve.eve-online.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=579110&page=3#83

Clansworth
Good Rock Materials
Posted - 2008.01.28 12:48:00 - [68]
 

Originally by: gordon861
Can we have some scripts for our Strip Miners ?

It would be good to be able to adjust the cycle time from 3mins to 1min when working on smaller rocks. Or just have the cycle end early when you've mined all the ore from a rock.


I don't see this happening, as the crystals are already loaded to the modules, I don't think they have the capability to load a module with multiple ammo types (scripts load as ammo). Also, the 3 minute cycle time was done to reduce database entries, so I doubt they will be changing it.

Popychacz
Constructive Influence
Posted - 2008.01.28 12:54:00 - [69]
 

Originally by: CCP Chronotis
Matthew, I agree entirely but only to the point where we have the balance between logistical value and economic value. The ability to source larger quantities of tritanium in lower sec space has a logistic value attached to it which does not mean it has to perfectly weigh pound for pound with megacyte in per hour income.



It's the other way around - trit has negative logistic value, since moving it back to Jita to sell is ****load of pain compared to high ends.

So, if you made 0.0 trit moar effective moneymaker than 0.0 mega, people would still dig up arknor because it doesn't require bloody freighter op to ship it back and cash in.

Matthew
Caldari
BloodStar Technologies
Posted - 2008.01.28 13:14:00 - [70]
 

Originally by: CCP Chronotis
Matthew, I agree entirely but only to the point where we have the balance between logistical value and economic value. The ability to source larger quantities of tritanium in lower sec space has a logistic value attached to it which does not mean it has to perfectly weigh pound for pound with megacyte in per hour income.


True, I hadn't considered that. And by keeping 0.0 trit sources slightly behind the risk vs reward curve, it encourages 0.0 to only produce the trit it needs itself, while still making it more attractive than the haul from empire. Otherwise there's potential for attracting too much mining capacity out of empire, and having the trit hauled into empire rather than out of it.

Though I guess you'd already figured that out Wink

Originally by: gordon861
Can we have some scripts for our Strip Miners ?

It would be good to be able to adjust the cycle time from 3mins to 1min when working on smaller rocks. Or just have the cycle end early when you've mined all the ore from a rock.


While I can't see this happening (dual-ammo need for script+crystal), it should be possible to get the client to simulate the known effects of your mining (though probably not the effects of other people mining your roid).

I'd envisage this happening in conjunction with the survey scanner, so that the client calculates how much you have mined out of each roid since the last survey scan cycle (as this would be a client-side estimation, there would be no server-load issue with updating this estimation in real-time rather than waiting for a cycle to end), which would help you better gauge when to manually shut down your lasers.

I'd be less inclined to have the laser stop automatically, simply because it adds another bit of afk-ness to mining, when well-timed cycles should be an advantage of you paying attention.

Deviana Sevidon
Gallente
Panta-Rhei
Butterfly Effect Alliance
Posted - 2008.01.28 13:23:00 - [71]
 

Some ideas:
I do not think that a super-fast mining ship should be needed to catch a Comet. Every celestial object moves with some speed, even the planets and moons. For technical reasons, these objects are static in their position and a system for different static positions could be used to simulate a moving comet and make it even mineable.

A Comet is scanned and a Mining ship moves there to begin with the Mining ops. The comet only spawns when it is scanned out and despawns, as soon as the last ship leaves the grid, the comet despawns. If another miner wants to find the comet he needs to scan again, only to find it into a grid that is a few thousand kilometers away from the grid, the comet had been before. Also the comets possible positions move along an elliptical course that will give experienced miners a chance to predict the most likely positions, of the comet in advanced, making it easier to find again.

Super large Asteroids, that can be found in Exploration sites in Lowaec and 0.0. Create Asteroids the size of a small moon but when you want to mine them, there is a problem. The super-size roids, have a hard shell of useless materials, that cannot being mined with normal Mining Lasers. But they have a dense core of very valuable materials. To get to the core of the super roid, should be several ways.

- Blow up the Asteroid. Yes, assemble Gang of Battleships or something else with weapons and fire on the damn thing, until the shell cracks. Afterwards, valuable chunks of materials, can be extracted with normal Mining Lasers. But doing so is risky. Using weapons on the Asteroid, might also open up pockets of volatile Gas, that damages ships or even pollutes the whole area, so it is impossible to mine the core material without a strong tank.

- Set up a Mining Base. Like a small POS but without shields, or weapons and everything else you expect from a POS. The Mining Base extracts ore from the Roid, but is defenseless, takes possibly days to do the job and can be attacked or destroyed by pirates who find these roids. But this is still the slow and relative save approach, compared to the above method

- There can be also combinations of these things. For example you might find the Asteroid, but it is already occupied by a Serpentis Mining OP, so to get to the Ore you will have to drive the NPC off.

- There could be other things to be found inside the Asteroid. The core turns out, not to be of valuable materials, but rather a giant rogue drone, that was constructed inside the roid and breaks free when the super roid is opened. Or instead of ore, your miners find inside the Asteroid a cache of Ancient Artifacts of Yan Yung or, Talocan or Sleeper Origin.

Sorry for the wall of text.ugh

Erica chez
Amarr
Black Thorne Corporation
Elemental Fusion
Posted - 2008.01.28 13:30:00 - [72]
 

My view was that to improve mining you could adjust the environment.

Having asteroid belts located near to the sun in a system, or on the outskirts of the system would require adjustment to ship fitting, perhaps in rigging, shielding from extreme heat or the cold of being on the outer rim of a system, extend that with gas clouds or other volatile areas of operation.

Perhaps solar winds would damage the ship on a continuing process and shields would be required to be on, specialised solar wind shielding would help. So you could get very high yield of a specific ore over a short time and have to keep your ship up to scratch, to encourage team work you could have a solar wind repair system. degrade over time panelling.

Perhaps gravitational areas with ore that generally rips the ship apart gradually, high yield high expense ore, takes a toll on your ship

Luke Lamarr
Beyond Divinity Inc
Posted - 2008.01.28 13:56:00 - [73]
 

I think the idea is nice, but I fear that finding targets in belts or pvping/pirating around systems will be nerfed. lowsec is already underpopulated imo, so adding an extra difficulty/delay in locating targets will deliver yet another blow to piracy (but we owe you thanks for the heavy dictors Twisted Evil)

So my two hopes are that this will bring more players to lowsec systems (I'll be drastic, and suggest that you remove about everything but veldspar from high-sec systems... should kill macros, and get people to try and defend their lowsec pockets) and still allow us to easily locate (using directionnal scanner) targets in belts (mebbe we could 'warp to' a belt showing up on directionnal scanner by right-clicking it when there's a ship at said belt?)

-Luke

Landarian
EVE University
Ivy League
Posted - 2008.01.28 14:31:00 - [74]
 

I won't speculate on how things will be changed but in the spirit of the great roman conquerors, I will give you this warning: Remember thou art mortal :)

Oh wait, that's not what I really meant. The real warning is: Remember, this is a GAME. The more you make it a JOB, the less appealing you will be to the casual gamer.

I'm not suggesting that you take special pains for carebears or anything .. just that the more complex and Pain In The A$$ you make it, the less mining that will occur.

Also, to those that really hate the macro-mining people: macro-miners are your best source of ICE product for POS fuel. Mining ICE is a huge PITA which is why so few players do it and leave it to the macro-miners. Personally, I'm all for leaving the ice to the macro-miners but the point here is that the more complex you make regular mining, don't think it'll get rid of the macro-miners; it might actually help them out, since they'll be the only ones willing to mine.

CCP Chronotis

Posted - 2008.01.28 14:33:00 - [75]
 

Originally by: Deviana Sevidon


- Set up a Mining Base. Like a small POS but without shields, or weapons and everything else you expect from a POS. The Mining Base extracts ore from the Roid, but is defenseless, takes possibly days to do the job and can be attacked or destroyed by pirates who find these roids. But this is still the slow and relative save approach, compared to the above method



this is slightly off topic but there are similar ideas batting around internally under the topic of 'remote structures'. We cannot promise anything on those other than we are looking into them as one possible future idea.

Please keep the ideas coming :)

Dontlike light
Posted - 2008.01.28 14:41:00 - [76]
 

Edited by: Dontlike light on 28/01/2008 15:04:54

My idea is about roids, crystals and a new bpo.

1) new roids could be a mix of existing roids (example: arkonor+bistot = biskonor but arkonor in overview) with different % of each (example 66% of arkonor 33% bistot but 50-50 and 33-66 exist) and only a special scanner can tell you the % of each

2) new crystals that fit the % of roid, created with a new bpo (example 66-33 biskonor need the 'mix bpo', (66%=) two arkonor mining crystal, (33%=) one bistot mining crystal and a little bit of glue)

3) damage taken + heat, if the mining crystal is different from the roid, you take heat of the strip miner II (T1 strip miner can't mine this new type of roid) and damage on your ship.(example using a bistot mining crystal on 66-33 biskonor and you take 66% of the full damage done with biskonor, 33% if it's a 33-66 roid. Of course biskonor is the best new roid so the damage are very high)

of course bonus of yield or refine (new skills)

Zutroy
Posted - 2008.01.28 14:55:00 - [77]
 

- Remove asteroids from the overview entirely, and only targetable through asteroid scanner. Or, they only appear in overview with a generic "mineable asteroid" tag, and composition is only known through scanner.

- The rare chance of finding a higher end ore in an empire belt. Not enough to disrupt the economy, but enough to be a nice reward for the lucky carebear.

PorlyP
Gallente
Revenent Defence Corperation
The Omni Federation
Posted - 2008.01.28 14:56:00 - [78]
 

Phase Shifting Asteroids

These rocks would shift in and out of game, so not only would this mean you could implement some kind of dimensional asteroid "harness" to keep it in game, but you could also foil the macro miners who do nothing and get paid loads for it.

Asteroid movement

When you mine out a roid, it just disappears, how about if it just fragmented or an explosion type effect that affected the belt itself, pushing the surrounding roids around a little? This again would call for some kind of anchoring, be it a "magnet" style attractor mountable in a non-high slot, or something to actually affect the way roids "finish" once mined out. Change their colour and crystallize, for example?

Changable Roid State

Following on from the above, imagine if the roid was to change state into another form that could be mined, but only by the high end miners, and more specifically, by those who mined them out? That way people wouldn't be able to steal the "new" roids from people who've spent all the time mining them. I think this could not only move to a further mining skill track, or science requirement, but woul mean that those who devote themselves to minig would actually reap a little more reward.

Dummy/hollow Asteroids

Again, a level of depth to a roid could be an idea, so that the surveying skill could be re-jigged to improve the depth of a scan on a roid. Now, this would then mean that it's riskier for the ships that aren't miners to randomly mine a roid, as it could well be a dummy roid, containing any kind of npcs be it drones, or whatever, that try and suprise attack you. Perhaps that would be an element of risk whether you're a seasoned miner or a newbie.

There so many great ideas on here so far from people, I hope mine are thought of in a good way...

Montaire
Krusual Developments
Posted - 2008.01.28 15:00:00 - [79]
 

Okay C, sorry to have wandered so off topic.

Given the limitations of what you are talking about I really think that "Jawbreaker" asteroids are the way to go. Peel off the outer layer of Veld to find out whats below - could be anything.

Also can you trigger an event when an asteroid is depleted? If so, perhaps we could find these new asteroid fields by tap'ing regular asteroids. "You find traces of radiation at the asteroids core that indicate it splintered off a much larger mass. Astrometrics indicate this mass may be at xxxxx coordinates"

Spawn Mechanics : Can you make asteroids that spawn and despawn in a chaotic fashion? If so this would be a nice "Meteor Shower" area to go into.

Overall I like the idea of "Hazardous Mining" or perhaps "Eventful Mining" is a better way to say it. Let mining "Escalate" over time and also give us an incentive and a big benefit to have a HUUUGE mining op. I would like to see Goons in a belt with 400 bantams. Spawn some of these sites with GARGANTUAN amounts of resources. Its 0.0, trit shouldnt be a problem.

Finally - I cant tell you how much I want BIGGER asteroid fields. I want to be able to have a 1,000 km square asteroid field, I really want to be in the damned middle and be coliding with asteroids left right and center. Make some of these static's very very large.

Miyamoto Shigesuke
Jugis Modo Utopia
THE KLINGONS
Posted - 2008.01.28 15:01:00 - [80]
 

You should rework the mining process itself. Make it less boring, and not so easy to macro, like a pattern matching puzzle.

Nifel
PAX Technologies
Posted - 2008.01.28 15:04:00 - [81]
 

Any chance the different ores would produce different build-results? Like say... tritanium of type super-duper-ultra-high density gives a flat 10% increase in resists on hull (or armor) while adding substansial mass as well as worsening the agility of the ship.

PorlyP
Gallente
Revenent Defence Corperation
The Omni Federation
Posted - 2008.01.28 15:11:00 - [82]
 

Edited by: PorlyP on 28/01/2008 15:12:31
I think one of the CCP peeps mentioned a reactive, chemistry type manipulation of minerals being a possibility? This would be great, as then the science skills would have a little more room for use.

I mean, in the same way you use a datacore for invention, imagine a similar process for asteroid alchemy? You could have a system of processes and minerals that react together creating something entrirely new, but all the time usable, and of diffetent value. Of course, unstable and dangerous reactions could occur, resulting in ship damage or whatever.

This way, again, there would only be a few ways to make tons of ISK, but you'd have to work it out, and put the initial effort in.

With 8 minerals, and possible new ones, you'd only need 3 other factors to have a massive amount of possibilities in what could be produced. This information could be valuable to the point that espionage could be rife. Again, though, having the process bound to a certain high level of skill would help.

In a way I'm kinda bummed that now I have my hulk, I can't really take to exploring solo, as in 0.0 it's all about danger of death from pirates and rats, how about giving the solo player something that they can spend a lot of time on, which is arguably as valuable as replacing a blown up ship.

Thanks for your time :)

manasi
Caldari
Ceptacemia
-Mostly Harmless-
Posted - 2008.01.28 15:13:00 - [83]
 

I think making the belts move(orbit) would help with macro miners that warp to their can and just dump ore into 500 cans anchored at the belt location. Not only that but orbital belts could be made to orbit at a slow rate so that you could actually mine a given belts for a number of hours without having to anchor and un-anchor everything.

The idea that belts would be in orbit would certainly add some change albeit modest one.

The other idea is yes adding combination of hi yield ores in both HI sec and low sec mining. The last time I low sec mined was 2003 as you need a substantial guarding force "just inn case".

There needs to be a little bit of new player love as well, I love the complexity of the game but make it a tad bit easier for new players to make some money, especially through a core mechanic like mining might help.

PorlyP
Gallente
Revenent Defence Corperation
The Omni Federation
Posted - 2008.01.28 15:18:00 - [84]
 

Ok, one more, sorry, I just keep getting inspired by people's comments.

The encouragement of full-blown mining ops would be a great idea for a mining mission: mine out a whole belt in x amount of time, and you get the ore you mined. The early finish bonus is that you could get a percentage higher yield ore for one of them.

This way, the size of the ops could grow with level, and the fleets would need to do so too, making it a possible 3 hour mission say, but with the spoils for those willing to partake in this marathon.

Of course, all the above features could still play a part, so a full fleet would be needed to protect the industrials and haulers.

CCP Chronotis

Posted - 2008.01.28 15:20:00 - [85]
 

Originally by: Montaire


Also can you trigger an event when an asteroid is depleted? If so, perhaps we could find these new asteroid fields by tap'ing regular asteroids. "You find traces of radiation at the asteroids core that indicate it splintered off a much larger mass. Astrometrics indicate this mass may be at xxxxx coordinates"




that is possible to have an escalation event. Would have to consult with the dungeon masters to be sure but sounds like something that could work well if the escalation gets a little interesting so is optional for the mining/ratting corp to proceed.

Quote:

Overall I like the idea of "Hazardous Mining" or perhaps "Eventful Mining" is a better way to say it. Let mining "Escalate" over time and also give us an incentive and a big benefit to have a HUUUGE mining op. I would like to see Goons in a belt with 400 bantams. Spawn some of these sites with GARGANTUAN amounts of resources. Its 0.0, trit shouldnt be a problem.

Finally - I cant tell you how much I want BIGGER asteroid fields. I want to be able to have a 1,000 km square asteroid field, I really want to be in the damned middle and be colliding with asteroids left right and center. Make some of these static's very very large.


ah yes, planet-wide asteroid fields. The problem ultimately comes in the number of celestial objects that need loading which is why despite our wishes, we could not inflict planet wide belts on the server. In dungeons we can handle more objects so its very possible to simulate very dense asteroid fields as well though you would probably have to mine your way to the centre :)

CCP Chronotis

Posted - 2008.01.28 15:25:00 - [86]
 

Originally by: PorlyP

I think one of the CCP peeps mentioned a reactive, chemistry type manipulation of minerals being a possibility? This would be great, as then the science skills would have a little more room for use.

I mean, in the same way you use a datacore for invention, imagine a similar process for asteroid alchemy? You could have a system of processes and minerals that react together creating something entrirely new, but all the time usable, and of diffetent value. Of course, unstable and dangerous reactions could occur, resulting in ship damage or whatever.

This way, again, there would only be a few ways to make tons of ISK, but you'd have to work it out, and put the initial effort in.

With 8 minerals, and possible new ones, you'd only need 3 other factors to have a massive amount of possibilities in what could be produced. This information could be valuable to the point that espionage could be rife. Again, though, having the process bound to a certain high level of skill would help.



yes reactions are possible and easily introduced with few changes and I think reasonable for the rarer more reactive ores which then react to normal minerals for example. Though the suggestion of different minerals and different products brings with it a whole different thing which really mirrors the SWG crafting system. That would be super cool and falls under the branding wishlist as it adds a whole additional level of complexity to the project.

Par'Gellen
Gallente
Neon Cranium
Posted - 2008.01.28 15:27:00 - [87]
 

Gravimetric exploration belts now are very cool and I really like how they are implemented. The one thing I hate about them is that some of them are spread out over OMG WTF HUGE distances making trying to mine them pretty much useless.

Nobody I know flies a barge 150km in deadspace to get... ANYTHING. Please keep this in mind when designing your new belts. Thanks!

zzbooks
Fighting Cats
Posted - 2008.01.28 15:51:00 - [88]
 

Could have an asteroid which gives extra good yield, but which advertises the miners presence to pirates. If a miner chooses to mine it, the miners ship can be warped-to from the system scanner.

An adjustable asteroid, the miner can choose whether it contains Veld, omber or Crokite. The yield will be a little less than normal asteroids and dependant upon sec status of the system.

BoB Peon
Caldari
Stop Posting on COAD You Tards
Posted - 2008.01.28 16:23:00 - [89]
 

Edited by: BoB Peon on 28/01/2008 16:25:14
I would really like to see the end of static belts that was promised last year. Not only would it reduce lag, but it would also help combat those macrominers who are making mining unprofitable. Make them unbookmarkable too please.

Ishina Fel
Caldari
Terra Incognita
Intrepid Crossing
Posted - 2008.01.28 16:27:00 - [90]
 

Edited by: Ishina Fel on 28/01/2008 16:51:23
This is an awesome discussion Very Happy

Please allow me to be a little redudnant and reiterate some of my favorite points previously presented here in my own words, and I'll add some new ideas of my own as well.

-Highsec vs. lowsec vs. zero sec: I firmly believe that the mineral distribution between the two needs to be adressed. Currently, there are too many** low-ends available in highsec, and too little** in 0.0; and on the flip side, there are too many** high-ends in 0.0 and none in highsec. This results in the need of massive hauling sprees which are a part of the game that I believe absolutely no one likes at all. If there was just a little less low-ends in highsec, and in turn a small amount of high-ends; and if mining low-ends in 0.0 was just a little more matched to the silly amounts you need out there; maybe then we could get by with less hauling and more blowing each other up, which helps the whole mineral market.

Also, in lowsec, which is more dangerous than 0.0 (because in 0.0 you either go with groups or own the turf anyway), there is currently too little of anything. If you nerf highsec mining some and buff lowsec mining to be almost as valuable as 0.0, that would get a lot more people out there, and result in less highsec congestion.

**: And with "too much" and "too little" I mean the mining speed, not the number of roids in a belt or the amount of ore in a roid.

-Surprises inside popped roids: This is a great idea. Even if the chance is ultimately so miniscule that you'd have to pop two hundred roids before you can realistically expect something to happen, it would be cool. Finding something that needs to be handled with archaeology, or an angry hive of rogue drones, or even an escalation event - that's the kind of things that will immerse people more deeply in the game. It also opens up additional reward schemes for players, while macro scripts would stupidly ignore it.

-Mining UI: Rocks need a health bar Smile

-Survey scanner: considering this module is so utterly basic in its fitting requirements and skill prerequisites (what, level 1 of a rank 1 skill that just about everyone has), I see nothing wrong with making them a requirement for successful mining. Asteroids should only show on the overview with very generic names, if they have names at all. The survey scanner would be mandatory to identify the actual ore or ice present. This one also needs and UI overhaul to make it immediately apparent to you which roid is which (a distance column, a single-target mode, directly updating the overview or other solutions possible).

-Random objects inside asteroid belts: Why should there only be boring rocks? From mission dungeons for example I remember a wide variety of our ever popular "large collidable objects", such as station ruins, ancient ship wrecks and so on. Why not add similar random debris to asteroid belts, and make it possible to "mine" them, i.e. cut them apart with your lasers into metal scraps you can haul home? Of course, this would require that you buff metal scraps!!!!1111one to be like a kind of ore first ugh

-Large, dense belts: Yes please! Give us belts full of floating rocks in all sizes in a random spread, but only some of them (like 1 out of 10) could be minable. The miner would first have to identify the good ones using the survey scanner (this is a working anti-macro strategy!).

-Removal of ice belts: A silly idea if you will, but why not have ice asteroids pop up as "faction asteroid spawns" with a certain chance in any belt? A single ice rock usually takes 30 people two entire days to mine out, so there's no reason why this would create a shortage of ice. Only finding the correct ice may be a bit more tricky, since you don't know what will spawn... maybe to counteract that, ice rock spawns would be relatively common.

(continued...)


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