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Herschel Yamamoto
Agent-Orange
Nabaal Syndicate
Posted - 2008.01.25 18:44:00 - [1]
 

I was having this discussion a while back, and it seemed like an interesting question, so I figured I'd throw it out to the masses.

Assume, hypothetically, that they allowed skills to be trained to level 6, instead of capping them at 5. The SP cost would progress upward at the same rate, so it'd be 1,448,155 SP per rank to get a skill to 6. What would be the first skill you'd take that high? Which ones would you take to 6 at any point short of the "Sure, I'll have everything maxed out in 20 years" end-game?

Our short-list focused around ones like Rapid Firing, Engineering, Electronics, Energy Systems Operation, and Drones - low-rank skills that are useful and general. But I'm curious to hear what others think.

Dirk Magnum
Blue Republic
RvB - BLUE Republic
Posted - 2008.01.25 18:50:00 - [2]
 

Edited by: Dirk Magnum on 25/01/2008 18:51:04
Yeah any basic ship support skills (engineering, electronics, etc) would be nice to have at 6. Advanced weapon upgrades would take forever but I think players who already have tens of millions of skill points might consider training up that one too. Drone Interfacing 6 would be pretty hardcore for any big drone ship.

I personally, apart from basic support skills, have no idea what I'd train to six. I'm usually reluctant to train things to 5Neutral

Radix Salvilines
legion industries ltd
AAA Citizens
Posted - 2008.01.25 18:52:00 - [3]
 

no plz no :D make more ships instead - or better make them able to refit - not modules but engine, power generator, central computer etc. + abilty to choose the bonus from the racial/ship size bonuses list (like t1 ships have 100 bonus points, t2 200... and a player can choose the bonuses from the list and apply to the ship :D).

Tamia Clant
New Dawn Corp
New Eden Research.
Posted - 2008.01.25 19:15:00 - [4]
 

Originally by: Radix Salvilines
no plz no :D make more ships instead - or better make them able to refit - not modules but engine, power generator, central computer etc. + abilty to choose the bonus from the racial/ship size bonuses list (like t1 ships have 100 bonus points, t2 200... and a player can choose the bonuses from the list and apply to the ship :D).


That sounds like an interesting idea.

Ryan Scouse'UK
omen.
IDLE EMPIRE
Posted - 2008.01.25 19:19:00 - [5]
 

DI 6
wu & adv wu to rank 6
gallente C rank 6
large hybirds / PJ's rank 6
all BS skills to rank 6

erm pretty much all of it =P



Herschel Yamamoto
Agent-Orange
Nabaal Syndicate
Posted - 2008.01.25 19:20:00 - [6]
 

Edited by: Herschel Yamamoto on 25/01/2008 19:23:42
Originally by: Radix Salvilines
no plz no :D make more ships instead - or better make them able to refit - not modules but engine, power generator, central computer etc. + abilty to choose the bonus from the racial/ship size bonuses list (like t1 ships have 100 bonus points, t2 200... and a player can choose the bonuses from the list and apply to the ship :D).


I never said it was a good idea - in fact, I think it'd be a pretty terrible thing to do to the game - just that it was an interesting one.

As for your ship-customization options, it's not a terrible concept, but it's one that is largely dealt with by putting modules on your ship. You could go into a deeper way of doing it, but then I'm not sure it's Eve anymore - ship-building is only one part of this game, and you don't want it to get so grossly complicated that players can't deal with it when the game is this complex already. Besides, that'd screw up the market something fierce - it's already hard enough looking through blueprint contracts, you don't need to add on the same level of complexity in ship trading.

Originally by: Ryan Scouse'UK
DI 6
wu & adv wu to rank 6
gallente C rank 6
large hybirds / PJ's rank 6
all BS skills to rank 6

erm pretty much all of it =P


I'm surprised so many people are picking AWU to take to 6. AWU 6 is the equivalent of a rank 34 skill to 5 - it's almost 8.7 million SP for a 2% reduction to weapon grid use. You could get Engineering 7 more easily than AWU 6 (8.2 million SP vs 8.7 million), and that's a 10% upgrade to total grid, which is far better than a 2% reduction to a subset of your grid use.

Blade Bleed
Celestial Mayhem
C0NVICTED
Posted - 2008.01.25 19:22:00 - [7]
 

Originally by: Radix Salvilines
no plz no :D make more ships instead - or better make them able to refit - not modules but engine, power generator, central computer etc. + abilty to choose the bonus from the racial/ship size bonuses list (like t1 ships have 100 bonus points, t2 200... and a player can choose the bonuses from the list and apply to the ship :D).


Win

Alora Venoda
GalTech
Whiskey Creek Alliance
Posted - 2008.01.25 19:23:00 - [8]
 

Mining level 6
Caldari Industrial level 6
Refining level 6
Wink

Danjira Ryuujin
Caldari
Posted - 2008.01.25 19:29:00 - [9]
 

Skill inflation is bad, mmmmmmkay?

Kerfira
Kerfira Corp
Posted - 2008.01.25 20:12:00 - [10]
 

It's a bad idea that should never be implemented, but just for fun I went through the skill tree to see which would be nice to have to 6.
Note that I've included the rank of the skills in my evaluation so high-rank skills are only included if absolutely great.

Drone Interfacing (5)
Electronics (1)
Long Range Targeting (2)
Signature Analysis (1)
Engineering (1)
Weapon Upgrades (2)
Navigation (1)
Connections (3)
Damage/RoF/Range increasing weapon skills
All learning skills
Starship skill(s) for your ship
For cov-ops: All scanning related skills

Herschel Yamamoto
Agent-Orange
Nabaal Syndicate
Posted - 2008.01.25 20:16:00 - [11]
 

Originally by: Danjira Ryuujin
Skill inflation is bad, mmmmmmkay?


At risk of repeating myself, I never said it was a good idea. It'd be a stupid thing to implement, it'd make old characters even more broken vis-a-vis newbies, and it'd break a lot of things that are tuned fairly specifically to there only being a max rank of 5(e.g., look at the resistance bonuses of Assault Frigates, or look at the fact that no drone bay around is designed for 6 drones). I'm not advocating that CCP does this - in fact, if they were even to consider it, I'd be one of the louder voices shouting them down. But fortunately, we here operate under no such limits of "realism" and "sanity" - we are on EVE General Discussion, remember? - so I'm asking it as an intellectual exercise.

Jenny Spitfire
Caldari
Posted - 2008.01.25 20:19:00 - [12]
 

i Support this.

SiJira
Posted - 2008.01.26 20:39:00 - [13]
 

Originally by: Jenny Spitfire
i Support this.

its only hypothetical so there is nothing to support

Wet Ferret
Posted - 2008.01.26 20:57:00 - [14]
 

Diplomacy 6 Sad (R.I.P. Gurista/Sansha/Blood)

MotherMoon
Huang Yinglong
Posted - 2008.01.26 21:26:00 - [15]
 

I support this as well if only to support newer players getting stronger than older players more quickly.

it would interesting balance because skills like battleship 6 would take what 4 months? in that time a new payer could get so many skills it's sick while that other player gets only one skill level.

Xonkra
Gallente
Posted - 2008.01.26 21:30:00 - [16]
 

Freighter to 6 so it can carry capitals into highsec

uh-oh exploit alert already

Ashira Twilight
Posted - 2008.01.26 22:18:00 - [17]
 

Originally by: Xonkra
Freighter to 6 so it can carry capitals into highsec

uh-oh exploit alert already


I wonder how long THAT would take.

Xavier Korg
Posted - 2008.01.26 22:26:00 - [18]
 

nooooo morrrrrrre skilllllzzzzzs

the station and planet walky thing is fine.. stick with it!

aQurio
Quasar Inc.
AAA Citizens
Posted - 2008.01.26 23:49:00 - [19]
 

Originally by: Xavier Korg
nooooo morrrrrrre skilllllzzzzzs

the station and planet walky thing is fine.. stick with it!


Why not fix the lag and bugs in the game now before anything walking?

The Herrick
Gallente
Autistic Sharks
Spreadsheets Online
Posted - 2008.01.27 00:05:00 - [20]
 

Hull upgrades to 6 and release advanced hull upgrades (evemon says it would add another 3% armor per level)

Dimagus
School of Applied Knowledge
Posted - 2008.01.27 00:17:00 - [21]
 

The average Rank VI (1) would take 20-25 days

Anything greater than (1) or (2) would definitely not be worth it time-wise, except for exploitive skill situations. (Freighters carrying caps into highsec being one of them)

Del Narveux
Dukes of Hazard
Posted - 2008.01.27 00:47:00 - [22]
 

I disagree that any skill should be trainable to level 6, it would just be yet another layer of winsauce for older players. That being said, I *would* like the ability to pick, say, two skills and get an extra bonus for them. So for instance someone could spec as a shield tanker, and have just a little bit more cowbell to reflect their choosing to be really good at it.

MotherMoon
Huang Yinglong
Posted - 2008.01.27 00:47:00 - [23]
 

Originally by: aQurio
Originally by: Xavier Korg
nooooo morrrrrrre skilllllzzzzzs

the station and planet walky thing is fine.. stick with it!


Why not fix the lag and bugs in the game now before anything walking?


...

do we really have to go over this AGAIN?

Del Narveux
Dukes of Hazard
Posted - 2008.01.27 00:51:00 - [24]
 

Yes, we do because this is the internet. And on a related note, I've been seeing these Templar things on the market...could someone fill me in on what those are all about? Laughing

Dirk Magnum
Blue Republic
RvB - BLUE Republic
Posted - 2008.01.27 01:04:00 - [25]
 

Templars are a medical drone, used by Gallente OB/GYNs.

In all seriousness though, I've found that I'd really like to train standard weapons upgrades to six, which would free up more CPU for fitting a recon probe launcher. For new players viewing this thread, the recon probe launcher tracks down celestial objects and ships quickly, and lets the one fitting the launcher warp right on top of that object. Invaluable in piracy, but hard to fit once you've already put weapons on your ship.

Valan
Posted - 2008.01.27 01:40:00 - [26]
 

No because you would have uber unbalanced ships. It would all have to be rebalanced.

You shouldn't be able to fit everything you want. It should be a trade off in roles for that specific craft.

Dirk Magnum
Blue Republic
RvB - BLUE Republic
Posted - 2008.01.27 01:45:00 - [27]
 

Originally by: Valan
No because you would have uber unbalanced ships. It would all have to be rebalanced.

You shouldn't be able to fit everything you want. It should be a trade off in roles for that specific craft.



An extra 5% won't unbalance anything, especially since anyone can just train that same skill to six themselves. Even the extra 20% to drone damage for interfacing six won't break the game imo

Valan
Posted - 2008.01.27 01:50:00 - [28]
 

Originally by: Dirk Magnum
Originally by: Valan
No because you would have uber unbalanced ships. It would all have to be rebalanced.

You shouldn't be able to fit everything you want. It should be a trade off in roles for that specific craft.



An extra 5% won't unbalance anything, especially since anyone can just train that same skill to six themselves. Even the extra 20% to drone damage for interfacing six won't break the game imo


Extra 5% grid, cpu, cap recharge and various other skills. MAx DPS a harder tank? You really don't want a 70mill combat character fitting whatever he wants believe me.


MotherMoon
Huang Yinglong
Posted - 2008.01.27 02:04:00 - [29]
 

Originally by: Valan
Originally by: Dirk Magnum
Originally by: Valan
No because you would have uber unbalanced ships. It would all have to be rebalanced.

You shouldn't be able to fit everything you want. It should be a trade off in roles for that specific craft.



An extra 5% won't unbalance anything, especially since anyone can just train that same skill to six themselves. Even the extra 20% to drone damage for interfacing six won't break the game imo


Extra 5% grid, cpu, cap recharge and various other skills. MAx DPS a harder tank? You really don't want a 70mill combat character fitting whatever he wants believe me.




however that 70 mil sp character wuldn't have too many level 6 skills.

for every level 6 skill he could of trained 5 level 5 skills.

Dirk Magnum
Blue Republic
RvB - BLUE Republic
Posted - 2008.01.27 02:07:00 - [30]
 

Sexcellent Mothermoon is kinda sorta defending my post.Twisted Evil

Everything is going according to plan/.


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