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Blitz'Krieg
Caldari
10010011001
Posted - 2007.12.18 13:16:00 - [1]
 

I have to lol at these "BoB is already dead" posts that are around, especially from the people who have been on the end of "there are no goons" but its looking kinda inevitable that BoB may be forced into the npc station and possibly empire. Regardless of wether you think thats true or not ... what would you do in their situation?

What interests me is if it would be in BoB's interest to stand and fight. Why not quitly withdraw, they dont need 0.0 to make a very good living and with their four (five?) titan's could effectivelly be anywhere in eve inside of an hour with a huge capital fleet so why stick to one region?

The only way BoB (or goons for that matter) could be killed is from within so to me the current climate is only going to make them stronger as a unit rather than break them up. If you really wanted to destroy BoB you would give them a reason to break up.

Perhaps offer finfleet amnesty from future action if they pulled out (they did join late in the game)?

ATM I think all of the corps in BoB know even if the alliance split up they would be hunted as corps. Add to that the reluctance of none affiliates to hire bobbits for fear of spy's and it makes you harder rather than softer the more you are pushed.

Anyways, what I would do personally ..

1) Move most of the alliance assets to empire
2) Leave a harrying force that would inflict maximum damage for minimum losses to make them pay for the space
3) send out a few trusted members to infiltrate future targets, do this as if they were leaving because they dont like bob etc
4) Use guerilla hotdrop's and raids to take out obvious industrial targets of their enemies.

Ponderous Thunderstroke
Minmatar
Republic War Machine Industries
Posted - 2007.12.18 13:19:00 - [2]
 

Edited by: Ponderous Thunderstroke on 18/12/2007 14:00:07
*Bzzyt* Corporate Non-troll PonderBot would also move his goods back to empire and fight. *Bzzyut*
*Bzzut* A harassing guerilla force would be a good idea. *Brrrzyt*
*Brazzat* Infiltration would be great. *Brrzzzit!*
*Bazzyt* Hotdrops and supply line conflict would be good *Bzzazzit!*

*Brzzzazzt* Except that no BoB will ever be given any quarter and be pursured around the galaxy until they quit or sold, the rest of the plan is quite possibly their best option. *Buzzzzzzzyt*

Zell
Caldari
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2007.12.18 13:28:00 - [3]
 

*snip* Posting with an unidentified character and characters in NPC corporations in this forum is prohibited. If you wish to participate in the discussions here, be sure to have your corporation and or alliance status ticked in your forum settings. - Valorem ([email protected])


Waagaa Ktlehr
Amarr
GeoCorp.
-Mostly Harmless-
Posted - 2007.12.18 13:29:00 - [4]
 

You're all jumping to conclusions.

You have to shoot the animal before you can eat it.

Ponderous Thunderstroke
Minmatar
Republic War Machine Industries
Posted - 2007.12.18 13:30:00 - [5]
 

Originally by: Zell
Originally by: Ponderous Thunderstroke
Trolling removed. The OP has made a reasoned and discussion worthy post. The least you can do is respond with something that is equally worth discussing - Valorem



*snip* Posting with an unidentified character and characters in NPC corporations in this forum is prohibited. If you wish to participate in the discussions here, be sure to have your corporation and or alliance status ticked in your forum settings. - Valorem ([email protected])




Spam removed. Please stay on topic - Valorem

Sakura San
Caldari
FlinFeet
Posted - 2007.12.18 13:33:00 - [6]
 

being an outsider, i still think you don't "get" BOB. i am pretty sure that it is way more than an ingame alliance.

Lazuran
Gallente
Aliastra
Posted - 2007.12.18 13:35:00 - [7]
 

Originally by: Waagaa Ktlehr
You're all jumping to conclusions.

You have to shoot the animal before you can eat it.


Wouldn't you rather be in MC in your Aeon now btw.? :)


Zell
Caldari
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2007.12.18 13:37:00 - [8]
 

*snip* Posting with an unidentified character and characters in NPC corporations in this forum is prohibited. If you wish to participate in the discussions here, be sure to have your corporation and or alliance status ticked in your forum settings. - Valorem ([email protected])


Waagaa Ktlehr
Amarr
GeoCorp.
-Mostly Harmless-
Posted - 2007.12.18 13:37:00 - [9]
 

Originally by: Lazuran
Originally by: Waagaa Ktlehr
You're all jumping to conclusions.

You have to shoot the animal before you can eat it.


Wouldn't you rather be in MC in your Aeon now btw.? :)




Both are target rich environments with plenty of opportunity to lose carriers like an emo lemming.

Sokratesz
Caldari
Rionnag Alba
Northern Coalition.
Posted - 2007.12.18 13:37:00 - [10]
 

Over the past year or so i've come to the conclusion that both bob and goons are the same person who is sitting in a scysc****r somewhere giggling like a little girl with alot of pc screens staring at him and a 5000$/month bill from CCP.

'For the lulz'

ISD Valorem


Amarr
ISD STAR
Posted - 2007.12.18 13:41:00 - [11]
 

Please stay on topic.

Do not troll/spam/flame. Failure to comply will result in a warning.

Jimi Tetro
Caldari
Vanquish Inc
Posted - 2007.12.18 14:03:00 - [12]
 

*snip* Posting with an unidentified character and characters in NPC corporations in this forum is prohibited. If you wish to participate in the discussions here, be sure to have your corporation and or alliance status ticked in your forum settings. ~Saint

Cvuos
Caldari
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
Posted - 2007.12.18 14:06:00 - [13]
 

1. No major alliance has survived losing all their space and remaining in their past form.

2. There is no such thing as a supercap fleet based out of NPC stations and empire.

3. Dying takes time. There is no dramatic final blow. There is a push to a brink, then it crumbles from the inside with absent directors, smaller fleets, quiet desertion, internal drama and the usual excuses of "didn't want that 0.0 anyway", "pos wars are boring", "now we are truly free".

LV is a great example. They were tied together by a culture of success. When success is gone, there is no unity anymore. This isn't true for all of BoB but for lots of it, particularly the recent individual joiners who consider(ed) it the end-game. The time from the beginning of the LV campaign to the end of organized resistance wasn't very long, but it took more than twice that time before it was really over.


Tholarim
Amarr
Destructive Influence
IT Alliance
Posted - 2007.12.18 14:14:00 - [14]
 

Originally by: Waagaa Ktlehr
You're all jumping to conclusions.

You have to shoot the animal before you can eat it.


You have to drown a cow before it can float!

Blitz'Krieg
Caldari
10010011001
Posted - 2007.12.18 14:19:00 - [15]
 

Originally by: Cvuos
1. No major alliance has survived losing all their space and remaining in their past form.

2. There is no such thing as a supercap fleet based out of NPC stations and empire.

3. Dying takes time. There is no dramatic final blow. There is a push to a brink, then it crumbles from the inside with absent directors, smaller fleets, quiet desertion, internal drama and the usual excuses of "didn't want that 0.0 anyway", "pos wars are boring", "now we are truly free".

LV is a great example. They were tied together by a culture of success. When success is gone, there is no unity anymore. This isn't true for all of BoB but for lots of it, particularly the recent individual joiners who consider(ed) it the end-game. The time from the beginning of the LV campaign to the end of organized resistance wasn't very long, but it took more than twice that time before it was really over.




goons lost all their space, their ships and the pos' and came back twice as strong. the thing that kept the goons together was something awful, the thing that will keep bob together will be that noone else dare take them. that is the point.

sheis
Caldari
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2007.12.18 14:20:00 - [16]
 

*snip* Posting with an unidentified character and characters in NPC corporations in this forum is prohibited. If you wish to participate in the discussions here, be sure to have your corporation and or alliance status ticked in your forum settings. - Valorem ([email protected])

NATMav
Caldari
F.R.E.E. Explorer
The Initiative.
Posted - 2007.12.18 14:24:00 - [17]
 

Originally by: Blitz'Krieg
the thing that will keep bob together will be that noone else dare take them. that is the point.


I think you overestimate the common sense of the average corp. Most will see "capital pilot" on the app and their eyes glaze over.

7shining7one7
Gallente
Aliastra
Posted - 2007.12.18 14:31:00 - [18]
 

Originally by: Sakura San
being an outsider, i still think you don't "get" BOB. i am pretty sure that it is way more than an ingame alliance.


Laughing i saw what you did there.

Darcuese
Amarr
Destructive Influence
KenZoku
Posted - 2007.12.18 14:38:00 - [19]
 

Edited by: Darcuese on 18/12/2007 14:38:04
Originally by: Cvuos


LV is a great example. They were tied together by a culture of success. When success is gone, there is no unity anymore.


I been there when Velios came on crossroad with left turn for PvP life or right turn for picking up flowers in his guarden. He didnt take left turn. Thats the difference between many others and BoB. And after all this time ppl dont get it still.
Anybody esle, ANYBODY else that would be in our shoes would already see many members not loging on, or leaving corps and alliances.
Maybe one day, after many glasses of milk, you might realize what benefit some, and others not


Brunn Leinbach
Gallente
Owl Trading
Posted - 2007.12.18 14:39:00 - [20]
 

Well I haven't seen dramatic movement on the sovereignty's map compared to the dramatic events on this forum section of the past couple of days. What is becoming apparent is that BOB has become the pariah of the eve community, a tittle that GS has claimed for a while Cool

fell1234
Caldari
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2007.12.18 14:40:00 - [21]
 

Edited by: fell1234 on 18/12/2007 14:40:49
Originally by: Darcuese
Edited by: Darcuese on 18/12/2007 14:38:04
Originally by: Cvuos


LV is a great example. They were tied together by a culture of success. When success is gone, there is no unity anymore.


I been there when Velios came on crossroad with left turn for PvP life or right turn for picking up flowers in his guarden. He didnt take left turn. Thats the difference between many others and BoB. And after all this time ppl dont get it still.
Anybody esle, ANYBODY else that would be in our shoes would already see many members not loging on, or leaving corps and alliances.
Maybe one day, after many glasses of milk, you might realize what benefit some, and others not




Wait RISE/MPIRE/D-L/MC dont count or something?

thoth foc
Caldari
Arcane Technologies
The Five
Posted - 2007.12.18 14:42:00 - [22]
 

Tradition dictates, that the exit strategy should be - "exit stage left"

Last time i tried to leave ATUK, i was flying in a circle for a week before i had to give it up as a bad plan :o(

Darcuese
Amarr
Destructive Influence
KenZoku
Posted - 2007.12.18 14:48:00 - [23]
 

Originally by: fell1234
Edited by: fell1234 on 18/12/2007 14:40:49
Originally by: Darcuese
Edited by: Darcuese on 18/12/2007 14:38:04
Originally by: Cvuos


LV is a great example. They were tied together by a culture of success. When success is gone, there is no unity anymore.


I been there when Velios came on crossroad with left turn for PvP life or right turn for picking up flowers in his guarden. He didnt take left turn. Thats the difference between many others and BoB. And after all this time ppl dont get it still.
Anybody esle, ANYBODY else that would be in our shoes would already see many members not loging on, or leaving corps and alliances.
Maybe one day, after many glasses of milk, you might realize what benefit some, and others not




Wait RISE/MPIRE/D-L/MC dont count or something?


I think using a profile of a man who was part of few (as 2) that created LV, would be enough to explain some differencesRazz

Waagaa Ktlehr
Amarr
GeoCorp.
-Mostly Harmless-
Posted - 2007.12.18 14:49:00 - [24]
 

Originally by: Tholarim
Originally by: Waagaa Ktlehr
You're all jumping to conclusions.

You have to shoot the animal before you can eat it.


You have to drown a cow before it can float!


We shouldn't try to get old cows out of the gutter.

Nero Winger
Amarr
Galactic Trading
Posted - 2007.12.18 15:09:00 - [25]
 

Originally by: Blitz'Krieg


1) Move most of the alliance assets to empire




only bits and bytes

Empyre
Minmatar
Chaotic Balance
Posted - 2007.12.18 15:25:00 - [26]
 

i'm not a fan of bob after the iss backstab. in some ways i think that really amplified the downward spiral. however, i think bob is just too proud to ever surrender. afterall, being too proud is what got them into this situation in the first place.

Taua Roqa
Minmatar
Sebiestor Tribe
Posted - 2007.12.18 15:26:00 - [27]
 

I think the station in NOL (?) is called the alamo, which is bob's hq? now we know what happened at the alamo (texicans all died in a huge fight) so it's probable that this is what BoB is wanting, a huge bloodbath, afterall what is the point in having a 0.0 alliance...to stay in 0.0 forever doing nothing much other than existing in stalemate or to orchestrate a situation leading to the largest and laggiest battle eve will probably ever see? BoB have roleplayed an excellent villain, using, abusing and throwing away numerous other alliances for their own good, whilst creating countless enemies with their infuriating, arrogant, posturing rhetoric. Now everything is polarised, BoB seem to have shedded all their 'pets', like a turtle have pulled in their arms and legs quite deliberately, and have bought all the enemies forces right on top of them, this is the strongest possible fighting position for BoB for many reasons, if they can break their enemies will to attack by inflicting morale breaking defeat after defeat they could burst out, and cluster**** everyone, who having relocated their assests to these new front lines to help their seiging, could suffer disarmingly large losses. Or they simply are going to get slaughtered, just like the alamo! :o/ who knows.

I base all this on the fact their HQ is called the alamo, and I feel that underpins everything, it was named the alamo for a reason, I assume :P?

Eleese
Caldari
Inglorious-Basterds
Posted - 2007.12.18 15:30:00 - [28]
 

Tbh I think bob are much more appealing place to be now than what they were when they would steam roll people like ASCN easily... Much more fun being outnumbered and losing occasionally.

Shayleigh Snowflower
Caldari
Thunderwaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2007.12.18 15:31:00 - [29]
 

Since there are things like jump clones and capital ships and alts, removing stuff from a station are not all that crucial.

Besides, BOB have they're money making alts in corps like RISE and D-L, that again pay rent to they're alts. In the last months they did bloat the numbers in the main alliance to show strength, but still, they don't have all that much left in they're stations in Delve.

And, when they know that the enemy are shooting something somewhere, they can easily titanjump 10-15 freighters with they're remaining titans / mommy's as cover.

Princess Hopy
Caldari
Your Friendly Booster Company
Posted - 2007.12.18 15:31:00 - [30]
 

What most of the people here dont get is that even if BoB is pushed out from their current territory it still took a very large force to do so. BoB is still, even after this, capable of taking any alliance in the game 1vs1 and claiming their space very quickly. Then the only thing that can be done to stop this is to bring the same huge blob of alliances to attack them again.. I dont know, but to me that sounds like alot of work and not particularily fun.

What i'd like to see would be BoB utilizing their superiour capital fleet and basing from npc space striking strategic targets, destroying them and leaving them in ruins before moving to a new target again.


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