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CCP Wrangler

Posted - 2007.12.11 23:09:00 - [1]
 

By now everyone should have heard of the boot.ini issue, it would be hard to have missed it. But what went wrong? How did it go wrong? How could we have let it happen? What will be done to fix it? These are some of the questions our Director of the EVE Software Group, Explorer, will answer in his blog: About the boot.ini issue.

And again, we would like to offer our deepest apology to everyone affected by this bug.

Uuve Savisaalo
Rage and Terror
Against ALL Authorities
Posted - 2007.12.11 23:24:00 - [2]
 

Edited by: Uuve Savisaalo on 11/12/2007 23:25:12


and so it begins..

Harry Bootini
Posted - 2007.12.11 23:26:00 - [3]
 

Nice to see how fast you were on the ball. It was almost like magic. Keep up the good work.

Fader Bane
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
Posted - 2007.12.11 23:39:00 - [4]
 

It's good that this has finally been addressed in this manner. Code is a pain in the ass to wade through so it is a flawed assumption that this would be picked up while checking the lines. Basically this file should not be named as it is despite whatever legacy exists.

Serenity Steele
Dynamic Data Distribution
Posted - 2007.12.11 23:42:00 - [5]
 

This bug fell into the WTF?! category, but now makes sense. Good job posting an explanation,
Thank you.


Trauts
Phantom Squad
Atlas Alliance
Posted - 2007.12.11 23:43:00 - [6]
 

This is why I like CCP.

They have no problem admiting a mistake was made, they appologize, they explain how it happened, and they tell us how they will keep it from happening again.

What more can you ask for?


Ma'kal
The Imperial Commonwealth
E.Y
Posted - 2007.12.11 23:44:00 - [7]
 

Thanks for the info.

Kirmok
Foyu Trading World
Posted - 2007.12.11 23:48:00 - [8]
 

I for one appreciate the candor and your fast response.

Please continue to be honest with us in the future!

I used to play a game called...lets call is SWG...and the company that produces/develops it is NOT very honest or forward about what they are planning and/or doing.

Jameroz
Echoes of Space
Posted - 2007.12.11 23:48:00 - [9]
 

Now that's pretty good explanation about the issue, causes and precautions that will be taken.
Now why can't all Eve developement be that transparent. Smile

MotherMoon
Huang Yinglong
Posted - 2007.12.12 00:06:00 - [10]
 

Edited by: MotherMoon on 12/12/2007 00:07:32
don't take this the wrong way I know you over overlooked it but...

Quote:

Section "EVE-ONLINE"

SetOutPath "$INSTDIR"

Delete "boot.ini"
Delete "manifest.dat"

File "boot.ini"
File "manifest.dat"
File "resDX9*.stuff"

SectionEnd



ROFL

that's going to be classic.

Sabrin Kulu
Caldari
Perkone
Posted - 2007.12.12 00:11:00 - [11]
 

Glad to see this has been resolved; luckily for me I wasn't affected by it :)

Thanks for the explanation CCP, much appreciated!

Dr Smythe
Amarr
Destructive Influence
IT Alliance
Posted - 2007.12.12 00:27:00 - [12]
 

Fubar'd me for over 5 hours as I didn't have my xp cd. So i had to download a copy from the net and create a bootable cd to get my system back working.

I looked for these links on here but you didn't have them you only had "if you have the cd do this" or "an other way of doing it is this"

Nothing for us poor folk who didn't have the cd.

Think of all aspects of solving problems in the future please just like you should think of all aspects of creating problems. 'QC'

Thank God I had a 2nd laptop to do this.

Rant over :)

Sinnbad Mayhem
Posted - 2007.12.12 00:30:00 - [13]
 

Awesome explanation and fantastic ownership of the problem.

(now where is that Broadsword you promised? - joke :)

All kidding aside, I know where your coming from when you say you didnt have time to test and yes, Windows sucks large. Problems like this is all too common in our small world of drive-through IT.

PEACE



Treher
Minmatar
Infinity Enterprises
Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
Posted - 2007.12.12 00:31:00 - [14]
 

Now, pretty, pretty please give us SOMETHING about jump clones. PLEEEEEEAAAASSEE

Trojanman190
D00M.
Northern Coalition.
Posted - 2007.12.12 00:32:00 - [15]
 

Seriously.. why was it called boot.ini in the first place? Nobody thought that that might become a problem later?

Raneru
Combat and Recon
Posted - 2007.12.12 00:36:00 - [16]
 

Originally by: Trojanman190
Seriously.. why was it called boot.ini in the first place? Nobody thought that that might become a problem later?


Don't worry, in the next patch it will be renamed to NTLDR Wink

Treelox
Posted - 2007.12.12 00:45:00 - [17]
 

Thank you for owning up and explaining the HOW of the error.


There is one thing though that I cant help but note in explorer's write up, it seems that rushing the job was the root of all evil in this case.

May I offer up a little phrase that has proved to be a golden rule to my life in many different areas

"Slow and Steady gets the moan, Fast and Frenzied just gets messy"

Now I realise that because advertising dollars had been spent months in advance your software team was under the gun to publish. The question I ask is should CCP continue to allow marketing to dictate release dates or should that instead be the jobs of the coders, who actually know when their product is ready?

---
For the record, I was not effected by this, since my current machine is not able handle the SH3 content. Although I have found that using classic I now have a 40-50% reduction in my FPS in comparision to my pre-trinity FPS. Of course thats something for another thread, and I'll wait till Trinity2.1 comes out before I start ranting. :)

Eirlie
Gallente
Garoun Investment Bank
Posted - 2007.12.12 00:54:00 - [18]
 

Originally by: Treelox
---
For the record, I was not effected by this, since my current machine is not able handle the SH3 content. Although I have found that using classic I now have a 40-50% reduction in my FPS in comparision to my pre-trinity FPS. Of course thats something for another thread, and I'll wait till Trinity2.1 comes out before I start ranting. :)

I had very choppy play after installing, and the map wouldn't load. Followed instructions in http://support.eve-online.com/Pages/KB/Article.aspx?id=142 and not only did my map load, but also gameplay FPS increased significantly. Note deleting everything including prefs.ini will reset almost everything (overviews and all!)... although you might be able to skip the .ini...

M1AU
Gallente
Posted - 2007.12.12 01:08:00 - [19]
 

Quote:
Why doesn't Windows protect its system startup files? That's a good question, one that I have asked myself in these last few days and wish I knew the answer. But of course I'm not going to blame Microsoft for our mistake. Windows doesn't protect those files and therefore software developers must take care not to touch them. We should have been more careful.


Windows don't need a feature like that, the answer is quite simple, admin rights.
I'm using EVE as a single user on my PC therefor I don't need admin rights.
And of course, a user with administrative privileges should always be able to delete `any` files on the system.

Treelox
Posted - 2007.12.12 01:10:00 - [20]
 

Originally by: Eirlie
I had very choppy play after installing, and the map wouldn't load. Followed instructions in http://support.eve-online.com/Pages/KB/Article.aspx?id=142 and not only did my map load, but also gameplay FPS increased significantly. Note deleting everything including prefs.ini will reset almost everything (overviews and all!)... although you might be able to skip the .ini...


Thanks for your assistance, but I dont have a map problem. As a matter of course I always kill off my cache before every patch, I have found that it just saves me loads of headache in the long run. Been doing that now for the last 2 years.

:)

Tiuwaz
Minmatar
No Paradise
Posted - 2007.12.12 01:34:00 - [21]
 

great explanation, i like it
the mistake was big but the handling of it was well done


the only complaint i still have is that it took nearly a week for this blog, besides that keep up the good work

Tarminic
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
Posted - 2007.12.12 01:37:00 - [22]
 

I'm glad to see a dev blog about this - though I didn't encounter this issue I know it affected a lot of people, probably more than those who contacted you since many of them came to the forums for answers.

I work in software development myself, so I have nothing by sympathy for the long nights and franticness this must have caused. Thanks for getting this resolved as quickly as you did guys.

Bossman
Gallente
Genesis Syndicate
Posted - 2007.12.12 01:42:00 - [23]
 

Originally by: Trauts
This is why I like CCP.

They have no problem admiting a mistake was made, they appologize, they explain how it happened, and they tell us how they will keep it from happening again.

What more can you ask for?




What can i say, lmfao. There is a litany of other bugs that still have not been addressed, with no information forthcoming. While its cool to finally get an explanation of how the 'major' bug occurred, what about all the other stuff that has been messed with? Still no comment? Rolling Eyes

Cosmo Raata
T-Cells
Moar Tears
Posted - 2007.12.12 01:47:00 - [24]
 

Edited by: Cosmo Raata on 12/12/2007 01:49:25
Only question I have, is WHY THE F do you put up a phone# for someone in the US to call, ask them to leave a message and never call them back????!!! I needed assistance and ended up relying on help from someone else after waiting too long, as I had filed I needed and just couldn't wait for you. Kind of pathetic if you ask me. I was impressed that you'd offer to take calls, but you proved that it was only a fake gesture to cover your asses.



P.S. You still haven't called (6 days later).

fuze
Gallente
Quam Singulari
Posted - 2007.12.12 02:06:00 - [25]
 

Why the heck would you reboot your puter?
Besides rewriting boot.ini from scratch isn't that hard. Rolling Eyes

Sky Marshal
IMpAct Corp
Not Found.
Posted - 2007.12.12 02:09:00 - [26]
 

Edited by: Sky Marshal on 12/12/2007 02:15:40
Quote:
4.9.1.1 Delete

[/REBOOTOK] file

Delete file (which can be a file or wildcard, but should be specified with a full path) from the target system. If /REBOOTOK is specified and the file cannot be deleted then the file is deleted when the system reboots -- if the file will be deleted on a reboot, the reboot flag will be set. The error flag is set if files are found and cannot be deleted. The error flag is not set from trying to delete a file that does not exist.

Delete $INSTDIR\somefile.dat


Quote:
4.9.1.9 SetOutPath

[...]

SetOutPath $INSTDIR
File program.exe


The assumption is correct in a logical way, and I don't find in the documentation anything who change this way of thinking. As the "Should" modal word is probably one of the most blurred english word possible, this error was possible.

I am french so I understand "Should" as "Must" and don't know why there is two words for the same use Question I am not the only person to state this word as well [Translated documentation in French]. Guess I have to learn a few more about modals ^^

Quote:
The installer scripting language is not easy to read.


ugh It is not really hard to read, but as I don't have your script and as I don't use this installer seriously (small specific needs), I will not disagree.

The smallest possible error is always the worse possible error.

Thaylon Sen
Minmatar
Posted - 2007.12.12 02:10:00 - [27]
 

I think the lesson here is more haste, less pace.

Zenst
Hall Of Flame
Chain of Chaos
Posted - 2007.12.12 02:31:00 - [28]
 

Excellent read.

Top stuff and glad to hear all being dealt with. Not much else you could of done or said. Again top stuff and a open honest writeup like that only leads to people respecting you more than before this whole affair.


Philmore Ganz
Ex Coelis
Posted - 2007.12.12 02:58:00 - [29]
 

Excellent post, thank you!

Sonorra Baki
Interstellar eXodus
BricK sQuAD.
Posted - 2007.12.12 03:06:00 - [30]
 

A sincere and good post.



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