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PDP11
Posted - 2007.12.18 05:28:00 - [121]
 

I'm in the experienced category with my main character in an NPC corporation. Only have the one character and not using alts. Onto the whys...

The player corp I was in effectively split when a large number of players went to 0.0 space, the Empire operations lost focus, most Empire POS were sold, corp started association with BoB, then I left due to boredom. Fell into an NPC corporation by default. There had been multiple WarDecs but they had absolutely no impact on why I resigned, they just made gameplay more interesting for me, and I don't think there was a WarDec active when I resigned (happened too long ago). Boredom and BoB association were the reason I left.

Sometimes look on the Recruitment channel but never found another Corp that syncs with my interests. I don't have TS/Vent, mostly play for short periods and can't guarantee when I will be available. Most Corps are too remote from my prefered area of operation, not in my timezone, or too juvenile.

Age and playing style are major factors. I did space empire Play By Mail using mark sense cards. Oldest hardware I attacked with a CRO and soldering iron was a B5500. So I'm not a good fit with the under 30 year olds.

Technically experienced with >25m but useless in PvP. Most of my ship losses are due to NPC activity not players. Last player loss was in 1.0 space where I lost 3 ships with all their T1 equipment. Wasn't concerned it allowed me to clear out old junk, hopefully boosted the other guy up the kill boards, losses did seem to upset some of the new players. I'm still using Frigate/Destroyer/Industrial/Miner ships, never flown a Cruiser (have the skill, never bothered), although I have flown one Battlecruiser (which I promptly lost to an NPC about 6 months ago), and will probably buy another Battlecruiser next year. So accumulating ISK or outstanding player rep on the kill boards are not my priorities.

Without a Player Corporation to join I'll remain in the NPC Corporation. So reason is not related to avoiding WarDecs, macro mining, using alts, or other insulting speculations.

Kerfira
Kerfira Corp
Posted - 2007.12.18 22:19:00 - [122]
 

Edited by: Kerfira on 18/12/2007 22:21:17
I've been in both player corp (both my own solitary one and big ones) and NPC corp on my different characters.
Originally by: CCP Wrangler
Why would an experienced pilot be in a NPC corp?

There're lots of reasons for this...... These are the ones I can think off on right now....
  1. The obvious one. Avoid war-dec's. Some players play this game for the PvE and doesn't like the PvP side. I'm not one of them, but I don't really have a huge problem with it. There're plenty of other people I can shoot, and shooting someone who doesn't want to or know how to fight is just another form of griefing to me.
  2. Some people like the large diverse community of the NPC corp. In big player corp you're usually all of the same 'type' of player, and your discussions are usually about your corp and its affairs. This is not so in the NPC corp where discussions is about everything ELSE than the corp.
  3. Making money for PvP in a way that doesn't involve you to constantly be alert. Ratting is all well and good, but sometimes you don't want to watch local or your mission space all the time but just want to earn a bit of ISK in a relaxing way while browsing the web, reading mail etc.
  4. Some experienced players I know just love to help new players. I've done it myself on no small number of occations. One of my most fun experiences was taking a group of players who'd never run a L4 mission before into Worlds Collide in their Cruisers, BC's and poorly fitted Ravens. I was directing the battle, tanking a lot and providing info, and it was LOADS of fun for all of us! I wouldn't have met these players if I'd been in a player corp!
  5. Macro miners and macro mission runners. Kill 'em all!

Kayscha
Posted - 2007.12.24 13:33:00 - [123]
 

Well, as it seems there are indeed a lot of players that remain in NPC corporations by choice, and seeing that there are many reasons for this, I wonder if CCP is actually going to address this issue or if they were just curious. Unfortuantely, this discussion has pretty much died out and the devs have yet to comment on their plans. How about we collect some suggestions on how to deal with the issue?
First of all, it seems different motivations for remaining in NPC corporations are to be viewed independently, as some are clearly unwelcome, others are debatable and a few are clearly legitimate and may even be tendered some love xmas being around the corner and all :)

Mining alts and macro miners: these are pretty much the same - characters that are created and used to work with instead of play. They will not likely contribute anything to the universe beyond siphoning off isk sources and not very legitimately moving the cash to characters that do not actively support their own in-game actions. As diligent greed is in fact a legitimate motivation, the problem with them is not so much how they act in the game but what they do with the isk they earned.

Wardec avoiders: While it is certainly a legitimate desire to seek the protection of an empire corporation from random PvP harassment, it is less so if this is just a game mechanic to exploit whenever one needs to run from a well-deserved beating.

Independent players: I (of course) see nothing wrong in that approach to playing eve. There is no apparent detraction to the experience of other players but the gain for all by increasing the diversity of eve.

Suggested measures:

- players should be able to become unincorporated, leaving them without protection by any larger entity aside from law enforcement
- individual unincorporated players could be 'feuded' upon by any other entity, a short-term "war" against a single character which could only be renewed if the character was still unincorporated at the end of the feud. There would have to be a cost and a consequence for calling a feud, of course a delay for notification, possibly even certain conditions to meet in order to be available for feuding
- active feuds would be visible to corps that are recruiting
- after switching corps, characters should be considered members of both their original and their new corporation for a short time (a week?) as far as rights to shoot them are concerned
- all NPC corporations should be joinable, requiring certain standings and maybe completion of a set of missions
- NPC corporations would drastically lower standings/loyalty to member characters that acted against that corp's creed/interests
- NPC corps would kick out players that lowered their standings beneath a certain minimum
- NPC corps would heavily tax donations and contracts that moved isk from a member to a non-member
- NPC corps would punish deserters (those leaving it) by again significantly lowering standings
- NPC corps should offer members certain exclusive missions and items in the lp store, possible even hand out things that could not be transferred to non-members and lost upon leaving the corp
- different NPC corps should offer very different conditions, making joining one an interesting choice
- NPC corps should be available to be wardecced. As most of them belong to an alliance (an Empire), this would mean wardeccers would be hostile to all corp or even empire NPCs.

Cagot
Spelunkers
Posted - 2007.12.25 01:22:00 - [124]
 

Suggestion for an upcoming Econ Blog: the effect of recent POS defense nerfs on T2 reaction production.

Specifically, a number of relatively recent changes to POS operations appear to have had the result of making it more difficult for small corporations to operate towers profitably for mining and reacting in low-sec. These changes include at least:

(1) Moving guns outside the shield, where they can be targeted and killed more easily.
(2) Reducing the maximum time for reinforced mode by 50%.
(3) Introducing Heavy Interdictors with infinite warp scrambling ability in Empire.
(4) Allowing aggressors to unanchor and scoop POS structures after popping the tower.

#1 and #2 make it easier for a small gang to kill a POS, #4 makes it profitable for them to do it, and #3 allows them to interdict fuel and product deliveries relatively painlessly.

Econ questions, assuming the numbers come out as I imply above:

(1) What effect has this had on production of T2 simple and complex materials for the market?

(2) What effect has this had on the proportion of T2 simple and complex materials produced by small corporations?

Dev questions, again assuming my intuition is correct:

Is this the effect CCP planned, or is it an unintended consequence?

Is it considered a positive, negative or neutral consequence?

Drakkarin
Posted - 2007.12.28 22:51:00 - [125]
 

For me choosing an NPC corp over a player corp is simple - time and effort.

The EVE universe is stunning. CCP's conceptualization of it is enticing. I never get tired of warping, jumping, running missions, trading and counting ISK. There are always new abilities to discover, new ships to pilot and new regions to explore. Occasional time spent in EVE is like taking time off and going to some exotic place.

I don't want to take a chance in a player corp and be required to pay taxes, fuel structures, organize raids, spoon feed other players supplies or information, stroke other player's egos or rank, resolve group drama, be stuck with a bunch of whimpering 13-year-old players, and compensate for the consistent lack of true managerial skills in MMOG corp/guild/whatever leaders (especially not the trained, in-game kind). When I have the time to spend a few hours in the EVE universe I want to enjoy it and I can turn it off when I want and when I need. Some players thrive on having this responsibility and devotion. That's great and essential for the universe but the statistics are showing me, in my opinion, that not everyone wants to progress down this same path. NPC corps are providing comparatively little to its members, even taking war-dec into account.

I agree, being unincorporated would be more appropriate for players like myself and I would jump at the chance if I could. The NPC corp is the best option at the time being for a player that looks at the game space as leisure instead of a job.

I cannot comment on the second question for obvious reasons.

Side note: Ambulation could really take for unincorporated players. A corp needing a service is going to want someone competent and efficient. What better way than to meet face to face and discuss a bidder's track record and qualifications in a station environment where contracts aren't just accepted, long duration services can be written and CEOs can move to the next bidder if not satisfied. Take schmoozing, contracting and factions to a whole new level in a true market economy.

Os Kantar
Posted - 2008.01.04 12:51:00 - [126]
 

LOL why would someone want to be in an NPC corp if the player has high SP? There are many reasons why, as listed, and I refuse to repeat what is already listed. Those are some of the problems, but it is not the existence of NPC corps it is in the poor quality of the Player Corps. Heck there is a poor variety in EVE's ingame events itself. But the issue of NPC players is only around because of the chaos in player corps. This blog forced me to ask myself "What does a player corp do for the player?" I must admit that it does not do much for the player. I can do missions inside outside of a player corp, I can do mining inside or outside of a player corp. As stated before players can do group activites inside or out side of a player corp. So the only thing left to the player corp is: 1). POS 2). Corp Hangers 3). internal PVP 4). Wardecs. Well I think that is it.

I think it would be a good idea if EVE brought back some it's old events like races, and other non combat activites, as well as some creative activites. Why not have quarterly ingame tourneys (_isk/blueprints/recognition to the player corp that wins). So the point is to make some good reasons to join a Player Corp so the rewards outweigh the risk. Not just join my corp who is in an alliance at war in 0.0 sec., and will get you shot to pieces."

For the taxes in player corps they serve a decent purpose, but it has no variance on a corps success. It is up to the members themselves if the corp is a success. If a CEO moves his taxes up to 100% without a just reason or no intention to share it with the corp, he can look forward to a very lonely corp chat window. So taxes really holds no evidence on success.

The main issue of Player Corps seems to be the fact that player behaviors are skewd. Everyone it seems, is trying to avoid ship loss, yet complaining when someone goes to work on earning isk for a new ship in high sec. This is a grand paradox. How can someone be mad at a player for staying in high sec while he works on getting another ship for you to blow up? The problem can be related to the ISK farmers the eat up the oppurtunities for players to make isk, and seriously slow down the EVE economy. Pair that with griefers and you have a perfect storm for economic depression. And please stop nerfing industry related stuff trying to get to the isk farmers. You only hurt the real players in the end 0_-?.

And what no snowballs for christmas this year!?!?

DasNara Aethelwulf
Blackwater Syndicate
Ushra'Khan
Posted - 2008.01.05 09:00:00 - [127]
 

Originally by: Maverick Ice
Quote:
1. They are miners or freighter pilots,.....The first group of people also hide behind game mechanics because there is no way to effectively avoid PvP in this game, but unfortunately, a large portion of them are using this mechanic to support their PvP play elsewhere in the game, and are exploiting this unfair advantage to have nearly risk-free play.

Both the first and second groups of people point towards a need to put a skillpoint limit on player's ability to join/remain in NPC corporations, which would rely on mechanics put into place for the third group of players.




Speaking as the miner freighter pilot...i do NOT support any PvP that I do in another portion of the game. I honestly decided that in this game I wanted something different than all the combat games that I played and wanted to try mining and trading. So yes, I do stay in the NPC to stay out of wars...it's bad for buisness and there are very few places that I can go that are 'policed' to do buisness and there is no cavalry to ride to the rescueSad

I don't mind if there was a skill point limit on NPC, maybe that is needed, then there should be a new mechanism that allows a group of merchants/miners to form a corperation and then maybe pay, somehow, the 'government' in there location to give them protect while in that state's territory. If the member of the corperation then attacks someone without cause some form of punishment ensues...maybe CCP automaticlly kicks them from the corperation (somehow). I know that's a lot of new mechanisms for the Dev's, but that would be the only fair way to do it. espically when you think about this game being created as a combat game and then having trade take more and more of the gaming time.

As a side thought, you know its pretty wierd that trade and mining is threatened by pirates, but the 'government' can then turn a blind eye to it. In RL that usually is pretty bad.

lastley, thanks Doc for the new report and keep them coming. They are wonderful reads. It's really helped my gaming expeirence.

Ratzap
Gallente
InterGalactic Corp.
Imperial Republic Of the North
Posted - 2008.01.07 23:33:00 - [128]
 

Originally by: Zilkin
I personally think that you shouldn't be able to keep high sp chars in NPC corps but as long it is possible I'm definitely taking advantage of it.


Precisely. Many have hauler alts to move material around in wartimes - you then only have to worry about getting a clone set up and jump to the theatre.

Personally I think taxing characters in NPC corps based on SP or time spent in NPC corps would fix a lot of the problem. Under 6 months, 0%. 5% extra every 6 months after that. It'd quickly move a hell of a lot of the older mission grinder alts for example and would encourage the runners to band together to make 0% corps.

Ratzap

Lorelei Lee
Posted - 2008.01.13 16:37:00 - [129]
 

I am an NPC corp main. I have one alt in a friend's corp for POS access, and no other characters.
Most of what I have to say has been said before, but an extra data point may be useful anyway.

What I like about the starter NPC corp:
  1. Corp chat. I get to help newbies, discuss all kinds of random topics, make friends with like-minded people (some of whom go on to join PC corps and stay in contact with me), get instant price checks from all over the galaxy, etc.
  2. No wardecs. There are plenty of rewards in low sec space that justify the risk, and I go there when I am feeling adventurous, but most of the time (especially when I log in for only an hour or less) I enjoy a reasonable expectation of peace.

What I don't like about PC corps:
  1. Pressure to participate. I am a casual player and keep my own schedule. I like cooperating, but I don't want to be pressured into ops at inconvenient times, places, or frequency.
  2. Instability and drama. I have yet to meet a corp that hasn't had its share of personality conflicts and other turmoil. One corp did well in that regard because of the energetic and capable CEO that everybody loved, but as soon as the CEO came down with a case of RL, the corp went downhill fast.

What I do like about PC corps:
  1. Teamwork. This is an MMOG, and I like playing in a group. Being in a well-chosen corp provides a fairly stable and compatible group to cooperate with.
  2. POS access. Starbases can do some things that no public facilities can do at all (cap ship construction) or as well (research).
  3. 0.0 access. NPC corp members get shot on sight in 0.0, so in order to gain access, one needs to be in a PC corp.

Reasons I don't need to be in a PC corp to get the benefits above:
  1. Teamwork: I can cooperate with my friends without formally joining their corp(s). Only I get to come and go as I please, with no pressure.
  2. POS access: I have rent-paying alt in a friend's corp for that.
  3. 0.0 access: No solution yet, but I aspire to get rich, powerful, and reputable enough that a whole 0.0 alliance will deal with me seriously as an individual.

One more note: Once I leave my starter corp, I can never go back. I can get dumped into another NPC corp, but never the starter corp. And since I like my starter corp (among other things, because that's where the newbies are), I don't want to take that step.

Lorelei Lee
Posted - 2008.01.13 18:16:00 - [130]
 

More on wardecs, in case anybody is interested. This is not strictly on topic of the blog, but it's been mentioned enough times that I feel justified in commenting.
Originally by: Venko Trenulo
Question 1: A player I know who likes economic PvP rather than pew-pewing ships is still in the noob corp after over 2 years, to avoid wardecs while flying a freighter around with all the minerals to support an enormous 1-person economic empire, producing goods with nearly all the T1 BPO's. This is a main character who does occasional missions for standings and mining for minerals to support the production operation, and who has never left high sec.
This applies to me, except that I do leave high sec a lot, and my markets of choice are different.
I consider my market activities to be generally beneficial to the community, but I can see how some people would want to wardec me because of them. Indeed, I am sure some market manipulators are unhappy about the relative stability I am providing in a certain component market, nor about my antiscam activities in a certain hauler market.
However, from what I gather, most wardecs happen not because of anything the target did, but because somebody perceives them as easy pickings.
Therefore, as long as the wardec mechanic makes it easy for the strong to prey on the weak for no better reason, I will feel justified in hiding behind the NPC corp mechanic to avoid the issue altogether.

Valarianna
Posted - 2008.01.15 13:41:00 - [131]
 

Edited by: Valarianna on 15/01/2008 18:32:51
1st Post, regarding war avoidance

I just spent the last hour scrolling through the replies to this blog and I noticed a remarkable shift over the course of the responses I wanted to point out and comment upon.

When the question was first posed about why an older and experienced player would choose to stay in a NPC corp., the majority of responders were people who were speculating on why they would. And most of the responses were derisive. Then people who actually were in NPC corps started chiming in and the reasons for their reluctance to be in a player corp. did not mesh 100% with the reasons perceived by others.

As a player with over 40 mil sp and who has never been in a player corp., I would like to comment on some of the reasons listed and list a few of my own. While I am more than a little late on the thread, maybe someone will enjoy reading my opinions.

1. NPC corps are for people avoiding wars. This has been shown to be partially true. It used to be true about me. I'm not enthused about pvp because the winner is usually the person who springs the trap and very, very rarely the person who has the trap sprung upon them. My very favorite pvper was a trap door spider. He had the biggest asset in pvping, patience. Personally, I want to be doing something. This means I will generally be the person who is caught in the web. The alternative reason for my not wanting to be caught in a war is isk. It's mine. I made it. I don't want to give the contents of my hold, the salvage from my ship, or a ransom to other people. If I have absolutely no hope of actually winning a war (and I really don't when I usually fly a non-combat ship), why should I show up? I have plenty of people who have resented me over the course of my time in Eve and who would love to war dec me. I have offered an alternative, to show up to a system with a group of people I picked to help me and they could bring their buddies to help them. Then we would slug it out for supremacy. Not one of the lovely idiots who wanted to war dec me took me up on this. Why? Warring in Eve is either an all out brute push between large corps or ambushes that can be aborted in case too big a fly drops in. Nobody wants to show up and realize their opposition is much bigger than they thought it might be. And being in an NPC corp. leaves me to be a dangerous unknown. So, to sum this one up, I am not avoiding combat, I'm avoiding ambushes. This isn't cowardly (as implied by many of the postings), this is simple prudence. After all, people rarely war dec. a corp. they don't think they could beat.

*edited to replace the word trolling for the word scrolling as it was pointed out to me that the association of the word 'trolling' on the forums is negative. Oops.

Valarianna
Posted - 2008.01.15 13:45:00 - [132]
 

2nd Post, regarding Alts

Many of the characters in NPC corps are alts. Sadly, this is true. Personally, I think that any character that is flying around and hasn't trained a skill at least half the time of the last week should show up green on my overview. Why? that is information I want to know (not that I have a right to know it....but I do WANT to know it Wink). If you don't want to be green, play your main. People who create alts to make isk to support their pvp habit are, in my opinion, in the wrong line of work. People who have alts to do their hauling may be saying that their corp. either can't protect them from being destroyed or that their corp. doesn't wish to commit the resources to prevent their demise. Having hauling alts in NPC corps is economically sound and probably won't change. But, and this is a big one, why there are alts in NPC corps is not the point of contention. The question was why experience pilots are in NPC corps. And alts do not qualify as experienced pilots. Sorry if that bursts a bubble, but there it is. I suggest that data be gathered comparing the number of accounts who have trained at least 1 mil of sp in the last month. That would weed out noobs and a lot of the alts. Then compare the data. Age of the character and total sp is great, but there are plenty of alts who got to a certain level and are then were transferred onto another character. Letís face it, a hauling alt needs enough sp to fly a hauler and doesn't need to have that much more sp pumped into it. Summary on this one is that characters who are alts and in NPC corps are irrelevant to the question and should be weeded out of the information accumulated as much as possible.

Valarianna
Posted - 2008.01.15 17:38:00 - [133]
 

3rd Post, regarding greifers

Greifers hide in NPC corps. This is absolutely true, and absolutely awful too. I hate the professional thieves and irritating players that get their jollies from annoying other people. But the quantity of greifers is actually pretty low overall. It takes a special type of person to be that immature and rude for that long. Most people want to be liked; only certain players can be hated for that long before they stop deriving joy from the game. Iíve got a list of people I would love to see punished for their violations of social contracts and most of them are hiding in NPC corps. Iíve got a few ideas about that, but those are reserved for another forum post, as this isnít the place for them. Summary on this one is that the small percentage, while annoying, is there and there should be ways to deal with them that make hiding in an NPC corp. unnecessary.

4th Post, regarding Macro Miners

Macro Miners belong to NPC corps. Probably quite true. I am not a macro miner so I canít really comment on this, nor do I expect somebody to pop up and say they are as itís a one way ticket out of Eve to do so. As such, I will refrain from commenting except to say that CCP has ways of dealing with them and I hope the lot of them are caught and expelled. Summary on this one is to accept they exist and ban them wherever possible. Beyond that there isnít much that can be done and they arenít exactly part of the experienced pilots in NPC corps that the question was posed to.

Valarianna
Posted - 2008.01.15 18:30:00 - [134]
 

5th Post, regarding less time to play

People who have less time to play stick to NPC corps. In many cases this can be true. People who play as they can and not as much as they can do get ejected from corps for lack of participation. Some people do not have the time it takes to invest in a corp. Hey, thatís what NPC corps are for. You want to see if the player base is apathetic? Run a query on NPC corps and ask how often they are logged in on average for the sp ranges over the course of a month. See what shakes loose from that angle. Honestly, somebody with less than a few hours a week to play really shouldnít be trying to keep up with the dynamics of an active corp. Summary, some people donít always have the time to play and if they want to stay in an NPC corp, they should be allowed to.

6th Post, Player Corps are too demanding

Player corps require too much dedication for some people. This one rubs me raw. As an example, Apple is a RL corporation and most people know its name. Do you know the name of its CEO? The majority of people do not. Why? Because itís the corporation we are interested in, not all the individuals. Most people who have made millions based on themselves alone are entertainers. Yet it is normal for businesses to net over a million a year or even to pay millions to their top executives. Why? Because that is the way the world works. If you want to get ahead, you canít do it all yourself. Entertainers make quite a bit of money themselves, but they are hopelessly outclassed by many businesses annual profits. Why should it be any different in Eve? Anybody who thinks that going the solitary route is any less rigorous than belonging to a corp. hasnít put as much thought into it as they should. Itís true that players in corps are expected to show up to corp. activities. There are lists of roles and responsibilities that are given out within a corp in order to make sure that corp succeeds. Hereís the catch, without a corp., the player has to do them ALL. You want something hauled? Pay somebody else to do it, or train up hauling and get in your ship and move it yourself. You need a bunch of minerals? Find a way and pay for them or train up mining. Somebody did something you didnít like? Take care of it yourself. You lost your last ship in the universe and are dead broke? Boy does it suck to be you. Itís about what you, the solitary player, can do and not about what a conglomeration can do. So sure, I can go join BOB or be a Goon and Iíll gain instant recognition when people see the insignia next to the name. Or, conversely, I can be recognized by the few people who know who *I* am because of *MY* accomplishments. And it is really, really hard to be famous without being in a corp. WellÖ.unless I did something really horrible. Notoriety isnít exactly the same. Ask anybody to name 5 people convicted of murder and they can probably do it. Ask them to name 5 CEOís of major corporations and they stand there and stare at you. Same is true in Eve. I donít know who the biggest philanthropist is, but I do know the names of people who have wronged me. Iím only human. Summary here is that solo players have a much more demanding time making ends meet than those in player corps. do.

Valarianna
Posted - 2008.01.15 19:35:00 - [135]
 

1st real reason, impatience

Iím in an NPC corp because I donít have the patience to deal with a player corp. And I havenít seen that one listed yet. I hate waiting for other people. And the more people you put in a corp, the longer the delays become. You want a corp mining op right now? Thatís plain silly. You need to schedule those things in advance. You need something hauled and you canít do it yourself? You better hope the pilot who does move things is both logged in and at loose ends or you better budget time to wait. The bigger the corp the more likely you will spend time waiting instead of doing. And in order to really succeed as a corp, you need a larger membership of individuals who function as a team. This does mean waiting. I get irritated at my husband for taking too long when heís doing a level 4 mission with me. Why? I had to wait for him to catch up in his slower ship. Can you imagine what that same impatience would do when setting up a fleet op? Or gate camping? Iím not interested in being in a corp. all by myself. I get all the drawbacks with none of the perks. I still depend only on myself and I look like some poor lonely individual who nobody loves enough to team up with. No thanks, Iíll pass

2nd real reason, selfishness

Yep, I said it. I want my isk to be my isk. I donít want to spend isk to make the corp a grand and wonderful thing for other people. I want to use my isk to buy expensive toys for me to blow up. Iím willing to pull my weight for myself and I have no interest in putting in extra effort so others can coast along and enjoy the perks. One of my husbands corps was like that. He poured at least 1,000 hours into that corp. for corp activities and mining ops. And he got nothing for it, they even refused to pick him up a cheap skill book because it would displace one zydrine in the hold of their freighter. Is that typical? Not to that extent, no. But on some scale a corporation will take everything that a player can give and very rarely will it return just as much. I know many people in player corps can and will dispute that, but that is the way I feel. Iím just not a team player. Iíll keep my selfishness to myself, I donít need to subject others to the pain of my character flaws.

Valarianna
Posted - 2008.01.15 19:36:00 - [136]
 

3rd real reason, I really donít want a POS or to go into low sec or 0.0

Thatís a big reason to join a corp, right? Many players want either access to a POS or to be safer in low sec or 0.0. Well thatís not my cup of tea. Cost analysis on a POS for my needs is prohibitive. Oh sure, I can get my bpos back out of research faster, but that doesnít help me afford them in the first place. Not to mention the startup and costs of running a POS. Iím also not gambling my ship and my clone on my ability to defend myself. Iíd be one of those people who uses a NPC alt to make isk to fuel my time in 0.0. Why? I absolutely must be able to walk away from the computer to deal with my kids with zero notice and that is the best way to die anyplace Concord isnít holding my hand. I can make sure that my kids are happy when I warp into a difficult mission and I can warp out if I really need to pay attention to the kids. In low and zero sec I can guarantee that a player would bust me out of my ship in less time than it takes for me to determine whether Ďsisters are nosyí is a true statement or just rude. Not the safest thing in the world.

4th real reason, I donít need a corp to socialize.

Chat channels are for socializing, corp channels are for information. I could care less what people are doing in Eve aside from generalizations like Ďminingí or Ďmission runningí or Ďbeating some other pirate corp out of a weeks earningsí. Coordinating activities is a priority in corp chat and I donít want to be told to be silent while everybody else is dealing with something catastrophic. NPC corps are like that as well. You donít deal with something like that because everybody else generally says Ďtake it private and stop bothering usí. Itís part and parcel of waiting. I donít like to wait for other people to get organized before Iím allowed to say something. I want my immediate gratification and I want it right now.

Valarianna
Posted - 2008.01.15 19:50:00 - [137]
 

5th and final reason, I am an individual, not a building block

Iím not an altruistic individual. Iím honest enough to admit that. Iím not happy with the idea of Ďtaking one for the teamí and Iím more interested in making sure that I continue to have a good time playing Eve. If that means that being beholden to others is not on the agenda, then Iím willing to dedicate the time and effort to go solo. Iím not here to help others achieve their definition of winning. Iím not here to build ships to replace the ones lost in fleet ops that I donít care about. Iím not here to funnel my time and abilities into forcibly taking shiny ships away from other people. Iím here to do what I want, when I want. Eve is where I donít need to sacrifice for others. Eve is where I can be selfish and still be good company. I donít need to give people my isk to talk to me. I donít need to build somebody a shiny new ship instead of selling it for a profit. Iím here to succeed on my terms and those do not coincide with a corp. That means leaving my computer idling for a few hours and not having anybody upset by it. So much of my life is spent on other peopleís needs; Eve is one of the few places where I give no quarter. I either enjoy myself on my terms, or I walk away. And the biggest part of that is being an individual. Iím not a mother in Eve. Iím not cutting my cake into pieces in order to make sure that everybody has some. I can chat with people while I blow things up whenever I want to. And that simple thing is what brings me back to Eve time and again.

So, in conclusion, unless I start losing interest in Eve and need an entirely new experience to keep me involved, I will continue to play Eve the way that makes me happy. And that means doing it without the headaches of a corp. Maybe one day Iíll put a massive amount of energy into a corp and gain pleasure watching it blossom, but that day is not today.

Cheri Elise
Posted - 2008.01.18 15:44:00 - [138]
 


We are in NPC corps because we want to be. Stop trying to engineer the game to be the game you want to play. You aren't paying the monthly subscription. We are.

I happen to like PvE play. I want to choose when I will PvP.

Deshcag
Amarr
Association of Freelance Agentrunner
Posted - 2008.02.02 09:11:00 - [139]
 

Edited by: Deshcag on 02/02/2008 09:21:33
Edited by: Deshcag on 02/02/2008 09:17:55
Originally by: Cey Shirii
Originally by: CCP Wrangler

  • Why would an experienced pilot be in a NPC corp?




I spent more time in an NPC corp than the average player. And I have to say that it was really fun. There is a constant stream of new corp memebers, and there were many experienced veterans. Many of my corp members were flying battleships, and we frequently got together and did missions and mining.

It was less of a hassle than in a player-corp. We didn't have to refuel starbases, nobody got mad at each other for not making it to corp pvp/mining ops, there really weren't any superiority issues. And we didn't get ganked every day.
this guy is correct. I too am very wary of player corps I just dont like being told what to do. also I get my ass kicked everytime I go to 0.4 or below and a lot of times im just mining or ratting.(charater not trained for bigger guns or ships yet). but I met a lot of really cool players in the npc corps(game vets) they taught me a lot. and often when is it that you can just ask for assistance and get it most other players dont want to just come out and help. I've tried for over a year now to either form a fleet as a wingman or find a wingman or two, to help protect me while mining in 0'5 and above and no ones interested. alot of these guys dont want to be in large groups.
p.s. make 0.5 red and 0.6 yellow that would solve a lot of problems Ie chinese farmers and macro miners.

Voltaire Leriel
BIG
Gentlemen's Agreement
Posted - 2008.02.08 04:53:00 - [140]
 

Edited by: Voltaire Leriel on 08/02/2008 06:03:17
Originally by: CCP Wrangler
Discussion on the difference in management of corps with 10% tax vs. 100%, and is there a difference in their success?


Somthing that is left out completely in this 100% figure is that corps that share everything do not always have 100% taxes, or even any taxes at all.

My corporation shares EVERYTHING. We have no personal property in BIG, the corp owns everything and no one owns the corp. However, we've chosen not to impose a tax on our members. All members are expected to donate all isk to the corp wallet at all times, and so we operate on a sort of "honor system."

The reason for this is partly accounting, taxes on members flood the corp wallet with entries that make it hard to track everything else that is going on. This would change if we could designate a divisional wallet for taxes to go into. The other reason is that we trust our members to comply with our policies, and don't feel the need to force them to obey.

Does this work? Yes, it does. Rarely does any member in our corp have more than 100m isk at any given time. They only ever have more because they are working on some corp project which requires them to have a lot of cash. The corp provides it's members with all the isk they need to do whatever they want, within reason.

The leadership of the corp determines what is appropriate when there is an issue, usually involving ammounts over 400m isk. Rarely do we turn down a request for money - but we perfer to give the member what they need directly instead of simply wiring them the money for it. This is primarily for security reasons.

It works mainly because we're careful who we recruit. We only accept applicants that we know we can trust to uphold our system, and not take advantage. So far, only a handful of members have ever skimmed isk, and all have been caught and expelled.


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