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DMF KingBob
Posted - 2007.11.28 15:14:00 - [31]
 

just say what grafikcard did u use ?

Anaalys Fluuterby
Caldari
Posted - 2007.11.28 15:17:00 - [32]
 

Originally by: MalVortex
My $350 HP laptop has an integrated 6200. It has SM3.0. Work laptops don't have dedicated GPUs... *bites tounge* you don't say?

No, read again. I said the laptop MY work provided me has the crappy Intel setup. You know, that one required for the "Centrino" buzz-word that everyone that doesn't know has bought into?

My wife's cheapie has a 6200 also. Shader 3 is painfully slow on it though; I would stay with the legacy setup on it...

MalVortex
Applied Agoraphobia
Posted - 2007.11.28 15:18:00 - [33]
 

Edited by: MalVortex on 28/11/2007 15:20:59
PS3.0 is included in DX9.0C.

Direct X works in an "all of the above system". You can install DX 9.0C on *anything*. The card will simply execute the content up to its level. If the card can't support DX9.0C standard, it will execute all the content that it can. Presuming its not a drastic difference this means you'll get things like no HDR, no shaders, no texture filters, but a core game thats still operable. For large differences, the game will either refuse to run or crash rapidly.

If MS wasnt trying to ***** out DX10 as a vista selling point, wed all be installing DX 10.1 right now. Of course, thats not the case, hence the reason why theres two currently supported DX versions for the first time.

Edit: sorry, I reread your post and I still can't read it as anything but a whine against improved client with SM3.0 support. Your second post doesn't sound like a whine though, so I'm probably too tired to read it correctly. Yay insomnia?

Trishan
Green Men Incorporated
Posted - 2007.11.28 15:47:00 - [34]
 

I don't want fancier graphics. I want simpler graphics, less effects. DirectX 1 if you will. Solid gouraud under 20 polygon models.

Seriously. And you know there's more people who would like to have this kind of graphics too.

Jurgen Cartis
Caldari
Interstellar Corporation of Exploration
Posted - 2007.11.28 16:28:00 - [35]
 

Originally by: Trishan
I don't want fancier graphics. I want simpler graphics, less effects. DirectX 1 if you will. Solid gouraud under 20 polygon models.

Seriously. And you know there's more people who would like to have this kind of graphics too.


In short, you want old-school Elite?

SM3 graphics cards aren't that hard to come across for desktops, any NVidia Series 6, 7 or 8 and any ATI Radeon X1 or X2 generation card will work. You can even find a few out there for AGP 8x slots, for those with older motherboards.

Crumplecorn
Gallente
Eve Cluster Explorations
Posted - 2007.11.28 16:37:00 - [36]
 

Edited by: Crumplecorn on 28/11/2007 16:37:22
Originally by: Anaalys Fluuterby
Originally by: MalVortex
My $350 HP laptop has an integrated 6200. It has SM3.0. Work laptops don't have dedicated GPUs... *bites tounge* you don't say?

No, read again. I said the laptop MY work provided me has the crappy Intel setup. You know, that one required for the "Centrino" buzz-word that everyone that doesn't know has bought into?

My wife's cheapie has a 6200 also. Shader 3 is painfully slow on it though; I would stay with the legacy setup on it...
My laptop is a centrino duo and it supports SM3.0.


Anyway (to all whiners, not you personally), CCP are still supporting the old client, which is more than most companies would do, so STFU.

Wolverine PL
Gallente
The Scope
Posted - 2007.11.28 16:48:00 - [37]
 

Good that trinity will req only dx9c, I dont need to install that sh*** Vista

DMF KingBob
Posted - 2007.11.28 16:58:00 - [38]
 

yes nobody want support microsofts next-gen-grafik-only-at-our-new-expensiv-sennsless-operratingsystem-tactic

Grez
Neo Spartans
Laconian Syndicate
Posted - 2007.11.28 17:02:00 - [39]
 

DX9.0c is not the same as SM3.0.

Just because your card supports DX9.0c games, doesn't mean it supports SM3.0.

Also, what's all this whining about not being able to play any more? The classic (old) engine is still being supported, so you can still run EVE as you can now.

Want to play EVE on high settings?
Get a computer setup that can support it. Just like every other game.

Scorp
Gallente
Fusion Enterprises Ltd
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2007.11.28 17:05:00 - [40]
 

I'm sorry if I am geting the wrong side of this moan and winge, but are you complaining about a supported feature that with your setup you wouldn't even be able to run any way? your kidding right? Try running your system spec with the premium engine with anything beyond a few things going on. Your system will die.

Just as an example and its a very poor one at the moment. trinity is very 'unstable' at the moment. Yes it doesnt crash or die but due to the fact the optimizations aren't in place on the current engine it kills itself on frame rate. Ask any body with a high end system at the moment (something like a 8800 with at least a 2.7ghz core2 and at least 2gig of memory) the game kills itself if you zoom out (yes zoom out) on the station in FD, with around 40 people outside.

This isn't a mock at your setup or anything its the fact you expect to run a high end client on a low end spec. You can hack all these great games you like. SupCom etc arent ment to be supported on your setup its as simple as that. Ever thought these standards are in place for these type of reasons?

DMF KingBob
Posted - 2007.11.28 17:19:00 - [41]
 

Edited by: DMF KingBob on 28/11/2007 17:19:08
A64 x2 3800
3gb ram
x800xl

this is not low end dude

ccp should have a user stat of the users hardware

Jakus Cemendur
Caldari
Invicta.
Advocated Destruction
Posted - 2007.11.28 17:22:00 - [42]
 

It's low end if it doesn't have a shader model 3 GPU, especially given how long shader model 3 GPUs have been out.

Cardice Makar
Dark Knights of Deneb
Posted - 2007.11.28 17:26:00 - [43]
 

Originally by: Scorp

Just as an example and its a very poor one at the moment. trinity is very 'unstable' at the moment. Yes it doesnt crash or die but due to the fact the optimizations aren't in place on the current engine it kills itself on frame rate. Ask any body with a high end system at the moment (something like a 8800 with at least a 2.7ghz core2 and at least 2gig of memory) the game kills itself if you zoom out (yes zoom out) on the station in FD, with around 40 people outside.



There's a certain amount of truth to this. I believe the rendering optimizations *are* in place, but there are still some issues. I have a feeling that the issues we're seeing here won't be fixed for a while, though they're certainly addressable in the long run.

I get very acceptable framerates generally, on both the premium and classic clients. When I first loaded up the Premium client, I instinctively set all graphics settings to their max. I have to admit, it looked pretty, but the performance hit was significant. Upon further consideration, I dropped the shadow-level and my fps increased dramatically. Shadow calculations, especially with shadow-maps, is not an easy process in EVE... there are a large number of entities involved.

As it stands, I've forced AA and AS in the driver settings and use HDR in game. With Normal shadows, in FD-, I see about 40-60 fps. This is respectable, no doubt about it. In a skirmish warfare with about 30-v-30 on the classic client, I would see about the same fps counts, and in FD- you can generally assume there's about 40-60 people outside station at any given time.

I have to say I'm fairly impressed with the client as a whole. It's very pretty. But I know for a fact that *architecturally* the X800 series just isn't up to par. I owned one, afterall. Even with the Bioshock 'bastardization' it looks quite superior on a true SM3 card. The investment to buy a nv6X series card is not that high, and they come in AGP variations. SM3 is a great deal better than SM2.

[Hardware, for your consideration: c2d - Q6600, 8800GT, 2gb of ram]

Hatch
Minmatar
4 Marketeers
Rura-Penthe
Posted - 2007.11.28 17:28:00 - [44]
 

ok, sm3 is a limitation based on your video card. DirectX has no bearing on wether or not your card is sm3 ready. To tell wether or not your card is sm3 ready, go read the technical specs of the card itself. Mine will handle up to sm4 :P

DMF KingBob
Posted - 2007.11.28 17:29:00 - [45]
 

for you is it low for other is it a dream....or simple acceptable

achoura
Posted - 2007.11.28 17:39:00 - [46]
 

Long version:

I agree it isnt low end, but that card is, in fact its pretty crappy. I mean every game since bf2 installs dx9.c by default which is when i bought my 7800gt and it's running this stuff well at 1680x1050 but even i know it's needing upgraded in the next few months just to keep up with technology and on that note graphics cards really haven't been this cheap or powerful ever.

I paid £225 for this 7800gt, the dx10 equivalent the 8800gt is £170 so i am not complaining. Least it's going to be even cheaper when i need it.

Short version:

Technological advancement is not going to stop today because you need to buy a new card to replace you old one to play a game which is actually only being upgraded to last generations technology. If it weren't for people like you with older cards we would be recieveing a dx10 upgrade instead.

Lulu Nakura
Caldari
Posted - 2007.11.28 17:43:00 - [47]
 

ehh... has anyone said not to feed the trolls yet?

St'oto
Elite Predators
Posted - 2007.11.28 18:32:00 - [48]
 

go buy a Nvidia Geforce 7900 GT it runs the new graphics engine + the models like a dream. Plus its not that expensive. I love this card even tho this christmas im upgrading to a 8800 GT

Anaalys Fluuterby
Caldari
Posted - 2007.11.28 18:35:00 - [49]
 

Originally by: Crumplecorn

Anyway (to all whiners, not you personally), CCP are still supporting the old client, which is more than most companies would do, so STFU.

I know, and am very happy they are.

I was just responding to the comment of "There isn't any reason you can't run SM 3.0 blah blah blah"... Wink There are situations that can prohibit it.

My main machine has a higher-end x1950 and is fine. But I'm always in the living room with the family instead of hiding in the computer room.....

DMF KingBob
Posted - 2007.11.28 18:38:00 - [50]
 

still waiting for Radeon HD3600xt
or have my eyes of this
http://geizhals.at/deutschland/a293843.html

Kyra Felann
Gallente
The Scope
Posted - 2007.11.28 18:49:00 - [51]
 

Originally by: Juha85
Originally by: DMF KingBob
may should delete the trininty Trailer from my desktop to stop thinking about

and keep watching by the Revelation 2 Trailer

or does CCP make an Trinity Classic Trailer for me and the other non-SM3 Dx9 Grafikcard users ?


So because your graphic card is from the stone age every other Eve-player should suffer from this and not get upgraded graphics?


+1

Ezekiel Sulastin
Gallente
Shiva
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2007.11.28 19:30:00 - [52]
 

My integrated Quadro FX Go1400* (yes, gaming with a mobile NVIDIA Quadro card, LULZ) that is three-plus years old on my 2.6 year old laptop supports SM 3.0. I think it is perfectly reasonable for CCP to develop and optimize graphics content runnable on cards from multiple generations ago ... and as mentioned above, they still allow for the non SM3 graphics ...

/not signed

*IIRC it's based on the GeForce 6800, with alterations to run autocad/etc. software better at the expense of most games.

Trishan
Green Men Incorporated
Posted - 2007.11.28 19:34:00 - [53]
 

Originally by: Jurgen Cartis
Originally by: Trishan
I don't want fancier graphics. I want simpler graphics, less effects. DirectX 1 if you will. Solid gouraud under 20 polygon models.

Seriously. And you know there's more people who would like to have this kind of graphics too.


In short, you want old-school Elite?

SM3 graphics cards aren't that hard to come across for desktops, any NVidia Series 6, 7 or 8 and any ATI Radeon X1 or X2 generation card will work. You can even find a few out there for AGP 8x slots, for those with older motherboards.

Well, if you put it that way... yes :) But then I still play angband... and omega...

Solbright altaltaltaltt
Posted - 2007.11.28 19:35:00 - [54]
 

As long as the new classic client renderer is updated with more hardware rendering, and hopefully will be faster than premium client, I'll never want to change.

Give me zero stuttering and I'll be happy with wire frames.


Tareen Kashaar
Gyoza Society
The Star Fraction
Posted - 2007.11.28 19:53:00 - [55]
 

Originally by: CCP Explorer
There is a really good reason for requiring SM 3 for the new Premium Graphics Content in EVE Online: Trinity. We use very complicated shaders in the new art content with much more instructions than SM 2 supports.


Tongue-in-cheek , but... There's this thing called optimization, ever heard of it? Twisted Evil

Gallatyn
Posted - 2007.11.28 19:58:00 - [56]
 

we should be happy that the new trinity engine doesn“t require dx10. it would be no fun to use this crap os called windows vista.

Eternal Hatred
Amarr
Pantsu Garu Limited Technologies
Posted - 2007.11.28 20:29:00 - [57]
 

I demand CCP cancel this STUPID and rasist patch that will not tolerate SM 2.0 people and work with stoneage technology!!!!! Evil or Very Mad

M1AU
Gallente
Posted - 2007.11.28 20:42:00 - [58]
 

I'll vote for SM 2.0.

Alex75a
Posted - 2007.11.28 21:22:00 - [59]
 

/signed

Arrow vote for SM 2.0.

petergriffen
Amarr
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2007.11.28 21:37:00 - [60]
 

Originally by: DMF KingBob
Edited by: DMF KingBob on 28/11/2007 17:19:08
A64 x2 3800
3gb ram
x800xl

this is not low end dude

ccp should have a user stat of the users hardware


That's pretty low end for a gaming machine, to be honest

to the others wishing for SM2 -

Upgrade your computer. If you don't want to, then use the classic graphics. If you don't want to...

...can I have your stuff?


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