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Karandor
Minmatar
Brutor Tribe
Posted - 2007.10.23 22:34:00 - [301]
 

Originally by: Goumindong
Edited by: Goumindong on 23/10/2007 20:10:53
Originally by: Elmicker
Why does the amarr one get so many drones in comparison to the gallente one? It's ridiculous when coupled with its neuting capability.

As for the black ops, covert cynos are a bad thing all round, imo, but i'll wait to see them in action on sisi before passing judgement. The sin and kronos look to be ridiculously overpowered right from the outset, so situation normal with the gallente, but apart from that, i dont think i can add anything to the discussion. Nice blog and nice work.


The keres is miles miles miles miles better than the Sentinel. Wooo, frigate neuts to 20km, oh wait, worse than a single battleship neut, doesnt incap frigates or any other ships naerly as fast as any of the other three ships, and also isnt a damage bonus.

Its only redeeming feature is that its an amarr frigate and has 4 meds.

Originally by: Kagura Nikon
Quote:
vargur stuff


It would be awesome if it wad the PG to fit 4 Arties with 1 PG module. It needs at LEAST 9K PG.



I would agree with that. Though with the falloff bonus, ACs should be just fine for missions.


The sentinel will neut 300/6s that's the same as 2 hvy neuts 1200/24s. That pretty nasty for being a frig. I honestly think all these frigs will be a bane to nano-gangs, well less so the caldari one.

Even with falloff bonus and barrage you're looking at 60km range with ACs. That's okay for missions but it limits damage type and is still a bit short range for missions when you consider the reduced DPS in deep falloff. Give it some grid and let it use artillery. A maelstrom can fit 8 1400 II with no problems, I don't know why it would be wrong for the vargur to fit 4 even with it's range and tracking bonus. Hell it IS T2.

Deva Blackfire
Viziam
Posted - 2007.10.23 22:39:00 - [302]
 

Originally by: Karandor

The sentinel will neut 300/6s that's the same as 2 hvy neuts 1200/24s. That pretty nasty for being a frig. I honestly think all these frigs will be a bane to nano-gangs, well less so the caldari one.



Too short ranges/too vulnerable to kill nano gangs. 18km nosf or 20km web wont turn off for ex. vaga. And as soon as vaga releases drones say bye bye recon frig. And its same with other nanoships.

Damion Zyne
Queens of the Stone Age
Rote Kapelle
Posted - 2007.10.23 22:39:00 - [303]
 

Urm, so you want to run missions with barrage? Yes there are only 4 guns but funny enough, CCP gave us also a ROF bonus. This will get expensive.

Merdaneth
Amarr
Defensores Fidei
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
Posted - 2007.10.23 22:48:00 - [304]
 

Ok, I am going to try and post my thoughts about the new Amarr ships, and be as constructive as possible. My corp only flies Amarr, so its really the only class that matters to me.

Sentinel
I am not sure what is role would be. It has no unique defining characteristic, no novel functionality. The Crucifier, Arbitrator and Curse/Pilgrim can all do what it does, only much better or cheaper (or both). For the price it will go for, I can outfit a Arbitrator with neuts and nos, tracking disruptors, achieve nearly the same effect and have more drones, more dps and a better tank at a lower price. I would not particulary desire one in my small gang.

A major advantage that is mentioned with the new EAS, locking time, is not a concern with Tracking Disruptors. It can be hugely useful for ECM, Scram and Web, but not for TD's. Also, you do know that a frig size ship doesn't even need TD's to avoid fire from battleship size guns?

In short, the Sentinel is not bad in itself, it just adds nothing new to the Amarr arsenal, while such ships as the Hyena and Keres do. They have clear new roles. I would love to have one in my small gang.

Devoter
With those disruption fields it certainly has a novel and clearl defined role. Although being rarely involved in 0.0 wars, I hope it will be able to deploy it's field in Empire as well. With only three mid slots and four guns, it would simply be an even tankier Maller. Tank all the way, and just forget about doing damage, just go nos/neut. Means two unused bonuses, but both bonuses just make it mediocre. Not terribly exciting ship, but doable I guess. Poor in comparison to the others of its class.

If it isn't useable outside outside of 0.0, I see no single reason to ever use it. Any other Amarr ship does a better job for its price.

Redeemer
Again, fairly clear role. I don't care much for the tracking bonus. It means one more medslot left if you want to fit tracking computers. Seems acceptable, again, nothing really exciting to look forward too, and since I'm not staking a claim to 0.0 space and these ships will cost a fortune, thanks but no thanks. May be useful to others though.

Paladin
I curious to its role. I can't find any role for it that another Amarr ship already does better. Not to mention for a much cheaper price tag. This class of ships (considering the skill requirements and price) are supposed to appeal to veteran mission runners, right? I'll tell you what veteran mission runners are looking for: doing their mission faster. Most veteran mission runners know their missions, and can already tank them quite fine (otherwise they won't be veterans). More mission speed can be achieved by doing more dps, specifically more dps at greater ranges, and having more speed (moving between gates etc.).

Also, I assume that as T2 ship it has only 2 rigs slots. Losing a rig slot and keeping the same cap consumption for its guns at the Apoc, means that the Paladin.

T2 resistance bonuses are largely useless. No sane person uses Apoc's in Angel missions, it will just take forever.

My mission Armaggedon will do missions significantly faster (more dps, more speed) and will cost only a fraction of what the Paladin will cost. Apoc's are good mission ships for starting players, since you can be effective without much skills, once you are a veteran, you use a Geddon or an Abaddon.

More cargo is largely meaningless, since cap booster charges or ammo isn't used by the Paladin on missions.

As for the free high slots: maybe for those who want to salvage, but personally, I believe in a dedicated salvager in the times that I actually want to salvage (no, not everyone does that).

As a new ship class, it has no role at all, and is generally poorer at anything than the current available ship classes (except for the Apoc itself possibly). Navy Apoc beats it hands down. Will never fly it. Collector's toy.

Mack Dorgeans
Camelot Innovations
Posted - 2007.10.23 22:51:00 - [305]
 

Originally by: Deva Blackfire
Originally by: Mack Dorgeans
Originally by: Deva Blackfire
Originally by: Mack Dorgeans
Guessing all these will be invention-only, will the drops in hacking exploration sites be increased once they're removed from the farmable Cosmos areas? Decryptor prices are going to skyrocket, especially when people are going to lose a LOT of datacores each time a battleship invent fails.

Frankly, I think with this many ships intended for everyday use, the BPOs should be seeded to the R&D agents, or else there won't be enough supply and invention overhead plus demand is going to make capitals look cheap in comparison.



Its not that much tbh. I did my shopping today, abt 900mil for 10x invention job (+9 run decryptors). So after 4 t2 BS sold you should start getting invested iskies back (and thats with LOW BS prices).


If you don't think invention materials are going to get more expensive, then you're deluding yourself. Some people hoarding decryptors and cores now are going to make a killing when Rev 3 goes live.



Thats why:
1. i know cheap sources
2. i bought quite a lot in advance (atm abt 2-4bil in cores/decryptors)
3. im runing my rnd agents

Also the so called "killing" passed already. Mech.eng. cores are slowly stabilising, the times when you could sell em for 3-4mil/piece already passed. Same for decryptors, sorry :)


Don't be sorry -- it won't be a big deal to me. I'm just pointing out that for the "common man" it will be expensive to invent these things, and without BPOs, there will be no baseline for pricing and availability.

Aslann
Gallente
The Scope
Posted - 2007.10.23 22:56:00 - [306]
 

Originally by: Anzig
the de-cloak, volley, cloak cycle has to take longer to give the opposition a chance to react.

Dont normal cloaks have a 30s reactivation timer?

Hon Kovell
Gallente
Neh'bu Kau Beh'Hude
Ushra'Khan
Posted - 2007.10.23 22:58:00 - [307]
 

Originally by: Ma Zhiqiang
Seems like many of the ships are getting cross racial bonuses...

These seem to be the traditional bonuses:

Amarr - armor resist bonus, laser damage/cap need, cap increase, tracking disr bonus, energy emission bonus
Caldari - shield resist bonus, hybrid range bonuses, ecm bonus
Gallente - armor rep amount bonus, hybrid tracking/damage, warp jamming bonus
Minmatar - shield boost bonus, projectile damage/rof, web bonus

Unless the designers behind these new ship types have "borrowed" technology from other sources.... . .. . ..
Speed and mass have also changed. The standard is the order Minmatar, Amarr, Gallente, Caldari from fastest/lightest to slowest/heaviest. All those swap Gallente and Amarr.

Deva Blackfire
Viziam
Posted - 2007.10.23 22:58:00 - [308]
 

Originally by: Mack Dorgeans
Originally by: Deva Blackfire

Thats why:
1. i know cheap sources
2. i bought quite a lot in advance (atm abt 2-4bil in cores/decryptors)
3. im runing my rnd agents

Also the so called "killing" passed already. Mech.eng. cores are slowly stabilising, the times when you could sell em for 3-4mil/piece already passed. Same for decryptors, sorry :)


Don't be sorry -- it won't be a big deal to me. I'm just pointing out that for the "common man" it will be expensive to invent these things, and without BPOs, there will be no baseline for pricing and availability.



Oh but there IS baseline. Its base production costs (materials) + invention costs (including chances to get BPC, per one run). Atm it was abt 550/650 (tier1/2 t2 bs) materials + 100mil invention costs (per each run). And i guess baseline will be abt 700/800mil for em (+-100mil). Ofc when prices stabilise, first months will be insane tho.

As for "starting inventors"... well materials to build one ship cost over 0,5b - so its WAY out of their reach. Also include prices of ship interfaces...

New inventors should start with modules. Fairly cheap, easy to invent, neats good results.

SO: "common man": modules, frigs/dictors/maybe HACs... T2 bs/commands need much more iskies for starters (but on other hand if succesfull can give VERY nice results).

The Cosmopolite
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
Posted - 2007.10.23 23:07:00 - [309]
 

Going to have to apologise if this is clear but I've tried searches and wading through a few threads to no avail.

Can a covert cynosural field be generated in a system with a cyno jammer active in it?

If not, what argument is there for this?

If yes, what argument is there against this?

My own position is that large swathes of 0.0 are turning into black holes for the purposes of cyno generation (which may or may not be a good thing when it comes to capital cynoing) and this raises a real question as to the utility of Black Ops battleships and covert cynoing if it is suppressed by basic cyno jammer structures.

I can see the arguments for cyno jammers as a defense against capitals. I have issues with the implementation myself but that's by-the-by in this context.

I can't really see the argument for cyno jammers, as is, suppressing covert cyno fields as those fields cannot be used to jump in capitals: only the Black Ops BS and any covert ships it bridges in.

The Black Ops BS is a limited ship as it is (perhaps rightly, I'm not arguing its basic stats) but to have its actual role as a covert infiltration platform limited so drastically by the phenomenon of mass cyno-jamming would be a bit disappointing.

Cosmo

Mordus Operandi
Posted - 2007.10.23 23:27:00 - [310]
 

dunno about all of this...

-Electronic Attack Ships are cool, but honestly, what is being done about the assault frigates and interceptors?

EW getting addressed is cool for the frigate class, but honestly its like things went a little overboard. I mean, we really do have mini-recons now as opposed to t2 EW ships. what that does is make many of the other t2 ships (assault frigate and interceptor less useful). if the Electronic Attack Ships are as shown, what role does the Assault Frigate play? it gets none of the toys or mid slots of any of these new frigates and like slightly better shield/armor hp?



Black Ops
- again a little too much on this ship. the covert cyno and jump bridge are neat ideas but on a cloaking, realitvely badass Battleship, that can jump, and jump bridge.
if anything i would put the covert jump bridge on a barge that has NO combat abilities (but maybe some good command abilities and a cloak) and give IT a decent jump drive and a longish ranged jump bridge.

as it is, you know everyone and their grandpa's are going to want a GOOD cloaking JUMPING BS, and that is how it's going to be used, with the covert jump bridge as a nice 'whatever' option.

-Marauders ... a lot of people have been calling it the t2 mission ship, i would like to ask - why the heck do we need a ship dedicated to running missions?! the SECOND the state issue raven is even a semi-regular option for production, you have your safe, 0.5+ mission tub; leave the mass producable t2 ships for pvp. the tractor beam bonus is silly.

if you want to help mission runners, invent a way to make it worth while to do missions in gangs - the "im going to die if i dont have someone remote repping me" is a poor excuse to run a mission, easily countered by "use a bigger ship, like this one! *cnr* *sir* *marauder* *carrier*." if the point is co-op, and the problem is that the reward is never worth spliting it with all of the party members, fix the reward system so that say 2 people can make maybe 75% of the what one could make solo on a job so that in the end the mission time drops be not so much the reward players get at the end.

if there is concern about abuse, you could limit the number of co-op missions accepted by a given character to ~6 a day or something - depending on what the rewards are like.


-Heavy Interdictors, these look promising, though im kind of confused.

Firstly can the heavy dictor use it's mwd w/o penalty while it's warp disrupt field generator (WDFG) is on? I would like to assume no from the screenshots ive seen of the module, but the blog seems to say different (balancing mass reduction and thrust bonus to do all sorts of weird things).

Secondly, does the WDFG have a warp scramble strength (and thus allows stabs to save your butt), or is it like a warp disrupt probe/mobile warp bubble?
(I would hope it just has a low warp scramble strength (1-2) thus leaving the current interdictor with a role aside from close range frigate killing)

assuming it does have a warp scramble strength, if the fields overlap will the scramble strength stack or not?

Thirdly, does it disrupt capital ship jump drives?
(again something that i think should be left to the interdictor)

Twarda Sztuka
Posted - 2007.10.23 23:48:00 - [311]
 

I read the specs of the Electronic Attack Ships and somehow I could only see following as description of the bonuses:
* CCP decided to make Recons obsolete 10%
* CCP decided to make Recons obsolete 10%
* CCP decided to make Recons obsolete 5%
* CCP decided to make Recons obsolete 10%

I just think you gave new ship category by completely removing from gameplay another.

1) They will be cheaper to produce than recons are.
2) They have similiar bonuses to EW
3) They have similiar number of med slots.
4) Recons have better cap but bonuses from EASes cancel the difference
5) Recons have to fill many slots with sensor boosters/signal amplifiers to have comparable lock time.
6) EASes are faster and more maneuverable.

There are one or two things that recons are better at:
more hull/armor/shields - But it basically means that while recon had to be shot 1 time, EAS has to be shot only half of that.
Bigger targeting range - however in 1:1 fight frig will lock sooner and use its EW on other ship.
Granted the EASes don't have bonuses to cloak, but most of the time Recons are used in either stealth or EW role (not both at the same time).

Recons will became just a bunch of parts flying in close formation.

Now I know it sounds like typical whining, but take into account that I'm usually quite optimistic person. Now, take a while and imagine what will happen on forum after their introduction to the game.

d026
temp holding
Posted - 2007.10.23 23:49:00 - [312]
 

Edited by: d026 on 23/10/2007 23:51:16

i just ran some numbers trough eft:

golem dps (missiles only + 4 x dg bcu): 698
golem dps (+drones): 929

cnr dps (missiles only + 4 x dg bcu): 815 dps
cnr dps (+ drones and 425mm II): 1009 dps


why in hell should anyone change to the golem? noobs who dont have the isk for a gist booster and desperately need 8 mids (lol)?

golem = complete fail ! also volley damage is not that impressive considering you don't get a rof bonus..

edit/ this is with with old launcher stats and torps




Axe 2Gr1nd
Posted - 2007.10.24 00:16:00 - [313]
 

Not being a Huge Ship stat hoar these ships look pretty cool,

But I do have one pressing question that I would like answered:
Quote:
Rather than using warp disrupt probes, the heavy interdictors use a module, the Warp Disruption Field Generator, which prevents all ships within its range from warping or jumping (including the heavy interdictor itself).


I'm Guessing that Jumping ref's to Capital/Black op cyno Jumping.

as atm, Interdictors are effective at catching & locking down ship coming into system at the gate they are camping. But at first read of this I thought this would mean that you could stop ships from jumping out of the gate that you are camping by putting a Heavy interdictor on the gate covering the 2.5km gate activation range.

Then there is the question of Scramble strength & What sec levels this module can be activated.

thanks heaps, as I don't think I will have time to hop on Sisi this week.
enjoy

Kagura Nikon
Minmatar
Emptiness.
Posted - 2007.10.24 00:20:00 - [314]
 

Originally by: d026
Edited by: d026 on 23/10/2007 23:51:16

i just ran some numbers trough eft:

golem dps (missiles only + 4 x dg bcu): 698
golem dps (+drones): 929

cnr dps (missiles only + 4 x dg bcu): 815 dps
cnr dps (+ drones and 425mm II): 1009 dps


why in hell should anyone change to the golem? noobs who dont have the isk for a gist booster and desperately need 8 mids (lol)?

golem = complete fail ! also volley damage is not that impressive considering you don't get a rof bonus..

edit/ this is with with old launcher stats and torps






None of the ships got increased DPS but the Kronos. The Ammar oen ahs same DPS the minmatar one has the DPS of a maesltrom (but cant use arties )

PRoblem is mainly on the paladion that is a joke, both low DPS and a stupid web bonus for a ship that is supposed to be king of MIDDEL range fight. Change the web bonsu to 5% damage bonus per level than it will be ok.

Give the matari oen PG to fit 1200mm arties whiel usign 1 PG mod, at LEAST

Golen is not bad, the secondary bonus give a real increase in lethality and its the king tank of game now.


ALL of thsoe ships need bigger drone bays. What the hell a loong tiem incursion ship without drone reserves? Double the drone bay of each one.

Princess Kristie
Caldari
Scion Innovations
Posted - 2007.10.24 00:20:00 - [315]
 

Edited by: Princess Kristie on 24/10/2007 01:28:43
Edited by: Princess Kristie on 24/10/2007 00:26:23
The sentinel looks decent (for an ''Amarr'' drone-GALLENTE-based ship)... nice drone capability and seemingly non-stop neut... PASS (since drone.. i.e gallente ftw)

Heavy interdictor: SINCE WHEN DOES GALLENTE HAVE ARMOR RESIST... give them their armor rep bonus... and the devoter with fracking only 4 turret slots (LEAST DPS OF THEM ALL) why bother with TWO turret bonuses??? replace the cap bonus with armor hp bonus... yes the cap bonus instead of the rof bonus since I do NOT WANT TO USE projectile weapons... FAIL

Redeemer... tracking bonus is ok... 3 weapon bonuses... nice... PASS

AND THE BEST OF THEM ALL (SARCASM ON)

THE MIGHTY PALADIN with NO FRACKING difference to an apocalypse DPS... Apocalypse 19500 pg... paladin 13,500 pg... a whooping 31% pg reduction FRACK!!!!! Megatron 15500 pg...Kronos 12,000mw ... and that's ONLY 23% pg reduction.... see the big difference?????????? GALLENTE FTW...FRACK!!!!! I was SOOOO hoping i would not have to use my low slots for fitting mods... SOOOOO hoping that i could use those useful and ""plentiful"" low slots to IMPROVE the apocalypse's suckiness...

Let me go through the bonuses:

5% bonus to capacitor capacity per Amarr BS level
SIGH... this ****ty bonus still made it... ok this give the Amarr ship some flavor... and useful since Apocalypse is a tanker... HOWEVER an armor hp bonus or armor resist bonus would have been better... yes a godly tank (since the apocalypse has '''super''' dps)

2% bonus to stasis webifier velocity factor per Amarr BS level
Soooooooooooo to fully utilise this bonus, now you want the """"mighty-range""" advantaged amarr laser weapons be used at WEB RANGE i.e 10 km ?!?!?!? FRACKING GALLENTE!!! Give this ship a web RANGE bonus

7.5% bonus to armor repair amount per Marauder level
ok its a good skill but WTF is Gallente doing here??? Y are the devs messing with racial bonuses... I Am sure there are Amarr bonuses like Armor hp or armor resist bonus.... YES MAKE this ship a godly tank (since it has has '''super''' dps)

7.5% bonus to large energy turret tracking per Marauder level
Useful... but sigh at '''super''' dps...

Role bonus: 100% bonus to large energy turret damage
Nice

Role bonus: 100% bonus to range and velocity of tractor beams
Whatever

Conclusion: BIG BIG FAIL
Gallente (web bonus fit for blaster weapons)
Minmatar (3 weapon bonuses = sex... ok no ewar... however u can have a target painter bonus if u want...)
And what was said before... dammage bonus with role bonus = WIN!!!

VERY VERY DISAPPOINTED AGAIN WITH AMARR SUCKINESS!!!!





riprjak
Hermits Rest
Posted - 2007.10.24 00:30:00 - [316]
 

Edited by: riprjak on 24/10/2007 00:31:55
Originally by: FireFoxx80
Edited by: FireFoxx80 on 23/10/2007 12:30:18
Marauders
Simply, WTF?! This simply seems to be a means of appeasing the mission runners of Eve. 100% bonus to tractor beam, increased damage, and increased resists. You might as well up mission bounties and have all level5 agents require a standing of 1.0 whilst you're at it.



Untrue; as a solo missioner who exclusively uses ravens (yes, just ravens, not CNRs and only tech II fitted to keep costs down), I feel competent to comment. With the low slot nerf (1 less BC) and the removal of the ROF bonus (and even assuming the x2 damage stacks with skill and implant bonusses); this will do less damage with cruises than a normal raven with optimal fittings. Since there doesnt exist a level 4 mission that can break a standard raven's shield tank as it stands (assuming, of course you have adequete skills) the improvements to shield boosting aren't necessary. As for the tractor boost, it will still be less effective than an alt in a cormorant rigged for salvage. So this ship will take longer to kill everything in your extravaganza (or whatever) and, therefore, is a burden on your sanity and income rate... With cruise missile blast radiuses already at about 100m (50m with precisions) given reasonable missile skills, there is no real need to improve a raven's ability to kill mission frigates.

I suppose my summary is that this ship offers nothing to a missioner beyond the need to blow several months training redundant T2 ship skills.

However, It seems that it posesses a rather pleasant anti-frigate alpha for busting tacklers. I've yet to encounter a pvp situation where the fire rate of my missile boat was that important; and improved shield boosting is absolutely critical as is painting the stickier targets for others. So my summary now is that everything the Golem does, it does for pvp gangs.

err!
jak

d026
temp holding
Posted - 2007.10.24 00:33:00 - [317]
 

Edited by: d026 on 24/10/2007 00:34:29
Originally by: Kagura Nikon
Originally by: d026
Edited by: d026 on 23/10/2007 23:51:16

i just ran some numbers trough eft:

golem dps (missiles only + 4 x dg bcu): 698
golem dps (+drones): 929

cnr dps (missiles only + 4 x dg bcu): 815 dps
cnr dps (+ drones and 425mm II): 1009 dps


why in hell should anyone change to the golem? noobs who dont have the isk for a gist booster and desperately need 8 mids (lol)?

golem = complete fail ! also volley damage is not that impressive considering you don't get a rof bonus..

edit/ this is with with old launcher stats and torps






None of the ships got increased DPS but the Kronos. The Ammar oen ahs same DPS the minmatar one has the DPS of a maesltrom (but cant use arties )

PRoblem is mainly on the paladion that is a joke, both low DPS and a stupid web bonus for a ship that is supposed to be king of MIDDEL range fight. Change the web bonsu to 5% damage bonus per level than it will be ok.

Give the matari oen PG to fit 1200mm arties whiel usign 1 PG mod, at LEAST

Golen is not bad, the secondary bonus give a real increase in lethality and its the king tank of game now.


ALL of thsoe ships need bigger drone bays. What the hell a loong tiem incursion ship without drone reserves? Double the drone bay of each one.


NO! golem is bad. for a +1bil pricetag getting something worse than a cnr for 600 mil...


Suoh Amshar
Amarr
Grid Square Removal System
Posted - 2007.10.24 01:07:00 - [318]
 

Originally by: Law Enforcer
Edited by: Law Enforcer on 23/10/2007 18:11:01
the paladin needs to be rethought. it doesn't do anything particularly well.
1) sub par damage (abaddon does more dps)
2) cap amount bonus when it should be a regen bonus.
3) sub par tanking (abaddon gets better resists after bonus)

why is a t2 ship tanking less and doing less dps then a t1 counter part? I don't care if it's a tier 3 battleship.
this is tech 2 battleship.
and wtf is going on with the kronos doing nearly 2000 dps?

I want to know whose in charge of balancing amarr ships. the guy should be fired.




also /signed

Malachi Nefzen
Caldari
Insane Decision
Anarchy.
Posted - 2007.10.24 01:26:00 - [319]
 

golem needs an rof

Caldrion Dosto
Excrutiating Dirge
Merciless.
Posted - 2007.10.24 01:29:00 - [320]
 

Why is Iskur nerfed?

Solant
Minmatar
C A P S U L E
Posted - 2007.10.24 01:40:00 - [321]
 

Originally by: Carniflex
Golem does less dps than CNR :/ as CNR has RoF bonus and 7 launchers while Golem has 8 'effective' turrets.


I'd love to know why you figured it would have more dps than the CNR. If it did, CNR's would be effectively useless in the game.

Clue delivered.

d026
temp holding
Posted - 2007.10.24 01:51:00 - [322]
 

Originally by: Solant
Originally by: Carniflex
Golem does less dps than CNR :/ as CNR has RoF bonus and 7 launchers while Golem has 8 'effective' turrets.


I'd love to know why you figured it would have more dps than the CNR. If it did, CNR's would be effectively useless in the game.

Clue delivered.


so whats the gain for the added 3-400 mil in price? 40k tractorbeam? nice but fail..

d026
temp holding
Posted - 2007.10.24 01:54:00 - [323]
 

Originally by: Solant
Originally by: Carniflex
Golem does less dps than CNR :/ as CNR has RoF bonus and 7 launchers while Golem has 8 'effective' turrets.


I'd love to know why you figured it would have more dps than the CNR. If it did, CNR's would be effectively useless in the game.

Clue delivered.


Also we figured because it was stated to be the missionrunners wet dream.. actually its somethign a missionrunner would never tuch given the fact the cnr does it all better..



BlackKnight1717
Posted - 2007.10.24 02:09:00 - [324]
 

Wish I could try compare the paladin to the navy apoc but the navy apoc is **** aswell.

Thats being amarr for you.

Grok Lask
Posted - 2007.10.24 02:11:00 - [325]
 

Well; I thought Amarr would eventually get boosted to even out with the other races.
These ship changes show that not to be the case. So I am going to take a long view on it.ugh

I suggest that the PG on the all the new Amarr T2 ships here be lowered to match the lowest ships in the class.
The point being Amarr is so screwed anyway lets be honest about it so that new characters wont be so stupid to train for it and veterans would all realize they should cross train for Gallante.

Then we can have one of two outcomes. It becomes so painfully obvious that the developers wont need to be hit with a clue by four to realize how bad it is and actually fix the dynamics that have unintentionally made Amarr the nerf race. Conversly they may realize that they are not capable of balancing four races. Maybe Blizzard was smarter than them by having only three races in StarCraft.Embarassed The next step being digging out of this whole; maybe letting Amarr join the Gallante federation and their skills get transfered to the owners as they see fit(only the ship skills, Gallante would take over laser tech and other racial stuff internally, i.e. hybrid bonus would be hybrid/laser bonus).

Come on lets have an honest dev blog here. Lets read the truth:
"Its not that we hate Amarr, its that we hate having to deal with balancing them when there are so many game dynamics working agianst them. Thats why we're pretending we didn't say anything about giving Amarr oomph or about fixing the Apoc.Sad"

In the mean time I'm glad I decided to start training Gallante. I can enjoy the new Gallante ShipsCool Maybe if Amarr gets fixed I can go back and start training them again.

Tchu
Rage and Terror
Against ALL Authorities
Posted - 2007.10.24 02:38:00 - [326]
 

Pink thorax ftw! Please leave its color unchangedRazz

D Bogart
Mafia Redux
Phobia.
Posted - 2007.10.24 04:22:00 - [327]
 

Edited by: D Bogart on 24/10/2007 04:22:28
Warp Disruption Field Generator, which prevents all ships within its range from warping or jumping

it also comes with some drawbacks. When activated the warp disruption field generator prevents remote assistance,


The no remote assistance makes me think that this is going to prevent jumping through a gates - i.e. no logistics ships sitting on a gate camp remote repairing a heavy dictor preventing anyone from jumping through the nearby gate. Finally we get a way to lock down systems, with the drawback that they are not indestructible Very Happy

/crosses fingers

Mordus Operandi
Posted - 2007.10.24 04:46:00 - [328]
 

so does the Warp Disrupt Field Generator also bugger enemy mwd's and afterburners, or just the heavy interdictor's ?

DrDooma
Posted - 2007.10.24 04:49:00 - [329]
 

yena Very HappyFTW! I love it YARRRR!!

Architecture
MASS
Posted - 2007.10.24 04:53:00 - [330]
 

Originally by: d026
Edited by: d026 on 23/10/2007 23:51:16

i just ran some numbers trough eft:

golem dps (missiles only + 4 x dg bcu): 698
golem dps (+drones): 929

cnr dps (missiles only + 4 x dg bcu): 815 dps
cnr dps (+ drones and 425mm II): 1009 dps


why in hell should anyone change to the golem? noobs who dont have the isk for a gist booster and desperately need 8 mids (lol)?

golem = complete fail ! also volley damage is not that impressive considering you don't get a rof bonus..

edit/ this is with with old launcher stats and torps






I agrees Evil or Very Mad

but hey .. check this out

Role bonus: 100% bonus to range and velocity of tractor beams

who cares for the tractor beam thingo FFS


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