open All Channels
seplocked Corporation, Alliance and Organization Discussions
blankseplocked Good Moooooooooooorning, Tyrrax! [Update: Tyrrax now REFUSING to pay]
 
This thread is older than 90 days and has been locked due to inactivity.


 
Pages: first : previous : 1 2 3 [4] 5 6 7 8 9 ... : last (16)

Author Topic

Depp Knight
Caldari
Evolution
KenZoku
Posted - 2007.10.20 13:02:00 - [91]
 

Originally by: Rae'vun
I've been following this bet for a while now, and I have to throw in my 0.02 isk.

First off: The bet was accepted by both sides. This means that voiding it is out of the question. The bet entailed that if FAT was in BoB hands by today, Tyrrax would pay 500 mill to Pilk. If this was not the case, Pilk would pay Tyrrax.

Up until now: So far so good.

However, your analogy to alliance bills doesn't fly, simply because as someone else has stated "The game was still going".

All of FAT's towers were reinforced, to come out yesterday. Seeing as how the server was down the entire afternoon, the towers were saved and FAT remained in your hands.

The problem with this is that there is no way of telling how things would have went.

A better analogy would be a soccer match where IACRAA had the ball, 10 steps from the goal with no defenders in sight except the goalie. Just as the player shoots, referee whistles to halt the game because there's rain incoming.

Now, the difference is: In football this would have been cause for a major uproar. That's why given the circumstances, I'm somewhat dissapointed in Pilk for posting this in the first place, knowing full well the terms of the bet and the recent events.

I fully believe that this bet should NOT be voided. You don't agree to a bet with all of the risks involved if you are going to cancel it later, no matter what the reason.

Currently I see no other alternative but to extend the bet by a number of days agreed upon between Tyrrax and Pilk. Double or nothing could apply, again: Depending on the two opposing parties. I'd recommend around 7 days extension, more if you decide to go double or nothing.

Anyway, that's my thoughts concerning the issue.



In terms of football (this is fun) a more reasonable way to explain it would be. If there is 10 mins left and the bob team were up 1-0 and one of their men were given a red card, meaning the IAC team would have the momentum for a comeback, which in all fairness does happen in the cruel world of football but then there was a crowd riot, which in all fairness happens in football too: P and the ref had to call the game off the team winning wins the match and not the team who had the momentum.

The fact is that there was no evidence that IAC and allies were guaranteed to take Fat- just like it was not guaranteed that the team down 1 goal would come back. If the bet were that if IAC doesn’t hold fat- by this date then the bet would need to be paid. But because Tyrrax left it to the last day to achieve this you can sorta say ‘too little too late’

Admiral Feelgood
Caldari
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2007.10.20 13:07:00 - [92]
 

i don't think he should pay the bet even if he lost, how stupid would that be

Admiral Feelgood
Caldari
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2007.10.20 13:08:00 - [93]
 

the answer is very for all of you left in doubt

JeanPaul Sartre
Amarr
THE INTERNET.
Goodfellas.
Posted - 2007.10.20 13:08:00 - [94]
 

Originally by: Depp Knight
In terms of football (this is fun) a more reasonable way to explain it would be. If there is 10 mins left and the bob team were up 1-0 and one of their men were given a red card, meaning the IAC team would have the momentum for a comeback, which in all fairness does happen in the cruel world of football but then there was a crowd riot, which in all fairness happens in football too: P and the ref had to call the game off the team winning wins the match and not the team who had the momentum.

The fact is that there was no evidence that IAC and allies were guaranteed to take Fat- just like it was not guaranteed that the team down 1 goal would come back. If the bet were that if IAC doesn’t hold fat- by this date then the bet would need to be paid. But because Tyrrax left it to the last day to achieve this you can sorta say ‘too little too late’



This is exactly how Ladbrokes or William Hill would pay out also.

I see lots of Goon rant and not much from Tyrax. Goons needs to keep out of affairs that do not involve you before the other half of eve wants to wipe you out too.

In short: PAY THE MAN™

Faith Black
Minmatar
Rolls Roids
Posted - 2007.10.20 13:13:00 - [95]
 

Think he has lost the bet, although some bad luck was against him.
Guess the circumstances of winning/losing were never part of the bet, the only thing that mattered was, who holds the systems at date X.

TT owns more than enough isk anyway I guess, considering what he's been risking and losing in the past again and again. Losing a bet and 500mil isk by bad luck should be a minor issue to him.

On the other hand Pilk could also be nice, after having had his fun, and don't insist on the payment anymore. So yes, thread is going places. Soap opera. Laughing

Admiral Feelgood
Caldari
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2007.10.20 13:14:00 - [96]
 

Originally by: JeanPaul Sartre
before the other half of eve wants to wipe you out too.


Shocked


INZi
Minmatar
coracao ardente
Posted - 2007.10.20 13:16:00 - [97]
 

in the world of internet spaceship pew pew you have to imagine that there is no bet

Jakiri
Minmatar
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
Posted - 2007.10.20 13:38:00 - [98]
 

Edited by: Jakiri on 20/10/2007 13:40:37
Originally by: Depp Knight

In terms of football (this is fun) a more reasonable way to explain it would be. If there is 10 mins left and the bob team were up 1-0 and one of their men were given a red card, meaning the IAC team would have the momentum for a comeback, which in all fairness does happen in the cruel world of football but then there was a crowd riot, which in all fairness happens in football too: P and the ref had to call the game off the team winning wins the match and not the team who had the momentum.


Actually, this isn't the case. A 3-0 victory given against the team responsible for the pitch invasion is the standard punishment, as recently seen in Denmark - Sweden, when the ref was attacked after awarding a penalty, and the Milan derby in the Champion's League when Dida was hit by a flare. The games were 3-3 and 1-0 at the time, respectively.

Obviously the bet should go against BoB then because everyone knows BoB are dirty hackers or somesuch.

Martinez
Caldari
T-Cells
Moar Tears
Posted - 2007.10.20 13:48:00 - [99]
 

Bet was won by Pilk.

First off we did show up to fight, server down or not, that was you alls decision not to push the attack. Also i am not sure that even had the servers not gone down killing all the towers, that would have given you the system by the end of the bet. Furthermore, goons really are great. You make this game more fun for people who want to shoot you.

CobraBytez
Caldari
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
Posted - 2007.10.20 13:51:00 - [100]
 

I recommend that Tyrrax not pay this bet on the grounds that AXE is a joke and it's not like he'll ever be able to hurt you anyway.

Montaire
Minmatar
Krusual Developments
Posted - 2007.10.20 14:04:00 - [101]
 

Well Hrm.

Since the bet offered both sides a set period of time at the beginning (X days, X weeks etc) and not a fixed amount of actual GAME time (x number of hours the servers were accessable) I would be inclined to argue that Pilk won.

Both sides went in knowing that there could be problems with the server. I'd imagine both of them have had enough time in EVE to have experienced this. Nobody went in ignorant, or if there was ignorance it was certianly both sides that were equally ignorant.

Much like a homework assignment, one side of the bet had an equal chance to do it during the period of time alloted, having held out to the last minute was ill advised in this case, as it is in so many other situations.

Since the downtime had its effect on both sides equally, this should go to Pilk. If, with 5 mins left in an American Football game the quarterback falls and breaks his neck, the game goes on. Just like this TT took a serious blow, but both sides understood that risk (the risk of downtime and server outages) when they took the bet.

And again, if they had wanted to specify a certian number of playable hours, they could have. That they chose not to, knowing fully that EVE goes down at least daily, means they understood the risks implicit to downtimes and made their agreement in that light.

Had Pilk waited to take FAT, relying on the very last moment, he would equally have had to pay up.

RDevz
Caldari
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2007.10.20 14:05:00 - [102]
 

Edited by: RDevz on 20/10/2007 14:06:35
Originally by: JeanPaul Sartre

This is exactly how Ladbrokes or William Hill would pay out also.


Also Spracht William Hill:

Quote:
We will not be liable or responsible for any failure to perform, or delay in performance of, any of our obligations under a Contract that is caused by events outside our reasonable control (Force Majeure Event).


This isn't like a player injuring himself or getting sent off. This is a neutral third party bombing the stadium and rendering it unusable for a certain length of time.

Montaire
Minmatar
Krusual Developments
Posted - 2007.10.20 14:17:00 - [103]
 

But both sides accepted that downtimes could (and allways do) happen.

And it could have had an effect on either side. True, RSF (Is that a non-derogatory term, is there one that is more appropriate?) did lose the timing they wanted, but they did not lose all opportunity. They simply lost the chance they wanted, and decided not to take another.

Originally by: RDevz
Edited by: RDevz on 20/10/2007 14:06:35
Originally by: JeanPaul Sartre

This is exactly how Ladbrokes or William Hill would pay out also.


Also Spracht William Hill:

Quote:
We will not be liable or responsible for any failure to perform, or delay in performance of, any of our obligations under a Contract that is caused by events outside our reasonable control (Force Majeure Event).


This isn't like a player injuring himself or getting sent off. This is a neutral third party bombing the stadium and rendering it unusable for a certain length of time.

Wigglytuff
Caldari
Perkone
Posted - 2007.10.20 14:18:00 - [104]
 


Obidios
Minmatar
Sebiestor Tribe
Posted - 2007.10.20 14:19:00 - [105]
 

People saying the bet was won because of downtime are ******s. Even if IAAAAC put towers on every moon and killed all of BOB's it would still be our station today.

dev1lwoman
Minmatar
Sebiestor Tribe
Posted - 2007.10.20 14:21:00 - [106]
 

Originally by: JeanPaul Sartre
Originally by: Depp Knight
In terms of football (this is fun) a more reasonable way to explain it would be. If there is 10 mins left and the bob team were up 1-0 and one of their men were given a red card, meaning the IAC team would have the momentum for a comeback, which in all fairness does happen in the cruel world of football but then there was a crowd riot, which in all fairness happens in football too: P and the ref had to call the game off the team winning wins the match and not the team who had the momentum.

The fact is that there was no evidence that IAC and allies were guaranteed to take Fat- just like it was not guaranteed that the team down 1 goal would come back. If the bet were that if IAC doesn’t hold fat- by this date then the bet would need to be paid. But because Tyrrax left it to the last day to achieve this you can sorta say ‘too little too late’



This is exactly how Ladbrokes or William Hill would pay out also.

I see lots of Goon rant and not much from Tyrax. Goons needs to keep out of affairs that do not involve you before the other half of eve wants to wipe you out too.

In short: PAY THE MAN™


Actually the rules have changed as far as betting goes.

If the Ref calls off the match due to crowd trouble etc the Pools panel make a judgement on the probable outcome, although as far as the league goes the result at the time the match was abandoned stands

If that case, the pools panel would have to make a decision on wether during the RA/AAA/IAC prime time they would have held/lost the system. In close calls such as this the panel normally announce a score draw.

Luckily for Tyraxx we dont have a Eve Pools panel, only a peanut gallery, so I reckon the resut is match abandoned- No result- No payout

deadtear
Gallente
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
Posted - 2007.10.20 14:26:00 - [107]
 

Originally by: Obidios
People saying the bet was won because of downtime are ******s. Even if IAAAAC put towers on every moon and killed all of BOB's it would still be our station today.


Hollow victories are bob's favorite.

Please Hold
Caldari
Train In Vain
Posted - 2007.10.20 14:33:00 - [108]
 

*snip* Posting with an unidentified character and characters in NPC corporations in this forum is prohibited. If you wish to participate in the discussions here, be sure to have your corporation and or alliance status ticked in your forum settings. - Kreul Intentions ([email protected])

Cippalippus Primus
Caldari
eXceed Inc.
HYDRA RELOADED
Posted - 2007.10.20 14:34:00 - [109]
 

Meh, no one said yet that 500m is nothing for tyrrax. He'll pay just out of boredom.

Jasese
Gallente
The Collective
Against ALL Authorities
Posted - 2007.10.20 14:45:00 - [110]
 

"Tbh, Tyrrax shouldn't pay, simply because axe and pilk are pathetic in every way and can't do anything about it." - Crucifier

Gnome Chomsky
Amarr
26th of July Movement
Posted - 2007.10.20 14:49:00 - [111]
 

Originally by: dev1lwoman
Actually the rules have changed as far as betting goes.

If the Ref calls off the match due to crowd trouble etc the Pools panel make a judgement on the probable outcome, although as far as the league goes the result at the time the match was abandoned stands

If that case, the pools panel would have to make a decision on wether during the RA/AAA/IAC prime time they would have held/lost the system. In close calls such as this the panel normally announce a score draw.

Luckily for Tyraxx we dont have a Eve Pools panel, only a peanut gallery, so I reckon the resut is match abandoned- No result- No payout


No.

William Hill spokesman Graham Sharpe said regulations that bookmakers only pay out if a match is completed contrasted with the Far East where certain bets can be paid out as soon as the game reaches the second half even if it is abandoned.

"Domestically, all bets are void if a match is abandoned, you keep your stake money but it's impossible to make any money," Sharpe said.


fire 59
Gallente
Destructive Influence
KenZoku
Posted - 2007.10.20 14:52:00 - [112]
 

Originally by: deadtear
Originally by: Obidios
People saying the bet was won because of downtime are ******s. Even if IAAAAC put towers on every moon and killed all of BOB's it would still be our station today.


Hollow victories are bob's favorite.


Few things as amusing as the enemy telling you what is important to you and not listening to what actually is, arf. Propoganda is a funny little animal aye


Moon Kitten
Gallente
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2007.10.20 14:55:00 - [113]
 

What happens if he doesn't pay up?

Jasese
Gallente
The Collective
Against ALL Authorities
Posted - 2007.10.20 14:57:00 - [114]
 

Originally by: Moon Kitten
What happens if he doesn't pay up?


Nothing. Bob still loose.

Scatim Helicon
Caldari
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2007.10.20 15:04:00 - [115]
 

Originally by: Moon Kitten
What happens if he doesn't pay up?

Tyrrax would lose his mad props and internet spacehonour Sad

fire 59
Gallente
Destructive Influence
KenZoku
Posted - 2007.10.20 15:05:00 - [116]
 

Originally by: Jasese
Originally by: Moon Kitten
What happens if he doesn't pay up?


Nothing. Bob still loose.


Lose what exactly? The only consequence realistically of him not paying up is showing the community he is all talk and no trousers so to speak. Can't exactly send space bailiffs after him ^^

wicked cheese
Amarr
Imperial Research Inovations
Barbarian Reformation Alliance
Posted - 2007.10.20 15:16:00 - [117]
 

well if the bet was over "who holds the system" then what is considered holding the system. if it was on lockdown by one side or vast majority numbers wouldnt that be holding the system? wouldnt most POS's also be holding system even in a station system? and of course who holds the station.

though i dont know (and couldnt have taken part) as to who woulda brought largest numbers, from what ive seen in the past that could have gone either way.

POS control could have gone either way

station was definatly GBC owned regardless.

seeing how 2/3 of those aspects are seen as maybes, due to an odd DT, id say no more than a week extension is reasonable?Wink

or perhaps backdoor bandit should make the final callIdea

Orochimaru
Minmatar
Brutor Tribe
Posted - 2007.10.20 15:27:00 - [118]
 

Aside from a couple people saying pilk won majority are BoB posting on this thread on his behalf....Pilk = Molle ? "throws on the giant tinfoil" where are axe pilots and everyone else who helped take fat that aren't posting? you guys helped to you know don't let Pilk take all the glory. Off to work let the blabbering commence.

much love for all
Oro out.

PeepingTom
Minmatar
DER KER DER
Posted - 2007.10.20 15:33:00 - [119]
 

Originally by: Orochimaru
Aside from a couple people saying pilk won majority are BoB posting on this thread on his behalf....Pilk = Molle ? "throws on the giant tinfoil" where are axe pilots and everyone else who helped take fat that aren't posting? you guys helped to you know don't let Pilk take all the glory. Off to work let the blabbering commence.

much love for all
Oro out.
rabble rabble rabble!

is that better? :P

Kar Strike
Caldari
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
Posted - 2007.10.20 15:33:00 - [120]
 

Originally by: fire 59
Lose what exactly?


Apparently there's a war going on.


Pages: first : previous : 1 2 3 [4] 5 6 7 8 9 ... : last (16)

This thread is older than 90 days and has been locked due to inactivity.


 


The new forums are live

Please adjust your bookmarks to https://forums.eveonline.com

These forums are archived and read-only