open All Channels
seplocked Market Discussions
blankseplocked EVE's 80 Trillion ISK economy in GTCs
 
This thread is older than 90 days and has been locked due to inactivity.


 
Author Topic

Praetor Novak
Macabre Votum
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2007.09.17 01:58:00 - [1]
 

Go Figure...

There is a total of about 80 trillion ISK (the official currency of EVE Online) floating around.

Originally by: "Dr. Eyjólfur "Eyjo" Guđmundsson"
"That is 80,000 billions; it works out to about 450 million ISK per player."

In terms of GTC (US Dollars) here is the math:

    100-day GTC
    Price per card in ISK
    ISK 395,000,000.00

    Price per card in USD
    $49.95

    Quantity of cards needed
    202,532

    TOTAL in ISK
    ISK 80,000,140,000,000.00

    TOTAL in USD
    $10,116,473.40

    In other words... (rates at 2007.09.17 01:47:16 UTC)
    10,116,473.00 USD = 7,292,461.34 EUR
    10,116,473.00 USD = 5,037,980.67 GBP
    10,116,473.00 USD = 652,411,348.95 ISK (real Iceland currency)

BY CCP's GTC market (which they control) that makes the economy of EVE worth USD $10 million. What MMO can make this claim?

Based on Iceland's GDP in the CIA World Factbook 2007, this mean that if the economy of EVE were to grow 17.5 fold (by current assumptions) it would exceed the value of Iceland's real world GDP in real dollars.

Anyway I thought you may enjoy the interesting math on this. Very Happy

Valator Uel
Caldari
Mercenaries of Andosia
Northern Coalition.
Posted - 2007.09.17 02:30:00 - [2]
 

So what you're saying is that soon Helmar will be Emperor of Iceland and start his crusade with Lord Oveur to conquer the rest of the world?

Coooool Cool.

Zephite
Masuat'aa Matari
Ushra'Khan
Posted - 2007.09.17 02:53:00 - [3]
 

Edited by: Zephite on 17/09/2007 02:53:21
That's pretty cool.

Letias
Caldari
Poofdinkles
Posted - 2007.09.17 03:03:00 - [4]
 

you are assuming they actually have 202532 GTC's somewhere tho :P

Shadarle
Posted - 2007.09.17 03:30:00 - [5]
 

Very cool, I love reading about statistics like this.

Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
Posted - 2007.09.17 03:56:00 - [6]
 

Edited by: Akita T on 17/09/2007 03:58:31
On a side-note, almost 730,000x 100-day GTCs (or equivalent in RL money, over 36 mil USD) would be used yearly to "fuel" the playerbase.
So, the total volume of ISK is barely worth 4 month's consumption of subscription times.

EDIT: Wait, WHAT ?!?!?. That would mean CCP's income equals over 15% of Iceland's GDP ?!?

Dark Shikari
Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2007.09.17 04:01:00 - [7]
 

Originally by: Akita T
Edited by: Akita T on 17/09/2007 03:58:31
On a side-note, almost 730,000x 100-day GTCs (or equivalent in RL money, over 36 mil USD) would be used yearly to "fuel" the playerbase.
So, the total volume of ISK is barely worth 4 month's consumption of subscription times.

EDIT: Wait, WHAT ?!?!?. That would mean CCP's income equals over 15% of Iceland's GDP ?!?

No, it means the OP was wrong, because Iceland's GDP is $15.823 billion.

Praetor Novak
Macabre Votum
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2007.09.17 05:28:00 - [8]
 

Originally by: Dark Shikari
No, it means the OP was wrong, because Iceland's GDP is $15.823 billion.


Quote your source and I will adjust the figures.

Nobum
Amarr
dabster Corp
Posted - 2007.09.17 06:32:00 - [9]
 

Edited by: Nobum on 17/09/2007 06:32:04
Originally by: Praetor Novak
Originally by: Dark Shikari
No, it means the OP was wrong, because Iceland's GDP is $15.823 billion.


Quote your source and I will adjust the figures.


Well, your own source says $13,7billion (or $11,38b, im unsure which figure to use though Goolge says $11,38b). Your posting says $10million, and "if it grows 17.5 fold", that turns to 175million.
Not quite 13billion is it?

Dark Shikari
Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2007.09.17 06:37:00 - [10]
 

Originally by: Nobum
Edited by: Nobum on 17/09/2007 06:32:04
Originally by: Praetor Novak
Originally by: Dark Shikari
No, it means the OP was wrong, because Iceland's GDP is $15.823 billion.


Quote your source and I will adjust the figures.


Well, your own source says $13,7billion (or $11,38b, im unsure which figure to use though Goolge says $11,38b). Your posting says $10million, and "if it grows 17.5 fold", that turns to 175million.
Not quite 13billion is it?

11.38b is Purchasing Power Parity which is useful when measuring standard of living but useless when dealing with exchange rates and the like.

13.7b is the 2006 figure based on the 2006 dollar; the latest 2007 figure, due to the lower dollar and GDP growth, is 15.8 billion.

Nocturnal Avenger
Sebiestor Tribe
Posted - 2007.09.17 11:13:00 - [11]
 

Originally by: Praetor Novak
Quote your source and I will adjust the figures.


Use some common sense, and you would know you were wrong.

Cker Heel
The Graduates
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2007.09.17 12:24:00 - [12]
 

Equally as interesting is this figure from the article..

Originally by: "Dr. Eyjólfur "Eyjo" Guđmundsson"
About 1.5 trillion ISK change hands every day in the EVE universe.


While we need to know precisely how the 1.5T was measured, we can start making crude estimates of the economy as whole. Firstly, lets say 1.5Tisk times 365 days represents the Gross Galatic Product -- 547.5 trillion ISK.

547T ISKperYear divided by 80T existing ISK means each ISK is spent 7 times per year. USDollar M0 velocity was 17 in 2006. So this would fit, as real life economies have much more developed financial instruments to keep the high powered currency in motion so you would expect M0 velocity to be higher than ISK velocity.

In other words, we keep a lower amount of physical cash in our real world wallets, than in our Eve wallets.

Hopefully the Eve logs are thorough enough that ISK velocity can be directly measured and graphed. Combine that with the measured size of market economy (the 1.5T ISK figure) and we can observe overall inflation/deflation.

Ratuu
Gallente
The Darkness Within
Posted - 2007.09.22 08:20:00 - [13]
 

Originally by: Cker Heel
In other words, we keep a lower amount of physical cash in our real world wallets, than in our Eve wallets.

I can verify this myself.

Despite working really hard both in game and in real life, spending more time doing real life stuff than Eve stuff, I have failed to break even the 'Million' barrier in my RL wallet.Sad
(Though I did have a great night out last month where I took out Ł100 and had to borrow money for the cab home... was trashed the next day though.Laughing)


Arithron
Gallente
Gallente Trade Alliance
Posted - 2007.09.22 11:20:00 - [14]
 

Based on GTC figures, its easy to see why some resellers wanted to buy gtc for isk and sell for RL cash!

Eraggan Sadarr
Comply Or Die
Posted - 2007.09.23 14:13:00 - [15]
 

Impressive :)

Alliance Fines
Posted - 2007.09.24 12:08:00 - [16]
 

80 Trillion hmmm... if this is true i need to get cracking on my 1/10 of Eves wealth goal... currently I'm only worth 1/80 lol... dam.. o'well back to work for me!

Valrandir
Gallente
Distant Thunder
Perihelion Alliance
Posted - 2007.09.24 18:28:00 - [17]
 

Originally by: Valator Uel
So what you're saying is that soon Helmar will be Emperor of Iceland and start his crusade with Lord Oveur to conquer the rest of the world?

Coooool Cool.


Sounds pretty good.

Let's have the New Eve Order, instead of the *snip* New World Order.

No racial epithets. -Rauth Kivaro(mods@ccpgames.com)

Dant Kramble
Posted - 2007.09.24 21:54:00 - [18]
 

Edited by: Dant Kramble on 24/09/2007 21:54:16
In case its interesting, and anyone hasn't already seen the reference, the first analysis of this sort (not about EVE) is from here:

Castronova

Every little bit helps.

Praetor Novak
Macabre Votum
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2007.10.18 19:30:00 - [19]
 

CORRECTION - Using USD, Iceland’s GDP (2006 est.) was 11.38B so EVE’s economy would need to grow 1,138 times to reach that level, not adjusting for inflation over time.

Must have been plastered when I carried those zeros off somewhere!

Wieting Foyu
Gallente
Apocalypse Rising Inc.
Posted - 2007.10.20 23:06:00 - [20]
 

Originally by: Ratuu
Originally by: Cker Heel
In other words, we keep a lower amount of physical cash in our real world wallets, than in our Eve wallets.

I can verify this myself.

Despite working really hard both in game and in real life, spending more time doing real life stuff than Eve stuff, I have failed to break even the 'Million' barrier in my RL wallet.Sad
(Though I did have a great night out last month where I took out Ł100 and had to borrow money for the cab home... was trashed the next day though.Laughing)




Um using this as a calculation. 100m isk is roughly 10 bucks. IF you can't get that in your RL wallet you really should stay away from online games.

Cenzo
Posted - 2007.10.21 04:30:00 - [21]
 

Originally by: Letias
you are assuming they actually have 202532 GTC's somewhere tho :P


Well, I don't think you need 202,532 cards available to make this accurate. We know what the price of a card is in isk and in USD, so we can use that to determine what the implied USD/ISK exchange rate is. However, the whole proposition is muddled by the fact that there are harsh trade rules on how things can be converted.

Shakuul
Caldari
RuffRyders
Axiom Empire
Posted - 2007.10.22 07:48:00 - [22]
 

Edited by: Shakuul on 22/10/2007 07:50:11
To know the true value of ISK in USD, you would have to allow the currencies to be freely traded. Assuming this, the currency would have to equilibrate to an amount slightly above what a good player could make using one account in a month, with fairly minimal effort.
If Mechanical Engineering Datacores are selling for 2mil each, you can get 3 characters with 5 mechanical engineering agents each, getting around 80 RP per day per agent. This comes out to:

3 * 5 * 80 = 1200 RP/day
If Datacores cost 40 RP each, that’s 30 data cores, or 60mil isk per day.
That comes out to 60mil*30 days = 1.8 billion ISK per month. This means on passive income alone, 1.8 billion ISK would be worth $15/month, maybe less if you use 6 months at a time or power of two and so on. This rate is much lower than the one you quoted, 80 trillion isk would be worth about….
$700,000 . This seems a bit more reasonable.


EDIT: Obviously the initial creation of the characters would take time and money, but this could be done by farmers at low cost, and eventually the price would level to something like this. Datacores wouldn't be the only source of income, anything semi passive would push the price down, etc etc.

Shadarle
Posted - 2007.10.22 08:04:00 - [23]
 

Originally by: Shakuul
Edited by: Shakuul on 22/10/2007 07:50:11
To know the true value of ISK in USD, you would have to allow the currencies to be freely traded. Assuming this, the currency would have to equilibrate to an amount slightly above what a good player could make using one account in a month, with fairly minimal effort.
If Mechanical Engineering Datacores are selling for 2mil each, you can get 3 characters with 5 mechanical engineering agents each, getting around 80 RP per day per agent. This comes out to:

3 * 5 * 80 = 1200 RP/day
If Datacores cost 40 RP each, that’s 30 data cores, or 60mil isk per day.
That comes out to 60mil*30 days = 1.8 billion ISK per month. This means on passive income alone, 1.8 billion ISK would be worth $15/month, maybe less if you use 6 months at a time or power of two and so on. This rate is much lower than the one you quoted, 80 trillion isk would be worth about….
$700,000 . This seems a bit more reasonable.


Your math on profit per month for 1 account seems WAY off. I'm too tired to double check the numbers but there is no way you're making 1.8 bil off it.

Kestramel
Minmatar
Sebiestor Tribe
Posted - 2007.10.22 18:59:00 - [24]
 

Since CCP is Icelandic, the entire EVE economy would be attributable to Iceland.

I think it won't be long before EVE-Online becomes the fourth largest industry in Iceland. Behind Aluminum, Fishing, and Bjork.

Shakuul
Caldari
RuffRyders
Axiom Empire
Posted - 2007.10.22 21:53:00 - [25]
 

Originally by: Shadarle
Originally by: Shakuul
Edited by: Shakuul on 22/10/2007 07:50:11
To know the true value of ISK in USD, you would have to allow the currencies to be freely traded. Assuming this, the currency would have to equilibrate to an amount slightly above what a good player could make using one account in a month, with fairly minimal effort.
If Mechanical Engineering Datacores are selling for 2mil each, you can get 3 characters with 5 mechanical engineering agents each, getting around 80 RP per day per agent. This comes out to:

3 * 5 * 80 = 1200 RP/day
If Datacores cost 40 RP each, that’s 30 data cores, or 60mil isk per day.
That comes out to 60mil*30 days = 1.8 billion ISK per month. This means on passive income alone, 1.8 billion ISK would be worth $15/month, maybe less if you use 6 months at a time or power of two and so on. This rate is much lower than the one you quoted, 80 trillion isk would be worth about….
$700,000 . This seems a bit more reasonable.


Your math on profit per month for 1 account seems WAY off. I'm too tired to double check the numbers but there is no way you're making 1.8 bil off it.


I'll try to go through it again, just to clarify.

(1) With Research Project Management V, you can use 5 agents.
With Mechanical Engineering V, and a L4 Research Agent with effective quality 0, you make (5+4)^2 = 81 RP/day (1x multiplier) per agent

(2) So, for a single character, he has 5 such agents (this would require a good deal of standings farming, but I think you can get 5 L4s with the Caldari R&D Corps, if not you could throw in some Amarr ones). Anyway, this one character is getting about 80*5 = 400 RP / day across the agents.

(3) There are three identical characters, so for all three of them, you get 3*400 = 1200 RP/day

(4) Datacores cost 40 RP/datacore, so 1200/40 = 30 datacores per day.

(5) Datacores sell for 2mil each, so 30*2 = 60mil per day

(6) There are 30 days in a month, so 30*60mil = 1.8 bil per month


I numbered them just so you could disagree a particular numbers. Also note I personally am not making this much, but this would be the ideal situation. Also remember that this is with ALL THREE CHARACTERS doing datacores. Each one individually is only getting 600mil per month.

Benn Helmsman
Caldari
Dark Prophecy Inc.
Posted - 2007.10.22 22:44:00 - [26]
 

Did they change something on Datacore RP costs? I remeber that datacores cost 50/100/150 depending on their multiplier.

Nizomi
Caldari
Technopolis Ventures
Posted - 2007.10.23 12:22:00 - [27]
 

Originally by: Shakuul
Originally by: Shadarle
Originally by: Shakuul
Edited by: Shakuul on 22/10/2007 07:50:11
To know the true value of ISK in USD, you would have to allow the currencies to be freely traded. Assuming this, the currency would have to equilibrate to an amount slightly above what a good player could make using one account in a month, with fairly minimal effort.
If Mechanical Engineering Datacores are selling for 2mil each, you can get 3 characters with 5 mechanical engineering agents each, getting around 80 RP per day per agent. This comes out to:

3 * 5 * 80 = 1200 RP/day
If Datacores cost 40 RP each, that’s 30 data cores, or 60mil isk per day.
That comes out to 60mil*30 days = 1.8 billion ISK per month. This means on passive income alone, 1.8 billion ISK would be worth $15/month, maybe less if you use 6 months at a time or power of two and so on. This rate is much lower than the one you quoted, 80 trillion isk would be worth about….
$700,000 . This seems a bit more reasonable.


Your math on profit per month for 1 account seems WAY off. I'm too tired to double check the numbers but there is no way you're making 1.8 bil off it.


I'll try to go through it again, just to clarify.

(1) With Research Project Management V, you can use 5 agents.
With Mechanical Engineering V, and a L4 Research Agent with effective quality 0, you make (5+4)^2 = 81 RP/day (1x multiplier) per agent

(2) So, for a single character, he has 5 such agents (this would require a good deal of standings farming, but I think you can get 5 L4s with the Caldari R&D Corps, if not you could throw in some Amarr ones). Anyway, this one character is getting about 80*5 = 400 RP / day across the agents.

(3) There are three identical characters, so for all three of them, you get 3*400 = 1200 RP/day

(4) Datacores cost 40 RP/datacore, so 1200/40 = 30 datacores per day.

(5) Datacores sell for 2mil each, so 30*2 = 60mil per day

(6) There are 30 days in a month, so 30*60mil = 1.8 bil per month


I numbered them just so you could disagree a particular numbers. Also note I personally am not making this much, but this would be the ideal situation. Also remember that this is with ALL THREE CHARACTERS doing datacores. Each one individually is only getting 600mil per month.



If alot of people would be doing this though the datacore price would drop drastically

Benn Helmsman
Caldari
Dark Prophecy Inc.
Posted - 2007.10.23 13:30:00 - [28]
 

Not many people think that alt spamming with ISK bought GTC is the way to play a game...

Shakuul
Caldari
RuffRyders
Axiom Empire
Posted - 2007.10.24 02:45:00 - [29]
 

Originally by: Nizomi
If alot of people would be doing this though the datacore price would drop drastically


So would the USD value of ISK.

I was simply bringing this up as a way to earn passive income, which would definitely push the ISK's value down. Of course there are many other ways to do earn passive income (other datacores, POSes, some kinds of trading), and they would be used if mechanical engineering core prices fell enough.

Also, I did check datacores cost 50, not 40 (dunno why i thought it was 40), so you only would get 1.44 billion per month.


 

This thread is older than 90 days and has been locked due to inactivity.


 


The new forums are live

Please adjust your bookmarks to https://forums.eveonline.com

These forums are archived and read-only