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blankseplocked 99.999% refining efficiency, annoying!
 
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Simmith
Macabre Votum
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2007.07.31 01:30:00 - [1]
 

My industrial alt just finished training 'refining efficiency 5', getting 99.5% yield so I figured a 1% implant would top it off, bought one and put it in (unplugging another one in the process).

Only to find out that the end result was 99.9994% yield, not 100%. Devastatingly annoying when you are counting on reprocessing stuff without loss.

Seriously, can this be intended?

/sim


William Hamilton
Caldari
Endless Destruction
Imperial 0rder
Posted - 2007.07.31 01:39:00 - [2]
 

Train the specific reprocessing skills?

Simmith
Macabre Votum
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2007.07.31 01:42:00 - [3]
 

"reprocessing" as in alloys and modules.
Metallurgy 5.. for 0.0004% more yield?



sov68n
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2007.07.31 02:23:00 - [4]
 

well if youre obviously so concerned with attaining 100% yeild, then why not?

Alaris Nightshadow
Sankkasen Mining Conglomerate
On the Rocks
Posted - 2007.07.31 02:54:00 - [5]
 

So get a +2% implant, or don't complain about a 0.006% loss

darkst0rm
H A V O C
Posted - 2007.07.31 05:20:00 - [6]
 

Edited by: darkst0rm on 31/07/2007 05:20:14
trained the scrapmetal processing skill?

GC13
Caldari
Species 5618
R0ADKILL
Posted - 2007.07.31 05:29:00 - [7]
 

You only need one level in the specific processing skill (whether refinery efficiency is at four or five) to max out your reprocessing at a 50% station. Levels beyond one are only useful at inferior stations.

So where's this idea that you need Metallurgy 5 come from?

Elite Marksman
Posted - 2007.07.31 05:58:00 - [8]
 

Perhaps, just perhaps, Metallurgy 5 is a prerequisite for Scrapmetal Processing?

Lord Loom
Loom Service
Posted - 2007.07.31 11:28:00 - [9]
 

...and the easier one at that, compared to the skill you just finished?

Simmith
Macabre Votum
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2007.07.31 15:36:00 - [10]
 

Refining Efficiency and Metallurgy is both rank 3 skills so.

after just finishing a 15 day training for refining efficiency 5, "starting over" with metallurgy to get to 5 and train scrapmetal processing for the last little bit is not my idea of fun.

Station refinery 50%, refining 5 (10%) and refinery efficiency 5 (20%) plus a 1% implant.

What kind of math makes that into 99.9996%?



Lord Loom
Loom Service
Posted - 2007.07.31 18:56:00 - [11]
 

oh, I apologize then, thought refinery efficiency took longer than metallurgy Embarassed

about the math, it can very well be intended given how they treat it in this game - I agree it sucks, especially since one gets the impression this has to work. Maybe it's like resists tho, +1% off the remaining waste, that would be what, 99.5+(100-99.5)*1% = 99.995% yield?

agrajag119
-Mostly Harmless-
Posted - 2007.07.31 18:57:00 - [12]
 

They are not additive...

The refine bonus % applies like the bulk of eve skills.

A bonus of 20% isn't a direct addition of 20% yield. It is 20% better then what you had before.

So you start at a 50% station, so you've got 50% waste.

The skill drops waste by 20%, so rank 1 in the skill with reduce wastage by 0.20 * 0.50 => 0.10 or 10%. Thus giving you an effective refine rate of 60%.

That 1% implant is giving you a one percent better refine, just not the way you were expecting it.

SexxxSlave
Posted - 2007.07.31 19:16:00 - [13]
 

Originally by: Simmith
My industrial alt just finished training 'refining efficiency 5', getting 99.5% yield so I figured a 1% implant would top it off, bought one and put it in (unplugging another one in the process).

Only to find out that the end result was 99.9994% yield, not 100%. Devastatingly annoying when you are counting on reprocessing stuff without loss.

Seriously, can this be intended?

/sim




really, seriously, are you in that big of a bind that you'll miss that .0006%?!?!?!?!?! come on.

Riley Craven
Caldari
Raata Invicti
Reckoning.
Posted - 2007.07.31 20:31:00 - [14]
 

Originally by: agrajag119
They are not additive...

The refine bonus % applies like the bulk of eve skills.

A bonus of 20% isn't a direct addition of 20% yield. It is 20% better then what you had before.

So you start at a 50% station, so you've got 50% waste.

The skill drops waste by 20%, so rank 1 in the skill with reduce wastage by 0.20 * 0.50 => 0.10 or 10%. Thus giving you an effective refine rate of 60%.

That 1% implant is giving you a one percent better refine, just not the way you were expecting it.


You are partially right. The thing is if you were 100% right you would never EVER be able to achieve 100% Much like sheild resist work today, you may be able to get damn close, but you wont ever break 100%

GC13
Caldari
Species 5618
R0ADKILL
Posted - 2007.07.31 21:53:00 - [15]
 

Originally by: Elite Marksman
Perhaps, just perhaps, Metallurgy 5 is a prerequisite for Scrapmetal Processing?
*looks at own post*

*looks at post own post was a reply to*

You know what? It's true.

Confused

Refazed
Interstellar eXodus
BricK sQuAD.
Posted - 2007.07.31 23:42:00 - [16]
 

Edited by: Refazed on 31/07/2007 23:45:49
Edited by: Refazed on 31/07/2007 23:43:54
Edited by: Refazed on 31/07/2007 23:43:15
Edited by: Refazed on 31/07/2007 23:42:37
the calculation acts as follows for refining:

base% + (.375 * (1+[refining_level]*.02) * (1+[refining_eff_level]*.04) * (1+[matieralSpecificLevel]*05) * (1+[implantboost]))

so with a 50% refine station and refine eff 5, no spec, and a 1% implant you get:

.5 + (.375 * (1+5*.02) * (1+5*.04) * (1+0*05) * (1+0.01))
or
.5 + (.375 * 1.1 * 1.2 * 1.0 * 1.01)
or
.5+.49995
or
.99995 = 99.995%


EDIT: Forgot a parenthesis in multiple spots. I am ok at math but suck at typeing this stuff out.

Halada
Caldari
Lone Star Joint Venture
Posted - 2007.08.01 00:58:00 - [17]
 

Edited by: Halada on 01/08/2007 00:58:29
Im sorry to say this but wtf are you talking about ?

With Refining 5, Advanced Refinery 5 and Ore/Scrapmetal Processing 1 you get 100% already in stations with a 50% equipment... no need for implants Rolling Eyes

Pilk
Evolution
IT Alliance
Posted - 2007.08.01 04:02:00 - [18]
 

Originally by: Halada
Edited by: Halada on 01/08/2007 00:58:29
Im sorry to say this but wtf are you talking about ?

With Refining 5, Advanced Refinery 5 and Ore/Scrapmetal Processing 1 you get 100% already in stations with a 50% equipment... no need for implants Rolling Eyes

Read. He doesn't have Scrapmetal I because he refuses to train Metallurgy to V.

--P

Simmith
Macabre Votum
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2007.08.01 10:47:00 - [19]
 

I dont refuse, but metallurgy 5 is another 15-17 days.


Refazed
Interstellar eXodus
BricK sQuAD.
Posted - 2007.08.01 14:49:00 - [20]
 

Originally by: Simmith
I dont refuse, but metallurgy 5 is another 15-17 days.




Then the .005% waste isn't that important to you. Complaining won't change the formula so either buy a better implant or train it if you are bothered that much.

Next time learn how the system works before you plug in an implant. Consider this a lesson learned.

Wyehr
Rage of Inferno
Posted - 2007.08.01 15:31:00 - [21]
 

Sorry man. Every other max refiner in the game trained up Metallurgy to 5 to unlock Scrapmetal Processing 5.

Your turn...

Royaldo
Gallente
Kongsberg Vaapenfabrikk Amarr branch.
Sev3rance
Posted - 2007.08.01 22:05:00 - [22]
 

yup, had this done 2 1/2 year ago.

also remember to get standing so the station doesnt take any of it.



 

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