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CCP Wrangler

Posted - 2007.07.30 14:08:00 - [1]
 

We have some interesting changes to Khanid and Nosferatus planned for Revelations 2.2 and it's already on the test server. Check out Revised Nosferatu Mechanics and Khanid mk 2 on the Test Server and then go try it out!

Chronus26
Team Laser Explosion
Molotov Coalition
Posted - 2007.07.30 14:17:00 - [2]
 

Realy interesting on the NOS changes. I think you've chosen a very good solution that should keep everybody happy.

Look forward to seeing how it all works out.

Fon Revedhort
Monks of War
DarkSide.
Posted - 2007.07.30 14:22:00 - [3]
 

Edited by: Fon Revedhort on 30/07/2007 14:51:03

Fendahl, would you be so kind to tell us whoever decided to spoil Damnation that badly so that we can add him to our KOS list? Twisted Evil

It just won't fit. As it stands now you simply cut 210 MW off adding nothing in exchange. Atm it is pretty much impossible to have a nice plated setup on Damantion with Heavy or even Focused Medium Pulses (Beams are no-no by default Rolling Eyes) so you are just going to nerf its tank...

NOS changes do sound good though Wink

Phillipe d'Rothschild
Discrete Solutions Ltd.
Posted - 2007.07.30 14:25:00 - [4]
 

Edited by: Phillipe d''Rothschild on 30/07/2007 14:30:54

I cannot seem to find a Test patch for my client. I think I'm running running version 3.21.35183. Any help?

Found: http://ccp.vo.llnwd.net/o2/test/evepatch35183-35248_test.exe checking to see if this helps.

Cypherous
Minmatar
Lions of Judah Incorporated
Posted - 2007.07.30 14:27:00 - [5]
 

Damnation change = bad, it lacks the speed to get in range to make its HAM bonus even remotely worth while, as for boosting its already insane tank why?

TBH the DPS on the damnation with HAM's is so poor it makes the ship useless for anything, mines going to be going on the market before the nerf :(

N1fty
Galactic Shipyards Inc
Huzzah Federation
Posted - 2007.07.30 14:28:00 - [6]
 

Edited by: N1fty on 01/08/2007 12:25:55

I like the NOS changes, it will affect my Curse or Pilgrim, but I'll just be fitting a neutraliser to kill tanks, which is how these ships operate.

HOWEVER: I have a much better idea for Nos based on % of cap regen, which will nerf using more than 2 nos on a ship AND nerf Large Nos vs Frigs.

Khanid changes: Well I hated them to start with, but then I realised how good these ships are going to be, closerange hardcore tanking and missiles. Nice.

Big Al
The Aftermath
Posted - 2007.07.30 14:28:00 - [7]
 

Edited by: Big Al on 30/07/2007 14:35:12
lolcurse/pilgrim.

Great job nerfing ships that get a NOS bonus while leaving lolsetups like a nosdomi intact.


Stealth amarr buff tbh (apart from nerfing their 2 best ships), since we never have any cap anyway.

Sylek
Amarr
The Collective
Against ALL Authorities
Posted - 2007.07.30 14:32:00 - [8]
 

Edited by: Sylek on 01/08/2007 15:13:01
The NOS changes may help nerf NOS boats, but at the same time they nerf the only two good non-capital amarr ships, the curse and pilgrim. I'm not sure how Curses and Pilgrims will work after this, probably won't be as good at soloing as they were before. And they already role of all the recons, tracking disrupting. As you can see from the fact not many people use tracking disruptors on them.

I think the Khanid changes are pretty bad, restricting the bonus to one type of missiles wasn't a very good idea. You don't see ships with bonus to autocannons or pulse lasers, then why should the Khanid ships have bonuses to only close range weapons?

HAMs and rockets are currently unfavoured because they require you to get very close while offering a very slight damage bonus when compared to other missiles with superior range.

So, anyone in the market for Amarrian characters?

Terranid Meester
Tactical Assault and Recon Unit
Posted - 2007.07.30 14:34:00 - [9]
 

So I guesss the backstory of the Khanid having the most advanced shield generators outside of Caldari Space should be changed now? Or am I missing something?

N1fty
Galactic Shipyards Inc
Huzzah Federation
Posted - 2007.07.30 14:36:00 - [10]
 

Edited by: N1fty on 30/07/2007 14:36:10
Originally by: Terranid Meester
So I guesss the backstory of the Khanid having the most advanced shield generators outside of Caldari Space should be changed now? Or am I missing something?


Yep and the bit where it says the Sacri is a flexible ship is just not true anymore! Closerange missile spam and tank only... YARRRR!!


EDIT: spelling.

Sakura Nihil
Selective Pressure
Rote Kapelle
Posted - 2007.07.30 14:36:00 - [11]
 

This will screw with Curse tactics a bit, but we'll adapt (I think).

The problem that concerns me here isn't that, but the close-range missile only bonuses to the ships. In effect, you're locking them into a singular fighting style by forcing the bonuses to only apply to those modules - its one thing to say "CPU will be tight on a standard/heavy missile setup", that's fine, if it is tight and the player wants to attempt a long-range fit, let them try.

Might as well build in the rocket or HAM launchers for the players.

Amanda Zeherah
Amarr
Scion Innovations
Posted - 2007.07.30 14:37:00 - [12]
 


Nice well-thought changes that will add some flavour to Amarr (Khanid) ships... Will have to train missiles now.

NOS changes sounds ok...

Also, in a battle, I dont think the GENERAL will be in the front line... in other words, is it intended that a FLEET command ship to fight at close range (even with long-range HAM fitted)?

Louis DelaBlanche
An Outlying Variable
Posted - 2007.07.30 14:39:00 - [13]
 

Edited by: Louis DelaBlanche on 30/07/2007 15:27:33
interesting changes. Gonna be interesting to see how ppl change setups to reflect the new way nos works. nosmyrm n nosdomi look to be out the window Sad. & looks like only real defence against tackling frigates for bs' (being able to nos em dry so cant scramble & mwd indefinately) is gone as well. A question on that though, will the noschanges affect NPCs as well or just for PvP? Im not sure I like it how it reads, but if it works for the better then all the better for it. The sig radius idea sounds better though Very Happy

Khanid changes look...interesting. Since i dont fly em i dunno ifits for better or worse but certainly its a move away from the current confused hybrid khanid ships seem to be. Just hope both changes get fully tested & feedback is listened to with due attention. Not just "these are the plans. It shall be so, Tux wills it!"

Amy Robbins
Posted - 2007.07.30 14:41:00 - [14]
 

Thanks for ****ing up the curse/pilgrim completely, any planned changes to them or are you just going to leave it as yet another useless ship?

N1fty
Galactic Shipyards Inc
Huzzah Federation
Posted - 2007.07.30 14:42:00 - [15]
 

Edited by: N1fty on 30/07/2007 14:44:20
Originally by: Sakura Nihil
This will screw with Curse tactics a bit, but we'll adapt (I think).

The problem that concerns me here isn't that, but the close-range missile only bonuses to the ships. In effect, you're locking them into a singular fighting style by forcing the bonuses to only apply to those modules - its one thing to say "CPU will be tight on a standard/heavy missile setup", that's fine, if it is tight and the player wants to attempt a long-range fit, let them try.

Might as well build in the rocket or HAM launchers for the players.


Yeah if CPU is tight with longrange missiles then most people will fit closerange anyway, the HAM and Rocket specific bonuses might be a bit redundant.


Originally by: Amanda Zeherah

Nice well-thought changes that will add some flavour to Amarr (Khanid) ships... Will have to train missiles now.

NOS changes sounds ok...

Also, in a battle, I dont think the GENERAL will be in the front line... in other words, is it intended that a FLEET command ship to fight at close range (even with long-range HAM fitted)?


A good leader always leads from the front Twisted Evil. And commanders would be expected to be in the hardest ships, just so they can 'stick around' for longer.

Originally by: Amy Robbins
Thanks for ****ing up the curse/pilgrim completely, any planned changes to them or are you just going to leave it as yet another useless ship?


Nos serveral different targets at once and Neut the guy you are trying to break the tank of. Its called adaptation and any half decent Curse pilot could see this minor tactical tweak.

Liang Nuren
Posted - 2007.07.30 14:45:00 - [16]
 

Uh, damn, glad I didn't spend the last month training for the curse/pilgrim. Because they'll suck now. Laughing

Of all the suggested good solutions (poison the chalice, sig radius, tracking, etc), they pick a crappy one. Laughing

At least the curse/pilgrim will suck as bad as everyone else's recons again! God, this thread delivers! Laughing

Liang

deadok
Amarr
RUS
Rebellion Alliance
Posted - 2007.07.30 14:47:00 - [17]
 

hehe, we need a HAM bonus on curse, since 1 hi slot will be fitted with neut, 1 with nos (who needs more?)

but that is nice idea - to kill da tank thou shalt loose da tank.Laughing

Dav Varan
Posted - 2007.07.30 14:50:00 - [18]
 

Nos changes are welcome.

But wouldn't it make more sense to make it % based on the target ship alone.

The restriction based on % of own cap is gonna mean nos is only really useful in passive shield tanked ships. Drake ftw ?

Bein Glorious
SAKUMA DROP
ANAHEIM ELECTRONICS Alliance
Posted - 2007.07.30 14:51:00 - [19]
 

The NOS change is sort of up the right alley but not exactly what I'd do, but overall I guess I'm okay with it. I just hope it stays useful for killing capital ships, anyway.

And yeah, with the Khanid ships, I'm okay with the armor tanking missile boat thing, but please, don't give the ships a capacitor recharge bonus if their base cap is going to be extra poor to begin with like how the Vengeance is now, if that is in fact what was planned already. For the frigates, I'd much rather have a decent capacitor from the start (Vengeance) or normal resists (Malediction) and a missile velocity bonus instead. That way, you'd have a better chance at hitting things with rockets, but the range still wouldn't really be that great, just pretty good.

Darian Hazedango
Caldari
Crypsus
Intrepid Crossing
Posted - 2007.07.30 14:51:00 - [20]
 

Edited by: Darian Hazedango on 30/07/2007 14:59:14
How would multiple NOS on a single target work? Would it just bring the two caps to their equilibrium faster? If so there would be a great amount of diminishing returns for having more than one.

And if the equilibrium is measured in percent, surely the transfer amount can't be the same, is it? NOSing a frig of 1% of it's cap won't give a BS 1% of its cap, right? If it's done by cap amount, NOSing just 1% from a BS to a frig would mean the frig would have limitless power. Seems there is a bias.

Sigh, I had my ideal setup too. I guess this is just going to drive up the cost of cap injectors.

Beef Hardslab
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
Posted - 2007.07.30 14:52:00 - [21]
 

Originally by: Dav Varan
Nos changes are welcome.

But wouldn't it make more sense to make it % based on the target ship alone.

The restriction based on % of own cap is gonna mean nos is only really useful in passive shield tanked ships. Drake ftw ?



That's what I was thinking - passive tank drake capbuster lol

Banana Torres
The Green Banana Corporation
Posted - 2007.07.30 14:53:00 - [22]
 

This is the best dev blog in ages.

I can't tell you how happy you have made this Banana. Oh Gawd, armour tanking missile boats and the nossing domi gets a thump in the knackers.

All my Christmasses have come at once.

Very HappyVery HappyVery HappyVery HappyVery HappyVery HappyVery HappyVery HappyVery HappyVery HappyVery HappyVery HappyVery HappyVery HappyVery HappyVery HappyVery HappyVery HappyVery HappyVery HappyVery HappyVery Happy

Glitch 10240
Dragon's Rage
KIA Alliance
Posted - 2007.07.30 14:55:00 - [23]
 

I like the change on the inties, because the missiles for inties are nice because of cap. However tbh on the stuff bigger than frigate class i would much prefer guns, simply because they fire faster (in most cases) and i like ripping into stuff up close with guns. p.s. heavy assault missiles suck :P

Tar om
Minmatar
Octavian Vanguard
Posted - 2007.07.30 14:55:00 - [24]
 

Another victory for interceptor pilots.
Am I the only person who enjoys flying battleships outside a massive blob?

deadok
Amarr
RUS
Rebellion Alliance
Posted - 2007.07.30 14:56:00 - [25]
 

imo it would be much more better to kill opponent cap in any case, but raise own cap only if opponent got more.


Garia666
Amarr
T.H.U.G L.I.F.E
Xenon-Empire
Posted - 2007.07.30 14:57:00 - [26]
 

Edited by: Garia666 on 30/07/2007 15:28:18
Edited by: Garia666 on 30/07/2007 15:20:17

Yet another nerf to amar.. and yet another ****ed of player.
Pilgrim, damnation, Curse, Dictor, Bhaalghorn! is made useless now

You have no idea how ****ed off i am about these changes..
Ill bet there is NO DEV who has his main char an AMARR one!

Amarr is the worst race in EVE and with these changes you do it even more.

WE spend so much time on turret training that now we have to train them on missles..
What are you guys thinking..

This is a sad day for amarr.. The game balance fals more and more apart with every change.
How much can an amarr player take.

Le Bon
Gallente
Aliastra
Posted - 2007.07.30 14:57:00 - [27]
 

Curse/Pilgrim/Bhalgorn will need a bonus to stick to the old method else these ships will become useless.

Valrandir
Gallente
Distant Thunder
Perihelion Alliance
Posted - 2007.07.30 14:58:00 - [28]
 

Edited by: Valrandir on 30/07/2007 14:58:45
\o/
Quite Good

Would you please take a look at the Nightmare split weapon systems problem?

Thanks

Blosphere
Malicious Intentions
Posted - 2007.07.30 14:58:00 - [29]
 

Well I kinda guessed that recon V was waste of time because some of the most useful Amarr ships get of course nerfed. Ohwell.

Dronte
Minmatar
Quam Singulari
Posted - 2007.07.30 14:59:00 - [30]
 

Im a bit ambiguous about these changes. On one account, i run a lot of ceptor and vaga loving, so the NOS nerf is a god send (no more insta fleeing when a domi shows up :)), on the other hand i just started an account extra with the sole purpose of flying NOS ships (curse/pilgrim).

I think one way not to uber nerf these ships which only purpose in life is using Energy weapons like nos and neut, would be to introduce a new high ranking skillbook (rank 8'ish perhaps), Energy Systems Calibration or something like that, which allows you to suck 5 or 7.5% extra cap per level, with stacking nerfs on the levels. So if you have the skill at level 1, are NOS'ing a target which has 100% cap and you have 65% cap, you'd be able to suck him down to 60% (using the 5% extra per level), with a maximum of around 20-30% extra cap sucked with this skill in level 5.

This way you dont kill off the niche of ships that are the Amarrian recons, and you still make it so that Heavy NOS arent an instapop, I-Win button for ceptors and ships like vaga's.


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