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Groox
Caldari
noli turbare circulos meos
Posted - 2007.07.29 11:32:00 - [121]
 

My first 450+ battle. Never saw more than one hostile on my overview. Never managed to shoot at them.
However! I was there in order to protect our home. I took fire more than 3 min I think in my T2 tanked domi. Started to warp when first missiles hit me. Left battlefield with 10% armour (no repping was involved). But I took battleheat away from those of us who where able to fire. So I would like to think that I contributed something after all.




Destruct
Gallente
Octavian Vanguard
RAZOR Alliance
Posted - 2007.07.29 11:39:00 - [122]
 

Originally by: Hyllekjeks
from what I saw in my covert, cow and friends sat with almost 150 ppl on the gate at some point with drones out. I wonder how the lag was created. When we jump in and you guys drop drones in order to create lag, you get it.


If that's true, if you sat with drones out you're either immensly stupid, out to ruin others gaming experience or you just believe it's a viable defence to make the game unplayable to save your pos's. which one is it?

Kaar
Minmatar
Rionnag Alba
Northern Coalition.
Posted - 2007.07.29 13:00:00 - [123]
 

Originally by: Destruct
Originally by: Hyllekjeks
from what I saw in my covert, cow and friends sat with almost 150 ppl on the gate at some point with drones out. I wonder how the lag was created. When we jump in and you guys drop drones in order to create lag, you get it.


If that's true, if you sat with drones out you're either immensly stupid, out to ruin others gaming experience or you just believe it's a viable defence to make the game unplayable to save your pos's. which one is it?


high! repz drones and fyterz!

Foxy CEO
Minmatar
Eviction.
Posted - 2007.07.29 13:10:00 - [124]
 

Originally by: Kaar

high! repz drones and fyterz!


If you're in a fleet battle, wouldn't the primary targets be vaporized before the rep drones can get to them?

And why not wait to assign fighters until your carrier pilots know which combat pilots have actually loaded the grid?

Aramendel
Amarr
Queens of the Stone Age
Black Legion.
Posted - 2007.07.29 13:23:00 - [125]
 

If they camp a gate they already all have loaded the grid.

Or are you seriously asking them to be nice and make the grid loading for the (bigger) enemy fleet as easy as possible and only then launch fighters/drones so they and their enemy has equal lag issues from them?

Jasmina Melt
Caldari
Imperial Amarr Research
Posted - 2007.07.29 13:58:00 - [126]
 

Edited by: Jasmina Melt on 29/07/2007 13:59:36
Originally by: Tearavygh Quillam

Actually, where are the stats vs RZR alliance. It doesn't look good when it drops under 40%, does it? You're disgraceful!


The KB-Admin just put together all attacking alliances into one campaign, you can still see the stats against single alliances (including razor) when clicking on the *snip* - no killboard links. -Ivan K and scroll down a bit.

However, what's with all the hate? I enjoy the fighting except for the lagwars that they were in the beginning since I play this game for fun, not to smack all my enemies to death, but maybe that's just me. Embarassed

: And oh hi Ara YARRRR!!

Lem2J
Gallente
Black Sea Industries
Posted - 2007.07.29 14:03:00 - [127]
 

Originally by: KOTH Fluf
Originally by: tartrus
last night was just another load of bull crap.... MM RZR dont sit there and pretend use had lag thats just bs guys u might of had a little. but when everyone our side is like i only see 402 in local and 3 other guys r like im getting shot... then one guys like umm there 500 and something in local it there gang and its sitting next to us. so frac use trying to make it look like use lagged as well and broke through our huge fraccin gate camp.

its almost like ccp want the defenders to loose and the attackers get all the benefits from the lag. CCP make the guys alrdy in system hav first prefs to server load this is bs im sick of these guys "winning" cus we desync and they dont. yes this is a whine but i got 0 repsect for MM rzr now so i dont want em letting peeps think there winning or there better. right now we hav not had a fair fight with MM rzr so both side hav no idea who accully win cus CCP chooses who win and its usally them jumping in. i would say they hav balls for jumping in but they know there gonna lag us out even more so im not gonna say it.

oh well guess im gonna get hammerd now. bring it on


I guess there are a couple of things you didnt learn from UEJ. First dont sit on a gate waiting for the attackers to come in as Cpt Pugwash said. Warp to the gate after or as they are jumping. Everyone in the system suffered from massive lag as multiple fleets jumped in from both the MU gate and the 2-3 gate. Your own forces (Fallen Souls) jumped in from the MU gate and according to your hypothisis should have had the advantage. We warped only our carriers to that gate to defend and RK jumped in behind the Fallen Souls gang. It appears that everyone at that gate was lagged massively as the 60 man gang from 2-3 jumped into you. The MM/Rzr support fleet warped to the 2-3 gate to a cov ops at range from your fleet. I was one of the first on grid and managed to load overview almost 3 to 5 mins later and started calling primaries. More then half the fleet that jumped into the large bubble on the 2-3 gate never loaded for almost 15 mins or more and some logged. Apparently some of you loaded, because you managed to kill me and a few others.

Bottom line is this is going to be a mess for awhile. You learn to deal with the various situations as they happen and try to learn how to play around the lag and plan on it. We all wish the game would play better, and I havent seen this much lag in along time, and I have been in alot of big fleet fights. We just have to adapt while CCP tries to fix this mess.


Dont take this the wrong way, but this proves that you didnt lag as much as we did... My entire gang on the 2-3 gang.. could not see anything.. We had 1 or 2 ppl warp to our position and tell us we we're being rapped.. We didnt see a thing.. Then a few ppl reported random ppl appearing on the overviews.. so about 5 pilots started to fire.. Mod lag was in the +8mins.. i counted..

After the warp order was given another 5+ minutes it took to warp.. When warp msg came up.. It said we were in a bubble... So we had to spam warp again.. Finally some of us had gotten clear..

We then sat at the POS, with nothing loading for up to 30 mins in some cases... Just a blank grid..

I know the attackers had lag... but it was not as bad as what we were experiencing.. props to our enemy for bringing it.. We've been having a blast between the major fights.. The rest is just pathetic though..

zykerx
Minmatar
Vrix Nation
Posted - 2007.07.29 14:36:00 - [128]
 

Quote >>I know the attackers had lag... but it was not as bad as what we were experiencing.. props to our enemy for bringing it.. We've been having a blast between the major fights.. The rest is just pathetic though.. <<


dude how you know if you sufered more then the attackers? thats yust bull

i jumpedin from 2-3, took me like 30 min, reloaded, took me 15 min to login (was alrdy looking on alt if i would apear in the cloning station) then another 20 min to load grid, finally saw 1 targed and then i emergency warped out

warped back to gate, saw only the gate and me, when i finally loaded the battle kinda ended alrdy

at the end my ceptor died at pos as couldnt move

but yeah this is poswar, lagghell, ccp thought posses would be cool but they are not
they should first have made a server that can hold it before introducing somethingh that needs big numbers

Baddias Mongo
Caldari
Cutting Edge Incorporated
RAZOR Alliance
Posted - 2007.07.29 15:21:00 - [129]
 

Originally by: Fabienne Sovicou
Why aren't Razor posting their losses?

We try to keep an accurate killboard but there will always be a few in a large alliance that dont post losses. Other alliances killboards are checked reguarly by senior rzr (myself included) and if any losses from us are not on our boards then they are cross-posted and the person who didnt post told off for not posting it.

Doing a quick Comparison between M.Pire boards and ours I notice there are at least 15 M.Pire losses to us for the past 3 days alone not posted on your own boards.

Why aren't M.Pire posting their losses? Razz

Undeadas2
Caldari
Atomic Zeppelins
BricK sQuAD.
Posted - 2007.07.29 15:34:00 - [130]
 

Regarding uber Lag (15-45 mins.) - it looks like it was created by bubles.

When we destroyed buble on the first gate - the lag simply vanished (well it was like 30 seconds - a very good one).
We warped to another gate - the lag went up (3-5 min) (local numbers have droped to ~430) - we killed bubbles and again - lag droped very much (to 1-2 mins.).
Latter we still got several fleet fights (with 320-350 in local), some even bigger and more ships on overview than on the "second gate" - but lag was acceptable (1-2 mins.).
This week as far as I remember - there was same experience report (by Triumvirate?) - that after killing bubbles lag went down very much.

So it looks like bubles has direct conection to lag - to exponentialy increase lag depending on the numbers in local.

Wrayeth
Caldari
EdgeGamers
Situation: Normal
Posted - 2007.07.29 16:34:00 - [131]
 

Originally by: tartrus
right now we hav not had a fair fight with MM rzr


I'm guessing you weren't on a few days ago in whatever that system is next to CZD when MM/Snigg had a gang of frigs/HACs/recons/command ships equivalent in size to your gang of BS and carriers and you guys ran and hid inside a POS shield. We even warped to the POS to see if you would fight us, but you (Sparta) wouldn't.

Fair fight? You had a chance to fight us where the odds favored YOUR side, but instead you wouldn't engage.

SMercer
Caldari
Lethal Corp
RED.OverLord
Posted - 2007.07.29 16:43:00 - [132]
 

I was at that pos in a blackbird. All i saw was over 50 spartans cowering in a POS with an entire BS/Carrier gang. We had 0 BS and maybe 4 command ships. Everything else was cruiser and frig size so dont say you didnt have a fair fight. Our gang topped 35-40 at most.

Wrayeth
Caldari
EdgeGamers
Situation: Normal
Posted - 2007.07.29 16:51:00 - [133]
 

Originally by: SMercer
Our gang topped 35-40 at most.


Actually, combined with SNIGG we had 30-ish. The enemies also had 30-ish (at its height, local had 64 pilots). Wink

Fozzy TBE
Gallente
Secret Criminal Underground Movement
Dark Taboo
Posted - 2007.07.29 16:53:00 - [134]
 

Killmail was posted this morn!... i was well Peed off about the god damn lag last night..i logged off and hoped that it would improve the lagg issue ..but to no avail!.and to make things worse i logged back on to see a buch of hostiles waiting!... not a welcome sight!...LMAO!!!WinkWink

Wrayeth
Caldari
EdgeGamers
Situation: Normal
Posted - 2007.07.29 16:53:00 - [135]
 

Edited by: Wrayeth on 29/07/2007 16:53:30
Originally by: Fozzy TBE
Killmail was posted this morn!... i was well Peed off about the god damn lag last night..i logged off and hoped that it would improve the lagg issue ..but to no avail!.and to make things worse i logged back on to see a buch of hostiles waiting!... not a welcome sight!...LMAO!!!WinkWink


Lag is ALWAYS worse on Sunday. Razz

Amuko
Amarr
Reverentia
Illuminati.
Posted - 2007.07.29 18:34:00 - [136]
 

Edited by: Amuko on 29/07/2007 18:34:13
First time I got desynched, cost me my pod. Oh well, probably wouldn't have made it anyway.
Thanks for the insurance money guysWink.

Tearavygh Quillam
Caldari
Cutting Edge Incorporated
RAZOR Alliance
Posted - 2007.07.29 18:41:00 - [137]
 

Originally by: Jasmina Melt
Edited by: Jasmina Melt on 29/07/2007 13:59:36
Originally by: Tearavygh Quillam

Actually, where are the stats vs RZR alliance. It doesn't look good when it drops under 40%, does it? You're disgraceful!


The KB-Admin just put together all attacking alliances into one campaign, you can still see the stats against single alliances (including razor) when clicking on the campaign and scroll down a bit.

However, what's with all the hate? I enjoy the fighting except for the lagwars that they were in the beginning since I play this game for fun, not to smack all my enemies to death, but maybe that's just me. Embarassed

: And oh hi Ara YARRRR!!


No hate involved dude, it's a game and I realy find no place here for egos like Peperami has.

Peoke
Caldari
Interstellar eXodus
BricK sQuAD.
Posted - 2007.07.29 18:50:00 - [138]
 

the lag is the same. i jumped caps into jv1v with red and goon. and in tenal we jumped in right after the fallen souls fleet. out of 70+ i think 7 said they loaded. The key thing people dont understand is what to do with the hand full of loaded. as mm and co proved today competent fleet commanders and members makes use of what you have in a 500+ situation. coming to the forums and whining doesnt sound like people used what they had. based on kills cow and co had people not lagged.

Captain Irregardless
Gallente
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2007.07.29 18:57:00 - [139]
 

Originally by: Reverend William
Not that I'm happy about the situation (I logged out after desyncing a couple of times and getting frustrated that I couldn't even load anything on grids), but what do you all expect? We called in hundreds of allies, RZR/MM/etc bring hundreds of people. Did anyone seriously think it would be lag free?

The problem is us, blobbing one another with every single pilot we have online. Is there an easy solution? Not really, but that's the plain and simple truth. No other game on the market even comes close to these size battles, why should eve be any different? Because people are stupid enough to sit around and amass thousands of players in alliances and then use them all at once?

*shrug* just sayin'


Good post man. No one is all to happy with the way things are going, but that's the nature of the beast right now. Sure you can ***** and moan, but that doesn't much help. The nature of the game has it being borderline intolerable to play for me (POS fighting is always like this), but right now I'm hanging in there.



Originally by: Fabienne Sovicou
Why aren't Razor posting their losses?



Razor is pretty strict about this, with a couple of junkies crossposting as well as the syndication. But if there's missing mails, just send a link to the corp bosses.

Lem2J
Gallente
Black Sea Industries
Posted - 2007.07.29 19:02:00 - [140]
 

moaning helps take the tension away sometime.. hehe..

Zanarkand
Gallente
Enterprise Estonia
Cult of War
Posted - 2007.07.29 20:01:00 - [141]
 

Edited by: Zanarkand on 29/07/2007 20:01:58
Originally by: Tearavygh Quillam
Originally by: Jasmina Melt
Edited by: Jasmina Melt on 29/07/2007 13:59:36
Originally by: Tearavygh Quillam

Actually, where are the stats vs RZR alliance. It doesn't look good when it drops under 40%, does it? You're disgraceful!


The KB-Admin just put together all attacking alliances into one campaign, you can still see the stats against single alliances (including razor) when clicking on the campaign *snip* - no killboard links. -Ivan Kand scroll down a bit.

However, what's with all the hate? I enjoy the fighting except for the lagwars that they were in the beginning since I play this game for fun, not to smack all my enemies to death, but maybe that's just me. Embarassed

: And oh hi Ara YARRRR!!


No hate involved dude, it's a game and I realy find no place here for egos like Peperami has.


Good thing Razor & co never smacks! Nice and respectful replies in this thread from both sides!

Torquemanda Corteaz
Gallente
Infinite Improbability Inc
-Mostly Harmless-
Posted - 2007.07.29 20:16:00 - [142]
 

there's a black hole where v7-mid used to be Shocked

zykerx
Minmatar
Vrix Nation
Posted - 2007.07.29 20:21:00 - [143]
 

Edited by: zykerx on 29/07/2007 20:21:32
jumped into v7 40 min ago

atm looking at a black screen with entering game

but loading to station or v7 ugh

thought geminate was a laggy region but jeez this beats all

Graalum
Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2007.07.29 20:22:00 - [144]
 

Edited by: Graalum on 29/07/2007 20:27:28
Originally by: Undeadas2
Regarding uber Lag (15-45 mins.) - it looks like it was created by bubles.

When we destroyed buble on the first gate - the lag simply vanished (well it was like 30 seconds - a very good one).
We warped to another gate - the lag went up (3-5 min) (local numbers have droped to ~430) - we killed bubbles and again - lag droped very much (to 1-2 mins.).
Latter we still got several fleet fights (with 320-350 in local), some even bigger and more ships on overview than on the "second gate" - but lag was acceptable (1-2 mins.).
This week as far as I remember - there was same experience report (by Triumvirate?) - that after killing bubbles lag went down very much.

So it looks like bubles has direct conection to lag - to exponentialy increase lag depending on the numbers in local.


This makes sense, how many calculations have to go into determining whether someone is in a bubble at any given time? I bet that is multiplied by the number of bubbles as well.

edit: Also, i once heard that alot of jump in lag is caused by the new fleet system, every time someone decloaks all the fleet boni have to be recalculated for everyone, and this is done every time someone decloaks. Have 100 people decloak in rapid succession and you get alot of lag period, and im willing to bet its worse for those in the decloaking fleet than those that aren't.

Inyis
Gallente
Marquie-X Corp
Posted - 2007.07.29 20:24:00 - [145]
 

Im dead. Looking since 20 minutes at my ship still floating in space. Nothing working, never did anything. Saw 1 enemy and 5 allies the whole time. Yay. Local count for me 380.
What a joke.

Torquemanda Corteaz
Gallente
Infinite Improbability Inc
-Mostly Harmless-
Posted - 2007.07.29 20:27:00 - [146]
 

just got in after 20 minutes making 2 jumps to get here... still not loaded yet though....

392 in local

gordon cain
Minmatar
x13
Raiden.
Posted - 2007.07.29 20:27:00 - [147]
 

Edited by: gordon cain on 29/07/2007 20:27:31
Well think I am dead to. Just want to say thx to CCP for bringing all the nice new POS stuff etc into this game.

Much more important than being able to fire your guns.


Hitman396
Caldari
Asset Relocation Specialist Enterprises
Galactic Syndicate
Posted - 2007.07.29 20:29:00 - [148]
 

Moar lag Sad

Pretty damn sure this time around i'm dead though

Jags
Minmatar
Savvy Gents.
Posted - 2007.07.29 20:29:00 - [149]
 

Local peaked at 419 on my client. Taken me 25 mins to move

CCP YOUR GAME IS A ****IN JOKE ATM SORT IT OUT.

Graalum
Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2007.07.29 20:30:00 - [150]
 

Originally by: gordon cain
Edited by: gordon cain on 29/07/2007 20:27:31
Well think I am dead to. Just want to say thx to CCP for bringing all the nice new POS stuff etc into this game.

Much more important than being able to fire your guns.




I thought the new pos stuff was supposed to make large gangs irrelevant. 10 man gangs blowing up the guns on pos and crap, lol, when they have hundreds of thousands of hitpoints. Wink


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