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Collypso
Gallente
Aliastra
Posted - 2007.06.29 00:20:00 - [1]
 

what are they for?

they have the same fitting problems as a frigate, low hp, comparitively low speed

they seem only good for pod poppin and intie killing...

anyone wanna prove me wrong? please do... i trained AF V thinking that theyre useful.

Valandril
Caldari
Ex-Mortis
Posted - 2007.06.29 00:21:00 - [2]
 

Anti frigate/dictor role in fleet.
thats all

Tarin Adur
Gallente
Crimson Empire.
Posted - 2007.06.29 00:21:00 - [3]
 

What a waste of time =(

The only worthwhile AF's are Ishkur,jaguar and wolf to my knowledge,and they, while costing something like 2-4x as much as a cruiser,do a crappy job anyways.

Grunanca
Final Agony
B A N E
Posted - 2007.06.29 00:26:00 - [4]
 

Originally by: tarin adur
What a waste of time =(

The only worthwhile AF's are Ishkur,jaguar and wolf to my knowledge,and they, while costing something like 2-4x as much as a cruiser,do a crappy job anyways.


I have killed several cruisers and even held up battlecruisers in my jaguar. They work just fine.

Kyle Semones
0utbreak
Outbreak.
Posted - 2007.06.29 00:27:00 - [5]
 

yeaaa. sadly AFs just arent very effective.

retribution would be awesome with another midslot

jaguar is good for arty. can insta-pop some t1 frigs but thats about it.

Ishkur i'd say is about the only one worth the trouble.

the only AFs i havent flown are caldari, mayb a blaster harpy thing?


Dangerously Cheesey
Black Omega Security
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2007.06.29 00:28:00 - [6]
 

Originally by: tarin adur
What a waste of time =(

The only worthwhile AF's are Ishkur,jaguar and wolf to my knowledge,and they, while costing something like 2-4x as much as a cruiser,do a crappy job anyways.

At least AF prices have come down somewhat. Wolf for 7m and Jag for 9m is nice.

Tarin Adur
Gallente
Crimson Empire.
Posted - 2007.06.29 00:30:00 - [7]
 

Originally by: Grunanca
Originally by: tarin adur
What a waste of time =(

The only worthwhile AF's are Ishkur,jaguar and wolf to my knowledge,and they, while costing something like 2-4x as much as a cruiser,do a crappy job anyways.


I have killed several cruisers and even held up battlecruisers in my jaguar. They work just fine.


i did say that the jag was a worthwhile AF, and soloing cruisers is doable,but then i'd rather buy and fit a t2 thorax for about the same as the ishkur(ship,no mods) and accomplish the same thing.

Gee Lok
Posted - 2007.06.29 09:35:00 - [8]
 

When the devs give us ships, they have specific intentions as to how we will use them. It is completely up to us to decide what we do with ships.

So what are they for? They are for us to use as we see fit.

Captain Crimson
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2007.06.29 10:08:00 - [9]
 

Originally by: Gee Lok
When the devs give us ships, they have specific intentions as to how we will use them. It is completely up to us to decide what we do with ships.

So what are they for? They are for us to use as we see fit.


To sell.

Xtreem
Gallente
The Collective
White Noise.
Posted - 2007.06.29 10:27:00 - [10]
 

AF are good but they need to be cheaper, i could t2 fit a cruiser easy for the same cost of getting a ishkur and fitting. plus i can inusure alot of the cruisers worth

Enkilil
Minmatar
Thirteen Ninety Three
Posted - 2007.06.29 10:31:00 - [11]
 

Is this thread even serious?

You can run level 3 missions easily w/ them.
You can tank 3x 1.5 mil Gurista rats in 0.0 ratting.
You can tank 2x 1 mil + support Sansha rats in 0.0 ratting.
Can easily take down a BC or BS with the right setup & skills pvp.

t2 guns and high resists, reps in a heartbeat? yeah, who'd want that?
currently flying: Ishkur, Enyo.

Great Artista
Caldari
Veto.
Veto Corp
Posted - 2007.06.29 10:53:00 - [12]
 

0.0 ratting is propably your best bet. Fast and agile ships can easily avoid gatecamps and most of the rat fire. They yield somewhat decend firepower, out dps'd by some cruisers and BC, but valid for low-level spawns.

madaluap
Gallente
Anthrax Foundation
Posted - 2007.06.29 10:54:00 - [13]
 

Originally by: Enkilil
Is this thread even serious?

You can run level 3 missions easily w/ them.
You can tank 3x 1.5 mil Gurista rats in 0.0 ratting.
You can tank 2x 1 mil + support Sansha rats in 0.0 ratting.
Can easily take down a BC or BS with the right setup & skills pvp.

t2 guns and high resists, reps in a heartbeat? yeah, who'd want that?
currently flying: Ishkur, Enyo.


Let me introduce you to the stabber without fancy pants snakes supergear or anything like that.

Just the simply stabber that can keep itself out of 10 km range, has around 7 k worth of HP and is capable of reaching speeds of excess 4 km/s. Its a awesome vessel that can pin down bigger enemy vessels by orbitting outside webrange and if it engages a missileboat just press mwd and keep mwding till backup arrives. The guns will track just *fine* even with barrage loaded and a orbit speed of 2-3 km/s.

That said: i can run lvl 3 easily in a vexor, i killed 10 mil commanders and plenty of faction vessels with a vexor while not docking for 1 month straight. The vexor tanked 3* 1.5 mil bs.

1 thing is absolute nonsense though: An AF taking down a BC or BS with ease. Take on any vessel you want, ill pwn that AF. Take the 65 K 60% resist 1100 dps, webbing, ogre 2 megathron or the 3000 repped each 9.5 sec hyperion.

Those are the easy ones, the dominix well...Twisted Evil

Cpt Branko
Retired Pirate Club
Posted - 2007.06.29 11:17:00 - [14]
 

Killing mining barges Twisted Evil
Other then that, they'll eat any T1 frig alive, also some T2 frigs, and, of course, non-drone cruisers are fair game. In fact, most ratters are.
Anything that can pop 5xwarrior II is very dangerous, or field medium/heavy NOS, or has a 80+% web.

AFs needing a boost have been discussed here in n previous threads.

LUH 3471
Posted - 2007.06.29 11:37:00 - [15]
 

afs are funmobiles and very deadly in small packs

Valandril
Caldari
Ex-Mortis
Posted - 2007.06.29 11:47:00 - [16]
 

Originally by: LUH 3471
afs are funmobiles and very deadly in small packs
To kill any decent cruiser pilot u will need at least 3, and even with that numbers at least 2 of you will die.

IamBen
Caldari
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2007.06.29 11:56:00 - [17]
 

Assault frigs need love.

Zhett Haukes
Mutually Assured Distraction
Posted - 2007.06.29 12:55:00 - [18]
 

Can't fly them yet, but I imagine the amarr ones esp are good for ninja ratting in 0.0 (no ammo needed).

In a pack of a few AFs are great fun. Plus, they look sexy.

5T1G
Posted - 2007.06.29 13:06:00 - [19]
 

AF's only role is to make new players feel 1337 because they can fly a fully T2 fitted T2 ship just like the big boys Laughing that is probabley why so many people jump to defend them Razz

I personally like them, an AF is a dead cert to drop some T2 mods YARRRR!!

The only situation I see them been good is as a heavy tackler in large gang/fleet, where tacklers can be expected to have drones set on them. The extra resists will let them keep the point on for a bit longer I guess *shrug*


Situation Bored
Posted - 2007.06.29 13:07:00 - [20]
 

I plan on using an Ishkur to solo 0.0 rat. Maybe a bit difficult to break BS rat tanks, but probably doable, and any player I can't out-fight, I can out-run (except for T1 frigates and interceptors). Also, 4'th highslot-proto cloak :).

Caios
Caldari
Killson Corp
Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
Posted - 2007.06.29 13:08:00 - [21]
 

I heard they're Amarr fighters used by carriers. They can tank quite well. Just don't get nosed.

Rik'tik'ticheck
Minmatar
Pangalactic Aquisitions
Posted - 2007.06.29 13:24:00 - [22]
 

well i did try ratting in my wolf in 0.0and i can tellyou i was not impressed

i used the setup i used forL3:s and couldn't kill abs with ovet 1M bounty,on the other hand the 3 BC 3 cuiser spawns were doing too much damage, and this was with 54/s rep before res...

so personally i use my wolf for L2missions mainly=) and that is onlybecause i don't wanna do missions in low sec and boundless highest L agent in high sec is 2

i mean sure they are fun - no doubt, but just not worth it

Teak Gothwood
Gallente
Black Thorne Corporation
Black Thorne Alliance
Posted - 2007.06.29 13:51:00 - [23]
 

I love my Ishkur, but you need good drone skills. Spent a long time in 0.0 ratting all day, every day never lost a ship to NPCs.

I repeat, you need good drone skills.

Valandril
Caldari
Ex-Mortis
Posted - 2007.06.29 13:59:00 - [24]
 

Originally by: Teak Gothwood
I love my Ishkur, but you need good drone skills. Spent a long time in 0.0 ratting all day, every day never lost a ship to NPCs.

I repeat, you need good drone skills.
Ishy is only worth something af because u can just send drones and kite your enemy.

Ashturi Nagano
Mantigen Quanta
Ultio Animi Causa
Posted - 2007.06.29 13:59:00 - [25]
 

Originally by: Enkilil
Is this thread even serious?

You can run level 3 missions easily w/ them.
You can tank 3x 1.5 mil Gurista rats in 0.0 ratting.
You can tank 2x 1 mil + support Sansha rats in 0.0 ratting.
Can easily take down a BC or BS with the right setup & skills pvp.

t2 guns and high resists, reps in a heartbeat? yeah, who'd want that?
currently flying: Ishkur, Enyo.


I'd agree that you can tank BS rats easily...even player BSs, but unfortunately, it's not nearly as easy (unless you have a lot of drone space) to actually KILL said BSs...though you can play blocker for your bigger, more easily hurt friends.

DarkElf
Veto.
Veto Corp
Posted - 2007.06.29 14:00:00 - [26]
 

I personally rather like af's. they are fast and agile so can avoid camps and blobs easilt enough but can usually take on more than an inty due to higher dps.

Also they are fun to fly in packs. try seeing how quickly 4 enyos can take a bs down. 4 neutron II's and 2 mag stabs on each and you've got urself like 1000 dps in frigs there.

oh and as said before af's like the wolf, ishkur, jaguar especially are total anti inty ships.


DE



Acinonyx Jubatus
Sebiestor Tribe
Posted - 2007.06.29 14:18:00 - [27]
 

Edited by: Acinonyx Jubatus on 29/06/2007 14:40:38
So... you spent 20-30 days training AF 5 for a frigate, that you "assumed would be useful" and you don't know the role of...

I'd expect you to have some sort of idea at around AF4, which is all you really need to use it. AF 5 is for that lil extra edge over others... but it still won't push you high enough for the time it takes unless you have other skills, and experience/knowledge.

I'd say the frigs need new bonuses, or realigned ones anyways to help their oddball bonus. I'm refering to things like, making the enyo have a double damage bonus and change the bonus to falloff like the deimos, but that was off my head. I dunno, I had ideas for them all a few hours ago, but all except that one and the ishkur's drone damage bonus or something slip my mind.

They need a bit of an "adjustment" to really make them "useful" in regards to everyone's complaints, not to mention I'd love the fourth bonus.

However, with that said. They do still have a use... IF you know how to use them, or you're frigate specced. Not everyone is useful in a cruiser, nor a BC, nor a BS, some just plain shine in frigates over others. They do have their limits for being in frigates... but they may just know how to fit them/use them to make them extra lethal compared to others. Same thing for other ship sizes.

You gotta know what to do and what not to do, it also comes down to playstyle and preferences aswell.

Which makes me also wonder about this topic, as you said you trained af 5 "thinking" they'd be useful, while appearing to have no clue what they can truely do.

Which leads to this, AFs can do things other frigs cannot do right off the bat.

Ishkur = 5 drones
Enyo = blasterstorm/standard/snipe(not as great as the harpy)
Wolf = more DPS over the jag + great arty frig (the thrasher will "outshine" it, BUT IT'S NOT A FRIG)
Jaguar = fastest AF, decent dps, and shield
Hawk = missile spewer + decent tank for a frig
Harpy = reach up to beyond 100km I believe
Vengence = I have no idea...
Retribution = Gauranteed to be instantly mocked when spotted by gang due to lone midslot...(same as vengence, as I'm not sure other than it having a fairly nice tank)

Oh right... You will ofcourse want to eventually upgrade even if you're best in frigs, by way of either cruiser/Bc/BS/capital sized... because it can get a lil tedious flying nothing but frigates... eventually you'll want to work on something with a lil bit more power/use.

LUH 3471
Posted - 2007.06.29 14:21:00 - [28]
 

Originally by: Valandril
Originally by: LUH 3471
afs are funmobiles and very deadly in small packs
To kill any decent cruiser pilot u will need at least 3, and even with that numbers at least 2 of you will die.


bitter much ?

Maeltstome
Minmatar
Sebiestor Tribe
Posted - 2007.06.29 14:29:00 - [29]
 

Originally by: Great Artista
0.0 ratting is propably your best bet. Fast and agile ships can easily avoid gatecamps and most of the rat fire. They yield somewhat decend firepower, out dps'd by some cruisers and BC, but valid for low-level spawns.



Actually if your attacking a crusier, the number of high damage and wrecking shots you get levels out the DPS (weapon sig radius compared to the targets radius). Most crusiers with default resists can take up to 200-300 hits with 250 II's on a fairly consistent basis. A speed tanked Jag with a MSE and some arties can humiliate cruisers, just with its small sig and vaga-resists, it also get a double damage bonus and opti bonus, means high damage ammo at 20k. I like my AF's.

Father Weebles
Celestial Refraction
Posted - 2007.06.29 15:09:00 - [30]
 

like other have said, afs mainly suck.

Not sure what gate camps u guys go through but a half a decent one will tackle you because a ceptor will be able to lock onto the average af.
They're slow compared to their t1 counterparts. A little faster than t1 cruisers but not by much.
The price, even now, does not justify buying one.
A decent cruiser pilot will eat your af alive.

Good points about an af:
Good at npcing in 00 because of resists
Good at killing mega newbs.



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