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blankseplocked Devs - what is your position on cloaking?
 
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Grey Area
Caldari
Posted - 2007.04.25 09:51:00 - [1]
 

I'm not asking for a detailed list of suggestions, I just want to know, in general terms, do you think that cloaked ships need to be detected in some way, and if so, will you be offering any compensatory "boost" to their abilities?

(There have been many posts on this subject, but other than requests to be more polite, I can't find any official CCP input)

Thanks.

firewalker220
Posted - 2007.04.25 10:31:00 - [2]
 

A deep safe spot?

Dr Qu
Caldari
Ginnungagaps Rymdfarargille
Posted - 2007.04.25 10:37:00 - [3]
 

They keep their opinions well cloaked. Haha. Laughing

Miss Anthropy
Perkone
Posted - 2007.04.25 10:42:00 - [4]
 

A cloaking device that can be detected isn't a cloaking device. Right?

Shadow Ballet
Gallente
Trillionaire High-Rollers Suicidal Bassoon Orkesta
Posted - 2007.04.25 10:54:00 - [5]
 

I don't think they will want to reveal their cloaked position .

On a more serious note, I don't think cloaks are unbalanced. Any cloaked ship is unable to cause damage. They are only really good for defence and recon.

Fitz Farseer
Sebiestor Tribe
Posted - 2007.04.25 10:57:00 - [6]
 

I used cloaking for the first time ever 1 month ago and I love it

Ive been taking my stealthbomber to hostile stations and taking pod shots at people and cloaking.

Its awesome when they have bs's, hacs, ceptors, Af's and even sometimes a Carrier undock all for me Very Happy

Its a great way of getting kills and if really fun if you enjoy stealth.

ArtemisEntreri
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2007.04.25 10:57:00 - [7]
 

How's this for official, CCP stated that they were going to release probes that can find cloaked ships.

b0ing
Caldari
INTERGALACTIC PLANETARY - PLANETARY INTERGALACTIC
Free Trade Zone.
Posted - 2007.04.25 11:17:00 - [8]
 

Originally by: Miss Anthropy
A cloaking device that can be detected isn't a cloaking device. Right?

Wrong. I've never played a game where there was no way to detect a "claoked" "stealthed" or "invisible" character, item, or npc. If you are hidden from 3000 people but 2 people can see you (if they exert some sort of special effort) you are still hidden up until when they find you, or even after they find you if you look at it from the points of veiw of the 3000 who still can't see you.

If you look up a definition for "cloaked" it does not include anything saying "Something is not cloaked unless it is cloaked for infinity seconds." or "Something is not cloaked if it has a chance of being found."

Anyways, the OP is talking about all the fuss that has been around concerning people dislike AFK cloakers. I have not seen many people who think cloaks as they function today are overpowered or need to be looked at etc, just tons of people who think people who are AFK and cloaked should have the chance of being found if people who are actually playing the game are searching for them.

To summarize, only crazy people think cloaking as-is is overpowered.

Why there are 897894 threads on "OMG NERF (AFK) CLOAKING!!" is because people do not like the fact that people can AFK cloak and affect systems as if they were not AFK. For months on end, 23/7.

So if you are asking the devs what their opinion of cloaking is and one who happens to have not read the 89688 threads about AFK cloakers responds I expect he migth say "Cloaking is fine." But if a dev who read the countless anti AFK cloak threads replied, he might (I hope) say "We are looking into the issue of AFK cloakers."

The OP is probly hoping the less informed of the two types of devs sees this and posts that cloaking is fine, so he can link it into and tell all the anti AFK cloaker people that he has the backing of the devs and they all need to shut up now.

Callthetruth
Caldari
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2007.04.25 11:19:00 - [9]
 

i want to point u to the features and ideas forum , u might get a better dev response there

Stelani Bellana
Caldari
The Fun Lovin' Criminals
Posted - 2007.04.25 12:02:00 - [10]
 

you would as well have said. "God/Allah/Buddah. whats your opinion on cloaking"

cos u have the same chance of getting an answer form them as the devs.




Janu Hull
Caldari
Terra Incognita
Intrepid Crossing
Posted - 2007.04.25 12:33:00 - [11]
 

Their position would appear to be missionary with a side of greek...

Sorry dude, no matter how you take it, you're screwed.

Thanos Mortis
The Illuminati.
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2007.04.25 12:40:00 - [12]
 

another cloaking thread? Rolling Eyes

mr bighelmet
Dirty Deeds Corp.
Posted - 2007.04.25 13:02:00 - [13]
 

Originally by: ArtemisEntreri
How's this for official, CCP stated that they were going to release probes that can find cloaked ships.

When/where?

Blue Pixie
Posted - 2007.04.25 14:45:00 - [14]
 

Originally by: ArtemisEntreri
How's this for official, CCP stated that they were going to release probes that can find cloaked ships.

They've also on numerous occasions promised to take a look at local chat... if not to remove it outright for 0.0, to at least remove cloaked pilots from it.

Seems to me the main issues here are the "waiting games" and virtual invulnerability associated with cloaking.

That said, both appear to be integral to cloaking tactics.

If cloaked pilots are neither invulnerable nor able to wear down the patience/resolve of their adversaries... what's the point?

It would be like a bubble camp that not only warns victims prior to jumping, but is subject to a chance-based hit-or-miss penalty.

Would it be more "fair" to people who don't like bubble camps? Sure. But it would also detract considerably from their entire purpose in the process.

Nyabinghi
Minmatar
Re-Awakened Technologies Inc
Posted - 2007.04.25 14:47:00 - [15]
 

A while back people complained that cov-ops were gimped for fitting and that Stealth Bombers were near useless, which I consider legit complaints. Now people get annoyed at seeing cov-ops/recons etc. hanging out in local 24/7 and they want a way to probe them out. Well you know you gotta take the good with the bad. What works for you can also work against you. If CCP does introduce probes to find cloaked ships then they'll have to make the scan time pretty long (otherwise they risk nerfing cloaked ships considerably), to which people will then complain that it "takes too long" to probe cloaked ships, on down till covert ships are nerfed to death. They could however remove cloaked ships from local, that would be the only compensation to cov-ops if CCP went ahead with probes that can find cloaked ships.

Anaalys Fluuterby
Caldari
Posted - 2007.04.25 15:02:00 - [16]
 

My favorite comment about cloaked ships was out of the original Klingon Ship Recognition Manual (yes, I know its fiction, so is the game):

"Of the 81 K22B Scout ships built, one has been destroyed, one has been captured by the Federation. The other 79 are believed to be in active service, their where-abouts unknown"

Simply I agree with the above poster: A cloaked that can be found isn't a cloak. Fitting a cloak seriously harms your combat abilities in anything but a recon ship and is enough drawback, they can't hurt you if you are prepared.

As for not being able to find someone in your territory, set a trap. Best solution: Remove cloaked ships from local. Then you won't see them to whine about it. Rolling Eyes

Lord WarATron
Amarr
Shadow Warri0rs
Posted - 2007.04.25 15:19:00 - [17]
 

Nothing wrong with cloaks.

Just make it that cloaks do not work in deadspaces as a anti-farmer device. But apart from that, I dont have any beef with cloaks.

Caol
Minmatar
Posted - 2007.04.25 15:19:00 - [18]
 

Can we have our corp logo's on our cloaks?

Grey Area
Caldari
Posted - 2007.04.25 15:59:00 - [19]
 

Edited by: Grey Area on 25/04/2007 16:01:12
Originally by: Thanos Mortis
another cloaking thread? Rolling Eyes
it was never my intention for it to be a damned thread!

/me shoos all the people who are NOT Devs out of his thread...(I wish)

Yes, I know they have talked about probes. I also know they changed the probe rules for NORMAL ships and got it SO badly wrong in the first place that they almost killed mission running in low sec entirely. CCP are not infallible.

I don't want to argue with anyone in this thread, there are plenty of others for that...so please, just bugger off and see if a DEV actually deigns to give us any input...

EDIT:
Originally by: b0ing
The OP is probly hoping the less informed of the two types of devs sees this and posts that cloaking is fine, so he can link it into and tell all the anti AFK cloaker people that he has the backing of the devs and they all need to shut up now.
Don't put words in my mouth. I want SOME input, that's all. Truth of the matter is, if they say "cloaking's fine", I know not to waste my damn time in the other million threads. If they are looking at cloak detection seriously, then I need to keep posting so that all the whiners don't jump on the whaaambulance and break cloaking as badly as CCP initially broke mission running in low sec.

Cloaks and a detection system for them are NOT mutually exclusive...but if all we get is a detection system and no checks and balances...you'll be able to buy Buzzards for 1 ISK by the end of the month.

SiJira
Posted - 2007.04.25 16:11:00 - [20]
 

Originally by: Miss Anthropy
A cloaking device that can be detected isn't a cloaking device. Right?


QFT
WTFBBQ FFS

there is no reason to cloak if there will be a way to scan for it. it will be like a self nerf to even fit cloaking.



SiJira
Posted - 2007.04.25 16:12:00 - [21]
 

Originally by: ArtemisEntreri
How's this for official, CCP stated that they were going to release probes that can find cloaked ships.


when ? thats even more BS than salvage drones - but i can live with salvage drones. I cant live with this BS

Nyabinghi
Minmatar
Re-Awakened Technologies Inc
Posted - 2007.04.25 16:28:00 - [22]
 

Originally by: Caol
Can we have our corp logo's on our cloaks?


See now, these guys are currently the top cloak-wh0-res in Providence atm. But you know we accept that, we adapt. They are annoying (have to make sure I close the window shutters when I take a shower at Unity station ugh) but the understanding is that what they can do so can we and everyone else, so it's not unbalanced.


Blue Pixie
Posted - 2007.04.25 16:55:00 - [23]
 

Off-topic, but just wanted to say damn Nyabinghi, your signature picture looks great. Well done!

SiJira
Posted - 2007.04.25 17:10:00 - [24]
 

Originally by: Nyabinghi
Originally by: Caol
Can we have our corp logo's on our cloaks?


See now, these guys are currently the top cloak-wh0-res in Providence atm. But you know we accept that, we adapt. They are annoying (have to make sure I close the window shutters when I take a shower at Unity station ugh) but the understanding is that what they can do so can we and everyone else, so it's not unbalanced.




it is already unbalanced
any good ship setup can beat a good cloaker or at least stay alive to get away

Slate Fistcrunch
Red Federation
Posted - 2007.04.25 17:15:00 - [25]
 

CCP believes that cloaks are an outdated fashion and should only be attempted at Halloween (Phantom of the Opera anyone?) or a masquerade ball.

Hoshi
Hedron Industries
Red Dwarf Racketeering Division
Posted - 2007.04.25 17:53:00 - [26]
 

Originally by: mr bighelmet
Originally by: ArtemisEntreri
How's this for official, CCP stated that they were going to release probes that can find cloaked ships.

When/where?



Originally by: CCP TomB, posted in the response thread for a devblog back in june 2006
Originally by: R3dSh1ft
I would also like to know about the possibility of scanning for a cloaked ship

Cloaked ships will be scanable, but they won't get uncloaked if they are found on the scanner.


http://myeve.eve-online.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=357367&page=2#48

Thesas
Gallente
Center for Advanced Studies
Posted - 2007.04.25 18:01:00 - [27]
 

If the concern is over AFK cloaked ships, then why not simply introduce the idea of overheated cloaking devices which require the pilotís intervention to maintain the cloak?

The AFK pilotís cloaking device overheats and fails while the active pilot scurries about emptying his beer cooler to dash ice on the offending unit.

DragonRiderTao
Posted - 2007.04.25 20:50:00 - [28]
 

Edited by: DragonRiderTao on 25/04/2007 20:47:04
Originally by: Thesas
If the concern is over AFK cloaked ships, then why not simply introduce the idea of overheated cloaking devices which require the pilotís intervention to maintain the cloak?

The AFK pilotís cloaking device overheats and fails while the active pilot scurries about emptying his beer cooler to dash ice on the offending unit.


So this would in effect not do anything except remove AFK cloakers. Brilliant.




Redpants
Gallente
Dark Star LTD
Posted - 2007.04.25 21:06:00 - [29]
 

Edited by: Redpants on 25/04/2007 21:06:15
WTF don't you people understand about cloaking? Why do I keep seeing threads questioning whether or not cloaking is overpowered because...you cloak?

And all this fuss over AFK cloakers is almost beyond the ability of some of you to comprehend the hilarity in irony. THEY ARE AFK!

Ahz
Posted - 2007.04.25 21:18:00 - [30]
 

Originally by: Redpants
And all this fuss over AFK cloakers is almost beyond the ability of some of you to comprehend the hilarity in irony. THEY ARE AFK!

Dude, this issue keeps coming up.

So you either have to assume that you're surrounded by a massive number of the dumbest people ever to stumble across the keyboard.

Or you don't understand the problem.

If you decide that it's the latter there are a bunch of threads that attempt to detail the problem. Take a look.


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