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korrey
Amarr
Posted - 2007.04.20 00:23:00 - [1]
 

After getting slightly tired (not bored, far from it) of my Absolution, I decided I wanted to train Minmatar so I could run both races. The first goal I have, is getting a Muninn.

Im hoping to rather skip the speed ships (AF's, Inties, Vaga) and go for the gunships (Muninn, Tempest, Sleipnir). Skipping the speed ships is half the race, but Im just not a fan of speed.

My questions are, how well does/will an Autocannon setup work with a tank? And are there many cap issues with the ship itself? I imagine with no cap guns, a repper is all you would need to take your cap, and an injector would be fairly pointless.

Just getting an opinion from anyone who flies one currently. (I dont know if my setup will fit, and its hypothetical.)

5x 220mm Autocannon II
2x Medium Diminishing Nos

Web
Scram
AB II?

Mar II
DCU II
2x Hardeners (Kin, Exp)
Gyro II

2x CCC rigs?
CCC and an Explosive pump?

Thanks


Vicious Phoenix
Posted - 2007.04.20 00:36:00 - [2]
 

*HINT* Fight Amarr ships, Muninn base EM resists 4tw.

bldyannoyed
Estrale Frontiers
Posted - 2007.04.20 00:43:00 - [3]
 

Just



Don't




Bother.



Muninns are good for one thing and one thing only.

Fitting 720 Artillery, sensor boosters, tracking and damage mods and blowing stuff up before it gets a chance to blink.

Although AC Muninns aren't particulary bad ships the only thing they will beat is a tech 1 cruiser. Any reasonably competent BC pilot or any HAC that isn't an Eagle should pwn it.

korrey
Amarr
Posted - 2007.04.20 00:45:00 - [4]
 

Originally by: bldyannoyed
Just



Don't




Bother.



Muninns are good for one thing and one thing only.

Fitting 720 Artillery, sensor boosters, tracking and damage mods and blowing stuff up before it gets a chance to blink.

Although AC Muninns aren't particulary bad ships the only thing they will beat is a tech 1 cruiser. Any reasonably competent BC pilot or any HAC that isn't an Eagle should pwn it.



Well thats the way it is with most HAC's, this will be in gangs. Small roving HAC gangs as it were.

bldyannoyed
Estrale Frontiers
Posted - 2007.04.20 00:52:00 - [5]
 

Doesn't matter.


Even in small roving gangs its ability to use artillery to destroy a tech 1 cruiser in 2 volleys is far more useful than any half arsed AC setup.


Don't get me wrong, i LOVE my Muninn.

With a gank fit i've recorder hits of over 1500 with quake, and taken intercepters out with a single shot.

But an AC fit is just not something the ship is suited for. It has a lousy armour tank and BOTH its HAC bonuses ( optimal range and tracking ) are totally wasted when engaging a webbed target at 2000 metres.

Idara
Caldari
Queens of the Stone Age
Posted - 2007.04.20 00:55:00 - [6]
 

Edited by: Idara on 20/04/2007 00:51:57
Bull****, AC Muninn works as well.

5x 425mm II, 2x Assault Launcher IIs or a Nos or two
1x 10mn MWD II or AB II, Large Shield Booster II, Sensor Booster/Web/Scram
3x Gyro II and an I-stab or two.

Used it plenty in roaming gangs, works well with the extra alignment speed from the Istabs. Don't armour tank it, just gank the crap out of the biggest ACs you can get on there and with the crazy good Minmatar shield resists, throw on an LSB II or a LSE II.

bldyannoyed
Estrale Frontiers
Posted - 2007.04.20 01:06:00 - [7]
 

With a large booster, an MWD and no injector uve got what, 60 secs before your caps gone, probably less.


Compare that to a Deimos, Ishtar, Zealot, Cerberus, Vaga or even the gimp the Sacrilege and you really think thats a setup worth playing with?

Then compare to the Arty Muninn which by the time your MWD AC muninn is even in range has already delivered more firepower than most BS are capable of.

Arty Muninn = The Win




Wrayeth
EdgeGamers
Situation: Normal
Posted - 2007.04.20 01:29:00 - [8]
 

Edited by: Wrayeth on 20/04/2007 01:39:04
Originally by: bldyannoyed
Then compare to the Arty Muninn which by the time your MWD AC muninn is even in range has already delivered more firepower than most BS are capable of.


Please tell me that you're joking and that you don't really believe that.

First, understand that the tempest in long range configuration with only 5 1400 II's does more DPS than a munin. Now understand that the tempest has another turret slot, so the DPS difference is further increased. Now understand that every other battleship aside from the dominix and typhoon inflicts more DPS than the tempest when fitted for long range.

Minmatar may have the highest alpha, but that means exactly jack since the hitpoint increase(s).

In response to the original poster, stick with the vaga if you're using ACs. Why? Simple: shield tanking a munin doesn't work all that well unless you're not expecting to take much in the way of incoming fire. You don't have the slots to passive tank and still run MWD and scrambler, which means you have to active tank. Without a cap injector (which you don't have the slots for), your MWD and shield booster combined will eat your cap alive.

Thus, you must armor tank. As an armor tanker, the munin's EM and thermal resists are quite nice. Unfortunately, though, that won't help you against anything that throws kinetic damage (everything except Amarr) and explosive damage (everything Minmatar, Caldari, and also Gallente droneboats). The reason for this is simply that the munin has no more on its kinetic and explosive resists than a rupture. Thus, the excellent resists which make a HAC viable in short range combat just aren't there.

In short, if you want to use a rupture hull with an AC configuration, just use a rupture - it doesn't inflict that much less DPS, and it tanks almost as well. It also costs a LOT less when you lose it.

bldyannoyed
Estrale Frontiers
Posted - 2007.04.20 01:32:00 - [9]
 

Wrayeth.


I say this with all honesty.

I have, with a bit of luck, destroyed a tech 1 cruiser in a single volley with my Muninn.

I have a lock time against a cruiser of less than 2 seconds.

It only takes 4 seconds to do a 180 turn and align for a warp out point.

I can be in, killing and gone before anyone can react.

So what BS can do that in that timeframe and hope to walk away in one piece ?

eXtas
NibbleTek
Posted - 2007.04.20 01:46:00 - [10]
 

720 for muninn, dont try to use ac's.. if u want ac's use vaga, it does it a lot beter, even if u want to armor tank for some reason Shocked

arty muninn is the way to go if you want to blow up stuff fast. sure its averige dps isnt yber but if you just look at 1-2 first wolleys the damage is huge

Wrayeth
EdgeGamers
Situation: Normal
Posted - 2007.04.20 01:58:00 - [11]
 

Edited by: Wrayeth on 20/04/2007 01:55:47
Originally by: bldyannoyed
Wrayeth.


I say this with all honesty.

I have, with a bit of luck, destroyed a tech 1 cruiser in a single volley with my Muninn.

I have a lock time against a cruiser of less than 2 seconds.

It only takes 4 seconds to do a 180 turn and align for a warp out point.

I can be in, killing and gone before anyone can react.

So what BS can do that in that timeframe and hope to walk away in one piece ?


First off, I'll bet money that this was before the hitpoint increases, and that the target didn't have any resists or plates. Furthermore, it would require three or more wrecking shots for that to actually happen, and that's IF you're using quake (also note that quake had its range and damage reduced in Revelations).

Basically, you're saying that, if you get a one-in-many-thousands occurrence, you can kill an unhardened, unplated cruiser in one volley. If that small chance of instant success against a target that you could've destroyed easily under normal circumstances, anyway, floats your boat, then by all means have at it. Just don't try to convince others that it happens all the time or even frequently.

EDIT: BTW, I'm not saying the arty munin isn't a good ship, just that it's not anywhere near as uber as you're trying to make it out to be.

Galen Silas
Gallente
Aliastra
Posted - 2007.04.20 14:20:00 - [12]
 

AC fitted Muninns are pretty dam nasty tbh


 

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