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blankseplocked Will CCP Ever Create Another Realm?
 
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Vrizuh
VTECHS
Posted - 2007.04.07 08:50:00 - [31]
 

New players to new 'realm' then feel unfairly disadvantaged, request new realm.

It doesn't end, just look at WoW. In fact, WoW and L2 serve as great examples of how attitude changes everything. I have only 1 60 (and I have no intention of ever reactivating that acc). I know some people with 3. I have met people who started the game years after me, who with the right connections, had not only hit 60 in under a month, but also out-geared me in a matter of weeks.

Its not something to try and correct half-heartedly. Humans compete, and the best you can do for the little guy, is average out the better guy. Which just makes the world more bland, more vanilla.

You say you've been playing for a year. Did you specialise? Do you think that the players with 20mil sp haven't rerolled and found a use for the new character within a month of sp training? Hell, there are trial accounts out there with level 5 skills I don't have. You can do a lot with new accounts thanks to ccp fighting sp inflation. It just takes a bit of effort. A change of perspective, something. Its one thing to be upset at arbitrary advantages people are given (T2 bpos) and another to be thinking that a company should just abandon or punish its loyal players to make way for new blood.

Marquis Dean
Caldari
Indigo Fade
Posted - 2007.04.07 10:02:00 - [32]
 

You can play on the test server.

RaWBLooD
Posted - 2007.04.07 10:45:00 - [33]
 

The biggest aspect of eve that makes it what it is .... is that its a single persistent server.

If you know someone that plays eve, you know you can meet / affect them in game !!


Jim McGregor
Posted - 2007.04.07 10:52:00 - [34]
 


Its not impossible to compete with older players. You might not be able to kill one in a duel, but so what? Eve is about team work and groups. When you have played a year you should be able to switch corporation and pick one of the established oldtimer corporations. Im pretty sure you will learn a lot from them on how to really play the game. And then you can start competing.

You do not compete in Eve by waiting for 20 mill sp and then try to find duels...

DragonRiderTao
Posted - 2007.04.07 10:53:00 - [35]
 

All great points in this thread. Any character after 2 years can be "maxed" if they were specialized, anything else is just for variety.

Seriously, if you want to go having a good chance of killing anyone else in the game, dont ask for new 'realms', just accept that you are going about gaming all wrong in the first place.


Sinder Ohm
Demonic Corp
G00DFELLAS
Posted - 2007.04.07 11:02:00 - [36]
 

Being effective in pvp involves 50% skillpoints and 50% knowing how to fly your ship propely.

I am in the same situation as you, it doesnt really bother me though.

Tarminic
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
Posted - 2007.04.07 11:03:00 - [37]
 

Originally by: YanBizzle
My point is that the rift between the new and old is growing TOO large in my opinion, I agree with those that say it should stay in one shard, it is what makes Eve, Eve.

Perhaps what could be done is offer the highest level players the chance to move to another server, when the population grows to large in Tranquility, this way it would give the new players a better chance of being successful. This also creates a better economic situation for CCP, as hypothetically there will be fewer people leaving the Eve Community due the fact they cannot contend with the far far superior players. As was said, Eve was designed so new players can survive properly, but that being said I still believe the gap between the new and experienced has grown too vast, and if it has not, it soon will.

Best regards, thanks very much for your input!
-Yan


I understand your perspective Yan, but you shouldn't let that percieved difference let you think that you're at a permanent disadvantage. After all, why is it the younger generation are not at a constant disadvantage to the older generation? Because while the older generation had experience and wisdom, the younger is more apt to innovate, take new risks, do stupid things in the name of science and/or conquest. It's much like evolution really, in the sense that the younger can overcome the older by innovating.
Goonswarm was/is a good example. The time they first came about the general doctrine of fleet combat was to outfit all your ships with the best equipment they could afford do lose, but Goonswarm turned the idea completely upside down by using extremely cheap ships in large numbers, and (to an extent) that's why you see them controlling a bug chunk of space on the map now.

Though I do get jealous when I see someone flying around in a HAC ugh

Kagura Nikon
Minmatar
Emptiness.
Posted - 2007.04.07 11:25:00 - [38]
 

There is no such problem in EVE. Tell me.. how many MMOs can have 10 x 2 week old character defeat any 2 year old character (except supercapital ships... but these are as hard to kill to 1 month old char as to 2 year old)?


Eve is the best MMO for begginers by far.... the only problem is that in first few weeks you have no clue of the tricks you need to use to survive. After that.. jsut find friends and you are good.

A 1 year old character as you can be a very good HAC pilot, as good as a 3 year old one.

michael weels
Gallente
Posted - 2007.04.07 11:36:00 - [39]
 

new realm wood b good

heheheh
Phoenix Club
Posted - 2007.04.07 11:36:00 - [40]
 

Edited by: heheheh on 07/04/2007 11:33:54
Edited by: heheheh on 07/04/2007 11:33:23
The rift betw4een older andnewer players is fine,
Younger players are always of use and despite what you say it is very possible for you to beat players with more SP in combat,
you say youhavebeen here 1 year yet have not once been succesfull in pvp ? all i can say is you are still choosing the wrong targets.
Im betting you were one of those people on WOW that cried for a new PVP server to open every month becuase the ones on your server had "EpicS" and you couldnt kill them, even though you could.
All in all i think a new server would be a good idea, but only for a lag reduction reason, nothing else.

Heraku
Katsu Corporation
Posted - 2007.04.07 11:42:00 - [41]
 

Edited by: Heraku on 07/04/2007 11:40:15
*put's flamesuit on*

YanBizzle i fully understand where your comming from.

The Universe in it's current form feels just like walking the paths, other players have prepared long ago.
There is nothing new and exciting.
Every corner is uncovered, every moon scanned, good spot's and plexes are timed and farmed to death.
T2 BPO's are seeded and no way inventioners can compete.

I play this game since almost a year, and i got to admit that this is the only beef i got with EVE.
I cant play a pioneer and build something up from scratch. Instead i got to seek consent or join a large corp / ally.
(Can you say : walking in other peoples shoes ? )

Face it in this Galaxy we will always be third class, no matter how much time we spend or how smart we play.

There is no real freedom in this Galaxy.
That beeing said, i would instantly start over in a new Galaxy given the chance.
Find me some cool buddies and start to work...

Highly unlikely but hey i allowed to dream or not ?

Thread Winner
Federal Navy Academy
Posted - 2007.04.07 11:43:00 - [42]
 

Originally by: Heraku

T2 BPO's are seeded and no way inventioners can compete.



You haven't seen the 350mill hulks have you?


Heraku
Katsu Corporation
Posted - 2007.04.07 11:45:00 - [43]
 

Taking Hulk's as an example for the entire T2 Market aint representative really.

Tarminic
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
Posted - 2007.04.07 12:03:00 - [44]
 

Originally by: Heraku

T2 BPO's are seeded and no way inventioners can compete.


That's completely false actually. Even if you own 10 T2 BPOs you can be beaten by an inventor because he's not bound to any single product and can choose which modules are most profitable. T2 BPO holders cannot.

Skyee
Vitriol Ventures
United Front Alliance
Posted - 2007.04.07 12:07:00 - [45]
 

Edited by: Skyee on 07/04/2007 12:05:01
The big issue here is not really skills, as has been said here you can operate with others till you get the skills up.

The big problem with Eve at the moment is the way CCP have biased Eve for PvP, this is leaving no place in the game for people who are not into PvP but prefer to mine and make things.

We are in a situation where a pirate corp decided to go after us, they joined the Priviteers and got them to war dec us. This is plain stupid an entire allience war decing a single corp, It has rendered us unable to operate they just sit outside station and blow up everyone who leaves, and although we will fight back we have already lost a long term player who has decided, to quit Eve, as he put it if he cannot play as he wants, he will stop paying CCP and give his money to a game that allows him to play as he wants.

His opinion is that Eve has reached a peak, and will now dwindle to small core of pure PvP players, also if most of the carebear empire producers decide to quit where does that leave the Eve Market?

A simple solution would be to prevent empire wars, this would allow people the option of playing safely in hi-sec if the want but still have the opton if going to low sec and accept the risk, the current situation is removing that choice.


Ankanos
Caldari
Posted - 2007.04.07 12:15:00 - [46]
 

Originally by: YanBizzle
Hello,
I was wondering if CCP ever plans to create another realm, or world where everyone must start from scratch?



um...NO.

Life is unfair. Eve does a great job of reflecting this.
the game's playing field has been leveled too much as it is..

only suggestion: pick your fights. don't let them pick you.

-lets keep the original vision of this game intact, tyvm.

fair=boring

dont caught up with the numbers.. skill counts alot more
than skill points.

/me goes back to sleep

-ank

----------
-i'm still twitching from
the Dev's April Fool's blog.

Rebal 88
Minmatar
Black Ice Protectorate
The Imperial Senate
Posted - 2007.04.07 15:16:00 - [47]
 

Originally by: Jex Jast
Originally by: Sheriff Jones

A good analogy(correct term?) would be to say: Well i know bill gates has a lot more of these paper thingies then i do, but winning 20 bucks from a scratch lottery is still heck of a rush Laughing


Correct term. Smile

Oh and OP...what is this "realm" you speak of?

Did you come from...yeah...you did I can still smell it on you...


lolz

Chewan Mesa
Resurrection
Gentlemen's Club
Posted - 2007.04.07 15:35:00 - [48]
 

Originally by: Heraku
Edited by: Heraku on 07/04/2007 11:40:15
*put's flamesuit on*

YanBizzle i fully understand where your comming from.

The Universe in it's current form feels just like walking the paths, other players have prepared long ago.
There is nothing new and exciting.
Every corner is uncovered, every moon scanned, good spot's and plexes are timed and farmed to death.
T2 BPO's are seeded and no way inventioners can compete.

I play this game since almost a year, and i got to admit that this is the only beef i got with EVE.
I cant play a pioneer and build something up from scratch. Instead i got to seek consent or join a large corp / ally.
(Can you say : walking in other peoples shoes ? )

Face it in this Galaxy we will always be third class, no matter how much time we spend or how smart we play.

There is no real freedom in this Galaxy.
That beeing said, i would instantly start over in a new Galaxy given the chance.
Find me some cool buddies and start to work...

Highly unlikely but hey i allowed to dream or not ?



So uhm, I get you right that you are saying that

- everything in a game that has already been done before you did it = boring and not exciting?
Like, if you would make enough isk, become part of an alliance and were able to build a mothership for yourself.
It loses all appeal because there are other motherships already flying around?

Going by that logic, every MMO is boring for you, because although for example Lotro is just getting released you can get maps of all things to discover already, cause someone did it. Means the game doesnt have any excitement for you?

And what is this with EVE having no freedom, how did you come to that conclusing?

I neither understand how "you" will always be 3rd class in EVE, I play with every age of chars ingame since I started out, there is absolutely no difference in the fun they have. And very few are unbelievably rich 3 year old players.

Tekka
Caldari
Sneaky Beaver
Posted - 2007.04.07 15:39:00 - [49]
 

Originally by: YanBizzle
...I have experienced a serious concern, which is that whenever I try to do something, anything, in Eve it seems there is always someone doing it a thousand times better than me.


More like only 2-6% better.

Rthor
Gallente
Smugglers Inc.
Posted - 2007.04.07 15:44:00 - [50]
 

There is always a possibility that it is not skill points that are keeping you from "winning." What if you could not hack it on the new server? And to solve this problem you want to shard Eve?

darklegionca
Caldari
Dark Deliverance Holdings
Posted - 2007.04.07 15:47:00 - [51]
 

*snip*

Be nice.

- Lord Harold


TomParad0x
Caldari
RogueNET
Posted - 2007.04.07 16:04:00 - [52]
 

Originally by: YanBizzle
Hello,
I was wondering if CCP ever plans to create another realm, or world where everyone must start from scratch?

I have been playing Eve for exactly a year on 4/20, and although I have enjoyed the game immensely, I have decided to cancel my accounts, once, and for all. Though I have long been a member of the 0.0 community, I have experienced a serious concern, which is that whenever I try to do something, anything, in Eve it seems there is always someone doing it a thousand times better than me. This is because the players that have been playing since release have a HUGE advantage over newer players, and unlike many, if not most other Massively Multiplayer Online Games's (MMO's or MMOG's), in Eve you cannot reach the upper levels of game play by simply playing the game more often; however this is not my 'beef' with Eve or CCP, the issue at hand is that the rift between the upper and lower classes (in terms of numbers of Skill Points) of Eve is growing far to large; newer player are far less likely to enjoy Eve, because it is impossible to compete with other, older players. The fix other MMO's makers use is a level cap, but this would absolutely ruin Eve.
The place where this is most evident is 0.0, where the very best aspects of the game are to be found: PvP and Wealth. For example, even my account and character that has always been 100% combat skilled has yet to have any success what so ever without the help of corp members that have been playing for Eve for much much longer than I have.

This is a huge frustration for me, and the only fix I can think of would be to create another realm, where any user of the realm must create new character's, and character transfers would not be permissible from realm to realm; or another option would be to create a maximum Skill Point transfer limit, say between 3-5 million SP, and offer free transfers to those that wish to move and meet the requirements.
This would work well, because the gap between the upper and lower classes would be far less severe, and eventually character transfers could be made available based upon whether your characters' Skill Points are below a median number. This way people could enjoy the buoyant market and playerbase on Tranquility until they are ready to move to the new realm.
This brings me to my second, and minor gripe regarding Eve, the lag, which is horrendous at times, a second realm could fix this issue.

I would highly encourage and appreciate your input.

-Jan


Ok, I might have missed this in your post if I did feel free to point it out, but:

Say CCP makes this new server, people transfer and so on... It would only fix the problem you are talking about for a short time. What happens when the players on this new server get high skills? Its in the same boat as TQ with the problem you are describing.

Nymos
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2007.04.07 16:17:00 - [53]
 

why do people always care about what others have? try to be happy with what you got and can do. one year is about the time when you start to really max out in certain fields if you specialized. that's the time when you feel you're able to accomplish things a thousand times better than others. it might be exactly the time where you shouldn't quit, but that's just my opinion.

in eve you can't quickly grind to end-game-status and then grind end-game content with the other 50% of the server that are already grinding them. in can only speak of eq2 for "current" fantasy mmorpgs, but oh man is it boring to go through low level zones. they are totally empty because everyone rushes (and is able to do so) to endgame stuff.

i think one big reason this happens is that you can buy/sell characters legally. in other games if you close your account your characters are out of the game (i don't mean deleted...). in eve it is much more sensible to sell your veteran character because as you said he can do things a lot better and as someone's alt he can be a great asset for no efforts.

if you specialize you max out that spec in about a year. someone who is 4 years has a broader variety of skills. he can maybe fly cap ships of more than one race, but is that important? i don't think so.

dennyreborn
Posted - 2007.04.07 16:49:00 - [54]
 

I don't think I would like a permeate other universe. But on the other hand I would love a temporary universe.

For instance make a universe set back in the past when the amarr still enslaved the minmatar. Then make it so players start at 10 mil SP and can only be minmatar. then go through the minmatar rebellion and freedom movement, also besure to add that the NPCs pod in this world. it would be a fun thing to do for one to two months. maybe have limited number of characters only or some such.

Apollyon X
Minmatar
The Hoodie Mafia
Cosa Nostra.
Posted - 2007.04.07 17:42:00 - [55]
 

I started 2 years after the release and I still pwn, as many people are ahead of you in skills, there is the same number behind you.

YanBizzle
Posted - 2007.04.11 02:47:00 - [56]
 

I'm not trying to anger people, or attempt to get flamed by people, I'm just sharing my opinion and looking for yours. However I don't appreciate being called an "emo kid" and being treated poorly.
I still think that there are issues, but I'm not so set in my mindset. I think my issue is I'm impatient, and I don't want to wait 1-2 years to be specialized in one field, especially when I know that there are others that already have the field down, and are training new fields. My hope is that the population will eventually grow too large to be contained by one server (excuse my use of the word 'realm', I believed it to be the appropriate wording for an MMOG such as this), and when this happens CCP will create the split to make it a little more fair.

I remember a MMOG from a few years ago where the split between the new and the old grew large, and the production team behind the game reset characters, and I think it would be to CCP's advantage to think of a way to prevent this, a way that does not involve the resetting of characters, but a creative way to balance the players of Eve. Eventually I fear the promise of success in 0.0 will be unattainable in Eve, because of this rift, this is my prime example, but I'm sure there are others; and then what? New players will not play, or will leave early on in their Eve career, and some of the older players will grow out of Eve, or leave for other reasons. I should have made it clear in my post that I had CCP's best interests in mind, as well as yours, and lastly mine.

I'm sure this has been brought up within CCP, and if CCP has any sense, there is already a plan out for such an eventuality of a server too crowded, or a rift between the new and old that creates economical or player issues for CCP.
I'm curious as to what CCP will do when they release the new expansion, with walk in stations and such? Walk in stations and the like are like a dream come true for me, perhaps CCP will hear the few of us out who share similar concerns, and take action when when action becomes necessary.

I'm not trying to create enemies, so please leave me alone and don't call me names or make generalizations about me, I'm not trying to create a flame war, but a discussion for other mature players about an issue of importance to me.
-Yan

lordharold


ISD YARR
Posted - 2007.04.11 03:13:00 - [57]
 

Cleaned. Keep it on topic and the flames/trolling down.

Lord Harold


Malcolm Gerwulf
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
Posted - 2007.04.11 03:50:00 - [58]
 

I think a new server would be a great thing. There are numerous advantages, and frankly any of the vets that think they have the "leet skillz" would be able to prove it by creating new characters in a new universe. Having one persistant universe throughout all the bugs and balance fixes means one messed up economy guarded by old vets too old and grizzled to abandon their nursing home server. (obligatory Wink )

Seriously though, I think new players would be much less intimidated on a new server, myself included. The ISK sellers would have to start over, which I think by itself justifies a new server/economy. Reduction of overall server lag is another excellent reason. I could go on and on, and maybe I will if this thread continues, but suffice to say that I believe it would be a great thing both for the EVE community, and CCP's pocket book to open at least 1 additional server. Flame on!

Farrellus Cameron
Sturmgrenadier Inc
Nulli Secunda
Posted - 2007.04.11 03:56:00 - [59]
 

CCP has repeatedly and very clearly stated that its committed to the single shard system.

I understand your frustration, I to have been playing for a little over a year and admit frustration when I get an idea to try and do something and find that hundreds of people have already come up with the same idea. Even so, I have still been able to figure out niches to occupy quite successfully. So while its hard, it is doable.

While people who have been playing longer do have an advantage, a lot of activities only require a few certain skills. Once you get those skills to level 5 it doesn't matter how much longer you play, there's nothing more you can do to improve them. It can take some time to train those skills up, once you get them up there you are on the same level as everyone else.

One example is industry. Once you get Production Efficiency V you are competitive with every other producer out there.

Or take interceptor pilot. Once you get the primary skills up high enough, you've pretty much maxed out your ability to fly an interceptor. There are a few longer skills you can train to level 5, but the bonus will be negligible. You can also put faction mods and such on there, but there are only a few pilots who have the isk to risk high end faction/officer mods in such a light ship. The vast majority of players, even if they've been playing for years, are not in a position to take that kind of risk.

Malcolm Gerwulf
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
Posted - 2007.04.11 04:00:00 - [60]
 

Much of the advantage in EVE is not from skills, but from an established powerbase and/or economic base. Can you say with a straight face that none of the past patches since release have been to correct ISK or corporation exploits?

Starting a new server is a great way to start a universe the way it was meant to be played, with the new patches from day 1 that enforce the balance that was supposed to be present all along.

If CCP is committed to a single shard operation then I admire them and what I see as their outmoded ideas. There are lots of us that have money just as green as the vets, and we are looking for a fair shake in a semi-new environment.


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