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KDM Corp
Firmus Ixion
Posted - 2008.01.08 21:13:00 - [151]

I like the idea from an RP point of view and adding to immersion but completely agree with all those pointing out that we are at risk of Yet Another Bonus To Amuse Micromanagers (ah well I tried but I don't think YABTAM will stick Smile).

A workable idea in two parts:
1. Crew happyness and deaths. i.e. more kills and recent usage by the ship = happier crew. When you kill a ship you get the deaths added to a running monthly total, or overall total, to show what a l33t killer you are. TEXT ONLY when you look at a ship for player amusement and immersion.
2. NO CHOICE OVER CREWS - NO MANAGEMENT. Instead, a ship that has a happy crew receives a very small bonus (e.g. 1% or less) onto its existing ship bonuses - so a ship with 5% ROF bonus would get a 5.05% ROF bonus with a happy crew. This has very little balancing or gameplay impact as all it does is negligably enhance a ship's existing bonus characteristics. I figure this would add to immersion in a light way that would add no management overhead and have little real impact but give all of us a nice warm feeling when we inspect the ship and see that the crew is happy.

I would suggest a small randomisation factor in crew happiness, or linked to global / alliance / corp events, might also be fun. So happiness varies between 0 and 0.01 based on ship recent usage and kills, randomised by other factors.

Fun, adds to immersion, little effect on gameplay, no extra management. Sounds good to me.

Jan Ars
The Thrill Kill Club
Posted - 2008.01.08 21:23:00 - [152]

This is a cool idea - I'd love to have my own Scotty, Bones, and Spock flying along with me in my Raven. I'd also appreciate the "RP" or "leveling" aspect that it would introduce.

Sadly, I don't think CCP would bother. It's an ambitious idea, but there's so many other things that need to be done.

In short:

Delightful, creative idea, but not likely to be implemented.

Mr Riis
Posted - 2008.01.17 11:19:00 - [153]


I agree with the idea of crew being a great idea from an immersion point of view- and it is imho a GREAT idea!

I agree with crew being yet another thingy to amuse munchkins, but what the hey, so is all the rest of our gear :)

I think that crew should somehow be dependant on your social skills, giving charisma (the forgotten stat) a much needed revival. In example: You would need to train certain (new) charisma based skills to gain acces to various types of crew.


Nemtar Nataal
Demonic Retribution
Posted - 2008.01.17 11:53:00 - [154]

I think you are looking at this the wrong way m8.

I like the idear of actually bieng able to control your crew in some fashion. But like a lot of people already pointed out, ships already have bonuses they dont need any more bonuses.

However insted of having crews give bonuses well you should have them give penalties! A normal motivated crew with a good captain would alwayes have full bonus and so forth. Your crew would be motivated in the fields as you wore which means if you did a lot of pirating your crews moral would become bether the more ships you killed. Thus bieng able to keep your ship in pristeen and working order.

However if you wore a careless captain and just did one suicide run after another you would be hard pressed to man your ship and get it working properly.
If you mis used the logof option your crew would start loosing moral, making your crew less efficiend in running your.

My point is we have enough bonuses but i would like to se some anti flood tool. You should still be able to do a couple of stupid missions i mean we all like a good fight every once in a while. But years and years of abuse of your crew threwing ships asay left right and center would have a negative impact on your ships.

Daugar Draaken
Posted - 2008.01.17 14:34:00 - [155]

I didnt read every post and I am not 100% experienced with eve but what I gather is this. This should be an "easily" (relative speaking) introduced idea in Eve.

1- crews should be fourth a slot underneath shield, armor and hull. Some weapons would be more effective on crews, some highly specialized devices maybe even bypassing the three and causing some crew incapacity. This feature can be implemented in 1-2 years in Eve and would enhance realism immensely.

2- Crews cost money to hire, outfit, train. Crews fatigue after an hour of flying. To fit a standard crew costs a standard token amount of money and would require a new service option in a station. Maybe a crew need food and goods, kept in cargo just like we keep in place ammunution. Again, this would spectacularly increase realism and reduce the current "asperger fringe" quality Eve arguably has. CCP should take steps to make the emotional bond a player has with the game and the vessel and this is one manner.

3- Wholly new missions and story elements can be introduced based on a crew. Some crewmembers could have backstories and names. A special legendary engineer would allow a player to enjoy clear advantages similar to skill based benefits, or even unique special tricks. Elite crews would increase weapon range, speed, scanning range. Anything is possible. These features can be implemented in 2-3 years in eve.

4- Crews would open a totally new combat device - boarding actions. A ship would have minimal crews in one of a handful of categories (officer, engineering, crew, gunner, security, science?) and maximum allotments. Weapons would require handling crews and special devices or ship alterations would require pretty costly crews. Some might specialize in killing off the crew of an enemy vessel and aim to sterilize a vessel with the specific purpose of boarding and pirating it. Alternately a compliment of crew would also make the whole issue of manned fighters (smaller than frigates, bigger than drones)
a lot more plausible, and the quality of a manned crew can make a damn bit of difference as we have seen in Battlestar Galactica. This stuff can be implemented in 2 to 4 years in eve.

5- Moving focus from the ship to a shuttle could open up exploration missions. The first step in the current paradigm could be an exploratory mission inside small asteroid caves as depicted in the game "descent". This would open up a new niche of gameplay, maybe even a parallel game - gameplay outside or near ships using anything ranging from powered armors to shuttles to barges - stuff bigger than a drone (AKV) but smaller than a frigate. One line of players could be outside, waging ship actions as is the norm in eve now, other players could be up and about doing boarding actions, remote operating (or hacking!!) robotics, exploring asteroids (close up mining!!) - and in the long run FPS action on stations or planets. This latter stuff can be implemented somewhere between 2 to 5 years in eve.

6 - which brings up the issue of gravity, or lack thereoff. One of my biggest fascinations with space is free fall. The introduction of crews and meaningful ways to operate crew (possibly using an auxilliary strategy game-like interface or a abstractized option in the existing eve structure) would allow for a robustly larger empathic bond between players and the game content. All of my friends frown on eve because it's a "****ed up overspecialized game" (quoted the most colorful reference). Reducing the specialization, in that line of reasoning, would open up the game to more clients verrry quickly.

Incidentally: I intend to start a 4-year training in Game design. In 2 years I'd love working with CCP as intern. I am very motivated about eve, especially in its longterm potential. I am a somewhat accomplished graphic artist and I have 25 years of experience with games and stories and people in a roleplaying context. I am very open for invitations.

Posted - 2008.01.19 23:09:00 - [156]

Edited by: Razoran on 19/01/2008 23:40:04
I, for one, absolutely adore the idea. Especially the part about the boarding parties, ship capturing. For all those who are whining that it will all be too much too manage.... imho, eve dosent have nearly enough combat depth or options to choose from, instead devoting too much time to relatively meaningless tasks like typing out a chat(which can be mostly negated by voice chat...which even i can use with my crappy connection...but i diagress...
Also, to all those who say that its a stupid idea because its just a meaningless bonus....well then, we might as well abandon all the other similar non-essential-to-"fun"-features while were at for example, we could all play in a dos screen where we can recieve notifications when we kill something....and hey...itll solve lag too! ITS PERFECT!!....the point being that EVE is a game, and immersion factor is important.I absolutely love eve, its depth, maturity and scope. Yet, it lacks something that That-MMO-That-Shall-Not-Be-NamedExclamationhas...character and personality. when my battleship looks and feels exactly like the other 5,963,623 ships of its class, and when i cant tell my new maelstrom from the one i lost 2 days ago....then id say something is missing.I agree that crew can cauze imbalence...but with so many different ways of implementing it, there has to be some way to make it work, just like every other feature out there in the game.
For my part though, i agree that loosing them with a ship loss may cauze the already high allergy to pvp rate even higher.Id like it if a crew can be cloned along with you for a fee, with all their bonuses intact. That way, it could make you feel that your killing that rat has some more significance than simply making isk, even if it is a small thing, giving it that slightly That-MMOetc,etc touch that could motivate people to play more.I agree with the long-term reward system, cargo hold style management and exp per kill or something similar btw.after so much talk, i think we can start classifying the ideas. Sorry if i offended anyone, just my opinion. Oh, and a dev response is seriously overdue.Its a wonderful idea that has the potential to add some much needed soul to eve.

P.S:take a look at this link if you dont believe me about the uselessly clutered UI, some things u just dont notice till someone points it out:

Aeo IV
Xomic OmniCorporation
Posted - 2008.01.20 01:54:00 - [157]

I don't think the ships that we, the players, fly, have crews, rather, they're modified from manned starships.

IE: I'm flying a Harbinger, but in the Amarrian imperial navy, a Harbinger may have a crew of 1,000 men and women.

The Scope
Posted - 2008.01.25 22:56:00 - [158]

I swear i posted this very idea up on the forums quite some time ago

but it was more indeph -- kinda like having bonus's and levels of hierarchy

Adunh Slavy
Ammatar Trade Syndicate
Posted - 2008.01.26 01:14:00 - [159]

Originally by: Aeo IV
I don't think the ships that we, the players, fly, have crews, rather, they're modified from manned starships.

IE: I'm flying a Harbinger, but in the Amarrian imperial navy, a Harbinger may have a crew of 1,000 men and women.

Listen to the recent live dev blog, ship crews were clearly mentioned as part of player ships - this will be in the novel, I think we can assume an official CCP published novel is canon.

Dalton Dalton
Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
Posted - 2008.01.26 01:16:00 - [160]

if there are crews inside our ships, i wonder how many bars the hyperion would have in it...

seriously tho, whether or not crews exist, implementing it into the game would be a massive addition to an already complicated game and it wudnt benefit many people at all. i gotta say its no the best idea ever...
...BUT coulda been worse... ...I mean walking in stations? srsly -.-

still many seem to like the theory of it so nice effort

Posted - 2008.01.26 03:42:00 - [161]

We need crews! This will make the game more attractive for new players "They await your command" "Seal their destiny with yours"...

Amazing ideas, this post is superb. CCP have here enough material for this improvement, can't add anything better myself. Count with my sign too.


Exu DoMeioDia
Posted - 2008.01.26 04:23:00 - [162]

C'MON!!! Im here to shot players not to manage my fire-brigade... soon you will want a "invasion crew" to "teleport" on enemy's ship and set'up an explosive on others Capsule and kill the pilot leaving the ship intact for you to salvage or use for yourself!

Who cares if your crew is happy or not?! you are the KICKASS!!! They MUST obey or DIE, they WILL do their jobs, dont matter how much food they have in their bellys, you dont have enough "micro-managin" systens in the game? we need something for the game-play of older-players like me, something challanging and powerfull, not a "maurauder" that hardly overdamage a Blaster Hyperion, or ship crews who are happy or sad, we play to shot, not to take care! If I want some "crew" happy I would be playing THE SIMS!

Arama Toranor
Posted - 2008.01.27 10:36:00 - [163]

the problem with boarding would be everyone would just train to BS. fit Micro warp drives and blasters, warp in and instant death
if you said you could do it when they reached structure i'd understand

but if you said shield Caldari would have a significant advantage. and ammarr screwed over.

and although it IS a good idea CCP would have to impleent calculators to work out how many of YOUR crew died and theirs. so they would have to figure out the penalties to 2 ships.

Posted - 2008.02.27 07:30:00 - [164]

Edited by: Deichi on 27/02/2008 07:31:20
I would already be pleased if the crew number shows in the information panel of each ship... but bringing the crew actively into play would be nice too, of course. Though I doubt it would be easy to balance that with already active stuff like heat or modules at all.
(Thinking of "more crew"->"less guns"+"more accuracy" or something in conjunction with "if I let too many of my crew members die, they will be more and more expensive and will not work for me at some point anymore...")

BTW: beeing reminded of the crew by the news posting, I am glad that I didn't need to open another thread ;)

Thera Romana
Posted - 2008.02.27 15:21:00 - [165]

So if I have a ships crew, and I pick up a load of exotic dancers, will it:

A: improve bonuses of ship crew due to higher motivation levels.

B: Decrease bonuses, due to the fact the ships crew is now distracted, chasing down the dancers trying to get some.

Posted - 2008.03.10 19:57:00 - [166]

Edited by: Couldspen on 10/03/2008 19:58:12

Sophia Savage
Posted - 2008.03.13 17:04:00 - [167]

I support this idea -- crew slots like rigs.

Astria Tiphareth
24th Imperial Crusade
Posted - 2008.03.14 09:38:00 - [168]

Just for the last time, for all the idiots out there who think our EVE ships have no crews, read the damned news once in a while! If you can't cope with or take the time to read the overwhelming background stories that suggest it, try this excerpt from the 5th Alliance Tournament coverage:

Rozalin Fuma and her gunnery crew survived the first weekend of the Alliance Tournament. She was not so lucky in the second weekend. On the first day of the second weekend of tournament matches, the ship that Rozalin manned went down near the beginning of the match, ending in the death of five hundred crewmen, including Rozalin.

As for the idea, I think it's a nice addition to the realism and immersion of the game to have some notion of interaction with the crew, the gameplay question is whether it should be purely statistical (yes, you are responsible for the death of 50,000 crewmembers so far) or whether it confers bonuses, are they purchaseable, transferrable, etc. Personally I don't mind either way, and ignore the comments about new players not getting it. I'm a relatively new player and I think it's a great idea.

Slab Drinklots
Posted - 2008.03.14 11:31:00 - [169]

I love it, if only to be able to have exotic dancers on my ship!Laughing

Posted - 2008.03.14 15:45:00 - [170]

I really like the idea.

Heres how Id work it:
Crew would add the following 3 bonus catagories (Each category can may have several sub-bonuses such as ROF, damage and tracking)No skill training required :

Gunnary or Missile bonus, Navigation / Propulsion bonus, Shield or Armor bonus.

Each ship comes with a crew of droids. They do not require the pod pilot to do anything, and they provide no bonus.

Base bonus: 0
Loyalty Bonus: 0
Experience Bonus: 0

Advanced Droids: 1-time fee, no maintenance required:
Base Bonus: 2%
Loyalty Bonus: 0
Experience Bonus: .05% per month (with a max %)

Then you could have a couple other levels of droid crews. With increasing skills and increasing
costs. Non would have a loyalty bonus.

Human Crew:
Base Bonus: 2%
Loyalty Bonus .05% per month (with a max %)
Experience Bonus: .05% per month (with a max %)

Again, there would be multiple base skill levels of crews depending on cost.
Human Crews are cheaper upfront than droids, but require food and water to be stored onboard, and a monthly salary.

Bel Amar
Sudden Buggery
Situation: Normal
Posted - 2008.03.22 13:04:00 - [171]

Make crews cost money to support. Let crews build experience as long as you're paying support, whether you're flying it, or the crew is practising on simulators in the hangar. Repackage a ship, you don't need to pay support, but your crew isn't increasing in experience. Ship gets destroyed? Lose any experience you've gained.

Bonuses for experienced crew should be minimal, but real. Perhaps a 1% bonus to the areas covered by piloting skills for a given ship for each month of time that has passed since the ship was purchased (ie, mining yield and cap usage for an Osprey). Repackage the ship or have it blow up, and you lose that bonus. Cap out the maximum bonus to 10% or something similar to give it a ceiling, after which more time doesn't actually achieve anything.

No slots, no grind, but some acknowledgement that a good crew helps even the best pod pilot

Kagura Nikon
Posted - 2008.03.22 13:34:00 - [172]

Originally by: Cygnet Lythanea
A long while back in the original "Wishlist" post, I mentioned ships crews, and that was... years ago now. And yet to this day, I see people in this forum talking out thier backsides about the total lack of ships crews and pointing to the background stories to support thier claims. These people need to learn to read.

The Battle of Vak'Atioth:

"Captains and their crews valiantly threw down their lives for the Empire, confident that they, God’s chosen, would be victorious. The few that retreated would later be executed for cowardice, their families enslaved and their Houses disbanded." (admittadly an older story, so we'll move to newer ones)

Forsaken Ruins:
"Mattias focused the drone cameras on the Blackbird, inspecting the massive gashes in its hull. Judging from the metallic carnage, he estimated that sections of at least 6 decks were now exposed directly to space. Somewhere beneath where he was sitting, hundreds of crewmembers were sealing off compartments, fighting electrical fires and desperately struggling to keep his ship's vital systems functioning. How many of them died because of this, he wondered. As the captain of the ship, he was sealed inside a pod made of an ultra-strong, Jovian-manufactured alloy and neurologically connected to the Blackbird's systems."

The Jovian Wetgrave:
"This is a capsule," Anu said to the Caldari. "It is used to control a ship. With it a ship a big as this one can be controlled with only a handful of crew and smaller ships, like your frigates, can even be controlled by a single person."
"As I said, the captain acts as the central unit in a highly advanced computer. This role allows him to access and evaluate data at extreme pace. He can easily handle the jobs it takes 5 or 10 people to do normally."

I quoted Jovian Wetgrave twice, because it's popular to refer to it as a source that says there are no crew at all, when, in fact, it says no such thing. The reason I quoted all this was to keep this thread from becomming a crew/no crew debate, as, there are, in fact, crew. If you have any further doubts, ask yourself "Why does my ship have all those little windowes with lights in them?" They're there because the crew needs lights, though why there are windows is beyond me, other then to make it look cool. Now, On to the idea!

just and adendo. The Jove Amarr battle is nto a valid reference since at taht time amarr didnt had pod technology. The whole idea of PODs is to reduce the need of crew to a minimal skeleton crew.

Marlona Sky
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2008.03.24 03:28:00 - [173]

First, I don't like the idea of crew's gaining experience based on the pod pilots actions, starts to sound like people what want their skills to go up based on their grinding on something like WoW again.

I like the idea of a crew. The thing is to program all of that it has to add to the game or whats the point. When they introduced rigs it has an impact on your ship. So maybe if they have crews have a significant impact on your ship then it will be actually worth programming.

Maybe if they did introduce "Crew" slots like rigs. Intead of having to actually put in 2000 crew members, lets have an example:

Your ratting/missioning/plexing and from the salvage of a nice wreck it yeilds some guy named "Scotty" and if you right click and show info, it is him and like 250 engineers who work for him. Now when you dock you can take Scotty and fit him to an open crew slot. Now your structure resistances went up by 15%

"She can't take much more of this captain!" - oh yes she can, now that your part of my crew!

You could be moon mining and BEHOLD while emptying the silo a mission opens up where if you complete it a guy named "Spock" from the planet the moon is orbiting wants to work for you, him and a couple other guys with pointy ears. Now when in one of the crew slots, you are able to prob 20% faster.

They want to make salvaging more interesting, some sort of interaction during the salvage to "harvest" the crew members who are still alive maybe?

There is tons of possibilities.

But in no way do I think that once you put a crew on a ship they are stuck there till the ship goes kaboom like rigs. That would be just stupid.

I mean they would be like implants that you can move around and stuff. Very Happy

Kyra Felann
The Scope
Posted - 2008.04.21 23:41:00 - [174]

For the morons still arguing that there are no crews, I present this thread where CCP Ginger says, "Ships have crews, most pod controlled frigates do not, above that they have crews of varying sizes.":

There's also this.

It is 100% confirmed that ships (other than most frigates and probably shuttles) have crews. Period. You can pretend they don't in your little fantasy land, but know that there is nothing official backing up any assertion that there are no crews.

Kyra Felann
The Scope
Posted - 2008.04.21 23:43:00 - [175]

Originally by: Aeo IV
I don't think the ships that we, the players, fly, have crews, rather, they're modified from manned starships.

IE: I'm flying a Harbinger, but in the Amarrian imperial navy, a Harbinger may have a crew of 1,000 men and women.

You are 100% wrong. Read my above post and stop spreading disinformation.

Tarron Sarek
Biotronics Inc.
Initiative Mercenaries
Posted - 2008.04.22 00:35:00 - [176]

Weeeee, yes we need crews!
Let's implement crews!

But without bonuses. Just for looks, 'immersion' and silly commands or voice feedbacks.
You don't like that? I thought you wanted immersion, and ... crews?
Ah, you really wanted bonuses?

Tough luck!

Posted - 2008.04.22 07:02:00 - [177]

Edited by: Pliauga on 22/04/2008 08:32:16

Long story cut short: Good idea, I like it. Hope this gets implemented soon.


Originally by: Tarron Sarek
Weeeee, yes we need crews!
Let's implement crews!

But without bonuses. Just for looks, 'immersion' and silly commands or voice feedbacks.
You don't like that? I thought you wanted immersion, and ... crews?
Ah, you really wanted bonuses?

Tough luck!

If there are no bonuses to crews, aleast give them some stats. Like keeping your crew alive in active combat would make them happy(as in they would work for less). Or like doing missions for minmatar with an amarr crew would dissplease them (they would start ranting and would eventually quit).
Yes, I do support salaries for crews of active ships. The salaries should be negligible though, so this would be more of an RP thing.

Frost 1232
Posted - 2008.04.22 08:44:00 - [178]


One man can sail a ship of any size in real life but he would not be able to keep it up for very long, and in combat forget it even with a capsule it impossible.

EVE always left out an important aspect out which is the crew of the star ships. Responsible to do all the in flight maintenance of life on a ship like going round the miles of corridors patching the holes fix the circlet backers and broken wiring fix the computers ,clean up storing cargo extra. Do they have robots in eve to do all this? I don't know, and I doubt that any robot would be trusted to do all this in stead of a human especially with all the rouge drones going round killing people in new Eden,

Crews should have a propos too like bonuses for armor repairing ,shield tanking, rate of fire, boarding actions are a bit too far advanced at this stage once walk in stations are done defiantly. As long as boarding is like FPS style and I get to tag along and shot stuff.

Cpt Branko
Retired Pirate Club
Posted - 2008.04.22 09:36:00 - [179]

I don't *care* about crews or immersion or whatever. However, gameplay balance I do care about.

We simply do not need more bonuses. I think rigs were a poorly thought out idea (and not so well balanced, since they shifted the balance far too much towards tanking, furthermore they're far more valuable and cost-effective on bigger ships) - and they enable very 'maxed' setups. Implants/hardwirings weren't too good of a idea either. Adding another option to get 5% in a area you're maxing in is just bad.

Adding more bonuses is bad for the game.

Adding 'boarding' is just a horrible idea (and SO exploitable with insurance as well).

I'm sure you all realize that a 5% bonus to, say, speed, just gave your well-fit (which is I think not crewed, the smaller frigates allegedly have no crew) a 500m/s bonus, or your pimped interceptor a 750m/s bonus or more. That's quite a lot - meaning crews are suddenly mandatory to compete.

Smaller ships get no/smaller crews? Congratulations, you've just stressed 'bigger is better' even more then it is now.

So, want to RP with crews? Sure. I don't care really.
Want more bonuses? No, bugger off.

Ellaine TashMurkon
CBC Interstellar
Tactical Narcotics Team
Posted - 2008.04.22 10:09:00 - [180]

No bonuses. Just a killmail entry "7200 crewmen died" Evil or Very Mad

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