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blankseplocked Corp-scale missions would be nice
 
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Jollyreaper
Gallente
Ace Adventure Corp
Posted - 2007.03.12 04:51:00 - [1]
 

Just did my first Level 4 mission. Ran it with some corpmates because I figured I'd get slaughtered running it solo. I was right. Took some damage in Pirate Slaughter towards the end that let me know there's no way I could tank it. Must research the subtleties of armor tanking some more. Anyway, with the corp it was fun. Lots of pewpew, lots of explosions, lots of salvage at the end of it. Makes for a nice corporate outing.

I'm sure these missions will start to feel mundane after a while but when you first hit them, man they're something. The first level 3 I did I ran with some corpmates because I had no idea what I'd encounter. It was Blockade and I was in an underfitted Brutie. Yikes!

I like the idea of level 5 missions. I like the idea of something so big, so bad, you just have to call in some friends to run it. That's all great. But there are some things that aren't so great.

1. Putting them in lowsec? Forget it. Mission-running ships are not something any sane person takes into lowsec. As has been pointed out elsewhere, you don't fly what you can't afford to lose. When running missions, it's managed risk. You know what's going on, you know you have to equip properly, but if you do your homework, you will survive. Going into lowsec is unmanaged risk, it's lighting an m80 and sticking it tightly between your legs and waiting to sing falsetto.

2. There's still the problem of splitting the rewards amongst everyone. No matter how many people shoot at a rat, the killing shot decides who gets the bounty. LP all goes to the person who selected the mission. Same with the reward. Salvage goes to whoever wants to pick up the rat droppings. At least that's a bit more equitable. But even with all that, there's not enough loot to make it worthwhile for all involved. Four people running a level 4 would make more money soloing level 3's. If nothing is changed in the proportions for level 5's, the hardcore solo missioners would make more isk doing level 4's.

The risk v. reward just ain't in balance enough yet. I'd be just as happy if CCP said "level 5+ missions will be available in all systems but lowsec will net you 50% or 100% better returns," that would be fine. But honestly, it would have to be 500% to make it worth risking some expensive ships. The only other solution would be a total redesign of the way NPC rats operate so that PVP and PVE are no longer separate fights. If a good mission-running setup is also a good piwate-busting setup, then we're talking a fair deal.

As a modest suggestion, if CCP doesn't want to change their idea of how they're doing player missions, why not add in corporate missions? The CEO or a company officer is the one who triggers them and they'll be intended to put a given corp trough the wringer. Rewards will be large enough that corp members will view the activity as a special treat. Corp missions can't be run continuously, they need a certain time to reset, so people can't just grind them out. Suitable special rewards should be available once complete like massive LP handouts, rare modules, etc.

Anyway, would just like to reiterate that running a big mission with corp is fun! It's like our own private complex. Fun fun fun.

Tulisin Dragonflame
Posted - 2007.03.12 06:42:00 - [2]
 

At least in terms of level 6 missions, I doubt there are many pirates who would mess with a multiple-capital + BS mission running gang, you could probably see the needed force pop into local, although the rewards for catching a mission-running solo capital would be great indeed.

I think we may actually see motherships killed more often if they let them into the higher level missions, as rats can bypass the EW immunity, letting them be locked down.

hotgirl933
Posted - 2007.03.12 21:36:00 - [3]
 

on the cap ship bypassing NPC jamming EW thingy. CCP could just code it that NPCs cant jam cap ships either. A simple change to progamming lanugage would do it

Marine HK4861
Caldari
State Protectorate
Posted - 2007.03.13 12:41:00 - [4]
 

Originally by: Jollyreaper
2. There's still the problem of splitting the rewards amongst everyone. No matter how many people shoot at a rat, the killing shot decides who gets the bounty. LP all goes to the person who selected the mission. Same with the reward. Salvage goes to whoever wants to pick up the rat droppings. At least that's a bit more equitable.


While I agree with all your other points (and I'd like to point out that level 5s are supposed to have shared mission rewards and possibly shared LPs) are you sure on the fact that only the person who kills the rat, gets the bounty?

All the level 4s I've run, the bounty is split between whoever's in the same gang and the same room.

For certain rats, this is still profitable though - Rachen Mysen from Vengeance is a lot easier to kill in a group and his bounty split multiple ways is still worth it when you factor in the cost of ammunition you'd spend trying to kill him solo. Very Happy

Jollyreaper
Gallente
Ace Adventure Corp
Posted - 2007.03.18 13:57:00 - [5]
 

Originally by: Marine HK4861
Originally by: Jollyreaper
2. There's still the problem of splitting the rewards amongst everyone. No matter how many people shoot at a rat, the killing shot decides who gets the bounty. LP all goes to the person who selected the mission. Same with the reward. Salvage goes to whoever wants to pick up the rat droppings. At least that's a bit more equitable.


While I agree with all your other points (and I'd like to point out that level 5s are supposed to have shared mission rewards and possibly shared LPs) are you sure on the fact that only the person who kills the rat, gets the bounty?



Yeah, I'm pretty sure that's the way it works. I've run missions with corpmates several times. When I check my wallet afterwards, I usually see the reard for the lower-level frigs and cruisers I killed but as for the battleships, that reward goes to whoever landed the killing blow. Given that my corpies fly drakes, whoever fires the last salvo usually gets the reward. The last level 4 I ran, one of my corpies came out 4 mil richer. "Thanks, Jolly!" he laughed. He's welcome to the cash, I couldn't have done the mission with the way my ship was fitted anyway. Still working out the mysteries of the tank, all I'm missing at this point is my t2 reppers. 6 more days of combined training until I have them. As for the LP payout, those always go to me. Promised 4k, complete mission, get 4k.

It's not all that difficult to pay out people for the percentage of the lp they'd be owed and salvaging would just be a matter of whoever wants some can fly their own salvager and get some. But the real issue I'm thinking of is the payout. Running missions as a corp is fun once in a while but if the missions are going to be corp-scale, the payouts need to be big enough for everyone to get a piece.

Sikozu Prioris
Serenity Engineering and Transport Company
Syndicate.
Posted - 2007.03.18 16:20:00 - [6]
 

Wrong Wrong Wrong

Rat bounties are split between everyone in the gang SO LONG AS THEY ARE FIGHTING IN THE SAME ROOM. No gang then no split.

Me and a friend run level 4 missions together and normally split up to take seperate spawns in the same room.

I get half bounty for what he kills and he gets half bounty for what I kill. Neither of us at anypoint normally shoot each others rats.

If I was to warp out cos my tank was failing or whatever then I receive no share of the bounty for what he kills as I am no longer in the same room.


Syllke Aronstein
Gallente
Le Moulin Rouge
Posted - 2007.03.19 10:07:00 - [7]
 

Rat Bounties get split between all people in same room of complex

I definately support rest of your post though,
+ missions and EVE in general needs to support multi function gangs.
+ PvP and PvE needs to become closer, it annoys me slaughtering swarms of rats, and later having a real struggle fighting a single player pirate.
+ Can we see missions for people who are specialised in different sized craft. I would like to see really challenging missions designed for and only allowing up to frigate, and up to cruiser class ships.

I am really impressed with the multitude of different skills needed for sucessful exploration, you turn up with a half skill set for it in a single ship you are likely to walk away with only part of the prize, and it is really hard to be a solo player and cover all of the things you might encounter or do it as efficiently as a team can.

Team missions should require:
+ Hacking into bunkers + silos to get stash within
+ Salvage (allready ingame)
+ Ability to disable defences by other means than just blowing everything up

EVE could really take a leaf out of traditional RPG games here (please dont copy them too much, EVE rocks because its so unique), but the roles in mission running generally fall into 1 category, TANK. EW, Support, and Sciene/Industry Roles barely function or and aren't catered for at all.

Courier missions should have Interdicted warp tunnels that drop you into an ambush from those deadly threats your agent warns you to look out for, but with options of checking local news, and doing homework to find safe routes. Make NPC's sneaky and devious, not just lemmings on your guns.

For delivery missions use delivery locations that can be blockaded, so you have to think about smashing through it in an indy, with support. NPC POS's at moons with an interactable agent to deliver to stranded inside, while rats stand in the way, message being over our dead bodies.

Red Rumurder
5punkorp
EternalRising
Posted - 2007.03.19 14:03:00 - [8]
 

i use to have some trouble on lvl 4 missions but having a larger gang is not the key always. I have done pirate slaughter and gotten my butt whooped and gone in and pwn them all. when ever i go in with a group instant full room aggression. this has happened in WC angel and gurista, both AE and GE. i agree with some of your posts but only thing that can be surmised is we just don't know anything yet. they have shown their hand a little but i take none of that for fact till its in game. so lets just wait a little bit. i for one can't wait, and if any pirates think they are gonna get easy kills they haven't met my corp Very Happy

Bakatu Kat
Minmatar
Kat Family
Posted - 2007.03.19 14:21:00 - [9]
 

Edited by: Bakatu Kat on 19/03/2007 14:17:48
/signed
especially with NO GRINDING solutions like 1 mission from agent to corp every 24 h or something like this. Every one involved gets share of rewards and LP or everything goes to corp (new feature - corp LP - might be a problem, coz of HOW to spend it, multiple ships of CEO's choice or bpc maybe).
As for gangs in low sec u need only 1 tank and 1 remote repper. rest of the gang can be pvp fitted. this gives higher chance of survival in low sec and additional firepower needed in mission


 

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