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Taizu Lilith
Minmatar
Re-Awakened Technologies Inc
Posted - 2007.02.22 01:23:00 - [61]
 

I see a lot of people asking for agents in 0 sec. They should realise that agents are agents of a Corporation or Faction. These people should only work with you if you are allied to that particular faction or corporation.

My suggestion is this. Allow 0 sec Alliances who are allied with a particular Faction or Corporation to do some sort of event which gives them in Agent in their Facility. This will encourage some of the 0 sec Alliances to be more involved in what is going on in the Empire parts of the Cluster.

Kesh McCall
Caldari
Interplanetary - Expeditions
Posted - 2007.02.22 01:23:00 - [62]
 

What ever you do, i dont get myself forced into lowsec or 0.0

Been there, done that, got fed up.

If you want to reanimate lowsec and 0.0, try to add some content and get rid of the gate chokepoints to enter. And leave the LV IV alone the missions are ok as they are.
Instead spread out the agents more, and get rid of the misson runner hubs.

"Never change a running system"


d026
temp holding
Posted - 2007.02.22 01:26:00 - [63]
 

im sorry but lots of this sounds like absolute crap to me. no bounties, miniprofessions, lowsec, all that sounds like more work, more grind and no fun at all! also i would rethink if you really want to reduce lvl 4's to lil better lvl 3's. i bet you **** off alot of carebears:)

Kaalen
Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2007.02.22 01:28:00 - [64]
 

Edited by: Kaalen on 22/02/2007 01:26:04
Originally by: Helmut Rul
Edited by: Helmut Rul on 22/02/2007 01:10:07To summarise: Make people WANT to go to low-sec do not FORCE them there, Until CCP gets an idea for what they can place in low-sec that may tempt people to go there low-sec will be virtually uninhabited. If you are big enough and organized enough you do not stop over in low-sec unless there is a reason to do so and being the targets of any number of pirates that want their gank is not a role most people choose.


Now, the thing that people don't seem to be realising is that CCP -are- giving you a reason to want to go into low-sec. If they didn't, then you wouldn't be complaining about them putting the higher paying agents there. You WANT to go into low-sec to get your share of the money that comes from these agents.

What you DON'T want is to risk losing your ships. Then that's your choice. All the money is going to be in low-sec and 0.0 space, you either take that risk and reap the rewards or stay nice and safe but without quite as much of a payout.

For CCP to make you 'want' to go into low-sec, they would have to make it impossible for you to be attacked or killed there. And surely that would defeat the purpose of it being low security in the first place. If you want your money, come out here and take it.

Taizu Lilith
Minmatar
Re-Awakened Technologies Inc
Posted - 2007.02.22 01:31:00 - [65]
 

Originally by: SonOTassadar

3. The Implant Market Was it your guys intention to crash this market? If not, implant offers need to be made more difficult to obtain, and I don't mean simply "more loyalty points". You guys seem to be on a roll with tying in several different professions into everything, and that is pretty fun, so perhaps implant offers could take more than just LP, and require other things.

5. Gang rewards Most MMOs have this problem. Hell most RPGs have this problem. It's simply easier to do it yourself. Organization is the main reason why gangs are slower than solo, and there's nothing anyone can do about it. If the total LP from a reward is 200, and 4 people join your gang, dividing it equally among them for 50 LP each is the wrong answer. Please, give a bonus of some sort to provide incentive for people to group up to complete missions.


I want to respond to both of these. Pirate Implants require Drugs (at least, the ones I have gotten). Making all Implants require something that is rarer and/or illegal would be a step towards addressing this issue. (Many LP Rewards require more than just LP, make almost all of them do so, so that there are more reasons to trade those goods)

((Yeah, many MMOs do have this problem. Mainly that it takes organization to get 4 people to join up and do something together, so the reward needs to be much better than for a soloer... but then a higher level player can do it solo, and rake in the money. Now EVE tries to take care of this somewhat by limiting ships that can do Complexs and the like, but this ignores SP. And there is no RP way to limit things based upon RP, so you will always have 1 high SP person doing what it would take a group of low SP people do (or weakly fitted) to make ISK at a much faster rate. The only idea I have ever heard to stop this was to make the items gotten by 'lower level' people only be interesting to them, but this would require almost completely redoing EVE which I don't think is worth it. The answer may be to just keep escalating things as they are...))

Flaming Lemming
Caldari
Puppeteer Press
Posted - 2007.02.22 01:46:00 - [66]
 

So you want to Nerf lvl 4 missions, make what used to be level 4 missions into level 5, and move them into low sec only.

Thanks for loving the pirates, and bending over the carebears.

This doesn't suck at all. Rolling Eyes

Astorothe
Aperture Science Industries
Posted - 2007.02.22 01:53:00 - [67]
 

Fantastic news about the mission overhauls - well done and have a beer on me.

Blind Man
Caldari
Blue Republic
RvB - BLUE Republic
Posted - 2007.02.22 02:04:00 - [68]
 

Edited by: Blind Man on 22/02/2007 02:02:01
nice boost to low sec Cool

(this is the kind of stuff that will make eve fun again, overhauls ftw)

Udyr Vulpayne
Amarr
PIE Inc.
Posted - 2007.02.22 02:18:00 - [69]
 

sounds pretty good all around.
especially making missions more group friendly.
lets see how it turns out.


Toria Nynys
Minmatar
Posted - 2007.02.22 02:36:00 - [70]
 

Originally by: Kaalen
Edited by: Kaalen on 22/02/2007 01:26:04

Now, the thing that people don't seem to be realising is that CCP -are- giving you a reason to want to go into low-sec. If they didn't, then you wouldn't be complaining about them putting the higher paying agents there. You WANT to go into low-sec to get your share of the money that comes from these agents.



Nope, you're not getting it. If CCP shifts the risk/reward equation by nerfing highsec mishes any more, then the highest reward/(risk*time spent) becomes mining scordite in emprire. Instead of adding a choice, one is taken away.

For PvPing in a wolf pack of frigates, the investment is tiny and the fun is huge -- if you're into that sort of thing.

For running mishes, you *need* to have decent gear. You're not going to take down a L5 with 1-2M ISK worth of frigates. PvP fittings which make it possible to take down a BS by a few frigates will be WORTHLESS against a blob of NPC rats who don't use cap, can't be effectively jammed, never reload and generally cheat in ways which make PvE a completely COMPLETELY different game from PvP. PvE is about the tank and DPS, PvP is about EW (and currently speed).

If I understand the stakes for L5-L7 mishes, you're going to be taking in a few hundred million to several billion ISK worth of 'at-risk' property. That kind of investment takes weeks or months to get for all but the largest alliances. And having it taken away in a second in case a pirate scout probes you and calls in 30-1000 of his friends -- well, you can see why anyone with an IQ more impressive than a turnip would not see L5+ being a choice for them at all.

Quote:

What you DON'T want is to risk losing your ships. Then that's your choice. All the money is going to be in low-sec and 0.0 space, you either take that risk and reap the rewards or stay nice and safe but without quite as much of a payout.



No, what I don't want is a guarantee of losing my VALUABLE ship, with the only risk being whether or not I manage to stay unganked long enough to make some ISK. Mish runners are sitting ducks because of current game mechanics, much like miners in a barge or haulers in an indy.

Quote:

For CCP to make you 'want' to go into low-sec, they would have to make it impossible for you to be attacked or killed there. And surely that would defeat the purpose of it being low security in the first place. If you want your money, come out here and take it.


Wrong. If I could make half a billion a mission rather than 10M, I'd be in losec in an instant. If I could make 40M a mish in a frigate or cruiser with cheap fittings in losec, I'd be there in an instant. If the equation is: earn 100M, lose 2B, earn 100M, lose 2B... Mish running ceases to be viable. Nosec ratting and empire scordite mining are clear winners over mish running, and one feature of the game is instantly rendered worthless.

Pirates are already whining re: lack of easily gankable people in lowsec/nosec. Well, big surprise there. As someone else pointed out, it's fine to OMGWTFPWN an unprepared, defenseless victim, but being the victim is not that great. So, people choose not to do it.

You want to PvP? Great, I can tell you where to find willing opponents. You want to gank lots of defenseless people with expensive gear? Doubt it'll happen.

giles666
Minmatar
Antares Fleet Yards
SMASH Alliance
Posted - 2007.02.22 02:56:00 - [71]
 

To me this sounds like a good idea.

I have a few worries though:

- Currently level 4's are way to easy, they can be solo'd in a BS easily. The new level 5 needs to be a challenge to solo in a BS but not too hard that you need a group to run them. Level 6 and 7 can be for groups.

- Removing isk bounties is cool as long as you boost the loot tables AND remove the bounties from belt rats.

Cheers

Nate D
Hell's Rejects
The Council.
Posted - 2007.02.22 03:09:00 - [72]
 

Edited by: Nate D on 22/02/2007 03:12:04
I believe that before high level missions move down to low sec there should be more control over low sec systems. Such as the ability for groups to "control" these low sec systems. Allowing pirates to control who runs missions in their space.

Look... here's my carebear opinion. I really like doing missions... but I am really NOT a fan of PVP in this game. I understand that this would try and bring those two closer together... but is there any thought that maybe carebears don't want to engage in pvp? In my honest opinion I think it would suck that I would no longer be able to advance in the PVE aspect of this game because I don't like to PVP.

OK and here's another problem with that. PVEers who are caught off guard are often times killed because PVE setups are WAY different from PVP setups.

Again I like the idea of more PVE levels and missions and stuff... but I don't like the idea of mixing PVP with PVE unless that specific PVEer wants to run their career that way.

Before everyone dismisses what I have said because I'm a carebear... I'd like to say that PVP in general pulls one over on my system... whenever I get caught by a gate camp or am in a fleet my frame rate drops to about 5 fps or lower... where PVE does lower my frame rate but not to a deadly level.

I hate it when people say to just get better hardware cause it's not that easy for me to just spend money that I don't have... I get a new "mid to lower end" computer every four years or so (with small upgrades in between). That's just what I can afford...

I really wish that I enjoyed PVP... but I don't and I really don't like the idea of bringing PVEers to the hands of PVPers.

Like I was saying at the top... unless there was some form of safety that could be given to PVEers by the people who control the system... maybe in some form of a contract... then I'd believe that this would suck. (poetically put)

-Nate

Edit: I used to live in low sec and I like the idea of populating it. But I believe that without the right tools for someone to manage low sec space... it's a long shot and sucks for those of us who don't like complete lawlessness... not even 0.0 is completely lawless.

Taizu Lilith
Minmatar
Re-Awakened Technologies Inc
Posted - 2007.02.22 03:12:00 - [73]
 

Originally by: giles666
To me this sounds like a good idea.

I have a few worries though:

- Currently level 4's are way to easy, they can be solo'd in a BS easily. The new level 5 needs to be a challenge to solo in a BS but not too hard that you need a group to run them. Level 6 and 7 can be for groups.

- Removing isk bounties is cool as long as you boost the loot tables AND remove the bounties from belt rats.

Cheers


Belt Rats give more ISK per time than Missions from Bounties.

Aaron Static
Ars ex Discordia
Test Alliance Please Ignore
Posted - 2007.02.22 03:52:00 - [74]
 

This game has PvE!??! Shocked

Namielus
Caldari
Namielus Holdings
Posted - 2007.02.22 04:02:00 - [75]
 

A quick story about my problem with the direction in EvE.

Once upon a time, I used to fly Assault frigates in low sec space and everything was grant, npc rats were plentiful, gate camps locked movement down, the risk / reward was far and balanced.

Then slow and slowly a new corperation of p-rats started working out of my connection to high-sec space so I couldn't effectively fly out there any more (Logistics killed me!)

Then I decided that I was ready to head into the quiet depths of 0.0 space. Where chances are I would be killed if spotted and I had to watch local like a hawk, which actually was a hell of alot of fun.

As you would have it time passed and then a huge corperation moved into my pocket of 0.0 and now there are suddenly hourly partols and probers coming with the damage dealers to track you down in a safe spot. After getting podded about 1 week straight while trying to keep up with my casual play style I had to leave.

I no do lvl 4 missions while frightened to enter .4 space because of my spendy equipment and my expensive pod and clones. I do not have regular free time to participate in corp activities and I generally keep to myself or occasionally will team up with someone in local.

End of sappy story

I've told you this story because what has constaintly been happening to me is that casual players keep getting there ass's handed to them by huge corps & alliances. I have no problem with those super huge units, but I don't want to be a part of them. I also can't keep up with there spending power, and I have no chance in hell at completing with the for space.

My beef is the space.

Right now everything is compacting smaller and smaller, the eve population is growing, and we have no where left to go, but out into lowsec and 0.0. The rarity of seeing another ship in 0.0 is gone. You can't go out into 0.0 with a buddy and try to find a safe spot for a day to mine and run missions. The world has become smaller and smaller.

I understand that lots of people like to pvp, and I will grant you that I really don't. But I accept it, its a part of the EvE world and I can't escape it. But it needs to be mitigated so the players that typically get jumped while already taking on 10-20 n-rats aren't automaticly screwed if a pvper enters the system.

Save us casual players from having to become ultra hardcore or leaving the game (because mining is lame, I need some risk :))

Sakura Yoshimitsu
Posted - 2007.02.22 04:12:00 - [76]
 

If you made it so that the Deadspace gates required a key by the mission runner(s) that will help a lot.

Rongar Maximus
Posted - 2007.02.22 04:14:00 - [77]
 

You know, I don't think he you will HAVE to use cap ships in the high end missions. Just bring more friends and blob the carrier or dread.

Moe2
Posted - 2007.02.22 04:17:00 - [78]
 

Been reading the posts to this topic and am starting to wonder what some of you mean by 'agents in outposts'... Agents in stations are currently for the NPC corp that owns the station, so are you implying that a player corp should be allowed to have their own agent? otherwise, it doesn't exactly make sense to 'host' an agent from a different corporation...

Would be cool (expecially if you were given the option to make agents of your corp available for others), but there are just too many things they would need to do and not much reward would come from it... at least not yet... I would say player owned stations would need to come before this ever became a possibility. *remembers the day when CCP said player owned stations were coming soon(TM)*...*suddenly feels old*

love the game :)

Katya Guillaume
Posted - 2007.02.22 04:18:00 - [79]
 

Edited by: Katya Guillaume on 22/02/2007 04:22:59
Originally by: Koronos
I agree with Kaptein Trefot.

I think this:
> Slowly involves the "PvE" player in more "PvP" EVE activity.

displays a flawed mindset, and not for the first time. Everyone is different, everyone likes different things, let people play the game how they want to play it, rather than continually channeling them into how _you_ think it should be played.

Me? I'm all about the pvp. But not everyone is.

Koronos


Also agree about this. Dev mindset has slipped out; the rumors are true - pushing pve players into pvp will thin your subscriptions quickly. Either I want to do pvp or I don't; pushing me into it will mean I'll spend my money elsewhere. There are too many problems w/low-sec and have been discussed every day for months on end. I will not fly my faction-kitted BS into low-sec for a gank squad unless I'm fitted for pvp, which I won't be as I'm going there for the mission....this seems like such basic logic that it's hard to believe this even needs discussing.

This "grow up and pvp" attitude is rather annoying in the extreme. I'm here because EVE is beautifully complex and I should have a choice about how to play. I've chosen to rp on occasion within certain corps and do enjoy this. I like to run missions, fooling myself into thinking that I'm doing my npc faction some favor and am having an impact (wish it were true, alas). I'll fly into pvp when I want, not when someone else wants.

Borasao
Ex Coelis
The Bantam Menace
Posted - 2007.02.22 04:27:00 - [80]
 

Compromise: Leave mission levels 1-4 the same with the same payout in highsec space and make levels 5+ lowsec/0.0.

Highsec mission runners run missions in highsec because they are tired of (don't want to be) being ganked by pirates in lowsec/0.0. Nerfing what they're doing now and moving the equivalent to lowsec/0.0 will not entice these people into lowsec/0.0. I can see the pirates and pirate corps licking their chops over this already.

Placing these great missions in 0.0 is simply rewarding whatever mega-alliance you select by placing the agent in that system. Since mega-alliances patrol and NBSI anyone in their systems of control, you aren't going to see highsec mission runners in *any* of them. You might as well just create a bunch of tech2 BPOs outside of the lottery system and hand them out to the mega-alliances because you 'like them'. It's basically the same thing.

In any case, anyone wanting to run these high level 0.0 missions will be forced to join these mega-alliances making them bigger. With all the talk about wanting to get rid of blobbing fleet tactics, this is sure not a way to do that. Making the mega-alliances bigger (if they actually recruit) just makes bigger blob fleets.

So... you've tried to lure highsec mission runners into lowsec by making what they are currently doing worth less and forcing them to submit themselves to pirates to maintain the level that they currently enjoy. Also, you're going to reward various mega-alliances by placing these really high level agents in areas that they control, giving them even more access to great stuff and, by necessity, anyone not of those alliances will not be able to use them because the mega-alliance will NBSI them.

1. Make highsec missioning worth lots less than it is now.
2. Attempt to force highsec mission runners into lowsec/0.0 where they don't want to go already.
3. Reward mega-alliances by placing choice agents in areas that they control.
4. Claim you want to decrease blobbing but require everyone to join mega-alliances.
5. ???
6. Profit?

At least you'll solve the node loading/crashing problems.

Raquel Smith
Caldari
Freedom-Technologies
Sev3rance
Posted - 2007.02.22 04:32:00 - [81]
 

DO NOT WANT

Mr Banzai
Caldari Rogue Squadron
Posted - 2007.02.22 04:35:00 - [82]
 

Originally by: Oveur
Level 4 will become closer to Level 3 in difficulty, the jump up will not be as drastic as it is now.
Level 5 will be the new level, consisting partly of the most difficult Level 4 missions, but mainly new missions.
Levels 5 and up are all in 0.4 security and below.



Sorry, but this pretty much looks like "moving level 4 missions to low-sec" to me.
To see where i'm coming from - i'm a dedicated mission runner, operating in high-sec and piloting a battleship.

If this change takes place, high-sec will have missions of (weakened) level 4 tops, requiring battlecruiser-class ships. While low-sec will get level 5 and harder missions, which, in theory, solo BS probably would be able to do. But keep in mind, this is a low-sec we're talking about, so forget your faction ships and mods, forget mission-focused fit and forget your feeling of safety. Basically, with L5s, we get either to a group mission-running, or to a capital-class ships (or preferably - to both combined).
Now, please excuse me, but what happens to the current battleship pilots? Right now, BS is a pinnacle of empire PvE play and there are a few of us PvE players (contrary to popular thinking, yes, we exist), who dedicated a bit of time and effort (just a little bit, mind you) to reach that pinnacle and now are working to excel in our chosen field of play. No, i'm not bored, there is alot to space to progress there still. But, all of sudden our specialization gets erased from the face of Eve?
What happens to our beloved mission-running machines? There is no way in hell i'd ever take my battleship anywhere with even a slight possibility of PvP, and i don't think i'm only one. What would be the use for all the faction ships and modules? No, they don't belong to PvP, and while i'm sure there will be people claiming how they both kill and lose 10-bil-worth ships daily, i doubt that's the common way of eve-life. And there are many other things directly connected or dependant on mission-runners. Read: huge hit to Empire market and economy if something bad happens to us.

There is an established niche for people like me, do not try to destroy it, please. Even if you manage to force us somewhere, probably it won't be the direction where you want us to go.

P.S. Don't get me wrong, it isn't all black, i like new/better/escalating missions and other fun ideas from the blog, but just too stunned with bad news now to be cheerful enough for the good part.

Dagrin RDM
Caldari
The Leather Knights
Sev3rance
Posted - 2007.02.22 04:44:00 - [83]
 

Originally by: Mr Banzai
Originally by: Oveur
Level 4 will become closer to Level 3 in difficulty, the jump up will not be as drastic as it is now.
Level 5 will be the new level, consisting partly of the most difficult Level 4 missions, but mainly new missions.
Levels 5 and up are all in 0.4 security and below.



Sorry, but this pretty much looks like "moving level 4 missions to low-sec" to me.
To see where i'm coming from - i'm a dedicated mission runner, operating in high-sec and piloting a battleship.

If this change takes place, high-sec will have missions of (weakened) level 4 tops, requiring battlecruiser-class ships. While low-sec will get level 5 and harder missions, which, in theory, solo BS probably would be able to do. But keep in mind, this is a low-sec we're talking about, so forget your faction ships and mods, forget mission-focused fit and forget your feeling of safety. Basically, with L5s, we get either to a group mission-running, or to a capital-class ships (or preferably - to both combined).
Now, please excuse me, but what happens to the current battleship pilots? Right now, BS is a pinnacle of empire PvE play and there are a few of us PvE players (contrary to popular thinking, yes, we exist), who dedicated a bit of time and effort (just a little bit, mind you) to reach that pinnacle and now are working to excel in our chosen field of play. No, i'm not bored, there is alot to space to progress there still. But, all of sudden our specialization gets erased from the face of Eve?
What happens to our beloved mission-running machines? There is no way in hell i'd ever take my battleship anywhere with even a slight possibility of PvP, and i don't think i'm only one. What would be the use for all the faction ships and modules? No, they don't belong to PvP, and while i'm sure there will be people claiming how they both kill and lose 10-bil-worth ships daily, i doubt that's the common way of eve-life. And there are many other things directly connected or dependant on mission-runners. Read: huge hit to Empire market and economy if something bad happens to us.

There is an established niche for people like me, do not try to destroy it, please. Even if you manage to force us somewhere, probably it won't be the direction where you want us to go.

P.S. Don't get me wrong, it isn't all black, i like new/better/escalating missions and other fun ideas from the blog, but just too stunned with bad news now to be cheerful enough for the good part.


You said what I was thinking better than I could have
/signed

Ben Derindar
Dirty Deeds Corp.
Posted - 2007.02.22 05:11:00 - [84]
 

This blog is hereby awarded the BennehTickô Seal Of Approval. Very Happy

Originally by: Sakura Yoshimitsu
If you made it so that the Deadspace gates required a key by the mission runner(s) that will help a lot.

This would also be a good idea, but not all the time. There still has to be some risk.

Maybe this is where hacking skills could come in - the level of Hacking you have equates to the level of deadspace mission you would have a chance of accessing without a key?

/Ben

James Duar
Merch Industrial
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2007.02.22 05:19:00 - [85]
 

After reading the posts here, once again it really does look like CCP is taking the route of "nerf it, and if they don't change, nerf it some more" rather then actually improving things to make the grass look greener rather then just "less brown".

Decard Sune
Posted - 2007.02.22 05:34:00 - [86]
 

So all this does is finally give the pirates what they've wanted for ages, mission runners income cut, agents moved to low sec and easy targets to gank.

Maeltstome
Minmatar
Sebiestor Tribe
Posted - 2007.02.22 05:45:00 - [87]
 

Edited by: Maeltstome on 22/02/2007 05:58:29
Originally by: Zigg Omelo
NO LVL 5 IN LOW SEC SPACE.Take it to 0.0

CCP this is your chance to breathe some life into 0.0 and make more ppl move there

Otherwise, lmao at getting this done for the summer.... LaughingLaughing


Not sure what your smokking, but i generally find 90% of the losec population are pirates, the other 10% being noobs who know nothing. no one is in losec. Plus this would necesitate more NPC stations in 0.0 - which defeats its purpose

There is very little reason to go into losec atm - the rat bounties are hardly breathtaking, most people either farm missions in empire, or mine/rat in 0.0 - and i think its obv. whos getting the raw deal out of them... no risk, good cash... massive risk, similar cash...

I'd like to see all these changes made, This is the sort of thing that CCP should, and hopfully are, focussing on. Eve is as competant and complete an MMO (if not more so) than any other ive played. The depth is breathtaking.

If the Dev's continue to add and expand like this, then eve will never die - and i hope this happens.. a chance to show companies like EA that continued support of a game is better than getting out that new expansion/sequal faster.

This could be a victory for maturity.

Minerva Radisky
Caldari
The Arcanum
Posted - 2007.02.22 05:45:00 - [88]
 

Edited by: Minerva Radisky on 22/02/2007 06:15:03
Guess I'll post my comments.

First; If you're going to nerf level 4 missions, DON'T put the former level 4 missions into lowsec. Infact, don't nerf level 4 missions at all. This is the part that really bothers me, and is most of the reason I'm making this post. Here's how I could see it working well...


Level 1, 2, and 3 missions - No change needed, really. I was doing level 3 missions just about 2 weeks after I started in a battlecruiser with minimum skills. Of course, I'm Caldari, the "made for missions" race, so I doubt it's as easy for the other races. But that's just my experience. You can do level 1's with frigates easily, 2's with cruisers, 3'd with battlecruisers. It all makes sense and there's no real problems.


Level 4 missions - If these get nerfed, with their harder missions going to level 5's, the rewards will need some small isk boosts to make up the difference. This way the highsec solo carebears won't have any problems.


Level 5 missions - These will need to be made for groups, or solo capital ships. A solo carrier shouldn't have problems with most lowsec pirates, afaik, though I'm probably wrong. This way your average solo carebear shouldn't really be missing out on anything. And a couple of carebears who want to do better missions shouldn't have any problems with lowsec pirates unless they attack en masse. 3 or 4 carebears with PvP setups should be able to gank any solo pirates, or atleast keep the pirates from bothering them.


Level 6 missions - These should require a large group effort (say, a fleet of 10 or so battleships or 1-2 capital ships) to complete. Something only corps or a large group of friends should be able to accomplish, and those two usually go hand in hand. And a corp that has members with enough experience and large enough numbers to do these missions shouldn't have a problem getting some recon/PvPers to scare off any pirates in system.


losec missions in general - You're going to need to keep pirates away from them. Disallow pirates from being able to probe out and enter missions just to gank anyone running missions. If they want to camp stations or gates, that's fine, as you can't really do anything about that. Carebears can find ways of avoiding these people camping their stations. See a pirate in local, and suspect he's camping your station? Just use a jumpclone to go elsewhere and do some level 4s. After all, you have the standings to do so if you're doing level 5s. As others have said, people who fit for missions will never beat pirates 1v1, and if level 5s will be able to be soloed, this is a problem. (sounds like they will if they'll be partially made of old level 4s.)


Agent Offers - I'm guessing we will finally see some +6 and +7 implants considering how much LP the level 5/6 agents will be giving out, which is cool. Perhaps adding in some named items? Maybe even faction/officer modules, or BPCs for them? Would make sense, and make more of the offers useful... Someone using a level 1/2 agent should be able to get some mid level named modules of their choice, with the LP they earn. Someone doing level 3/4 agents should be able to get the top named modules. Level 5/6 agent LP should let you be able to get a faction item of your choice every day or two with the LP earned.

I don't see faction items being available from the agents being a problem, as level 5/6s are supposed to be big group efforts and so they would be just as hard to get as if they were acquired from complexes or constantly ratting and finding a rare rat. Just keep it at _____ Navy items only being available from that race's agents. Caldari agents only give out Caldari navy faction items. But I'm sure there's something obvious I'm forgetting that proves it just wouldn't work.


That took forever to type up, and almost hit the character limit. EmbarassedRazz

Edit: Character agent? Fixed some other typos as well.

Storm Mage
Amarr
Forgotten Souls
THE INTERSTELLAR FOUNDRY
Posted - 2007.02.22 05:48:00 - [89]
 

The main problem I am seeing with this is the low sec areas that have good agents where I run are populated in pirates with motherships. I am glad cap ships will be allowed in more missions but some of us like to run missions because we don't want to pvp at the time and don't want to deal with the added charge. If my friends and I want PvP we go to 0.0, missions are a way for us to have fun as a group in a relaxed manner. Same with lowsec, if we go there we are usually looking for trouble. Some of us are casual players who have saved for close to a year to buy ships and/or mods and can't afford to replace them with any regularity.

Why not as an alternative allow carriers (not motherships) and dreadnaughts in space up to say .8 with some low level 5-6 agents sprinkled around in higher sec systems for us more casual players with rather limited budgets.

Another thing I would recommend is toning down system scanning, or having someway to prevent pirates from finding people in missions/allowing them into mission areas, the second of these options being more viable. If a pirate finds the mission area but can't enter it because he isn't in the gang that the mission runner is in, it still leaves probing as a viable option but protects mission runners who don't want to deal with pirates. Some people don't like being forced into possible PvP just to make money to get by.

Maeltstome
Minmatar
Sebiestor Tribe
Posted - 2007.02.22 05:48:00 - [90]
 

Thats a perfect knee-jerk reaction to be expected from a mission farmer :)

"Noes, dont break my toiz!!"


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