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Posted - 2007.06.27 22:47:00 - [721]

Originally by: Soma Brava
You can't make this change and continue to have my money. Clear?


I decide how i earn my money and when im make pvp or not.

Tarkan Kador
PanTarkan Kador Holdings
Posted - 2007.07.01 20:26:00 - [722]

Edited by: Tarkan Kador on 02/07/2007 05:13:06
As I said in the post welcoming your new economist, this idea of yours about inflation is just plain wrong, Oveur.

You claim, for example, "You [should] earn your ISK by selling to other pilots. We're very aware of ISK inflation and this is a step in preventing that."

The problem is, as anyone who has examined the trends in The Forge markets will tell you, that the markets are already too flooded with loots and other goods. Examples are as follows:

Hornet I drone average prices: 5,250.00 a year ago, 2,381.51 yesterday.
Hornet II drone average prices: 134,444.21 a year ago, 44,756.34 yesterday.
Catalyzed cold-gas Arcjet thrusters average prices: 2,826,173.17 a year ago, 2,217,792.49 yesterday.
200mm Railgun II average prices: 1,368,375.00 a year ago, 769,406.12 yesterday.
425mm Railgun II average prices: 6,500,000.00 a year ago, 3,510,177.66 yesterday.

The only thing that seems to be increasing are ship prices, and those aren't dropped as loot. So the problem with your theory behind getting ISK "by selling to other pilots" is that your average pilot doesn't really need to buy more loots as much as they need to sell the loots (or loot products, like reprocessed minerals) for ISK. You are essentially taking the thing we are going on missions to gain (ISK), and giving us more of the things that we simply have no use for, and will dump on the markets at a loss simply to recoup (loots).

Right now, players are able to buy a lot with the ISK they have. The ISK is stronger than it has been in recent memory, and I fear that by making ISK harder to acquire, markets are going to collapse. Not just in terms of the markets you see on Tranquility, but also, the markets that grow up alongside the game (server hosting for ISK, sig makers, banner ads for ISK, EON ads).

In short, by all my measurements, Tranquility already has too much loot flooding the markets. What players need is ISK to buy that loot, not more junk to clutter the markets.

Etho Demerzel
Holy Clan of the Cone
Posted - 2007.07.02 20:41:00 - [723]

Edited by: Etho Demerzel on 02/07/2007 20:40:09
You are very right in your worries, Tarkan. The phenom we are experiencing since the drone regions came is deflation. Deflation is very bad for any economy. Inflation is the natural and inevitable result of economical growth.

Any healthy economy has a small and controlled inflation. Inflation is necessary in order for trade to exist. It is easy to explain why, you won't buy or produce (unless you really need to do it for personal use) if the things are going to be less valuable tomorrow. Deflation kills commerce and therefore the economy.

I don't care too much about T2 market as it is not really that important to the economy as a whole, being a very specific submarket. But introducing loot only rats in the new regions has already dislodged the main economy into deflation. I don't know how changing the complexes will alter the money flow into the game, but if its impacts are as significant we will see more deflation yet.

Botton line is, as you introduce goods you have to print money proportionally and even a little more, to keep the economy growing and healthy.

Posted - 2007.10.18 12:34:00 - [724]

I've got mixed feelings about this one. I do missions infrequently, just to build up lp's, cash, and sometimes salvage parts. Just like anything else, I'd hate to see any part of that nerfed just because the devs want to see us lose some money to pirates in lowsec. Additionally, I think that many mission runners will perceive that they're being 'forced' to move to a different area just to maintain the same level of income that they currently make on a daily basis. That's going to **** off a fair amount of people.

On the other hand I can see the shatload of farmers doing level 4's in motsu everyday, no doubt selling isk up the ying on ebay. If these changes will make it more difficult for these people to continue, I say bravo.

I won't do missions in lowsec however. Current game dynamics dictate that missions in lowsec are just a very, very effective isk sink. Between the very effective scanning mechanic and the well organized piracy prevalent in all the lowsec regions of EVE, it's been well demonstrated that lowsec mission running cannot be done profitably (even in a region that you THINK you control).

A better option would just to make agents available for alliances to 'buy' by the month, if you want another isk sink. Say, 500 mil/month for a level 5 agent, 750 mil for a level 6 when they come out, and a bil for a level 7 (0.0 only obviously). This still isn't going to solve the problem of all the highsec mission runners that you've just totally alienated, but a small portion of them might be lured into 0.0 if they can get an alliance to take them.

Marcus Danning
Aquila Victrix
Posted - 2007.11.04 04:58:00 - [725]

Though I LOVE the idea of introducing lvl 5+ missions...I have to ask, why so drasticly mess with lvl 4 missions?

As it is, I have been soloing (no alts) every lvl 4 missions since I only had about 9 mill SP. I understand that a low(er) SP BC pilot can't solo lvl 4's but I dont see that as a reason to make them closer to lvl 3's and move the best missions to lvl 5.

I would suggest leaving lvl 4's as they are now. Perhaps a few tweeks to make room for the lvl 5+ missions but nothing drastic. This will give all us carebear mission runners somthing to do in Empire while the more adventorus take on the 5+ in low-sec/0.0

By leaving lvl 4's as THE way for PvE'ers to make ISK (as it is now) then no one could claim they are being "forced" into low-sec. 5+ missions would be New content that players don't HAVE to partake in inorder to stay competitive.

Oveur already stated that most of the new missions wont have Bounties so the current lvl 4 missions would still be a viable plateau for mission runners.

I would also suggest balancing the agent lvls so that:
lvl 4...Solo BS
lvl 5...Solo Capital OR 3+ BS
lvl 6...Capital(s) + Support
lvl 7...Mixed Fleets ??

Anyways, that's my 2 cents.

Posted - 2007.11.06 18:27:00 - [726]

The only thing Oveurfocussed in his dev blog over and over again and what they are trying to do is :

Slowly involves the "PvE" player in more "PvP" EVE activity.

Posted - 2008.01.06 13:01:00 - [727]

Edited by: Zaphed on 06/01/2008 13:04:58
Edited by: Zaphed on 06/01/2008 13:02:15
Im a carebare with A CNR running Level 4 missions. Can maybe do 1-2 missions a day most days and generally not on long enough to be useful for 0.0 or lowsec.

Basically i play the solo level game. Im bored with it started playing around with exploration in high sec but its too much of a time sink. Keep hoping CCP would introduce the next tier of challenge for empire space that like a MIssion can be accepted and started immediately on logon.

What I really want ... is to be able to log in and at short notice engage in some challenging and REWARDING exercise allowing me to buy a Golem or maybe a capital some time down the track. You can add 100 new level 4 easy version missions , their exciting for a couple of times and then they become a means to end. In every other MMO poeple run instances and do stuff repeatedly for the promise of rewards, not for storelines or other crap. To me 2-3 million for an easy mission is a waste of time when a faction mod or high end ship is like 1 billion to buy.

Currently for the pve'er / casual:

level 1 --> level 2 --> level 3 --> level 4 --> PVP / Alliance/ mandatory attendance / gankers / griefers / one side mechanices (gate camps) / huge time commitments and most importantly STRESSFUL GAME PLAY.

I just want to come home from work , have some fun , get some meanigful rewards and not be worried about poeple who can PVP 24/7. EVE goals are all about ISK , no ISK no progression or use Real Life money.

Problem with EVE is every new toy they release costs more and more ISK so ultimately PVP will just be about BLOBS or cheap desposable ships poele were using one month into the game. If they made items cheaper to produce over time so for example a Raven costs now 20 million to buy and fit you would find more poeple willing to take a risk on PVP. How is it every other real life item drops in value as production tecniques and technology improve.

What could get me into LOWSEC:
* Jumping into a low sec system would randomly put you somewhere in the system not next to the gate. Pirates have to actually work for a kill here.
* Insurance which could affordably cover ship and fittings
* Bounties of level 4 mission should be 30 - 50 million a 30 minute mission. (+/- loot)
* Missions themselves instanced.
* Many many more entrances to low sec to thin out the pirates. (you want to thin out mission runners do the same to pirates)
* Make security status actually mean something so that poeple with low security cannot use any alt in Empire or ever themselves go back into Empire. Make consequences for poeples action. This will also make selling more lucrative in low sec as no way for the pirates to get into empire

Changing the way PVP works from being gate camps and ambushes during a mission . make it more so that both sides can be alert and aware that PVP could happen. (eg when leaving a mission and heading back to agent)

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