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Drokar Gazer
Caldari
DISORDERLY CONDUCT.
Posted - 2007.02.17 14:38:00 - [1]
 

While i am sure I will get flamed for this from the immatures out there, it has to be said. The state of EVE is unfortunately, not good. Devs caught cheating doesnt help but i think that can happen anywhere, so this is not really about that.

Its about pvp tactics. Its about honor in a fight. Its about fighting for your space, or fighting for someone elses space. When you die. You are supposed to STFU. You acknowledge a good fight or you dont, but thats it. Win or lose. That has been the rule of consensus in EVE since day 1. But there are other rules.

Tactics that occur in eve everday that are not true spaceship tactics, they are game mechanics. Using game mechanics to win a fight which was never intended by the devs, but impossible as yet to find alternatives it seems, is the worst type of gameplay and without honor.

Aggro Timer Abuse For what takes billions upon billions of isk and time and team work to create, one persons stupidity (i'll admit) while flying the most expensive ship in EVE, he loses it all. Twice. (different pilots losing their titans). I admit they were really paying attention. Why do you log off in a titan with ANYONE in the system? Even if its a corp/alliance mate?

That being said.. it does not absolve the pilots who used game mechanics to destroy the titans in question (both occurances by BoB pilots). Now there is nothing Devs can do about this issue unless they change how loggin off occurs (such as 30 second loggoff rule like in other games) but they havent for whatever reasons. Still, it is upon our honor that pilots do not use game mechanics to win a battle (ie shuttles with thousands of bookmarks surrounding a POS) Why is this acceptable. Did they use teamwork to accomplish the feat? Yes, but thats not theh issue. They cheated. While its possible to do ingame, its still cheating, because you are using mechanics that have nothing to do with honor. You did not 'bring it' to D2, you used an aggro timer, again.

This is absurd. Perhaps the game is going downhill. Perhaps the devs dont care that all that work to produce these titans were lost not because they died in a straight up fight, but because another team decided to cheat by using game mechanics.

How utterly pathetic (yes i know this will be locked but i dont give a rats right now).

The log off Somehow, this is still being used to avoid dying. This is without honor. If you are flying your ship (that you should be prepared to lose if your flying it) and you get caught at a gate camp bubble.. well duh.. ur dead. And you know what.. its your fault for not flying a scout. Game mechanics to save your ship. How pathetic.

Mass Log in Since the early days of the game, this has been used, and still is being used. The whole "well me and my friends who all know each other in real life decided to play eve at the same time, all 150 of us" .. cough Bullshiznit. You are using game mechanics to win at EVE and you have no honor, and are cheating. Perhaps Devs allow because they have no fix for it and cannot prove, but you as a pilot know just because the game allows it, it is using game mechanics to win.


Do i have no merit with this post? Has the game become so washed down with so many new players who never knew how it was originally when there was honor among pilots. (no im not saying there were not these issues then, but it has become 100 fold since). I am not totally blaming BoB 100% either. ASCN.. you lost your alliance because you refused to fight. The moment bob attacked you started losing members, people suddenly going afk all day in stations when there was a fight. You lose a titan and you quit Cyvok.. way to go. Then everyone else runs for the doors when you outnumber your opponent 3 to 1, and refuse to even try to keep your space (albeit a few corps who did try)

The state of EVE is bad, and its not the game.. its the players.

V0rador
Amarr
Imperial Academy
Posted - 2007.02.17 14:55:00 - [2]
 

Even is the most basic mmorg have some exploit possible.

and eve is very complex , so easier to find such exploits.

Sad peoples still use it but tbh its everybody who enjoy use dirty way , because war is dirty even in virtual.

CCP give us the freedom to do some evil things like piracy , spy etc , its a part of EVE and what it make it so good , coz we have a lot of freedom.

Cosmic Flame
Gallente
Federal Navy Academy
Posted - 2007.02.17 14:56:00 - [3]
 

*snip* Posting with an unidentified character and characters in NPC corporations in this forum is prohibited. If you wish to participate in the discussions here, be sure to have your corporation and or alliance status ticked in your forum settings. -Eldo Davip ([email protected])

Drokar Gazer
Caldari
DISORDERLY CONDUCT.
Posted - 2007.02.17 14:58:00 - [4]
 

Edited by: Drokar Gazer on 17/02/2007 14:55:19
Originally by: V0rador
Even is the most basic mmorg have some exploit possible.

and eve is very complex , so easier to find such exploits.

Sad peoples still use it but tbh its everybody who enjoy use dirty way , because war is dirty even in virtual.

CCP give us the freedom to do some evil things like piracy , spy etc , its a part of EVE and what it make it so good , coz we have a lot of freedom.



Well this is very true, but it still doesnt excuse these cheap tactics, does it? Its just getting old. No one is willing to fight straight up.. everyone is looking for the best way to cheat but within game mechanics so its a legal cheat. Its just sad.

BTW.. Waves to V0rador... nice to see you found a home.. good choice :)

NightmareX
Caldari
Nomads
Nulli Secunda
Posted - 2007.02.17 15:00:00 - [5]
 

Edited by: NightmareX on 17/02/2007 14:57:18
Originally by: Cosmic Flame
An aggroed pilot logs off and gets probed and killed.


Yeah that happens when an enemy have started his aggro timer, or by him self.

Drokar Gazer
Caldari
DISORDERLY CONDUCT.
Posted - 2007.02.17 15:04:00 - [6]
 

Originally by: Cosmic Flame
Using a spy to aggro a careless pilot who thinks that just because he is alone in the system and only a "friendly" pilot aggroed him he is safe, and then killing him by jumping in a fleet is in no way cheating as you put it.
This type of ganking happens every day all over EVE. An aggroed pilot logs off and gets probed and killed. In this case it was careful planning from BoB and poor judgement and carelessness by the D2 pilot.

You talk about "fair" fighting. There is none anywhere in any game or RL for that matter. The victor is always the side with some advantage: tactical, firepower, numbers, something that can make the outcome favorable. "Spying" is within game rules, friendly fire is within game rules and probing down a ship with aggro is within game rules. Hence it is not cheating.

Fair play you say? Talking about something other than pvp... Trust is not the most rich group of T2 production corps by "playing fair". They are probably the biggest cartel in this game. They have ripped off many people for much longer than BoB has been around. They don't make "fair" prices, and have huge profits. They gather up bpo's to have control over the market. There's nothing "fair" about that, ooo but wait..... lemme guess, that doesn't count right? It's all fair when it suits you, but not all fair it doesn't. Right...

Biased views suck.


I could give a rats about D2 tbh, we are allies for a common cause and i am not trying to pounce on Bob only.. its not them only.. they just excel at it. Many allainces use these dirty tactics rather than just fighting straight up.. win lose or draw. Nothing wrong with spy's, etc. But to shoot just as he logs off to get the aggro timer.. That is different. They did it to prevent the fight. There is no way for him to fight back. Perhaps if he logged off in combat i wouldnt feel bad for him.. But this is NOT the case. Spy tactics or not, Bob refused to fight straight up. They had the option, and took the weaker route.

Im not trying to say Bob sux. They are not the only ones. Its the entire game. This was just an example. bob have great pilots and most are very honorable, and do 'bring it'. Same of any alliance. But this junk has got to stop.

BTW.. post with your main!!!

Cosmic Flame
Gallente
Federal Navy Academy
Posted - 2007.02.17 15:05:00 - [7]
 

*snip* Posting with an unidentified character and characters in NPC corporations in this forum is prohibited. If you wish to participate in the discussions here, be sure to have your corporation and or alliance status ticked in your forum settings. -Eldo Davip ([email protected])

Wibiq
Gallente
Cloak and Daggers
Posted - 2007.02.17 15:06:00 - [8]
 

Edited by: Wibiq on 17/02/2007 15:03:35
War isn't fair. War is simply about killing them before they can kill you. It's absolutely stupid to charge a superior force with a superior position. To put it another way, if you got jumped by five people in a dark alley while you were alone, would you jump them all immediately, or would you look for some weakness? A stand up fight only makes sense when you have the advantage. Think outside the box and maybe win. So many real wars are lost because people think that everyone should fight the way they themselves do. News flash: that's called sports, and even then the rules are subject to "interpretation".

Edit for punctuation.

Drokar Gazer
Caldari
DISORDERLY CONDUCT.
Posted - 2007.02.17 15:16:00 - [9]
 

Originally by: Wibiq
Edited by: Wibiq on 17/02/2007 15:03:35
War isn't fair. War is simply about killing them before they can kill you. It's absolutely stupid to charge a superior force with a superior position. To put it another way, if you got jumped by five people in a dark alley while you were alone, would you jump them all immediately, or would you look for some weakness? A stand up fight only makes sense when you have the advantage. Think outside the box and maybe win. So many real wars are lost because people think that everyone should fight the way they themselves do. News flash: that's called sports, and even then the rules are subject to "interpretation".

Edit for punctuation.


Did i not say the pilot acted stupid for logging off even with friendly's in system? LIke i said.. i dont care about D2 or their Titan. They are not my friends. Its about how this game has come to such tactics whereby a spy was instructed not to find the titan to bring the war to it, but to wait til it starts to log off to shoot it to get an aggro timer going. They entire thought process is to avoid actual combat and use the mechanics of the game that were not intended as such, to win a battle. Perhaps it does happen everyday, but its about Honor, and while some alliances/corps dont care about it, others do, I being one of them.

I understand their is Spy's, theft, whatever. Some people use very good tactics for this, but they are real life situations. Waiting for someone to logoff is not a real life situation. In real life people dont log off, and while this is not a real life situation, it is a game based on some principles of a virtual simulation of a futuristic real world scenario, where in the future people still dont have the ability to log off, its a game mechanic.

So going off searching for a pilot to log off to kill him is not cheating, legal cheating or not? Its honorable? Well whatever.. perhaps im an old fool with old values. I prefer the days of bring a fight, and we will fight. If we lose, it was fun.

But thanks for everyone not flaming and at least so far giving valued criticism of my post. Agreed with or not.

Viscount Hood
Caldari
Gallivanting Travel Company
Band of Wanderers
Posted - 2007.02.17 15:17:00 - [10]
 

What does fairness and honour have to do with war?

Find the best way of killing/demoralising your opponent and use it to the full.


pershphanie
Gallente
Black Core Federation
Fidelas Constans
Posted - 2007.02.17 15:19:00 - [11]
 

I know. Why don't we all stand in a line and someone type "fire" in local. Then who ever has the best mods and most SP wins.

Rolling Eyes Sounds exciting. Go play counterstrike.

Don't confuse creative tactics with poor gameplay.

Wibiq
Gallente
Cloak and Daggers
Posted - 2007.02.17 15:27:00 - [12]
 

Originally by: Drokar Gazer
Originally by: Wibiq
Edited by: Wibiq on 17/02/2007 15:03:35
War isn't fair. War is simply about killing them before they can kill you. It's absolutely stupid to charge a superior force with a superior position. To put it another way, if you got jumped by five people in a dark alley while you were alone, would you jump them all immediately, or would you look for some weakness? A stand up fight only makes sense when you have the advantage. Think outside the box and maybe win. So many real wars are lost because people think that everyone should fight the way they themselves do. News flash: that's called sports, and even then the rules are subject to "interpretation".

Edit for punctuation.


Did i not say the pilot acted stupid for logging off even with friendly's in system? LIke i said.. i dont care about D2 or their Titan. They are not my friends. Its about how this game has come to such tactics whereby a spy was instructed not to find the titan to bring the war to it, but to wait til it starts to log off to shoot it to get an aggro timer going. They entire thought process is to avoid actual combat and use the mechanics of the game that were not intended as such, to win a battle. Perhaps it does happen everyday, but its about Honor, and while some alliances/corps dont care about it, others do, I being one of them.

I understand their is Spy's, theft, whatever. Some people use very good tactics for this, but they are real life situations. Waiting for someone to logoff is not a real life situation. In real life people dont log off, and while this is not a real life situation, it is a game based on some principles of a virtual simulation of a futuristic real world scenario, where in the future people still dont have the ability to log off, its a game mechanic.

So going off searching for a pilot to log off to kill him is not cheating, legal cheating or not? Its honorable? Well whatever.. perhaps im an old fool with old values. I prefer the days of bring a fight, and we will fight. If we lose, it was fun.

But thanks for everyone not flaming and at least so far giving valued criticism of my post. Agreed with or not.


One of the pivotal precepts of honor is that one holds to it without expecting his enemy to do the same. Expecting your enemy to live by your own code of honor cheapens it and renders it nothing but an arbitrary set of rules. Honor is personal and subjective. Live by your own honor, but do not expect the honorless to live by it.

Ayrine Elenthiel
Minmatar
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
Posted - 2007.02.17 15:36:00 - [13]
 

Originally by: Drokar Gazer
Originally by: Wibiq
Edited by: Wibiq on 17/02/2007 15:03:35stuff...
I understand their is Spy's, theft, whatever. Some people use very good tactics for this, but they are real life situations. Waiting for someone to logoff is not a real life situation. In real life people dont log off, and while this is not a real life situation, it is a game based on some principles of a virtual simulation of a futuristic real world scenario, where in the future people still dont have the ability to log off, its a game mechanic....stuff


QFT

I don't understand why people keep comparing EVE to Real Life. Really, I'm not even talking about any specific situation, I'm talking about all the people constantly saying things like "this is war, in real war, such things are normal" and stuff.

EVE is not and will never be compareable to Real Life War. And you people better be glad about it.

Now let's get back to what we all enjoy in the game, eh? Cool

PS: My personal views and opinions, just that. Oh and I don't know if this will once more be seen as my alt, but I can actually assure you this is my main character. I haven't figured the Forum settings out yet. Embarassed

Wylker
Caldari
Pyrrhus Sicarii
Posted - 2007.02.17 16:40:00 - [14]
 

Good topic Drokar.

Someone has already hit upon a key concept in honor, which is that it is personal, and expecting your opponent to live up to your concept of honor cheapens it.

On the flip side, it is always interesting to debate when something stops being a game mechanic and starts being an exploit. We often try to draw a correllary to real life, because that is where our experience lies. Obviously this is a game, and is not real life, but we need to do it so we have a basis for comparison. Take the D2 titan for example. Now obviously you don't log off in real life. But what if an army moved a battallion of tanks, or an ICBM launcher to a remote area and left it unprotected? It is within reason that a spy would report the location of said weapon system and that the enemy could destroy it.

Now, you can ask if this is honorable or not, but the bottom line is that the enemy has removed a critical weapons system from the field. The question of if the tactic is valid or not is extremely tough to argue, as it is a system that anyone in the game can use/abuse.

I do not particularly want to address the logoff in a bubble scenario, as that is a blatantly BROKEN mechanic. While I won't call it an exploit, everyone knows it will get fixed eventually.

In conclusion, the best thing you can do is fly with honor, and associate with people who fly honorably. You may be doomed to destruction, like the samurai of old, but if you end up being able to look back and be proud, good for you.

Edde Bebbi
Amarr
The Griffin
Posted - 2007.02.17 16:57:00 - [15]
 

Originally by: NightmareX
Edited by: NightmareX on 17/02/2007 14:57:18
Originally by: Cosmic Flame
An aggroed pilot logs off and gets probed and killed.


Yeah that happens when an enemy have started his aggro timer, or by him self.


Why on earth would ccp let him off when it was a friendly?

Sameth
Caldari
Mercurialis Inc.
RAZOR Alliance
Posted - 2007.02.17 17:05:00 - [16]
 

Honour?

Dear god who gives a flying ****. That concept has a definition that varies from person to person. No two people see it the same way and you cant enforce your views of what is "fair and honourable" on someone else.

While I tend to think the D2 titan kill was pretty lame, it was however very clever, there is no denying that. Currently to date no one has actually fought a titan and won, all titan deaths have been unmanned or in the case of LV, half built.

If you really want to whine about this stuff then at least to it in a logical fashion, campaign for gameplay changes or whatever, but dont cry about something not being honourable because there is no such thing. Hard facts are all that will really help you, not snivelly nosed roleplaying sentiments.

Edde Bebbi
Amarr
The Griffin
Posted - 2007.02.17 17:05:00 - [17]
 

At the end of the day, if this was a goonswarm or RA kill on an LV titan, Everyone, and by that I mean 99% of you flamers, would be saying "good job, nice move"

Why were there no crys of OMG LAME when they brought 1000 to LVs titan in production, used the first 200 to crash the node and the rest to hold the system while the defenders tried to log on.

Why were there no crys of 'lame' from you guys when D2 were caught using an official website to get BoB IPs?

Why didnt you cry 'lame' when an ISS director offlined an entire systems worth of towers for goonswarm? How is THAT intended by the game mechanics?

Why wernt you crying lame about the recent hacking on so many different servers?

I'll tell you why; because when its done to BoB and allies it is considered genious, when its done by them its considered lame.

Thats all there is to it. You Hate BoB.

Asariasha
Caldari
DEFCON.
The Initiative.
Posted - 2007.02.17 17:09:00 - [18]
 

Edited by: Asariasha on 17/02/2007 17:07:36
<<<just my own opinion>>>

Quote:
Exploits

An exploit is when someone bypasses normal game mechanics, such as by utilizing a bug in the game, allowing him to take advantage of other players without them having any means of preventing it whatsoever.


What's exploit? by CCP.

1) aggression timer was introduced to prevent players
to log off a current fight into safety.
2) recent titan kill has shown that BoBlead had planned
to use this game mechanic
3) large scale battles demand the players to turn off
effects meaning you are not able to monitor if you get
hit by anything
4) titans are extremely inert meaning you can not monitor
the warp after your log off.
5) of course other players could monitor your logoff,
but players should never be forced to run 2accounts to
fly a ship.

Concerning these points, the recent titan kill was a
clear and planned exploit which requests CCP to interfere
by reimbursement and an additional punishment for the
exploit-performing party.

Im really excited if CCP will obey their own EULA.

Greets
Asa

Edde Bebbi
Amarr
The Griffin
Posted - 2007.02.17 17:12:00 - [19]
 

Your arguement fails because the purpose of aggro timers isnt "to prevent people running from a fight" its "to keep ships that have been aggroed in space for 15 minutes".

Else how do you explain being able to flag yourself by shooting at cans, your own drones, being webbed by a corpmate when in a freighter etc.

Trivas
Caldari
Nexus Aerospace Corporation
Posted - 2007.02.17 17:43:00 - [20]
 

Edited by: Trivas on 17/02/2007 17:44:02
Lots of intersting Comments here. Let me preface what I am about to say by saying that I dont think that it was a cheat or exploit or anything else of the sort (or even morally wrong, we'd all do what it takes to win). But people need to relise that EVE IS A GAME! When I want to return to the real world, I want EVE to stop existing when I hit ctrl-q. If this was a real war in real life I would not have to log off. People seem to forget this. The problem is how the game mechaincs work when you log off. Since Titans cannot dock there is no safe place to store them.

Since I dont like to complain and not offer a sugestion perhaps this will help. Say a new log off system was in place. Using this system when a player logs off in space his ship remains for 1 min and can be warp scrambled and bubbled durring that time. ONLY warp scrambing or bubbleing would keep him there. If you're gatecamping and a guy logs and you cannot warp scrable him in that time you deserve to lose the kill. However this prevents logging at a starbase from being dangrous as it should never be dangrous to log off at a base!

Just my two cents...My opinion is my own and not that of my alliance or corp.

EDIT: forgot to metion, if you don't think that EVE comes infront of Real life (which I'm sure 99% of those who play believe) then you should have a problem with the way aggro is handled atm. Its not just this titan kill, but hundreds or even thousands of other kills from people logging at starbases.

Xelphior
Caldari
Black Pearl Cartel
Posted - 2007.02.17 17:58:00 - [21]
 

eve was intended to be like life, and tbh its a good representation.

you can scam/cheat/doublecross/spy and kill

Life isnt Fair, in Real War you dont hold onto your morals, its them or you, and its the same in eve

you see an oppurtunity to get the advantage you take it, same as RL.

Moral of the Story.

eve isnt fair, eve dont promote fairness, but neither does life.


NightmareX
Caldari
Nomads
Nulli Secunda
Posted - 2007.02.17 18:18:00 - [22]
 

Edited by: NightmareX on 17/02/2007 18:16:13
Originally by: Asariasha
Edited by: Asariasha on 17/02/2007 17:07:36
<<<just my own opinion>>>

Quote:
Exploits

An exploit is when someone bypasses normal game mechanics, such as by utilizing a bug in the game, allowing him to take advantage of other players without them having any means of preventing it whatsoever.


What's exploit? by CCP.

1) aggression timer was introduced to prevent players
to log off a current fight into safety.
2) recent titan kill has shown that BoBlead had planned
to use this game mechanic
3) large scale battles demand the players to turn off
effects meaning you are not able to monitor if you get
hit by anything
4) titans are extremely inert meaning you can not monitor
the warp after your log off.
5) of course other players could monitor your logoff,
but players should never be forced to run 2accounts to
fly a ship.

Concerning these points, the recent titan kill was a
clear and planned exploit which requests CCP to interfere
by reimbursement and an additional punishment for the
exploit-performing party.

Im really excited if CCP will obey their own EULA.

Greets
Asa



Yup, if the peoples here can't see that we have right here, then i don't know what their IQ is, but i believe it may be very lowLaughing

I really don't know why peoples can't read the EULA at all, it's not hard to read it, and the EULA is easy to understandVery Happy

Edde Bebbi
Amarr
The Griffin
Posted - 2007.02.17 18:39:00 - [23]
 

http://myeve.eve-online.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=477648

NightmareX
Caldari
Nomads
Nulli Secunda
Posted - 2007.02.17 19:13:00 - [24]
 

Originally by: Edde Bebbi
http://myeve.eve-online.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=477648


Hehehehe, so your still saying that the post over you are not true?, if yes, then why is it from the EULA?. CCP can't say another things that the EULA is saying, because it's their own rules. So please STFU noob.

More excuses please Edde Bebbi?

Just post like 1000 more excuses, because i love to see how much you lub♥♥♥♥BoC♥♥♥♥Laughing

Lori Carlyle
Caldari
Intelligent Design RD
Posted - 2007.02.17 19:21:00 - [25]
 

Originally by: Asariasha
Edited by: Asariasha on 17/02/2007 17:07:36
<<<just my own opinion>>>

Quote:
Exploits

An exploit is when someone bypasses normal game mechanics, such as by utilizing a bug in the game, allowing him to take advantage of other players without them having any means of preventing it whatsoever.


What's exploit? by CCP.

1) aggression timer was introduced to prevent players
to log off a current fight into safety.
2) recent titan kill has shown that BoBlead had planned
to use this game mechanic
3) large scale battles demand the players to turn off
effects meaning you are not able to monitor if you get
hit by anything
4) titans are extremely inert meaning you can not monitor
the warp after your log off.
5) of course other players could monitor your logoff,
but players should never be forced to run 2accounts to
fly a ship.

Concerning these points, the recent titan kill was a
clear and planned exploit which requests CCP to interfere
by reimbursement and an additional punishment for the
exploit-performing party.

Im really excited if CCP will obey their own EULA.

Greets
Asa



Regards to (3) Correct me if i'm wrong but where does it say CCP demands you to turn off the visual effects ? yes it saves us some lag however it's a personal choice.

Xeliya
Caldari
Destructive Influence
IT Alliance
Posted - 2007.02.17 19:22:00 - [26]
 

Edited by: Xeliya on 17/02/2007 19:20:11
Originally by: Asariasha
Quote:
Exploits

An exploit is when someone bypasses normal game mechanics, such as by utilizing a bug in the game, allowing him to take advantage of other players without them having any means of preventing it whatsoever.



I bolded a part of it, he could have went to a deep safe alone not in gang sat cloaked then logged after 15, or he could have been INSIDE the POS shields. He could have prevented it if he were careful.

Voculus
Minmatar
The Illuminati.
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2007.02.17 20:26:00 - [27]
 

To Cosmic Flame, AKA DICE Alt. It's evident now that Blob of Brothers are subpar pvpers. The only way you clowns get ahead is by gaming the game. The fact is, it's the only way you will ever kill the Titan, because BloB don't have the skills or motivation to do so under normal combat conditions.

Asariasha
Caldari
DEFCON.
The Initiative.
Posted - 2007.02.17 20:36:00 - [28]
 

@Edde:
please read carefully the DEVblogs. In one of them
it is exactly told that the system was implemented to
prevent players of logging off while being in a fight.

@Xeliya:
Excuse me, but how are you supposed to prevent an aggression
on your own POS?
POS use to shoot at every incoming hostile ship.
Of course you may say:"But spies are allowed..."
At least they are not prohibited, but in that special
event a hostile player logged in a spy to abuse a game
mechanic in the purpose of destroying a vessel that
under normal circumstances would not have been killed.

And exactly this is why it was a planned exploit by
BoB leadership.

Greets
Asa

Wylker
Caldari
Pyrrhus Sicarii
Posted - 2007.02.17 20:37:00 - [29]
 

Originally by: Voculus
To Cosmic Flame, AKA DICE Alt. It's evident now that Blob of Brothers are subpar pvpers. The only way you clowns get ahead is by gaming the game. The fact is, it's the only way you will ever kill the Titan, because BloB don't have the skills or motivation to do so under normal combat conditions.


[email protected]

Wether you like BoB or not, this post is just ignorant flame bait. You should stfu and go help D2.

Soryn Kael
Gallente
Chaos From Order
Posted - 2007.02.17 20:39:00 - [30]
 

Eve is the new Asheron's Call...


Exploit early, exploit often!


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