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Rells
Caldari
Fusillade.
Posted - 2007.01.22 11:40:00 - [31]
 

Originally by: Tuxford
I agree the corp interface needs some love, so does the eve mail inbox for that matter. Not much I can tell you I'm not really that involved in implementation or design so all I can promise you is that I'll lobby for this internally Razz


Thanks a lot for looking at this tuxford. I hope we can see something soon.

LeisureSuit Lurkie
Posted - 2007.01.22 12:10:00 - [32]
 

Oh yes, one thing I've never understood is why CCP hasn't paid any attention to aspect of game that touches almost all of their clients. Current corp thefts, POS thefts, whatever, are mostly to blaim on extreamly bad role and "division" design.

It's so funny how someone can gain control of a region because he needs some "ammo" container rights.

Trebor Locke
Gallente
Nexus Aerospace Corporation
Posted - 2007.01.22 12:29:00 - [33]
 

Originally by: LeisureSuit Lurkie
Oh yes, one thing I've never understood is why CCP hasn't paid any attention to aspect of game that touches almost all of their clients. Current corp thefts, POS thefts, whatever, are mostly to blaim on extreamly bad role and "division" design.

It's so funny how someone can gain control of a region because he needs some "ammo" container rights.


Many of those thefts aren't because of poor design but rather stupidity on the part of a corporations directors/CEO. If you can't trust someone, don't give em rights. Many people who join new corporations are out for personal gain and the second you give them build rights or access to anything, they might just take it.

I am sure there are the occassional loopholes, however if stuff is that important to you, put it in secure containers, or audit cans, or something. Something that has a password. (There should be a blueprint to an Auditable Giant Secure Container >.>)

Joshua Foiritain
Gallente
Coreli Corporation
Naraka.
Posted - 2007.01.22 12:37:00 - [34]
 

Edited by: Joshua Foiritain on 22/01/2007 12:34:31
Originally by: Trebor Locke
Originally by: LeisureSuit Lurkie
Oh yes, one thing I've never understood is why CCP hasn't paid any attention to aspect of game that touches almost all of their clients. Current corp thefts, POS thefts, whatever, are mostly to blaim on extreamly bad role and "division" design.

It's so funny how someone can gain control of a region because he needs some "ammo" container rights.


Many of those thefts aren't because of poor design but rather stupidity on the part of a corporations directors/CEO. If you can't trust someone, don't give em rights. Many people who join new corporations are out for personal gain and the second you give them build rights or access to anything, they might just take it.

I am sure there are the occassional loopholes, however if stuff is that important to you, put it in secure containers, or audit cans, or something. Something that has a password. (There should be a blueprint to an Auditable Giant Secure Container >.>)

If someone is willing to put in the time and effort to work his way up in your corp with the sole intent of robbing you there is nothing you can do against it.

Not to mention that theres things only a director can do, insuring corp ships, recieving new application mails, cleaning corp/alliance mailboxes/etc. All of these things need to be changed into roles that can be assigned without giving someone access to everything.

Not to mention the fact that Pre-Kali a producer could build using corp minerals without being able to take them, they broke this. Normal members could take stuff out of audit log cans, without being able to take them... they broke this too, they can now take the entire can. Quite handy those half functioning logs are when the thief just runs off with the entire container...

Trebor Locke
Gallente
Nexus Aerospace Corporation
Posted - 2007.01.22 12:51:00 - [35]
 

Originally by: Joshua Foiritain
Edited by: Joshua Foiritain on 22/01/2007 12:34:31
Originally by: Trebor Locke
Originally by: LeisureSuit Lurkie
Oh yes, one thing I've never understood is why CCP hasn't paid any attention to aspect of game that touches almost all of their clients. Current corp thefts, POS thefts, whatever, are mostly to blaim on extreamly bad role and "division" design.

It's so funny how someone can gain control of a region because he needs some "ammo" container rights.


Many of those thefts aren't because of poor design but rather stupidity on the part of a corporations directors/CEO. If you can't trust someone, don't give em rights. Many people who join new corporations are out for personal gain and the second you give them build rights or access to anything, they might just take it.

I am sure there are the occassional loopholes, however if stuff is that important to you, put it in secure containers, or audit cans, or something. Something that has a password. (There should be a blueprint to an Auditable Giant Secure Container >.>)

If someone is willing to put in the time and effort to work his way up in your corp with the sole intent of robbing you there is nothing you can do against it.

Not to mention that theres things only a director can do, insuring corp ships, recieving new application mails, cleaning corp/alliance mailboxes/etc. All of these things need to be changed into roles that can be assigned without giving someone access to everything.

Not to mention the fact that Pre-Kali a producer could build using corp minerals without being able to take them, they broke this. Normal members could take stuff out of audit log cans, without being able to take them... they broke this too, they can now take the entire can. Quite handy those half functioning logs are when the thief just runs off with the entire container...


A director is usually a trusted member of a corporation. Would you would allow someone to hire people to your corp but not allow them to take out minerals from your mineral hangar? It also makes sense that if a builder is building for a corporation, that the builder uses corporate minerals.

Its all an issue of trust and who can be given that trust. As for cans. What is a theif going to do if you decided to invest in a secure container and passworded it? Blowing it up is about all that he can do. I'd much rather know that the theif couldn't get any use out of the goods he stole :-P

Marine HK4861
Caldari
State Protectorate
Posted - 2007.01.22 13:05:00 - [36]
 

Originally by: Trebor Locke
What is a theif going to do if you decided to invest in a secure container and passworded it? Blowing it up is about all that he can do.


He could repackage it, which doesn't need a password.

All the contents would then just pop out, plus he gets a free can.

In the case of audit containers, he'd have to wait 3 weeks since the last log, but he could still repackage it.

Joshua Foiritain
Gallente
Coreli Corporation
Naraka.
Posted - 2007.01.22 13:31:00 - [37]
 

Edited by: Joshua Foiritain on 22/01/2007 13:27:48
Originally by: Trebor Locke
A director is usually a trusted member of a corporation. Would you would allow someone to hire people to your corp but not allow them to take out minerals from your mineral hangar? It also makes sense that if a builder is building for a corporation, that the builder uses corporate minerals.

Its all an issue of trust and who can be given that trust. As for cans. What is a theif going to do if you decided to invest in a secure container and passworded it? Blowing it up is about all that he can do. I'd much rather know that the theif couldn't get any use out of the goods he stole :-P

Just because i have people to go over applications and accept them doesnt mean id like them to have access to several bill worth of assets.

Same goes with the builder, just because i want him to be able to producer ammo and equipment using corp minerals i dont want to be able to drag the entire, billion isk, stack of minerals into his hangar.

As for the password, right click > retrieve password. That or wait 3 weeks for log entries to expensive and repackage it. Passwording ammo and equipment containers also doesnt work all that well, since members would need the password to take stuff out.

So yeah, empty cans with logs telling you who took everything or an empty hangar, you take your pick. Ill go for the old system where i at least knew who did it.

Popsikle
Minmatar
Caffeine Commodities Company
Posted - 2007.01.22 16:02:00 - [38]
 

The real kicker about this are Research Monkeys. Having tens of billions of isk tied up in BPO's that can't be researched without take access is bull****. Cant be copied, cant be anything'd without take rights. My corp is really really small, and I trust everyone in it, but Id hate to have to give take access to capital BPO's just to get them researched/copied....

Thats not the way it used to be... Sad

Glenmorangie
Gallente
Posted - 2007.01.22 17:46:00 - [39]
 

Just reading this i thought it would be impossible to make the corp interface worse more broken. Guess i was wrong.

Gemini Zero
ANZAC ALLIANCE
Southern Cross Alliance
Posted - 2007.01.24 00:56:00 - [40]
 

Edited by: Gemini Zero on 24/01/2007 00:54:36

Lets not neglect the Corp Wallet as well.

  • EXPORT EXPORT EXPORT: If the wallet cant have more complex tools incorporated in it, let us have the option of doing the dirty work in Excel

  • More leway in what is actually taxed, focusing only on bounties and mission rewards neglects many of the other professions in eve

  • A reporting engine on corp funds. Do you know how difficult it is to do analysis on money going in and out of a corp




JForce
Minmatar
Posted - 2007.01.24 02:05:00 - [41]
 

For the sweet love of jesus christ in heaven, please fix the corp interface.

I'd be willing to bet that there isn't a single issue that every corp in Eve would agree on completely other than this.

Rells
Caldari
Fusillade.
Posted - 2007.01.27 07:35:00 - [42]
 

BUmp because there still is no info in the next patch.

Orchid Ix
Kahi Mohala
Posted - 2007.01.27 08:03:00 - [43]
 

I'd love to see the divisional corp wallets come into play.

Thor Xian
Rebirth.
THE GOD SQUAD
Posted - 2007.01.27 08:06:00 - [44]
 

Quote:
As many tabs as we want (corp as well as personal). Just right click and add smart tab and allow it to sort the hangar contents appropriately. Smart tabs would be like smart Playlists in Eve and the CEO should be responsible and able to configure them. Players could configure their own for their own private hangars and store them in the settings.


Yes.

Quote:
Configurable permissions for hangars allow people to build things but not take.


Yes.

Quote:
Quotas for builders so they cant build 400 tractro beams at once.


Yes.

Quote:
Rank HIERARCHY. You should be able to set integral hierarchy in the build interface.


As in build priority? If so then, hell yes.

Quote:
Export of roles for all memebers in the corp.


Eh?

Quote:
Ditch the shares. They stink, they dont guarantee payouts and they are the biggest scam in Eve.


Shares can and are used legitimately, the issue is not with shares, but how limited they are. Shares need a revamp...share tracking should def be possible.

Quote:
Make the ability to propose a vote for all directors without having to have a share. Better yet .. have a role to propose the vote.


And also make it possible to disallow voting entirely.

Quote:
Overhaul the UI to make it easier to use.


Amen.

Quote:
Blast out all the useless tabs in corp interface.


Or make them not useless...same thing.

Quote:
Assets list for corp paired with personal assets with asset search. This tab should be in corporate interface.


With various levels of permission options of course.

Quote:
Expired Sanctionable actions should be cleared after two weeks or by CEO operation.


Yes, and a historical database should be available, with footnote options (as well as adding vote independent entries).

Quote:
Sanctionable actions, implemented or rejected should be cleared after some time.


Same as above.

Quote:
You shouldnt need 4 clicks to immplement each sanctionable action. I SENTENCE Oveur to unloc 510 blueprints.


Plus an option to auto-execute certain types of SActions.

Quote:
Corp orders should be visible in corp interface.


With appropriate access permissions (view/modify/create/etc).

Quote:
Corps should be able to set standings to alliances.


Yes.

Quote:
Auditing for who removes what from hangars and who puts what in.


Hell yes, and allow us to operate Excel style input/output calculation functions, example: Member E419 dumps 7800 units of Crokite into Input Hangar A, the associated calculation computes an ISK based payout to Player A and can either autopay...or accumulate and pay out at a scheduled time...payroll if you will.

Quote:
Build and research job auditing.


Yes.

Quote:
Corp members tab into corp interface and display titles. and ranks.


Member Roster needs a complete overhaul. Divisions would help tons.

Quote:
Ranks should be separate from other titles.


That option should be available, yes. Rates and Ranks.

Quote:
Any number of ranks you want up to some number.


30 would be a good start.

Quote:
Allow directors once again to strip all roles from a member via a single menu iter rather than having to do it manually.


Also an option to temporarily freeze the access permissions of a given member, Administrative Leave so to speak, this will help if there is a suspected event, but you havent actually decided to terminate the member.

continued

Thor Xian
Rebirth.
THE GOD SQUAD
Posted - 2007.01.27 08:08:00 - [45]
 

Quote:
Fine grained permissions for being able to use and administer POS. Also drop the POS shield password and replace it with the ability to set access to the POS based on title and standings.


POS/corp interfacing needs a definate improvement. Launching for Alliance should be an option, and should be required for sovereignty claims.

Quote:
Ability for players to deploy POS for "Self" without needing to deploy it for corp. I shouldnt have to give corp permissions for someone to deploy a POS for themselves.


Read above.

Quote:
Ability to filter the audit logs described above based on character.


Hell yes.

Quote:
Ability to know who is an alt of who. Simply allow members to select that their char is an alt and give the name of the main.


This could be part of the new roster, give preference to mains with an option to see an alt sublisting.

Tissa
Minmatar
Mnemonic Enterprises
New Eden Research.
Posted - 2007.01.27 09:56:00 - [46]
 

Quote:

# Auditing for who removes what from hangars and who puts what in.


/signed x1000 on this one

I would like to add:
Originally by: Tissa, hundreds of times
go to corp tab/corp/home/members/applications/my applications/offers/turn around three times and touch your toes and you can accept offer from any station, yes I know it is a pain isn't it.

Rells
Caldari
Fusillade.
Posted - 2007.02.11 03:37:00 - [47]
 

Another content patch and still no changes. Too busy handing out BPOs to BoB?

Thor Xian
Rebirth.
THE GOD SQUAD
Posted - 2007.02.11 09:10:00 - [48]
 

Nothing good happens first.

Doc Extropy
Gallente
Cruentus Invicta
The Covenant Alliance
Posted - 2007.02.11 09:17:00 - [49]
 

Edited by: Doc Extropy on 11/02/2007 09:14:01
Originally by: "Rells"

Would you believe CCP BROKE the corp interface further?



LOL. Is that a rhetoric question? Laughing

Willow Whisp
Sadist Faction
Posted - 2007.02.19 17:43:00 - [50]
 

I think the biggest pet peeve of mine is the fact that in order to do remote research & build jobs, you need to have take access to corp minerals & BPO's. It's ridiculous that in order to be able to research, you must give essencially what means free access to all the corp assets to someone.

Johnathan Roark
Caldari
The Graduates
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2007.02.19 18:41:00 - [51]
 

The corp interface is one of the most neglected interfaces in eve, yet is also one of the most important. Here is a 11 page thread of suggestion in the feature and ideas discussion forum.

Montague Zooma
Imperial Dreams
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
Posted - 2007.02.19 19:09:00 - [52]
 

The corporate interface needs to be a top priority.

MMOs build communities. Trust is a basic community foundation. I'm not saying to remove corporate espionage/sabotage from the game (which would be impossible, anyway), but CEOs need better tools. For example, allowing someone to set up a small POS on their own shouldn't mean you have to give them the ability to sabotage your major POSes and Outposts.

There will always be paranoia in a pvp game like this, but there's far more of it in Eve now than is necessary or healthy. Please give corps better control of their assets.

Gaogan
Gallente
Solar Storm
Sev3rance
Posted - 2007.02.19 20:13:00 - [53]
 

You do NOT need take access to research or copy bpos. You also CAN give access to take from cans, but not take the cans themselves. I got rather annoyed a while back because we were using this configuration, but found that if you store bpcs in cans at a pos construction array, you can not remove the bpcs from the cans to build from them without removing the entire can to your ship's cargo hold.

As for the comments on corp theft: it most definitely is in large part, due to the lack corp controls, not so much an issue of trust/betrayal. This is due to the lack of granularity in permissions. You may trust someone to build for the corp, but that does not mean you trust them with the ENTIRE corp mineral supply. You may trust someone to accept applications, but that does not mean you want them to be able to swipe ALL corp assets.

Then when things DO go wrong, it is often impossible to figure out how due to no audit logs. And don't even mention audit log secure containers; they are a complete joke. They don't audit what people take or put, only lock and unlock events, and the whole concept of locking things is pointless and annoying. Not to mention that you can't get station containers in 0.0.


Frug
Omega Wing
Snatch Victory
Posted - 2007.02.19 20:31:00 - [54]
 

Yeah the corp management is by far the most messed up interface of a game that has some of the worst interface designs ever. It's complete madness and how it has remained this way for so long blows my mind.

While we're at it, how about removing the billion items in the wallet journal dropdown that are only there because they let a rabid monkey add random things to the list?

Gold? Can I have some gold in eve please?

Shamis Orzoz
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2007.02.19 20:36:00 - [55]
 

Originally by: Tuxford
I agree the corp interface needs some love, so does the eve mail inbox for that matter. Not much I can tell you I'm not really that involved in implementation or design so all I can promise you is that I'll lobby for this internally Razz


Nobody gives a **** about the stupid inbox. I know there is somebody at CCP who gets paid to redesign the damn inbox every patch, but whoever that is should be fired.


Par'Gellen
Gallente
Neon Cranium
Posted - 2007.02.19 20:52:00 - [56]
 

CCP,
If you guys need something to model the Inbox after, try imitating Outlook Express (or any other email program but without all the silly frills). Just a simple Inbox, Sent Items, Search, and maybe the ability to add a few custom folders to move the more important emails that need keeping. That's really all there is to fixing it. The ability to create mailing lists would be nice to.

As for the Corporate Administration UI you could take a look at Netware Administrator or Active Directory and build something similar. Corp members would be like users and all the corp resourses would be like the network resourses. Titles would be groups. In fact it should all be title or group based. It makes it FAR FAR easier to manage if you let the CEO and Directors set up groups and then just add and remove people from them as needed. I know the title system already lets you do this but it's clunky and hard to navigate. It's overly complicated as it is now.

Anyway, that's my 2 cents.

Mritanu
Utopian Dynasty
Posted - 2007.02.19 21:39:00 - [57]
 

Originally by: Rells
The reality is that posts like htis have been made in the Ideas forum for three years to no avail. It seems to me pthat CCP only serves those that scream the loudest. Time to scream.

I CHALLENGE Oveur to unlock 500 blueprints and run a corp of more than 100 people for 6 months.


/signed

In fact, I have 110 BPOs sitting in a hangar which are presently perma-locked. I have tried to run unlock requests on all of them TWICE now, and I have a petition open to get them unlocked. Going on 4 weeks, not even a response to my petition.

Thanks for wasting my time CCP :(

hotgirl933
Posted - 2007.02.19 21:42:00 - [58]
 

Originally by: Mritanu
Originally by: Rells
The reality is that posts like htis have been made in the Ideas forum for three years to no avail. It seems to me pthat CCP only serves those that scream the loudest. Time to scream.

I CHALLENGE Oveur to unlock 500 blueprints and run a corp of more than 100 people for 6 months.


/signed

In fact, I have 110 BPOs sitting in a hangar which are presently perma-locked. I have tried to run unlock requests on all of them TWICE now, and I have a petition open to get them unlocked. Going on 4 weeks, not even a response to my petition.

Thanks for wasting my time CCP :(


[yello] new note on petition - i wish to elevate this petition to senior GM status thanku [/yellow]

Death Kill
Caldari
SolaR KillerS
UN1CUM
Posted - 2007.02.19 21:42:00 - [59]
 

Originally by: Tuxford
I agree the corp interface needs some love, so does the eve mail inbox for that matter. Not much I can tell you I'm not really that involved in implementation or design so all I can promise you is that I'll lobby for this internally Razz



WOuld it be possible to filter corp alliance mail so that we only receive mail from ceo's and not everyone and their kid sister asking for ts info or other stupid questions/statments?

WilliamPD
Caldari
The Walt Disney Company
Posted - 2007.02.19 22:13:00 - [60]
 

Originally by: Par'Gellen
That's really all there is to fixing it. The ability to create mailing lists would be nice to.



Already exists.


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